How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

Purplewaters · 13-09-2020 10:20PM

I personally think the fact media aren't covering any school cases or now possibly outbreaks aka 2 or more cases is making me feel so uneasy. It feels like a deliberate cover up. We can see how many cases in hospital, how many are supposed household outbreaks but nothing to do with schools. With household outbreaks I want to know if these people have gotten covid 19 in work, I feel they are deliberately fudging the numbers to cast the blame on socialising. So if someone gets this in work then it spreads to their own family and 2 friends that is considered household outbreaks. Thr additional message of come hell or high water schools will stay open combined with the lack of transparency has my trust in the goverment fully gone. We are all just serving a purpose for them. They are twisting the information to suit their rhetoric.

Purplewaters · 13-09-2020 10:21PM

Honest question, do we have actual figure for how many school cases and if any have turned into outbreaks? We do need to know this.

13-09-2020 10:23PM

Purplewaters wrote: »

I personally think the fact media aren't covering any school cases or now possibly outbreaks aka 2 or more cases is making me feel so uneasy. It feels like a deliberate cover up. We can see how many cases in hospital, how many are supposed household outbreaks but nothing to do with schools. With household outbreaks I want to know if these people have gotten covid 19 in work, I feel they are deliberately fudging the numbers to cast the blame on socialising. So if someone gets this in work then it spreads to their own family and 2 friends that is considered household outbreaks. Thr additional message of come hell or high water schools will stay open combined with the lack of transparency has my trust in the goverment fully gone. We are all just serving a purpose for them. They are twisting the information to suit their rhetoric.

It’s because the outbreaks are not to do with schools, They are kids who go to the schools who caught it elsewhere. Once outbreaks are traced to a schools, I would presume they will be reported as school clusters

Locotastic · 13-09-2020 10:30PM

Purplewaters wrote: »

Honest question, do we have actual figure for how many school cases and if any have turned into outbreaks? We do need to know this.

None as far as I know.

Although I believe one school in Dublin has had 3 cases this week between the junior and senior schools.

However this could easily be siblings or close contact outside of the school setting, it does not indicate an outbreak in a school setting.

Will Yam · 13-09-2020 10:30PM

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

Also worth keeping the perspective of just how long schools are open, 1 week for most post primary students, 2 weeks for most national students.

True.

And also worth keeping in mind the perspective that, thus far, only one school is reported as having had a second case.

So 66, call it 70 cases out of a million. Or .007%.

13-09-2020 10:31PM

Purplewaters wrote: »

Honest question, do we have actual figure for how many school cases and if any have turned into outbreaks? We do need to know this.

You don’t really. You need to know number cases associated with your own kids class or if there is an outbreak in your kids school/ the school you teach in, but otherwise why do you need to know? If 10 schools in Dublin are shut due to outbreaks, why does that have relevance to schools in Cork for example?

niamh247 · 13-09-2020 10:31PM

Purplewaters wrote: »

I personally think the fact media aren't covering any school cases or now possibly outbreaks aka 2 or more cases is making me feel so uneasy. It feels like a deliberate cover up. We can see how many cases in hospital, how many are supposed household outbreaks but nothing to do with schools. With household outbreaks I want to know if these people have gotten covid 19 in work, I feel they are deliberately fudging the numbers to cast the blame on socialising. So if someone gets this in work then it spreads to their own family and 2 friends that is considered household outbreaks. Thr additional message of come hell or high water schools will stay open combined with the lack of transparency has my trust in the goverment fully gone. We are all just serving a purpose for them. They are twisting the information to suit their rhetoric.

Totally agree. The goal seems to be to give a perception of taking progressive steps, keeping business as usual etc, rather than citizens' health.

Locotastic · 13-09-2020 10:32PM

Will Yam wrote: »

Ok. Then the rate is 1.6%.

Which aligns with our overall positive rate.

khalessi · 13-09-2020 10:36PM

Updated list from Twitter of affected schools
https://twitter.com/schools_19/status/1305257055943499776

niamh247 · 13-09-2020 10:38PM

Deleted User wrote: »

You don’t really. You need to know number cases associated with your own kids class or if there is an outbreak in your kids school/ the school you teach in, but otherwise why do you need to know? If 10 schools in Dublin are shut due to outbreaks, why does that have relevance to schools in Cork for example?

I think it does have relevance because the same common reasons will hold good for any school, and so the Cork or other city schools might see the same outbreaks just like what's happening in schools in other cities.

Will Yam · 13-09-2020 10:39PM

Locotastic wrote: »

Which aligns with our overall positive rate.

Not sure you can compare % of schools with % of cases.

A truer comParison is the 1.8% Cases from testing with the 0.007% cases in schools.

13-09-2020 10:40PM

niamh247 wrote: »

It does have relevance because the same common reasons will hold good for any school, and so the Cork or other city schools might see the same outbreaks just like what's happening in schools in other cities.

Same applies for any business, workplace, or any other setting where people gather

Purplewaters · 13-09-2020 11:18PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You don’t really. You need to know number cases associated with your own kids class or if there is an outbreak in your kids school/ the school you teach in, but otherwise why do you need to know? If 10 schools in Dublin are shut due to outbreaks, why does that have relevance to schools in Cork for example?

We can agree to disagree here. Parents and teachers have taken a gamble with this and now that we're back we need honest information of how this is spreading once it gets into schools. If you believe that there have only been rhese singular cases that came in ans no spread then that's great, but I don't really think that is tbe case. We need honest numbers of school spread in my opinion. So cases of kids who came into school and (most likely) didn't get it there. Though with all these '"community" cases who is to say where any of those got it. The government are also taking a gamble only sending pods home when they know the ecdc says anyone in a classroom is a contact. Maybe you don't want these figures and that's fine, but I think a lot of us do.

Purplewaters · 13-09-2020 11:21PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Same applies for any business, workplace, or any other setting where people gather

Except they're the ONLY one with the combination of high numbers, no 2m spacing and no masks for primary. Pods in the case of a creche meant a lot more but for schools they are simply groups within a class, so sending just a pod home when there is a positive case is not enough also imo.

Purplewaters · 13-09-2020 11:23PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You don’t really. You need to know number cases associated with your own kids class or if there is an outbreak in your kids school/ the school you teach in, but otherwise why do you need to know? If 10 schools in Dublin are shut due to outbreaks, why does that have relevance to schools in Cork for example?

I'll put this simply. People need to know if the conditions in irish schools are leading to outbreaks within the school or not. If the conditions are causing a problem then proper spacing is needed and should happen. End of story.

13-09-2020 11:34PM

Purplewaters wrote: »

I'll put this simply. People need to know if the conditions in irish schools are leading to outbreaks within the school or not. If the conditions are causing a problem then proper spacing is needed and should happen. End of story.

No, the health officials making the decisions need to know. The people will make irrational decisions based on emotions and not fact. An what conditions prevail in one class may be completely different to another

s1ippy · 13-09-2020 11:43PM

https://maps.app.goo.gl/LD8vrRZ1b7u2MgCr5
Emma Cassidy doing the lord's work, or NPHET's work actually.

Purplewaters · 14-09-2020 12:02AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No, the health officials making the decisions need to know. The people will make irrational decisions based on emotions and not fact. An what conditions prevail in one class may be completely different to another

You may be happy to blindly follow but I would like the information thanks. Each to their own.

tscul32 · 14-09-2020 12:09AM

Locotastic wrote: »

Why oh why is there no continuity for pupils who have to isolate, wait for tests, are are otherwise unwell and can't go to school??

Along with the testing capacity (now under strain) some form of basic online schooling in line with the curriculum needs to be available and should have been planned for.

I just can't believe that what the last couple of weeks have shown was not considered or planned for. Shambolic!!

In our school if the class has to isolate for two weeks then it's class dojo with full days' worth of work for the two weeks with teacher interaction - there is a class currently off and doing this. For those who are missing due to waiting on tests/results for themselves or family members the work being covered each week is posted on the school website so students can continue with parental assistance for the few days they're at home if they're well enough to do so.

r93kaey5p2izun · 14-09-2020 01:28AM

Will Yam wrote: »

True.

And also worth keeping in mind the perspective that, thus far, only one school is reported as having had a second case.

So 66, call it 70 cases out of a million. Or .007%.

That is not accurate. There's 110 cases in the 5-14 age category in the past 7 days alone. We don't know about 15-18/19 year olds in post primary because they're part of a wider age category. 58 cases 0-4 also, some of whom are most likely in school too.

Will Yam wrote: »

Not sure you can compare % of schools with % of cases.

A truer comParison is the 1.8% Cases from testing with the 0.007% cases in schools.

Why would you compare percentage positive from total tested to percentage positive from total student population?

Will Yam · 14-09-2020 08:49AM

Johnny Gorgeous Numerate wrote: »

That is not accurate. There's 110 cases in the 5-14 age category in the past 7 days alone. We don't know about 15-18/19 year olds in post primary because they're part of a wider age category. 58 cases 0-4 also, some of whom are most likely in school too.

Why would you compare percentage positive from total tested to percentage positive from total student population?

What is the source of your numbers?

And you can compare % among students with % among total tested. What you cant do is compare % of schools that had at least one case with % among total tested.

PCros · 14-09-2020 09:45AM

76 cases in schools as of this morning from 02/09/2020.
1,965 cases in the same time frame thus 3.9% of cases in total are associated with schools.
47 in Dublin and 29 outside of Dublin.

SusanC10 · 14-09-2020 09:47AM

PCros wrote: »

76 cases in schools as of this morning from 02/09/2020.

1,965 cases in the same time frame thus 3.9% of cases in total are associated with schools.

47 in Dublin and 29 outside of Dublin.

Thanks for this.
Where are you seeing it ?

PCros · 14-09-2020 09:47AM

SusanC10 wrote: »

Thanks for this.
Where are you seeing it ?

The Facebook page, it's debatable if those figures are correct but I'd say its near enough.

I believe there is an update of NPHET once a week on numbers in schools so we can cross reference then.

A big focus is needed on the Dublin area now, outside of it seems to be going well.

ginoginelli · 14-09-2020 09:52AM

The governments recent switch in strategy 'to 'live with the virus' is shaping up to be a complete disaster. Since schools opened cases have exploded in dublin. And now the plan is to open up even more - with the likes of offices and travel next. We are on the cusp of ending up like Israel unless something changes.

On another note, the blatant propaganda propagated by the hse, government, and their best friends rte on the subject of schools has been stunning. The way colm Henry casually dropped about having 56 cases in schools after just a few days, and saying things were 'so far so good' was particularly fanciful. 56 cases so early was headline worthy but it was casually dismissed and barely mentioned by gov or in media.

We are being played.

PCros · 14-09-2020 10:18AM

ginoginelli wrote: »

The governments recent switch in strategy 'to 'live with the virus' is shaping up to be a complete disaster. Since schools opened cases have exploded in dublin. And now the plan is to open up even more - with the likes of offices and travel next. We are on the cusp of ending up like Israel unless something changes.

It's probably to early yet to predict a disaster. Sure for all we know they could land Dublin straight in the red category or whatever it is tomorrow when this road map comes out.

I'm interested to hear what percentage on a 2 week rolling basis is acceptable in schools? At the moment we are looking at 3.9% which is not bad in my opinion. This could go up and it could go down but we are never going to be Covid free in any aspect of life until the vaccine arrives.

14-09-2020 10:44AM

Purplewaters wrote: »

You may be happy to blindly follow but I would like the information thanks. Each to their own.

But you don't need the information. I am a bit of a data nerd, and would like the information also, but me having the information is not necessary for any decisions that need to be made. As I said, we need the information for the schools that impact us, but not for those on the other side of the country, with different case profiles in their area. What happens in one area should inform the actions in another area when an outbreak occurs - e.g if the pod system is found wanting in that outbreaks occur in the wider class group when only pods are isolated, that should inform actions in other schools in other areas when issues arise. However parents making decisions based on incomplete information on what is happening elsewhere will just increase the level of panic.
Even if there were no cases in my county for 2 weeks, if multiple parents were withdrawing their kids due to schools outbreaks in other counties would make you question myself as to whether to leave my kids in school. But that is an emotional response, not a rational, fact based action.

JimmyVik · 14-09-2020 10:45AM

s1ippy wrote: »

https://maps.app.goo.gl/LD8vrRZ1b7u2MgCr5
Emma Cassidy doing the lord's work, or NPHET's work actually.

That map isnt accurate.
We got an email last week about a class being sent home from our school.
Another school where a friends wife works also have positive cases.

Neither school is in that map.

But I agree with the sentiment that there is something up with the dissemination of information about schools
Its actually information that the public is most concerned about right now, yet it is not part of the daily briefings.
You would think if it was good news that they would tell the public to ease their fears, but they are doing the opposite.

14-09-2020 10:47AM

ginoginelli wrote: »

The governments recent switch in strategy 'to 'live with the virus' is shaping up to be a complete disaster. Since schools opened cases have exploded in dublin. And now the plan is to open up even more - with the likes of offices and travel next. We are on the cusp of ending up like Israel unless something changes.

On another note, the blatant propaganda propagated by the hse, government, and their best friends rte on the subject of schools has been stunning. The way colm Henry casually dropped about having 56 cases in schools after just a few days, and saying things were 'so far so good' was particularly fanciful. 56 cases so early was headline worthy but it was casually dismissed and barely mentioned by gov or in media.

We are being played.

There is no evidence that any of the 56 cases are as a result of schools opening, and that was his point

crossman47 · 14-09-2020 10:54AM

Deleted User wrote: »

There is no evidence that any of the 56 cases are as a result of schools opening, and that was his point

That's exactly it. If school reopening leads to a spread, it will IMO be due to parents chatting in groups rather than keeping a social distance and then going home.

How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

Comments