How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

Only catching up on the thread and its been a long read since last week.

Absolutely no comment yet in relation to the snotty, sneezing kids in school despite it sounding a little off kilter. Anyway, I've been a consistent advocate in this thread of a phased return to school as in 50% capacity, one week in one week working at home most particularly with PP schools as far less child minding involved. I genuinely hoped that the "plan" would've been close to that.

I have the guidance from my childs PP school. Shady at best and in line with the general plan as best they can manage it. But like others have said, it has more holes than Swiss cheese. Should Teachers strike over it? IMO, yes. I'm no teacher basher. Never have been. I understand the opinions from teachers in relation to a strike and their opinion that parents should be the ones to push any objection to the planned reopening. I'm a parent and agree. However, and I've mentioned this before, those I engaged with directly in relation to only one school, didn't give a fiddlers about any of it. Yes a micro example, but enlightening at the same time.

There is no buy in from parents. That's only my opinion. Parents have no real umbrella organisation to unite under and from the localized group I spoke to, there was a very definitive sense that they wanted their kids out 5 days a week and from under their feet. I find that quite sad. No mention of mental health implications, just a get back out to school as you're wrecking my head scenario. A micro example and I accept it's not an example that proves anything nationwide.

I really hope that in the years to come, if a teachers strike happens (due to non covid related matters) it doesn't bite you on the arse because you didn't stand up during covid, yet stood up in relation to a monetary issue. I love teachers. Lots of teacher friends that I've had loads of debates with in private about this. I'm gonna get flamed here by teachers, but someone has to shout stop. You guys have the ability. I'd stand with you and feck the naysayers.

Grandeeod wrote: »

There is no buy in from parents. That's only my opinion. Parents have no real umbrella organisation to unite under and from the localized group I spoke to, there was a very definitive sense that they wanted their kids out 5 days a week and from under their feet. I find that quite sad. No mention of mental health implications, just a get back out to school as you're wrecking my head scenario. A micro example and I accept it's not an example that proves anything nationwide.

Regarding parents, I really think a large proportion of parents want their children to be back full time at school. Reasons I'm hearing are just a longing for normality, dread of home schooling as per pre holidays, a genuine feeling that their kids need to be back not just for educational purposes but at the moment maybe more so for psychological and social concerns and then there are a lot of parents who probably need their children full time at school to get back full time to their jobs. Financial concerns are no small deal even though in Covid times, they are often dismissed as unimportant.. Then on top of that I feel the fact that schools are inviting children back so beautifully is another factor. Parents are taking them at their word that the 'invitation' is genuine, that there are changes made because the school have told them they have been working away for weeks getting everything ready. The school is not raising any red flags and the parents are reassured by that. There is bias in how we all receive information so those who are anxious will take on board all the anxiety inducing stories but visa versa also. Even parents who are somewhat worried but whose children have no health issues probably feel they would be doing their children no favours making a big drama over the children returning to school. There will be loads of information in all this for future sociology students.

Grandeeod wrote: »

Only catching up on the thread and its been a long read since last week.

Absolutely no comment yet in relation to the snotty, sneezing kids in school despite it sounding a little off kilter. Anyway, I've been a consistent advocate in this thread of a phased return to school as in 50% capacity, one week in one week working at home most particularly with PP schools as far less child minding involved. I genuinely hoped that the "plan" would've been close to that.

I have the guidance from my childs PP school. Shady at best and in line with the general plan as best they can manage it. But like others have said, it has more holes than Swiss cheese. Should Teachers strike over it? IMO, yes. I'm no teacher basher. Never have been. I understand the opinions from teachers in relation to a strike and their opinion that parents should be the ones to push any objection to the planned reopening. I'm a parent and agree. However, and I've mentioned this before, those I engaged with directly in relation to only one school, didn't give a fiddlers about any of it. Yes a micro example, but enlightening at the same time.

There is no buy in from parents. That's only my opinion. Parents have no real umbrella organisation to unite under and from the localized group I spoke to, there was a very definitive sense that they wanted their kids out 5 days a week and from under their feet. I find that quite sad. No mention of mental health implications, just a get back out to school as you're wrecking my head scenario. A micro example and I accept it's not an example that proves anything nationwide.

I really hope that in the years to come, if a teachers strike happens (due to non covid related matters) it doesn't bite you on the arse because you didn't stand up during covid, yet stood up in relation to a monetary issue. I love teachers. Lots of teacher friends that I've had loads of debates with in private about this. I'm gonna get flamed here by teachers, but someone has to shout stop. You guys have the ability. I'd stand with you and feck the naysayers.

A lot of parents seem to be rejoicing their kids are going back, met a few recently and it had nothing to do with mental health or their friends as most of their children were having play dates and a good old summer anyways, the reason they were so happy was because they could get their time back again and plan their week. One parent actually said on whatapss she wants to have a party.

Mrsmum wrote: »

Regarding parents, I really think a large proportion of parents want their children to be back full time at school. Reasons I'm hearing are just a longing for normality, dread of home schooling as per pre holidays, a genuine feeling that their kids need to be back not just for educational purposes but at the moment maybe more so for psychological and social concerns and then there are a lot of parents who probably need their children full time at school to get back full time to their jobs. Financial concerns are no small deal even though in Covid times, they are often dismissed as unimportant.. Then on top of that I feel the fact that schools are inviting children back so beautifully is another factor. Parents are taking them at their word that the 'invitation' is genuine, that there are changes made because the school have told them they have been working away for weeks getting everything ready. The school is not raising any red flags and the parents are reassured by that There is bias in how we all receive information so those who are anxious will take on board all the anxiety inducing stories but visa versa also. Even parents who are somewhat worried but whose children have no health issues probably feel they would be doing their children no favours making a big drama over the children returning to school. There will be loads of information in all this for future sociology students.

Mrsmum you have voiced something that I have been thinking about a lot over the past few days and trying to make sense of in my mind. The message from school management to parents is for sure a big factor in how parents feel about the return to school. A teacher friend of mine was at her class communion recently and a parent asked her how she felt about the return to school. She said she was nervous because she lives with her high risk parents. She was later approached by her principal and told she shouldn't have voiced her concerns in front of a parent; that it was inappropriate. I found this very interesting.

I took my 9 year old into school today in the North for 2 hours. He has some complications but would not be considered a priority for shielding. My son and I were the only ones at the school wearing masks although some of the assistants/cleaners had visors. You could tell the majority of parents were relieved that the kids were back in school and I can understand that. Parents were going in and out of reception and mingling in groups in the yard. I would rather not take him back there again. Apart from the few assistants wearing visors it seemed business as usual.

kali.mist wrote: »

I took my 9 year old into school today in the North for 2 hours. He has some complications but would not be considered a priority for shielding. My son and I were the only ones at the school wearing masks although some of the assistants/cleaners had visors. You could tell the majority of parents were relieved that the kids were back in school and I can understand that. Parents were going in and out of reception and mingling in groups in the yard. I would rather not take him back there again. Apart from the few assistants wearing visors it seemed business as usual.

Visors will do nothing to protect your kid too.
They only protect the wearer, and even then they're not great.

Crap situation. Best of luck

Grandeeod wrote: »

I agree with you, but just want to stress that my post is only based on my locality. If there are other examples like yours, I hope we see them. There must be.

Parents are all different, same with children going back. Some parents say just get on with it, others say our children are guinea pigs, you know how you have parents who are great at giving play dates, others who shy away from it, parents who find it hard to make school concerts, others who are there putting up the bunting, not all parents take to it. It has absolutely nothing to do with parents, working or not working, not all parents parent the same way. Some just find being around children all day very very tiresome and hard going. I remember a parent actually saying to me once, that i was a right old mary poppins, just because i had a good few kids back to my house.

Queried wrote: »

She said she was nervous because she lives with her high risk parents. She was later approached by her principal and told she shouldn't have voiced her concerns in front of a parent; that it was inappropriate. I found this very interesting.

FFS ......that's overstepping the mark imo but I've seen similar (although usually its done more tactfully).... you should be able to feel free to voice concerns if you have them and you feel they are legitimate.

Jesus things have gone so much down the road of PR and face saving even anyone that has a mind of their own and voices an opinion seems to be viewed as a liability now rather than a potential asset to at least be aware of other views/sides.

amacca wrote: »

FFS ......that's overstepping the mark imo but I've seen similar (although usually its done more tactfully).... you should be able to feel free to voice concerns if you have them and you feel they are legitimate.

Jesus things have gone so much down the road of PR and face saving even anyone that has a mind of their own and voices an opinion seems to be viewed as a liability now rather than a potential asset to at least be aware of other views/sides.

Yes, I totally agree. To be fair to her she was having none of it and just said she was telling the truth. However, I wouldn't be surprised if this is a common occurrence.

combat14 wrote: »

and loss of taste / smell

Yes ..and this is the main one before fever even. Anyone I know who got it lost their smell and taste. One friend has yet to regain their taste or smell which is awful.

Sammy2012 wrote: »

Would like some thoughts on this please. We have received the back to school plan. I work in my school and have a child in 1st class and one starting in Juniors next week. Some of the things that worry me are, children bring their own facecloth every day which they will use to dry hands as no tissue paper being provided by school, (obviously could be in bathroom 4 or 5 times a day) school bags or lunch boxes not allowed but kids have to bring a zip mesh pouch to put lunch, drink bottles in, ( dirty face cloth in there too), no waste bins in classrooms to put dirty tissues in (we have never had waste bins as they are not allowed by principal so we don't waste collections) teachers disposed of waste themselves for the most part but this year no waste bins to put dirty tissues in so assume they go into the mesh pouch.

Any feedback?

Presuming this is a green schools thing? In your position I reckon a plastic bag for the towel and another for the tissues would be best? Difficult when your child is so young though, maybe colour code the bags or put a little picture on them?

This is definitely not the usual back to school prep we are used to eh?

i_surge wrote: »

That isn't interesting it is a disgrace and so is that principle for having zero standards.

I agree. It is a disgrace. I chose the word interesting because it's very telling regarding the attitude from the powers that be.

Edit: may I add, the powers that be who are not in the classroom like the rest of us.

So it starts...

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/asti-teachers-facing-life-or-death-risk-due-to-covid-19-vulnerability-1.4337894

Ann Piggott, vice-president of the ASTI, estimates as many as one such case for each of Ireland’s 723 secondary schools.

“This is their health, their life. While they may not be classified currently as very high risk, if they pick up the virus they don’t have a hope. Their lives are totally on the line here,”

It is amazing that not only that Ann Piggot from the ASTI is able to try and represent teachers (badly at that), she can also give a prognosis for anyone with huge variety of conditions, a death sentence.

.... and teachers think we, the public, should respect these Unions?

If these teachers are indeed THAT sick, then go on sick leave and/or retire and give up your full-time position to someone younger and healthier.

So so late in the day for the ASTI to be concerned about this, what have they been doing for the past 6 months? **** all as it turns out.

Just a few thoughts on your post.

Sammy2012 wrote: »

Some of the things that worry me are, children bring their own facecloth every day which they will use to dry hands as no tissue paper being provided by school,

In our workplace we have banned things like roll towel cabinets and insist on people only using disposable tissue paper. It's much safer than using something reusable. In the kids scenario, they'll use another kid's facecloth. It certainly will happen. They can also become soiled or contaminated. I think that's a bad idea. See also below my point on cough etiquette.

school bags or lunch boxes not allowed but kids have to bring a zip mesh pouch to put lunch, drink bottles in,

I don't understand this requirement because the virus can live on/in a zip mesh pouch just the same as it can live in/on a lunchbox.

( dirty face cloth in there too),

No comment.

no waste bins in classrooms to put dirty tissues in (we have never had waste bins as they are not allowed by principal so we don't waste collections) teachers disposed of waste themselves for the most part but this year no waste bins to put dirty tissues in so assume they go into the mesh pouch.

We've provided everybody in work with a flip-top bin for disposing of their tissues etc.

The HSA/HSE/WHO are encouraging cough etiquette where everyone is encouraged to cough into a tissue and dispose of it immediately. Kind of reckless to not provide facilities to do this.