Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VI - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

zerosugarbuzz wrote: »

Globally the deaths are elderly with underlying conditions too. I will be going out shortly, not a bad day for a long walk.

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

All you get in here is feelings - no evidence, no facts.

What was I going on about six months a go? Providing evidence saying we would end up where we are now? No really, I was. And the usual suspects dismissed it at every opportunity.

I'll take a pass on your guidance here, thanks.

[Deleted User] wrote: »

We’re a little too clever here to fall for your long Covid nonsense.
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zerosugarbuzz wrote: »

We’re no allowed travel, did you miss that bit? Been going on most of the year...

growleaves wrote: »

The debate around Long Covid is this: whether long-terms effects are normative in higher numbers than other illnesses.

Because influenza can lead to heart damage, neural damage, lung problems, fatigue etc., etc.

Whenever I ask pro-restrictions posters about this they fudge by saying "we don't know yet".

Meaning they have NO EVIDENCE and NO REASON TO ASSUME that covid is non-nornative or unusual in terms of long-term effects. Its just that it can't be ruled out because hey anything's possible.

No one should be fooled by this line of argument. Any scare can be justified that way.

zerosugarbuzz wrote: »

People dying “with” Covid not “of” Covid. Or the latest one deaths “associated” with Covid. What does that actually mean?

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Alright, I'll play along...


- Over 8 months in and we have less than 2000 deaths "from" CV-19. The fear of ten times that number or more hasn't materialised, yet some refuse to recognise that for what it is - extremely positive, and a sign that the virus is not as deadly as was feared in the early stages

- Despite the significant rise in new "cases" over the last 2 months, deaths continue to remain in single digits with many being reported from weeks or indeed months earlier. Again, extremely positive result and an indicator that CV-19 is not the deadly plague that was feared. Many of these "cases" include people who had to be told they had it before they realised

* Quotation marks above referring to situations where a diagnosis of CV-19 is being conflated with the actual cause of death or reason for attending a doctor/hospital.


- Despite no mask wearing up till Mid-July(ish?) there were no outbreaks reported in the likes of supermarkets etc which remained open throughout. Even with the aforementioned rise in cases this continues to be so. Mask effectiveness then is at best neutral

- The official stats have shown that those most at risk are those who are in the latter stages of life and/or who have underlying issues. This is unfortunate, but the narrative currently would make you think that these people weren't dying before CV-19 arose which is just not the case, and people continue to die every day from a variety of entirely unrelated issues - however, some of these are the indirect result of such people not seeking or getting their needed treatments because of the sole focus on CV-19 in the medical arena generally and that IS a problem we need to put greater focus on

- The stats also prove that the vast majority of people are at little to no risk from CV-19. We are therefore using a sledgehammer to crack a walnut in terms of our response. This is completely disproportionate to the actual level of risk involved

- It's generally recognised at this point that public buy-in and adherence to the suggestions (because that is in fact all the majority of them are) is falling significantly as people become more frustrated with the restrictions and impact on their lives - in part because they too can see that very few are actually getting seriously sick and even fewer are dying. Despite this slackening of focus, actual deaths remain extremely low



The better questions for people like yourself and others of the same mindset are...What are you so afraid of/why are you so tied to your position?


- Is it that you are in the vulnerable category, perhaps that you have elderly relatives that you fear you might infect?

- Is it that you have been listening to so much of this negative coverage and daily updates on who died (again only from CV-19 it seems) that you are genuinely that fearful? I'm not being smart for there are indeed many out there like that (an ex of mine is a prime example) who are afraid almost to set foot outside the door unless there's no-one around - the damage to the mental health of such people is hugely significant and not something that's being discussed enough

If yes to either of the above then absolutely should you protect yourself and your loved ones up to and including isolating if needed. However, you must also acknowledge that most people do not fit into this category of risk and therefore it's unreasonable to expect them to feel the same way you do


- Is it that you're working from home, saving a fortune on commuting and/or childcare, quite happy and able to do your job from the bedroom/kitchen, and have no particular desire to return to the office?

- Is it that you are annoyed by others who do not share your level of concern about the virus? Are you possibly biased by your own situation and irritated that those others don't share your risk assessment? Or is it that you NEED them to do so, so you can continue to benefit personally (as exampled above)

If yes, then perhaps you need to take a look at your motivation and recognise that it may not be about the "public good" but rather your own


The bottom line here is that CV-19 is thankfully(!!!!!) not the deadly virus it was first feared to be. Most people are at little to no real risk from it, and those who are can be, and should be, far better protected through targeted measures than a blanket lockdown which ultimately:

- is far more damaging to the mental and non-related physical health of both groups

- ultimately solves nothing. Cases rise once lockdown is lifted. Rinse and repeat

The HSE themselves have admitted the flaws in their testing and measurement procedures in Dail committees. We probably will NEVER know how many people actually died BECAUSE of CV-19, but I'll wager that the number will be significantly under 5000 in Ireland when this is all over - even with the unreliable metrics.


Ultimately, as I've said before , NO-ONE wants to get sick from this, or see friends or family get sick or die. Thankfully CV-19 has proven to not be the deadly killer we feared in March, and this is a VERY GOOD THING

It would be even better if people like yourself recognised that, stopped living in and spreading fear, and most importantly - stopped attacking or brow-beating others for seeing the reality on the ground for what it is.