Mart Price Tracker

kk.man · 22-04-2021 1:46pm

Jb1989 wrote: »

Can they rise anymore?

4.10 base for steers now... It ant over yet

Dunedin · 22-04-2021 2:16pm

kk.man wrote: »

4.10 base for steers now... It ant over yet

My worry on this that when the pull comes, it comes heavy and quick. I’ll happily eat my words if they’re 4.10 next August-September

kk.man · 22-04-2021 2:21pm

Dunedin wrote: »

My worry on this that when the pull comes, it comes heavy and quick. I’ll happily eat my words if they’re 4.10 next August-September

Fat cattle are extremely scarce and will be till autumn.

tanko · 22-04-2021 2:24pm

The base price should be at least 4.50, the price fixing cartel are screwing us as usual.

Jb1989 · 22-04-2021 2:58pm

kk.man wrote: »

4.10 base for steers now... It ant over yet

I knew the factory was increaseing, tho will the Marts edge up at the same rate as I was referencing to with kollege nights heifers. , they are already dearer than what most of us can kill at with profit.
Saying that I know round here the northern influence buying factory ready in the mart is fairly good.
If all end costs go up then maybe we'll have a good summer.

Dozer1 · 22-04-2021 3:54pm

Running a bit tight on grass these 2 ladies were 640 kgs and 574kgs 3 weeks ago both are 26mths old would I better better off to mart them or horse em nuts for a few weeks.

kk.man · 22-04-2021 4:03pm

Dozer1 wrote: »

Running a bit tight on grass these 2 ladies were 640 kgs and 574kgs 3 weeks ago both are 26mths old would I better better off to mart them or horse em nuts for a few weeks.

Will the second one grade an R-.... (open question).. Tbh I don't think weight or age will matter this summer. They r char cross Fr and have the ability to keep into weights without goin over fat. I really like those types.

morphy87 · 22-04-2021 4:29pm

kk.man wrote: »

Will the second one grade an R-.... (open question).. Tbh I don't think weight or age will matter this summer. They r char cross Fr and have the ability to keep into weights without goin over fat. I really like those types.

Why do you think age and weight won’t matter this summer? I know 3 men back my way that would normally have around 400 cattle between them ready off the grass from August onwards, they have no cattle now between the 3 of them, changed their farming systems

Albert Johnson · 22-04-2021 4:39pm

Jb1989 wrote: »

I knew the factory was increaseing, tho will the Marts edge up at the same rate as I was referencing to with kollege nights heifers. , they are already dearer than what most of us can kill at with profit.
Saying that I know round here the northern influence buying factory ready in the mart is fairly good.
If all end costs go up then maybe we'll have a good summer.

I'm hearing of price pulls and reduced demand for fat IE born cattle in the Northern factories recently although it's only from listening to lad's and not first hand experience. The Nomad status issue seems to have disappeared off the radar in recent year's but I don't think it's gone away entirely.

The sole driver behind exporting store or fat cattle to the North is that there cheaper in the Republic. If the live price increases in the South or the factory price reduces in the North then this difference is eroded. The cross border trade for beef stock is a welcome boost but it's not something I'd be totally relying upon at all times.

Albert Johnson · 22-04-2021 4:45pm

I see Dowra mart has cancelled this week's sheep and cattle sales in accordance with "HSE guidelines and as a precautionary measure". I've said it before but I wouldn't envy a mart managers job atm and there's no sign of any more breathing room being allocated as regards restrictions in the short term.

kk.man · 22-04-2021 5:28pm

morphy87 wrote: »

Why do you think age and weight won’t matter this summer? I know 3 men back my way that would normally have around 400 cattle between them ready off the grass from August onwards, they have no cattle now between the 3 of them, changed their farming systems

When cattle are scarce, age etc go out the window. I saw a factory docket 4 weeks ago for what could be described as a load of screws all priced at 4e flat. There was bulls and cows in the mix. This will be a good summer for beef.

Now I admit I'm not a betting man {only a lotto ticket or two) so I'm not putting my house on anything but the omens are good.

Bass Reeves · 22-04-2021 7:20pm

Dozer1 wrote: »

Running a bit tight on grass these 2 ladies were 640 kgs and 574kgs 3 weeks ago both are 26mths old would I better better off to mart them or horse em nuts for a few weeks.

Really hard call. As kk said they will carry weight. If they were mine I try to struggle throught the grass shortage unless it's going to run for a while. I be feeding them 3kgs and holding them for 8-10weeks. I killed a heifer like them 2-3 years ago 380kg DW at FS 3+. Feeding nuts even to quality cattle is only a bit with break even at best. Going up a grade may add a bit but that's it

kk.man wrote: »

Will the second one grade an R-.... (open question).. Tbh I don't think weight or age will matter this summer. They r char cross Fr and have the ability to keep into weights without goin over fat. I really like those types.

Ya at present she looks O+/R-. Will be hard to feed her into an R+. Other heifer could feed into a U at 4= but she be fairy heavy at that. Having said all that heifers go fat very fast off May grass along but can then slip back a couple of FS's

Dozer1 · 22-04-2021 7:50pm

thanks All, they are in a bunch of 7 that are a mixed bag, I'll see how weekend goes but currently looking like I'll graze the silage ground next week with the cows & calves as walked it today and it had made very poor progress.

that'll free up ground for these girls plan was to hold em till June and let em off then.
I guess question was will the mart give me the same return now as factory in a 2 months given trade seems on the up in general

Bass Reeves · 22-04-2021 8:18pm

Dozer1 wrote: »

thanks All, they are in a bunch of 7 that are a mixed bag, I'll see how weekend goes but currently looking like I'll graze the silage ground next week with the cows & calves as walked it today and it had made very poor progress.

that'll free up ground for these girls plan was to hold em till June and let em off then.
I guess question was will the mart give me the same return now as factory in a 2 months given trade seems on the up in general

Them sort of heifers can do 1.5+kgs/ day on good grass alone. Say they do 2.2/ kg LW( heavier cattle struggle to hit the really high prices) say they are 600 average mart weight and make 1350 euro each.

In 60 days time allow them to gain 90 kgs each. The better heifer could hang at or over 400 kgs DW and at a base of 4/ kg she could gross over 1700 euro

The other heifer would not gain as much hanging at maybe 350 DW she could hit 1475 euro.

Of course that is all dependent on having them bombing along. I put them on 3kg and grass of maize/barley/ hulls mix if I could

Anto_Meath · 22-04-2021 8:47pm

I hear talk of forward stores & beef been bought for export to Manchester at €2:30 - €2:40/kg lw, that's bound to keep beef prices up for awhile if that carries on

Bass Reeves · 22-04-2021 9:17pm

Anto_Meath wrote: »

I hear talk of forward stores & beef been bought for export to Manchester at €2:30 - €2:40/kg lw, that's bound to keep beef prices up for awhile if that carries on

That is all great until October/ November when 4k extra cattle per week start to come on stream. It would be great if it continues. There was an old saying went something like this

It takes a good live export trade to keep life in the dead trade.

josephsoap · 22-04-2021 10:02pm

Albert Johnson wrote: »

I see Dowra mart has cancelled this week's sheep and cattle sales in accordance with "HSE guidelines and as a precautionary measure". I've said it before but I wouldn't envy a mart managers job atm and there's no sign of any more breathing room being allocated as regards restrictions in the short term.

Would it have been closed on animal welfare grounds or do you think they were shut down for not adhering to Covid guidelines ?

Good loser · 22-04-2021 11:06pm

tanko wrote: »

The base price should be at least 4.50, the price fix
ing cartel are screwing us as usual.

That's blinkered begrudgery.

When prices fall factories are conspiring to pull prices.
When prices increase by 25c/kg in a fortnight (when did that ever happen before) they should have increased by another 40c/kg!

Albert Johnson · 22-04-2021 11:08pm

josephsoap wrote: »

Would it have been closed on animal welfare grounds or do you think they were shut down for not adhering to Covid guidelines ?

The short answer is I don't know and therefore I'm only speculating as to the reason. However I don't see why animal welfare would have been an issue and my gut feeling would be it's Covid guideline related.

Bass Reeves · 22-04-2021 11:46pm

Good loser wrote: »

That's blinkered begrudgery.

When prices fall factories are conspiring to pull prices.
When prices increase by 25c/kg in a fortnight (when did that ever happen before) they should have increased by another 40c/kg!

On a 340 kg carcasse there is now a 270 euro difference between the UK and Ireland even after the f@@king 25c. Where we are now we should have been at Christmas. The penny is even dropping now with those that gave the market forces BS up to now. Every farm organisation is up in arms over it at this stage. I suppose we will have some one trot on soon and blame BP

morphy87 · 23-04-2021 9:31am

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Them sort of heifers can do 1.5+kgs/ day on good grass alone. Say they do 2.2/ kg LW( heavier cattle struggle to hit the really high prices) say they are 600 average mart weight and make 1350 euro each.

In 60 days time allow them to gain 90 kgs each. The better heifer could hang at or over 400 kgs DW and at a base of 4/ kg she could gross over 1700 euro

The other heifer would not gain as much hanging at maybe 350 DW she could hit 1475 euro.

Of course that is all dependent on having them bombing along. I put them on 3kg and grass of maize/barley/ hulls mix if I could

What kind of daily life weight gain would you be exspecting from continental cattle out British fresian cows, around 600kgs at the moment, hope to sell first week of September,will feed 5kgs of ration for the last 6 weeks

Bass Reeves · 23-04-2021 9:40pm

morphy87 wrote: »

What kind of daily life weight gain would you be exspecting from continental cattle out British fresian cows, around 600kgs at the moment, hope to sell first week of September,will feed 5kgs of ration for the last 6 weeks

Friesians are great to put on weight it's there size and K/O that they struggle with.

On 5kgs with decent grass I have expect them to do 1.5kgs/day. At that level of ration they will be replacing grass with ration in the he diet. I be trying to get a low protein high Me ration. A barley/hulls/maize mix would be ideal. This will put flesh on them not bone.

At 600kgs they would be eating 12kgs DM per day. They say animals can eat about 500grams/100kgs LW without effecting intake or reducing it much. After that they replace grass DM with ration DM kg for kg

richie123 · 23-04-2021 9:47pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

On a 340 kg carcasse there is now a 270 euro difference between the UK and Ireland even after the f@@king 25c. Where we are now we should have been at Christmas. The penny is even dropping now with those that gave the market forces BS up to now. Every farm organisation is up in arms over it at this stage. I suppose we will have some one trot on soon and blame BP

Would a lot of that 270 difference be down to checks and increased transport costs to the UK?

kk.man · 23-04-2021 10:07pm

richie123 wrote: »

Would a lot of that 270 difference be down to checks and increased transport costs to the UK?

Not a hope. They export in bulk and cut price haulage contracts. Imo Everthing been equal the difference could be 50e max on a whole carcass and that would be the outside of it. Whole carcasses are not the norm anymore but that is a flavour of the price differintal.

I'd tend to agree with Mll that they only supplying 3 of the top ten supermarket chain directly however I suspect that there is more to the story of indirect selling.

The food service trade/wholesale is a big pull on Irish beef and that's where much of the beef goes.

Bass Reeves · 23-04-2021 10:39pm

kk.man wrote: »

Not a hope. They export in bulk and cut price haulage contracts. Imo Everthing been equal the difference could be 50e max on a whole carcass and that would be the outside of it. Whole carcasses are not the norm anymore but that is a flavour of the price differintal.

I'd tend to agree with Mll that they only supplying 3 of the top ten supermarket chain directly however I suspect that there is more to the story of indirect selling.

The food service trade/wholesale is a big pull on Irish beef and that's where much of the beef goes.

And the food service trade/wholesale would not have the same negotiating strength as large retailers or the like of McD's.

ruwithme · 23-04-2021 10:39pm

Albert Johnson wrote: »

The short answer is I don't know and therefore I'm only speculating as to the reason. However I don't see why animal welfare would have been an issue and my gut feeling would be it's Covid guideline related.

https://www.northernsound.ie/news/dowra-mart-cancels-weekend-sales-due-to-covid-19-precautions-173110

kk.man · 23-04-2021 11:58pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

And the good service trade/wholesale would not have the same negotiating strength as large retailers or the like of McD's.

Plus 1 Bass. When the food service sees the v expensive British product vrs The Irish they will go with ours. When you go to a pub or restaurant very few label where the beef comes from.

McDonald's was a huge contract for Dawn, I'd say price of the contract wasn't the only deciding factor for the victor. Still very lucrative mince in mass production format is big bucks.

richie123 · 24-04-2021 11:07am

kk.man wrote: »

Not a hope. They export in bulk and cut price haulage contracts. Imo Everthing been equal the difference could be 50e max on a whole carcass and that would be the outside of it. Whole carcasses are not the norm anymore but that is a flavour of the price differintal.

I'd tend to agree with Mll that they only supplying 3 of the top ten supermarket chain directly however I suspect that there is more to the story of indirect selling.

The food service trade/wholesale is a big pull on Irish beef and that's where much of the beef goes.

Playing devils advocate here ,
If what your saying is true why are uk supermarkets not buying more Irish beef if its same quality and a lot cheaper ?

Bass Reeves · 24-04-2021 11:58am

richie123 wrote: »

Playing devils advocate here ,
If what your saying is true why are uk supermarkets not buying more Irish beef if its same quality and a lot cheaper ?

Because they will stock the red tractor logo beef first. It's s bit like NDC council logo in Irish milk. Saw somewhere recently that there was a 23% rise in demand from UK retailers for beef in the first quarter this year with the close down. People will only eat so much chicken. Personally I finding it hard to get decent pork at present. A lot of it is very tough so not suitable for either frying or grilling.

You are right to ask the questions Richie but we are not getting a fair rub from processor's. If they cannot push up the price to retailers when demand is high and numbers are lower than for years where are we going.

I think the really interesting thing to look at is the demand for AA beef. Obviously consumers are buying red tractor logo AA beef first and a lot are the moving to the Irish AA beef rather than taking non AA RTL beef from the shelf. Maybe they take RTL HE and then move to Irish AA beef.

If you hadn't a cartel some processor would break rank and grab market share but again you see the way it seem every processor seems to be working on a quota of what they kill

richie123 · 24-04-2021 2:32pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Because they will stock the red tractor logo beef first. It's s bit like NDC council logo in Irish milk. Saw somewhere recently that there was a 23% rise in demand from UK retailers for beef in the first quarter this year with the close down. People will only eat so much chicken. Personally I finding it hard to get decent pork at present. A lot of it is very tough so not suitable for either frying or grilling.

You are right to ask the questions Richie but we are not getting a fair rub from processor's. If they cannot push up the price to retailers when demand is high and numbers are lower than for years where are we going.

I think the really interesting thing to look at is the demand for AA beef. Obviously consumers are buying red tractor logo AA beef first and a lot are the moving to the Irish AA beef rather than taking non AA RTL beef from the shelf. Maybe they take RTL HE and then move to Irish AA beef.

If you hadn't a cartel some processor would break rank and grab market share but again you see the way it seem every processor seems to be working on a quota of what they kill

Price has rose 25 cent in past few weeks.if it was a cartel there would be no price rise would you not agree ?
Would lack of supply with the kill being down have anything to do with it ?
Demand being up?

I'm saying it a long time like a broken recorder at this stage..less stock is more money at less cost for the farmer.

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