Would you be happy for your children to receive covid-19 vaccine

Former Former Former

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691432#Comment_117691432

I'm a little concerned that you think Yahoo News is a reputable news outlet, especially when reporting verbatim from Fox News. But here's another, more recent one from Yahoo which makes no mention of him as anything of note, except a peddler of disinformation.

https://news.yahoo.com/flawed-scientific-papers-fueling-covid-014423071.html

As I said, the guy is a fraud but he knows he has a very receptive audience of people who want to believe that it's all a conspiracy. He knows you won't look too closely at details (which you didn't) because you don't want the bubble to be burst. Trump knew this too and exploited it brilliantly.

c.p.w.g.w

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117690687#Comment_117690687

Never said they added anything strange in the vaccine...

The technology used for mRNA vaccines are new, and even the person who discovered this type of technology has voiced concerns about how it's being used...

Typically trials for new medicines are carried out to assume any potential long term as well as short term affects...

Even well established medicine have had negative affects that aren't initial known...a certain type of anti-histamine(diphenhydramine HCL) has been discovered as being linked to dementia and Alzheimer's dishes when taken long term...

It may proof long term that these vaccines are perfectly safe for all, but I find it befuddling that we take the positive news and ignore some experts, especially when you have people who are deemed top people within their fields showing concern I think we need to sit up and listen...

Dr Koch, who was the lead clinicians, who developed treatment protocols for Covid19 has voiced many concerns, an expert in his field in fact in the top 10 of his field within the US

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691491#Comment_117691491

That article has nothing to with the point being discussed (Robert Malone being a pioneer of mRNA technology). You should get out there and report the endless sites that have him listed as such 😄

Anyway, have a good day 👍

c.p.w.g.w

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691196#Comment_117691196

Ivermectin study in Argentina shows how effective it can be in protecting health care workers from developing significant symptoms of it...

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04701710

Ivermectin can be produced for under $1 per dose

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117689397#Comment_117689397

Oh my god they are such a shower of nutters!

Heard that they were naming doctors and scientists on a death list alright but didn't think that sort of hatred and lunacy would spread here.

Surely that is hate speech and incitement to harm?

I appreciate your point, but to be honest life is too short and my down time can only stretch to a bit of Boardsurfing which I enjoy, rather than reading some of that ridiculous sxxx on FB that would just annoy me too much.

I only frequent the more moderate threads here for that reason.

I would be concerned that some parents would disappear down that rabbit hole in their worry, that is why I recommend sticking to the established paths of information.

I think a GP/ practice nurse who knows a family is the best source of information, or public health staff.

is_that_so

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691432#Comment_117691432

He didn't invent the vaccines and has admitted as much, even if his website still claims he did. He and others played a large part in the development of the original mRNA platform. Drew Weissman and Katalin Kariko are the ones whose work led directly to Moderna and BioNTech developing them.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691582#Comment_117691582

Robert Malone is not what he claims to be. And that’s about the nicest thing you could say about.

Isnt it great to see so many people unwittingly spouting the lies of the anti vaccine movement. The greatest difficulty is distinguishing the gullible from the loons

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691584#Comment_117691584

Alternative reality “Let’s promote this magical cure that requires ongoing treatment with a chemical with many known side effects based on trials with participants in the 100’s than the vaccines which are way more effective and only require two doses and have been administered to billions of people already with exceptional safety record no far”

This is the bizarre mindset that is setting in to this place. Fortunately in the real world people aren’t as gullible

Del Griffith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687782#Comment_117687782

Very promising, and if taken at face value someone should tell FG that all and any restrictions should be completely dropped inside venues that only allow the vaccinated. Electric Picnic can go ahead with the vaccine certs.

Unfortunately it's totally at odds with several sources of more recent data, particularly where delta is concerned.

Promising all the same.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117689323#Comment_117689323

All good.

I got as far as the CMO recommending the Swine flu vaccine?

NIAC are recommending the vaccines following on from EMA and FDA recommendations and having reexamine all the data available.

That is good enough for me.

Having worked with some of these people I can attest to their diligence and professionalism.

What happened with Pandemrix was a rushed through early batch with emergency authorisation.

These vaccines have completed all their trials and more.

Believe me nobody wants anything given to anyone that will cause them damage

When NIAC were recommending a pause in AZ over the clotting / thrombocytopenia issues being investigated, there were posters freaking out that they were too cautious, delaying the rollout, people will die, blood on their hands etc. Now we are seeing similar reactions from people but in reverse. Can't win.

Anyway get them vaccinated is my recommendation, but it is obviously a decision you as a parent must be happy with.

Del Griffith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687646#Comment_117687646

Not surprised to hear you've lost track of the point, considering the plethora of irrelevant statements you're making well outside of it:

"the phase 3 vaccine trials into younger people started as soon as the adult trials had finished" - Obviously, since there are vulnerable in all categories.

"herd immunity is one of the great benefits of all vaccines" - No one is talking about all vaccines, vaccines are just great.

"people with symptoms aren't going out" Great?

While you do make also make valid points around asymptomatic transmission, are you still denying that lessoned transmission is widely/primarily attributed to the effect of lessened symptoms?

And to save on any further confusion on your part - what my original point (before I had to start replying to all these curveballs from the extremist elements on here that like to shut critical thinking down) - was that, as children are largely asymptomatic, there is a minor risk (extremely slim) / reward (practically none, which is crux of it) consideration for parents when it comes to giving children the vaccine.

Parents generally care primarily for the welfare of the child. When it comes to even the most minor or unlikely of risks, that is almost the only consideration. I'm primarily talking about children under 12, which is due approval in September.

I'm not in any way saying that they shouldn't vaccinate their kids. But I wouldn't like to see that responsibility for the choice removed from the parents hands by back-handed means such as limiting children's access to essential services or even essential social activity. In my opinion this is highly likely to happen given recent history in Ireland and abroad.

And yea Covid that a child doesn't even notice might be dangerous later - if the parents speculate this to be case, they can vaccinate away. But I wouldn't want that choice removed from them, just to appease.. <>

Do you disagree then, would you be in favour of forced vaccination of children?

 

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117692022#Comment_117692022

Reality has no place on this thread

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117687741#Comment_117687741

Excellent post.

Have passed this advice on to my teenagers who are post vaccination.

No problem for them to take it easy 😉

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117692048#Comment_117692048

Sorry? Am I being too realistic or not real enough? 😉

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691094#Comment_117691094

Well, first of all, we don't know if she really does work there and after reading her post, she basically says fcük all. That's how I see it.

But to keep it related to the thread. Two sons, 15 and 19. 19 year old fully vaccinated by now, 15 year old waiting for a green light to get vaccination. Their own decision.

I'm fully vaccinated as well.

c.p.w.g.w

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691982#Comment_117691982

No body said it's a magical cure ...but it is certainly a medicine with an exceptional safety record, currently out of patent so can be produced for next to nothing...and it offers an alternative...

But I'm not saying this, but some of the world's top viroloists are saying so...

As I've stated I have got the vaccine, and I understand the risks(well potential risk)...as with all medical treatment's there is the potential for risk

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691094#Comment_117691094

To take as example in the past few days, DrFrost has basically had all his talking points shown as lies and misinformation, now, an ordinary person would take the information, re-evaluate their position and maybe come to a different conclusion, DrFrost instead comes back within minutes posting a video about mRNA vaccines from a doctor who had his videos banned from youtube for being anti-vax, in a thread about giving vaccines to children, this has been a pattern in this thread, people have moved on from adults who have largely taken the vaccine and the anti-vax legion is now targeting children, parents and pregnant women with FUD.

People are repeatedly saying that the choice to take vaccines is and will always be with the parents and the adults and the pregnant women, however people coming onto threads to spread lies and anti-vax nonsense will continue to find themselves challenged, whether that be to present their sources or just to point out the outright lies they are telling.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117692032#Comment_117692032

Stop trying to strawman the argument, no one has said vaccines should be forced, adult, child, pregnant, whatever. People are however saying that the risk/benefit is now greatly in favour of the vaccines even for younger people, the small % chance of catching SARS-COV2 and then developing COVID and then developing symptoms has now turned into a high % chance of catching SARS-COV2. Which for children means either taking a proven safe vaccine that virtually eliminates severe symptoms and greatly reduces all other symptoms AND reduces the chances of them transmitting to others whether showing symptoms or not vs. taking their unknown chances when they do contract SARS-COV2 while also having a much higher % chance of passing SARS-COV2 onto others.

Del Griffith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117692837#Comment_117692837

Strawman ha ha you're having a laugh now are you, with all the sideways shite you and the rest on this side of it bring up, throwing around antivax accusations, bringing Donald Trump into it, mysterious boogeymen that are brainwashing people etc. Paranoid lunacy.

My position has been constant throughout and you can go all the way back to page 2 of this thread to my first post on the matter if you'd like to verify that.

What it boils down to is kids by and large absolutely don't need this vaccine, not for themselves, and even militant pro-censorship folks like yourselves won't be able to prevent parents from taking that into consideration when it's time to make the call.

mcmoustache

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691366#Comment_117691366

Brushing your teeth or applying Preparation H your arse is a medical are medical treatments. This is a simple jab the people in their 90's took months ago. We consume far more questionable things than that without a second thought.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117692971#Comment_117692971

But this is wrong, the risk/reward calculation is different now for all the reasons outlined multiple times already, back in February, this might have been true, now it's not:

"What it boils down to is kids by and large absolutely don't need this vaccine, not for themselves, and even militant pro-censorship folks like yourselves won't be able to prevent parents from taking that into consideration when it's time to make the call."

You have claimed in defense of this statement:

Transmission is when symptoms are showing -> not true at all and is one of the reasons SARS-COV2 is so transmissive since it first emerged

Vaccines weren't "designed" to prevent transmission -> not true, it wasn't the priority of safety and efficacy trials but is a target for the vaccines

The last remaining one is that vaccines are more dangerous than the virus, and again, all the safety studies show that this isn't true.

When the virus becomes endemic, the risk of getting a vaccine is far lower than the risk of contracting SARS-COV2 without a vaccine for young people and children.

Del Griffith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117693137#Comment_117693137

"Transmission is when symptoms are showing ->" - No I didn't say that, as you know. I said that primarily the lessening of transmission is credited as a result of the lessening of symptoms. You haven't disputed that.

"Vaccines weren't "designed" to prevent transmission -> not true, it wasn't the priority of safety and efficacy trials but is a target for the vaccines." - Lots of things are a nice target. The vaccines were developed specifically to lesson symptoms and prevent death, end of story. Again you know this.

"The last remaining one is that vaccines are more dangerous than the virus, and again, all the safety studies show that this isn't true." - I never said that at all, that's just a lie of yours. Both have a non-zero risk factor, you will have to accept that.

Are you going to continue to twist things in a desperate search for "misinformation" you can "bust" ?

This is getting ridiculous. Sooner or later you'll just have to accept that parents are allowed free thought (I know, you're livid at the idea but give it a chance).

Mimon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117691094#Comment_117691094

Questioning someone who has no medical knowledge asserting things that require medical knowledge is being aggressive? Sorry but an admin person who has a couple of anecdotal experiences has zero relevance to how the vaccines will effect a whole population.

This thread shows how people can be manipulated by a few anecdotes. Really is a blight on modern society.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117693219#Comment_117693219

I've specifically said that everyone should be able to choose.

What you're doing is giving out wrong information to people which may influence that choice. If you give out wrong information, you will get called up on it. You have now stopped insisting that transmission is only symptomatic, so progress there. I still don't understand what you mean by "The vaccines were developed specifically to lesson symptoms and prevent death, end of story." All vaccines (including SARS-COV2) are developed in the hope of preventing transmission, it's why there is such thing as herd immunity, why you're trying to paint the massive reduction in transmission due to vaccines as some sort of accidental side effect is odd and incorrect, it was very much part of the "design" of the vaccines, but the first priorities are to prevent death and severe symptoms.

So you now agree that the vaccines are less dangerous than contracting SARS-COV2 even for younger people, again some progress.

I'm struggling as to what your argument is now, that parents don't have a choice? (they do), that the choice might be taken away from them (I don't see anyone advocating for that?) or that you don't like people giving out up to date information on vaccines, their effectiveness and their effects on transmission.

Del Griffith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117693265#Comment_117693265

Free information is a blight on society. I've heard it all.

Del Griffith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117693305#Comment_117693305

Christ almighty I'm not going to keep going over the same thing again and again. Please find my previous posts re: Gibraltar and the transmission amongst the vaccinated populous for a real life and current up to date example of this effectiveness.

The generic hope of all vaccines is of little relevance when we're discussing a particular scenario with these particular vaccines that were developed with emergency speed with one emergency task. Such a reach by you over and over just proves you have no real counter.

And again moaning that you're lost in the conversation. I've explained several times my opinion on where this goes and why I hold it, I won't again. If you can't handle the free exchange of ideas and opinions then a message board probably isn't for you, perhaps grab a megaphone and bring the pontificating to the top of Grafton Street on a Sunday morning.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117693374#Comment_117693374

Sure, but see the studies showing that transmission rates drop by up to 80% among the vaccinated vs. un-vaccinated and that countries like Israel which have high vaccination rates are primarily seeing increased transmission due to Delta in areas with a high % of unvaccinated individuals.

Also see cases in places like the UK (and Ireland) plateau or drop rather than keep rising due to high vaccination rates and see the case rates being predominantly among unvaccinated individuals at a much higher % than the numbers vaccinated in the country.

And finally see the inherent safety of vaccines vs. the risks of developing SARS-COV2 for young people.

These are all easily verifiable facts, and to take one of your own, the case rates in Gibraltar have now plateaued again and are mostly downwards since mid July.

Mimon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117693334#Comment_117693334

Yeh social media is known for it's fact based discourse 😶

Sad that people actually use social media and made up anecdotes as their source of "Free information"

Do you understand peer reviewed science or is this new information to you? No doubt to you the scientific community are all part of some big conspiracy.

In any case great to see Irish people are less thick than most populations and are going wholeheartedly for the vaccine instead of buying into the anti vax industry who make millions from it.

These people who have fallen for the snakeoil salesmen are shouting loudest on threads like this but thank fk they are a small part of the population

Del Griffith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117693487#Comment_117693487

Lol conspiracy card, anti vax etc.. there it is again. Did you forget 'far right'?

Have a day off.

d22ontour

Won't be getting my teenager jabbed, there is nothing to say she actually needs it. Case numbers of children needing hospital care or ICU would be beneficial for parents but guess we won't get that data.

Golden girl said hospital cases have doubled for kids,why do we get filtered data from her but any data that would clear up our current stable situation can't be given because of a hack months ago.....