Government flip flops / school closures

Rosita · 07-01-2021 9:26pm

[QUOTE=amacca;115843120

Think about the sequence of events and tell me govt didn't deliberately try to get this outcome.[/QUOTE]

If they did I think they were foolish, which in fairness doesn't make it less likely.

It was issue not about pay; the government was clearly ignoring the crazy rate of infection transmission; was clearly going against the advice they are giving to anyone else who can work from home; and even Principals and Students were up in arms.

If this is some kind 'you have us exactly where we want you' victory for the government they are even more out of touch than I thought.

ShamoBuc · 07-01-2021 9:26pm

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Is this just at primary level?

Jesus - they can't even row back with clarity

INTO are only primary.

However, SNA's probably wont be allowed in either as their union Forsa are looking for a pause for next week.

gaiscioch · 07-01-2021 9:27pm

If they're going to cancel the LC again, it would be preferable if they did it now. I suppose they must carry on with another few months of sham "The LC will definitely be on" before they cancel it, wasting everybody's time and energy in the process.

Logically, if the reason they cancelled last year was because it was unfair to so many students who hadn't access to the relevant technology, etc, the reality this year isn't too different for the kids from the same poor areas or isolated/poor broadband areas. I feel like I'll be wasting everybody's time with my 6th years after this.

km79 · 07-01-2021 9:29pm

The worst thing about this is all the time that could have been used to prepare further for remote learning has been wasted on pointless exercises such as rejigging timetables etc etc
And all the unnecessary stress

Rosita · 07-01-2021 9:30pm

gaiscioch wrote: »

If they're now going to cancel the LC, it would be preferable if they did it now. I suppose they must carry on with another few months of sham "The LC will definitely be on" before they cancel it, wasting everybody's time and energy in the process.

Logically, if the reason they cancelled last year was because it was unfair to so many students who hadn't access to the relevant technology, etc, the reality this year isn't too different for the kids from the same poor areas or isolated/poor broadband area. I feel like I'll be wasting everybody's time with my 6th years after this.

They will want to avoid cancelling it until students have chosen their levels. But given the horrendous level of infection about at the moment and an R rate between 2.4 and 3 there is no guarantee that we will be in school anytime soon so even the box-ticking exercises mightn't happen.

km79 · 07-01-2021 9:30pm

gaiscioch wrote: »

If they're going to cancel the LC again, it would be preferable if they did it now. I suppose they must carry on with another few months of sham "The LC will definitely be on" before they cancel it, wasting everybody's time and energy in the process.

Logically, if the reason they cancelled last year was because it was unfair to so many students who hadn't access to the relevant technology, etc, the reality this year isn't too different for the kids from the same poor areas or isolated/poor broadband areas. I feel like I'll be wasting everybody's time with my 6th years after this.

It’s a dead duck now imo
As for the JC ......

TheValeyard · 07-01-2021 9:30pm

For perfectly selfish reasons I hope creches stay open. Teaching with two kids under four is a nightmare scenario.

Treppen · 07-01-2021 9:30pm

Norma on RTE at 9:30

Now the issue of LEaving Cert, Special Schools and online learning is to the fore.

2011abc · 07-01-2021 9:33pm

gaiscioch wrote: »

If they're going to cancel the LC again, it would be preferable if they did it now. I suppose they must carry on with another few months of sham "The LC will definitely be on" before they cancel it, wasting everybody's time and energy in the process.

Logically, if the reason they cancelled last year was because it was unfair to so many students who hadn't access to the relevant technology, etc, the reality this year isn't too different for the kids from the same poor areas or isolated/poor broadband areas. I feel like I'll be wasting everybody's time with my 6th years after this.

Just imagine being a lazy but 'bright' Sixth Year (a very common beast)who has only had three months this year and four or five last year to 'impress' their teacher.There will be some Herculean work done 'online' in next few weeks by these lads !

Smacruairi · 07-01-2021 9:41pm

Panicked parent wrote: »

So can can proper supports be given to child in special schools and units by a zoom call. Of course not.Their abandonment will be shameful.

Email josepha Madigan. She said extra supports will be made available to you. If she doesn't give you specifics, she is lying to you, take it to the media.

Random sample · 07-01-2021 9:43pm

What would be the point in cancelling now? No learning is wasted. They still need to have a certain level of education leaving school.

History Queen · 07-01-2021 9:46pm

2011abc wrote: »

Just imagine being a lazy but 'bright' Sixth Year (a very common beast)who has only had three months this year and four or five last year to 'impress' their teacher.There will be some Herculean work done 'online' in next few weeks by these lads !

Once predicted grades were called last year we had no further interaction with the students so that wouldn't happen.

Panicked parent · 07-01-2021 9:46pm

Smacruairi wrote: »

Email josepha Madigan. She said extra supports will be made available to you. If she doesn't give you specifics, she is lying to you, take it to the media.

Where would I get the time? Remote teaching and homeschooling. I’m sorry but your post comes across as not understanding the predicament

amacca · 07-01-2021 9:49pm

Rosita wrote: »

If they did I think they were foolish, which in fairness doesn't make it less likely.

It was issue not about pay; the government was clearly ignoring the crazy rate of infection transmission; was clearly going against the advice they are giving to anyone else who can work from home; and even Principals and Students were up in arms.

If this is some kind 'you have us exactly where we want you' victory for the government they are even more out of touch than I thought.

No ...they failed to prepare any sort of contingency for an eventuality like this and needed cover

Think of the alternative of them just doing the right thing and all the ****storm that would descend on them alone, they aren't that noble and aim to cling on to power regardless of competence for as long as possible

They have managed to divert attention away from their poor planning, give themselves cover for the schools closing (if it turned out that had to be done)and not just have their bib dirtied but muddy the waters and apportion blame to teachers/unions + be able to say a lot of students/parents were calling for it too.....and they have a bit of a get out of jail free card in that they can sacrifice Norma (and kudos to MM for the strategic appointment there imo)if it has to come to that and the news cycle will surely lurch to another crisis soon enough ....vaccinations/brexit/house prices etc

It's in the finest tradition of spineless ass covering weasleling political survival strategies imo......

At least that's my reading of it.....if you think they are just a bunch of incompetents then maybe you are correct...i just think incompetents with an extremely well developed survival instinct....you don't survive decades in politics withput learning how to deflect blame, manipulate situations to your own ends etc

If there were any viable alternatives that weren't crazier or less desirable it wouldn't be so bad.

07-01-2021 9:51pm

Weepsie wrote: »

the leaving cert has long needed a shakeup.

Has long needed removing, more like. It's a waste of time as a measure of how intelligent a person is, as it's the definition of rote learning.

Everyone who attends 90%+ of their scheduled days should just get an auto-pass on all the 'normal/textbook' subjects, and then an exam on the practical stuff.

Someone needing a pass in Irish to be a Garda, or needing to get great results in everything, including history and geography, to be a Doctor, is just silly.

Although I've always felt that for the Gardai, specifically, the leaving cert shouldn't be a requirement, and instead your CV should include practical accomplishments that make you a good candidate (full driver's license, certified at first aid, being able to swim, etc.)

The leaving cert seems like a mess, in my opinion. (although it's only fair to say, that I didn't actually do my leaving cert, so perhaps I'm biased against it. I was never good in a classroom, and found it to be boring (i was never a trouble-maker, mind you, just disinterested).

I ended up getting work as a photographer and have been doing that for about a decade. I always wanted to be a Garda though, so i went to one of those adult education centres where you get to re-do the leaving, and after a week I couldn't stick it anymore. Just couldn't handle the classrooms thing).

Reason I'm posting the above is to clarify that although I never did my leaving cert, it's not because I'm a scummy knacker that spent all day at school throwing hammers at the teachers and selling drugs, I just didn't enjoy it - but nonetheless, I still think the exam as a whole is being done wrong.

I would have got an A+ in 'rambling on and on' though.

Smacruairi · 07-01-2021 9:52pm

Panicked parent wrote: »

Where would I get the time? Remote teaching and homeschooling. I’m sorry but your post comes across as not understanding the predicament

I understand well. You've had time to make an account tonight and to post several times. Email the minister. She promised you supports, ask her what they are. She's very very active on twitter even.

You said vaccinate teachers, josepha has teachers on 11 out of 13 on thr vaccine list. Email her about that.

rainbowtrout · 07-01-2021 9:53pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Everyone who attends 90%+ of their scheduled days should just get an auto-pass on all the 'normal/textbook' subjects, and then an exam on the practical stuff.

Where would be the incentive to do any work if you only had to attend to pass?

History Queen · 07-01-2021 10:05pm

2011abc wrote: »

Just imagine being a lazy but 'bright' Sixth Year (a very common beast)who has only had three months this year and four or five last year to 'impress' their teacher.There will be some Herculean work done 'online' in next few weeks by these lads !

Once predicted grades were called last year we had no further interaction with the students so that wouldn't happen.

07-01-2021 10:06pm

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Where would be the incentive to do any work if you only had to attend to pass?

Well you'd have to be fairly hardcore disinterested to show up and sit there day after day and not do anything. (Obviously going in and causing hassle wouldn't count, as the simple way to deal with that would be to send the person home, thus cancelling out their day of attendance).

Why does it matter, though, whether they do any work or not? If you have to put a gun to someone's head for them to learn the difference between stalactite and stalagmite, then just don't bother. Leave them to sit there day-dreaming.

If a job opens up in the Aillwee Caves, they'll be seen through fairly quickly during the interview. But if they sit there scratching their hole and looking out the window in Geography, but they really excel at, and enjoy, say Spanish for argument sake, then let them at it.

amacca · 07-01-2021 10:17pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Well you'd have to be fairly hardcore disinterested to show up and sit there day after day and not do anything. (Obviously going in and causing hassle wouldn't count, as the simple way to deal with that would be to send the person home, thus cancelling out their day of attendance).

You effectively can't send them home now if they're causing continuous disruption ...... why woukd the Govt let that happen under your system

I always thought that was the ideal solution but "in loco parentis" and all that

Spanish Eyes · 07-01-2021 10:23pm

Good decision, the one day old one was unsustainable..

Continuous assessment is needed now. Going forward. But that removes anonymity. Still...

07-01-2021 10:32pm

amacca wrote: »

You effectively can't send them home now if they're causing continuous disruption ...... why woukd the Govt let that happen under your system

I always thought that was the ideal solution but "in loco parentis" and all that

Well that'd have to change, obviously. Or you'd just cancel their attendance even if they had to stay on the grounds.

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Continuous assessment is needed now. Going forward. But that removes anonymity. Still...

Between the girls offering blowjobs for A's and the scumbags threatening to petrol bomb the teachers' houses, I don't think that'd work too well in practice.

At least basing it on attendance (or something like that), primarily, means it's not as easy to manipulate/exploit. You have to still show up, and can't blame, threaten or suck up to anyone else if you don't bother to get out of bed.

wirelessdude01 · 07-01-2021 10:36pm

How many times will Norma say "safe", "if I could just say", "spirit" "generosity/generously"?

Icsics · 07-01-2021 10:45pm

Norma is tedious to listen to...says nothing but same jargon all the time

Smacruairi · 07-01-2021 10:46pm

She's having a mare already

wirelessdude01 · 07-01-2021 10:47pm

Useless.

Treppen · 07-01-2021 10:47pm

Surprise surprise, Norma trying to blame the unions...

She's all about the "partners in education" now.

amacca · 07-01-2021 10:47pm

She's getting an easy ride so far anyway

km79 · 07-01-2021 10:48pm

“One of the doctors”
LOL

wirelessdude01 · 07-01-2021 10:49pm

She needs to be questioned by Sarah McInerney again but doubt Norma would be willing to do there again after what she got yesterday.

Government flip flops / school closures

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