Eoghan Murphy TD resigns...

Pandiculation · 27-04-2021 12:02pm

The housing issue is still very much a product of the 2008 crash and what is now several decades of failure to build adequate social housing.

I think we’re underestimating the impact of that crash though. The reality was at peak we were building 100,000 homes a year. That plummeted to almost none for several years and the capacity hasn’t come back. There have been huge issues with lack of supply and backs that aren’t really in wonderful shape since that era.

COVID could well still bork the economy for another decade, so I think we need to be a hell of a lot more imaginative on housing policy.

I don’t think that haranguing one rep really did much to drive that debate though. If anything, it may have achieved the opposite.

It needs serious politics and people to change voting habits and drive change properly.

Beechwoodspark · 27-04-2021 12:03pm

humberklog wrote: »

But she's can't get elected. She's tried a number of times in a number of constituencies and failed every time. She's failed every time even with huge party support in her campaigns when the party was doing pretty ok in elections.

Whatever good she does for society she's fairly toxic on the ballot and she should, at this stage in her life, be a bit more self-aware about her appeal to people outside of the Dublin 8 Dinner party set.

Toxic??? Wouldn’t go that far at all. Why do you say that.

jpfahy · 27-04-2021 12:05pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

I brief history of Eoghan Murphy

39 years old
Born in Sandymount
5 siblings
Father is Henry Murphy (Senior Counsel on the Mahon tribunal Team, he made over €2m on this tribunal)
Went to fee paying school St Michael's College

You forgot to mention his grandfather Russell Murphy who swindled Gay Byrne and Hugh Leonard out of their money

Jinglejangle69 · 27-04-2021 12:06pm

golfball37 wrote: »

He’ll be neither missed or remembered. Unless it’s for homeless children eating off a pizza box on the street.

Never the parents fault.

Always the government.

Beechwoodspark · 27-04-2021 12:08pm

jpfahy wrote: »

You forgot to mention his grandfather Russell Murphy who swindled Gay Byrne and Hugh Leonard out of their money

I got told off on here for simply suggesting RTÉ should’ve asked Simon Harris brother (who runs an autism charity) what his opinion is about the secret autism files allegation that happened when Simon Harris was minister for Health

this grandfather issue is far more tenuous

Beta Ray Bill · 27-04-2021 12:08pm

jpfahy wrote: »

You forgot to mention his grandfather Russell Murphy who swindled Gay Byrne and Hugh Leonard out of their money

True, but I didn't think that it was completely relevant to Mr Murphy's rapid progress up through the FG party.

Jinglejangle69 · 27-04-2021 12:10pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

True, but I didn't think that it was completely relevant to Mr Murphy's rapid progress up through the FG party.

It's not but sure what does that matter to the mob.

Mad_maxx · 27-04-2021 12:12pm

Cal Croydon wrote: »

Ireland has a poverty porn obsession. It's weird. People in other countries don't focus on the homeless anywhere near as much. But it just makes the Irish so smugly self satisfied to obsess about a tiny number of people living in tents mostly due to mental health issues. And then virtue signal about it to a nauseating degree. Sensible people like Murphy are better off in the multinational sector. No hope battling that tide.

we swapped catholic piety for progressive piety .

talking about homelessness on twitter from your nice apartment in D6 is like your granny doing the stations of the cross in the local church

landofthetree · 27-04-2021 12:13pm

Pandiculation wrote: »

The housing issue is still very much a product of the 2008 crash and what is now several decades of failure to build adequate social housing.

I think we’re underestimating the impact of that crash though. The reality was at peak we were building 100,000 homes a year. That plummeted to almost none for several years and the capacity hasn’t come back. There have been huge issues with lack of supply and backs that aren’t really in wonderful shape since that era.

COVID could well still bork the economy for another decade, so I think we need to be a hell of a lot more imaginative on housing policy.

I don’t think that haranguing one rep really did much to drive that debate though. If anything, it may have achieved the opposite.

It needs serious politics and people to change voting habits and drive change properly.

Yep. So many people have either left the construction industry or gone abroad. Plus loads of the big construction companies went under. Then we had few new people trained up for years. Both on the trade and professional side.

2019 report:

There has been a 55 per cent decrease in civil and building engineering graduates over the last five years, despite a jump in starting salaries and thousands of job openings in the sector.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/critical-shortage-of-engineering-graduates-1.3816692

Plus add in the fact that we shut construction down for months and we will have lost many workers to the UK.

Also the cheap labour from the likes of Poland isnt as plentiful as they are having their own construction boom.

We haven't the people nor the companies to build the houses required.

Mad_maxx · 27-04-2021 12:13pm

I see sheep wrote: »

I don't have a clue what you're on about, I have know idea where he's from and I don't care.

He didn't do anything do help the housing crisis and I believe that's because FG don't care about it.

which party has the dominant position on Dublin City Council ?

MrMusician18 · 27-04-2021 12:13pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

He called Co-Living arrangements "Exciting".... doesn't sound very decent or humane to me. I see that as a step backwards in fact.

Look, lets be serious here: this was a job for him to do, cause there was nothing else for him to do. This is normal situation for Millionaires kids, they've never had to work for anything and aren't hungry enough to succeed.
They end up going into things like quangos, politics, on the board of semi-state bodies, acting, music, etc

We need TD's that most of us can in some way relate to, I fully get he was handed a lemon as the Minister for Housing, but he made things worse rather than better.

Co-living had the potential to take hundreds or possibly thousands of migratory or transitory workers (eg tech workers on short secondment, summer workers) out of the apartment rental market. A market that summer workers find is often overcrowded and very low quality. It could've quickly opened this accommodation for permanent residents to occupy - residents that could insist on higher standards.

Co living was never intended as permanent housing, but a stepping stone to finding more permanent accommodation. When I moved to London the first time, I was very grateful that I could find a co living space for the first month until I found a room.

The lies and misinformation spread around co living is quite remarkable. It's almost like it was used by some to score political points.

mariaalice · 27-04-2021 12:13pm

jpfahy wrote: »

You forgot to mention his grandfather Russell Murphy who swindled Gay Byrne and Hugh Leonard out of their money

What has that got to do with anything?

Curious do posters really think the family of a TD should be an issue or for that matter their accent background etc.

To me, it always comes across as a chip on the shoulder more than a concern about their policies.

Northernlily · 27-04-2021 12:16pm

is_that_so wrote: »

Kate O'Connell to mount a comeback?

Maria Bailey might swing into the constituency from Dún Laoghaire.

blanch152 · 27-04-2021 12:16pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Co-living had the potential to take hundreds or possibly thousands of migratory or transitory workers (eg tech workers on short secondment, summer workers) out of the apartment rental market. A market that summer workers find is often overcrowded and very low quality. It could've quickly opened this accommodation for permanent residents to occupy - residents that could insist on higher standards.

Co living was never intended as permanent housing, but a stepping stone to finding more permanent accommodation. When I moved to London the first time, I was very grateful that I could find a co living space for the first month until I found a room.

The lies and misinformation spread around co living is quite remarkable. It's almost like it was used by some to score political points.

It was used to score political points.

You are actually quite correct about co-living. It is a minority of housing provision for a minority of people who want it. They should have their housing needs looked after too.

landofthetree · 27-04-2021 12:17pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Bitter post tbh. Most people elected to a council for the first time have no experience in politics, it is the lowest rung of political representation ladder in Ireland after all.

Matt Carthy has never held a job outside politics according to his linkedin.

https://ie.linkedin.com/in/matt-carthy-6562b047

Too many of these types in all parties.

MrMusician18 · 27-04-2021 12:17pm

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

In fairness to bacik she has worked for many many years on women’s rights etc. Also is a professor of law.

You can knock her on some issues but there’s no denying She has a lot of experience and expertise.

A lot of experience and expertise in being rejected by the electorate one might say.

Beta Ray Bill · 27-04-2021 12:18pm

landofthetree wrote: »

They work well in other countries.

I would have liked to live in one in my 20s instead of a houseshare.

Lots of things work well in other countries that don't work well here and vice versa

Co-living would have been an absolute disaster, it would have been Darndale/Ballymun 2.0
Most people who are for these kind of arrangements have never had to live in them or spend time around them.
They are a disaster and create more problems than they solve.

It'd be fine if they moved a bunch of professionals in, but they would more likely move in lone parents that are unable to work due to raising their children, and layabouts that don't want to work. This creates a perfect storm for major social problems.

Irish people have a "Mind your own business" mentality, which is actually quite unique to us. And that is the core reason these kind of housing arrangements do not work.

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Co-living had the potential to take hundreds or possibly thousands of migratory or transitory workers (eg tech workers on short secondment, summer workers) out of the apartment rental market.

It was never marketed as that to us though.
It was was perceived as the end Solution.

And just to put something in perspective for you, I used to work for a bank in the IT dept.
We had at least 15 software Devs working on day rate contracts €400/500 per day working mon-fri that were commuting from the UK
These people arrived in Dublin on the first flight on Monday morning and then stayed in a hotel until Fri and then flew home. Hotel stays were tax deductible so it didn't actually cost very much. They were all friends and could have rented an apartment together but didn't, quite simply because they were high earners and didn't want to.
So what reason is there to believe that they'd all suddenly go into a co living arrangement (That would probably cost more!)

It was a MAD idea designed to get a load of people on the housing list off the housing list.

archfi · 27-04-2021 12:19pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Co-living had the potential to take hundreds or possibly thousands of migratory or transitory workers (eg tech workers on short secondment, summer workers) out of the apartment rental market. A market that summer workers find is often overcrowded and very low quality. It could've quickly opened this accommodation for permanent residents to occupy - residents that could insist on higher standards.

Co living was never intended as permanent housing, but a stepping stone to finding more permanent accommodation. When I moved to London the first time, I was very grateful that I could find a co living space for the first month until I found a room.

The lies and misinformation spread around co living is quite remarkable. It's almost like it was used by some to score political points.

And the rent prices and contract lengths were going to be...?

Pandiculation · 27-04-2021 12:25pm

landofthetree wrote: »

Yep. So many people have either left the construction industry or gone abroad. Plus loads of the big construction companies went under. Then we had few new people trained up for years. Both on the trade and professional side.

2019 report:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/critical-shortage-of-engineering-graduates-1.3816692

Plus add in the fact that we shut construction down for months and we will have lost many workers to the UK.

Also the cheap labour from the likes of Poland isnt as plentiful as they are having their own construction boom.

We haven't the people nor the companies to build the houses required.

I also know a few people who worked in construction here from other parts of the EU who were in no rush to come back when it did take off too as they felt they’d had their fingers burnt by how suddenly it collapsed here in 2008. There was a lot of upheaval for people who had built lives here in the early 2000s.

I think though the huge risk now is a COVID driven global impact recession.

This pandemic still has a long way to run.

The only positive is it might also open up more remote working options which could fill some of those ghost estates in the midlands and so on, taking a lot of pressure off Dublin and other cities housing stock but it also has downsides in terms of potentially reducing urban economic activity.

There a lot of stuff to play out yet and a lot of unknowable unknowns.

Hopefully we’ve learnt the lesson that healthcare and housing are as essential to the economy and national security as motorways, power stations and airports.

MrMusician18 · 27-04-2021 12:26pm

archfi wrote: »

And the rent prices and contract lengths were going to be...?

Three were going to be whatever the market price for such accommodation is. In London they are relatively expensive and leases were short, typically month to month. Some places were week to week.

As I said, thry designed for short term stays (but longer than one might stay in a hotel) and places for migrant workers to find their feet when arriving in a new country. They weren't a bad idea and there was room for them in the accommodation mix.

landofthetree · 27-04-2021 12:26pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

Lots of things work well in other countries that don't work well here and vice versa

Co-living would have been an absolute disaster, it would have been Darndale/Ballymun 2.0
Most people who are for these kind of arrangements have never had to live in them or spend time around them.
They are a disaster and create more problems than they solve.

It'd be fine if they moved a bunch of professionals in, but they would more likely move in lone parents that are unable to work due to raising their children, and layabouts that don't want to work. This creates a perfect storm for major social problems.

Irish people have a "Mind your own business" mentality, which is actually quite unique to us. And that is the core reason these kind of housing arrangements do not work.

The left in opposition ie SF SD Lab etc claim they want a Nordic style model for Ireland.

Yet they dont want highrise,co-living,property tax etc.

Its almost as if they are full of shi1t.

humberklog · 27-04-2021 12:29pm

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Toxic??? Wouldn’t go that far at all. Why do you say that.

Her record in elections.

Following her campaigning over the years.

I was on one election following her through Dublin 8 for a few days. She had 12 Labour Reps with her the full time knocking on doors and one rep was Rauri Quinn from a Friday to Monday. This was in the 00's, (I'll have to check photo files for exact one).
What struck me was how she introduced herself, even though she lived about 8 doors down, everyone was a total stranger. There was no house that knew her. She let Quinn do all the introductions and talking. When she tried to engage with people on the street she was roundly dismissed, whilst Quinn was given a big "Hi Rauri".

Another election, a bye-election on the Northside I caught up with her again for a day campaigning outside the Phibsborough Shopping Centre. It was about the 20th time I'd met her, I was even on her quiz team once and at a small house wedding (16 people) but of course she needed me to introduce myself all over again (if you're not in her sphere you're no one).
I asked her what connection she had with the Northside and she said "my husband's from the Northside so that qualifies me!!" and laughed her head off. No one else was laughing. During the 6 hours or so I was with her that day the reception she got was brutal. She brushed people off as soon as she suspected they weren't her "set". They were brushed off quickly and plentiful.

To see her people skills and the reaction she recieved I popped her into the box as "toxic", meaning to me- not a popular person and not a person people will vote for. And they didn't, never have.

I'm using the word "toxic" only in a political attraction frame.

I always make sure to say Hi to her, even though it's usually received with a snooty look down her nose- before the lockdown I was with Rosalean McDonagh from Pavee Point, she's a fairly well known Traveller advocate. We were outside having coffee and Ivana walks by, "Hiiii Rosalean!! (they know each other from Trinity)...how are you! and Hi who are you? Are you connected with Pavee..". No Ivana, we've met before. Many times.

She is an awful snob, like really awful. I kinda like her- but I wouldn't vote for her. But who does?

Beta Ray Bill · 27-04-2021 12:31pm

landofthetree wrote: »

The left in opposition ie SF SD Lab etc claim they want a Nordic style model for Ireland.

Yet they dont want highrise,co-living,property tax etc.

Its almost as if they are full of shi1t.

I fully agree with you!

We do need high rise, but it needs to be done in a way which is unique and compatible with "How Irish People Are", to my knowledge there has never been study on this, and we constantly look at what other people are doing and try there ideas rather than come up with our own.

golfball37 · 27-04-2021 12:32pm

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Never the parents fault.

Always the government.

Perception is always more powerful than reality.

gormdubhgorm · 27-04-2021 12:50pm

RandomViewer wrote: »

Will FF/FG/Green do the unionist thing and have an agreed candidate?

I see the 'West Brit' implication was nicely slid in there - well played. Very dexterous indeed :rolleyes:

Pandiculation · 27-04-2021 1:06pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

Irish people have a "Mind your own business" mentality, which is actually quite unique to us. And that is the core reason these kind of housing arrangements do not work.
.

I don’t agree with that being unique to us. Having lived in a few places on the continent I’d actually have said that’s far more pronounced in say Belgium, the Netherlands, Scandinavia, Germany or even France. They aren’t slow to say “Occupe-toi de tes oignons!!!”

I think the concept of co-living is just awful tbh. You need privacy. It’s a basic human right.

That being said, we’ve extensive ad hoc co living with many younger adults having no option but to house share.

I’d prefer the pokey Parisian studio apartment to either coliving or a house share here.

iffandonlyif · 27-04-2021 1:13pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

I brief history of Eoghan Murphy

...

Fingers crossed SF will run a strong candidate in the by election and get them down to 83.

Grateful for that unbiased history.

He was a poor TD, way out of his depth and suffering from "How could you not possibly love me?" syndrome

Was it his accent that so offended you?

Fann Linn · 27-04-2021 1:18pm

I really don't give a damn who wins this seat so long as it's not Bacik or Chu. I'll even grudgingly tolerate FFG.

Beechwoodspark · 27-04-2021 1:20pm

humberklog wrote: »

Her record in elections.

Following her campaigning over the years.

I was on one election following her through Dublin 8 for a few days. She had 12 Labour Reps with her the full time knocking on doors and one rep was Rauri Quinn who was giving time off his own campaign to help her from a Friday to Monday. This was in the 00's, (I'll have to check photo files for exact one).
What struck me was how she introduced herself, even though she lived about 8 doors down, everyone was a total stranger. There was no house that knew her. She let Quinn do all the introductions and talking. When she tried to engage with people on the street she was roundly dismissed, whilst Quinn was given a big "Hi Rauri".

Another election, a bye-election on the Northside I caught up with her again for a day campaigning outside the Phibsborough Shopping Centre. It was about the 20th time I'd met her, I was even on her quiz team once and at a small house wedding (16 people) but of course she needed me to introduce myself all over again (if you're not in her sphere you're no one).
I asked her what connection she had with the Northside and she said "my husband's from the Northside so that qualifies me!!" and laughed her head off. No one else was laughing. During the 6 hours or so I was with her that day the reception she got was brutal. She brushed people off as soon as she suspected they weren't her "set". They were brushed off quickly and plentiful.

To see her people skills and the reaction she recieved I popped her into the box as "toxic", meaning to me- not a popular person and not a person people will vote for. And they didn't, never have.

I'm using the word "toxic" only in a political attraction frame.

I always make sure to say Hi to her, even though it's usually received with a snooty look down her nose- before the lockdown I was with Rosalean McDonagh from Pavee Point, she's a fairly well known Traveller advocate. We were outside having coffee and Ivana walks by, "Hiiii Rosalean!! (they know each other from Trinity)...how are you! and Hi who are you? Are you connected with Pavee..". No Ivana, we've met before. Many times.

She is an awful snob, like really awful. I kinda like her- but I wouldn't vote for her. But who does?

Or maybe you are a completely unremarkable and unmemorable person, so much so that a person who has multiple meetings with you has no recollection .....who knows !

markodaly · 27-04-2021 1:21pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

I brief history of Eoghan Murphy

39 years old
Born in Sandymount
5 siblings
Father is Henry Murphy (Senior Counsel on the Mahon tribunal Team, he made over €2m on this tribunal)
Went to fee paying school St Michael's College
"Worked" for UN up until 2008
In 2009 he was elected to Pembroke–Rathmines Council having no prior political experience (At the age 27)
After just 2 years he was elected to the Dail in 2011 (At the age of 29)
Made minister for housing in 2017 and had a motion of no confidence tabled against him on that year.
In 2019 a 2nd motion of no confidence was tabled against him.

By far the most controversial change he made during his time as a housing minister, he gave builder/developers the ability to bypass local councils, this in turn allowed said builders and developers to build what ever they wanted, where ever they wanted without any reasonable planning.
He also had other hair brained ideas like "Co-living"

He was a poor TD, way out of his depth and suffering from "How could you not possibly love me?" syndrome
He some how managed to get into politics at 27 despite having no political career prior to that, (He worked on Arms regulation at the UN, a far cry from international relations/politics) No doubt he was pushed along by the wealth of Parents (as are his siblings).

It was clear that politics was "Something for him to do", he's never had to do a tap in his life. (Along with a great many other TD's from South Dublin)
He's a complete disconnect with an average member of the electorate.

Chris Andrews got in 2nd on the 8th count in 2020, fingers crossed SF will run a strong candidate in the by election and get them down to 83
This governments performance has been appalling to say the least, I'd say he wanted to leave a few months back, but was asked to stay until covid issue had settled a bit.

The bits in bold are falsehoods being peddled.
Readers should be aware that they are lies.

Eoghan Murphy TD resigns...

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