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How will schools be able to go back in September?

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Comments

  • #8822
    Grandeeod
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,318 ✭✭✭✭Grandeeod


    GazzaL wrote: »
    I'd rather we didn't fall behind the rest of the developed world and fail our children. If someone wants to leave their child behind, that's their decision. But resposible parents want their children to receive an education.

    I am a responsible parent and I want my child to receice an education. I never said I didn't. Alternate weeks under review, condidering what our schools face, is a perfectly acceptable proposal.


  • #8823
    am_zarathustra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,404 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    Alrigghtythen wrote: »
    So all the children with asthma, will you be demanding they were masks or segregating them way down the back like they are lepers?

    I can tell you no decent parent I know with an asthmatic child will be sending them near a school under these guidelines.

    And yes, if I have a class of 22 and 21 students and I are all wearing masks then that child could come to school, with a visor and I would do my best to ensure they were at 2m SD instead of 1m. We are wearing masks to protect the most vulnerable, that is the whole point!!!!The students I know have very worried parents currently, we were even looking at perspex screen to increase safety for these students.......because I care........in my job I do professionally.


  • #8824
    khalessi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,216 ✭✭✭khalessi


    Alrigghtythen wrote: »
    So all the children with asthma, will you be demanding they were masks or segregating them way down the back like they are lepers?

    No their parents probably will or a face shield. I already know of a number of children with CF and asthma who will be wearing facemasks to school as their parents have contacted the school and have been told if they feel happier to send them back with the mask or visor to do so.


  • #8825
    wirelessdude01
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,441 ✭✭✭wirelessdude01


    am_zarathustra wrote: »
    I can tell you no decent parent I know with an asthmatic child will be sending them near a school under these guidelines.

    And yes, if I have a class of 22 and 21 students and I are all wearing masks then that child could come to school, with a visor and I would do my best to ensure they were at 2m SD instead of 1m. We are wearing masks to protect the most vulnerable, that is the whole point!!!!The students I know have very worried parents currently, we were even looking at perspex screen to increase safety for these students.......because I care........in my job I do professionally.

    We are looking at perspex pods for some of our children as well. Not quite sure where the money is coming from for them as there is ZERO provision for same under the government plan but we decided that ALL children have to be given the best chance to return where possible.


  • #8826
    am_zarathustra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,404 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    khalessi wrote: »
    No their parents probably will or a face shield. I already know of a number of children with CF and asthma who will be wearing facemasks to school as their parents have contacted the school and have been told if they feel happier to send them back with the mask or visor to do so.

    It's a false sense of security if the other students in the class don't wear them.

    I think the department have a very dim view of students. I'm in an inner city school and, though it might take a bit of coaxing and good systems, I can see most of the kids really getting on board with masks. Especially if they were aware of a classmate who might be in real trouble if they got sick, or that someones little sister has CF.


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  • #8827
    khalessi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,216 ✭✭✭khalessi


    am_zarathustra wrote: »
    It's a false sense of security if the other students in the class don't wear them.

    I think the department have a very dim view of students. I'm in an inner city school and, though it might take a bit of coaxing and good systems, I can see most of the kids really getting on board with masks. Especially if they were aware of a classmate who might be in real trouble if they got sick, or that someones little sister has CF.

    Yeah the kids are great, I know my nieces friends will all wear masks in school when she goes back to protect her and some of the children in my school were wearing them before lockdown as they felt better. so they will get on board quick enough


  • #8828
    GazzaL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭GazzaL


    Some of the people would want to go back to school themselves looking at some of the suggestions thrown out there. We can't fall behind the rest of the developed world. We must allow children who want to go back to school to do so, it is simply unacceptable to hold them back.


  • #8829
    Ectoplasm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,603 ✭✭✭Ectoplasm


    Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »
    According to the plan, if SD is not possible in a classroom in secondary school then these kids will be all put together in an alternative room where SD can be maintained.

    Thankfully kids with asthma won't be forced to wear masks but they will be segregated.

    :pac: :pac: :pac:

    Where are these magical alternative rooms coming from?

    I've taught in 3 schools. One was small, under 500 students. The other 2 were large with circa 1000 pupils. Not one of the classrooms I taught in (probably around 15 in total) was the size of the apparently 'standard' size rooms in the guidlines and in fact, most were smaller than the so called 'small' rooms. Now that's not to say there weren't bigger rooms at all but they were in the minority. The spaces required to cater for larger groups at social distance *do not exist* in most schools!


  • #8830
    am_zarathustra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,404 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    wirelessdude01 wrote: »
    We are looking at perspex pods for some of our children as well. Not quit sure where the money is for them as there is ZERO for same under the government plan but we decided that ALL children have to be given the best chance to return where possible.

    We couldn't see a better one when they are very vulnerable, we have perspex in the engineering room so I'd say we will be jimmy something together.


  • #8831
    KerryConnor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 149 ✭✭KerryConnor


    My kids n their friends all love masks think they're cool and don't mind wearing them at all. The novelty will wear off but the older children would be well able to wear them for periods of time during the day.

    Now we re used to wearing masks even when collecting a take out pizza it's going to feel weird going into a packed room all without masks
    khalessi wrote: »
    Yeah the kids are great, I know my nieces friends will all wear masks in school when she goes back to protect her and some of the children in my school were wearing them before lockdown as they felt better. so they will get on board quick enough


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  • #8832
    joe40
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,813 ✭✭✭joe40


    GazzaL wrote: »
    Some of the people would want to go back to school themselves looking at some of the suggestions thrown out there. We can't fall behind the rest of the developed world. We must allow children who want to go back to school to do so, it is simply unacceptable to hold them back.

    Thousands of teachers are also parents. This is not a them and us situation. Everyone wants the best long term solution.


  • #8833
    GazzaL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭GazzaL


    joe40 wrote: »
    Thousands of teachers are also parents. This is not a them and us situation. Everyone wants the best long term solution.

    Let the people who want to get on with life to do so. It's not fair to hold them back.


  • #8834
    Smacruairi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,481 ✭✭✭Smacruairi


    GazzaL wrote: »
    Let the people who want to get on with life to do so. It's not fair to hold them back.

    Grand, looking forward to you going around to every additional needs child and telling them that they are holding everyone back. That's great stuff.


  • #8835
    KerryConnor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 149 ✭✭KerryConnor


    I shouldn't let it but the teacher bashing in recent times feels like a personal attack. It's upsetting as what we all want is keep our communities safe. 3 or 4 deaths in our local community as a result of a bundled return and resulting cluster is the reality of what we re dealing with. Not to mention a third of "mild" CV cases seem to be turning into long term health issues. Pat Kenny today when talking to Prof O'Neil actually asked "if teachers weren't being paid to stay at home would they have more incentive to return to work?"
    It's so undermining, sure there's no question of teachers not going back in August anyway, it's just a question of how to manage the return.


  • #8836
    GazzaL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭GazzaL


    Smacruairi wrote: »
    Grand, looking forward to you going around to every additional needs child and telling them that they are holding everyone back. That's great stuff.

    Many parents of children with additional needs are very keen for education to resume because the lack of education and structure is resulting in regression. If people choose to move forwards and resume their children's education, then they should be allowed to do so.


  • #8837
    Grandeeod
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,318 ✭✭✭✭Grandeeod


    GazzaL wrote: »
    Some of the people would want to go back to school themselves looking at some of the suggestions thrown out there. We can't fall behind the rest of the developed world. We must allow children who want to go back to school to do so, it is simply unacceptable to hold them back.

    We don't have to hold any children back. What is it about recently joined posters that bang on about that crap and simply play the open everything up card. We can reopen our schools, no problem and with a reduced risk. But the Government plan is contradictory to public health advice and includes a big risk. This is all very simple stuff. From August 10th, phase four is supposed to come into play. In terms of gatherings, it will restrict indoor gatherings to 100, like Weddings, conferences etc. Not withstanding that we are proposing to fill schools with a lot more, even if we did actually halve the amount, it would still contradict public health advice.


  • #8838
    Alrigghtythen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,365 ✭✭✭Alrigghtythen


    Grandeeod wrote: »
    We don't have to hold any children back. What is it about recently joined posters that bang on about that crap and simply play the open everything up card. We can reopen our schools, no problem and with a reduced risk. But the Government plan is contradictory to public health advice and includes a big risk. This is all very simple stuff. From August 10th, phase four is supposed to come into play. In terms of gatherings, it will restrict indoor gatherings to 100, like Weddings, conferences etc. Not withstanding that we are proposing to fill schools with a lot more, even if we did actually halve the amount, it would still contradict public health advice.

    Schools are divided in to rooms


  • #8839
    Smacruairi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,481 ✭✭✭Smacruairi


    GazzaL wrote: »
    Many parents of children with additional needs are very keen for education to resume because the lack of education and structure is resulting in regression. If people choose to move forwards and resume their children's education, then they should be allowed to do so.

    Yeah we are all looking forward to it. You really seem to not grasp the fact that there's no space in schools to achieve these plans, and the ones who are being asked to make way are the additional needs kids.


  • #8840
    Alrigghtythen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,365 ✭✭✭Alrigghtythen


    Smacruairi wrote: »
    Yeah we are all looking forward to it. You really seem to not grasp the fact that there's no space in schools to achieve these plans, and the ones who are being asked to make way are the additional needs kids.

    What's the measurements of your class and how many pupils?


  • #8841
    Smacruairi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,481 ✭✭✭Smacruairi


    Alrigghtythen wrote: »
    Schools are divided in to rooms

    That can't handle the number of a socially distant class... What are you arguing about there


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  • #8842
    Alrigghtythen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,365 ✭✭✭Alrigghtythen


    Smacruairi wrote: »
    That can't handle the number of a socially distant class... What are you arguing about there

    What size is the class and how many pupils?


  • #8843
    Smacruairi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,481 ✭✭✭Smacruairi


    Alrigghtythen wrote: »
    What's the measurements of your class and how many pupils?

    I'm secondary and have many but 42sq m, 30. One in a wheelchair, one SNA. And myself. When you're doing your calculations please include chairs, desks, teachers desk and space for the door to open. Thanks.


  • #8844
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    KerryConnor wrote: »
    I shouldn't let it but the teacher bashing in recent times feels like a personal attack. It's upsetting as what we all want is keep our communities safe. 3 or 4 deaths in our local community as a result of a bundled return and resulting cluster is the reality of what we re dealing with. Not to mention a third of "mild" CV cases seem to be turning into long term health issues. Pat Kenny today when talking to Prof O'Neil actually asked "if teachers weren't being paid to stay at home would they have more incentive to return to work?"
    It's so undermining, sure there's no question of teachers not going back in August anyway, it's just a question of how to manage the return.

    I would agree, the underlying tone is of it being teachers fault for not just sucking it up.

    Where did these 3/4 deaths happen?

    A third of 'mild' cases seem(?). Is it not a third of all cases? And secondly, 3/4 months, is not long term.


  • #8845
    grind gremlin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 420 ✭✭grind gremlin


    Smacruairi wrote: »
    42sq m, 30. One in a wheelchair, one SNA. And myself. When you're doing your calculations please include chairs, desks, teachers desk and space for the door to open. Thanks.

    If it’s like almost all other schools, desks are all doubles 120cm X 60cm. (I don’t think we have any single desks in our school).
    Don’t forget the 2meter space around the teacher and the SNA.


  • #8846
    Ectoplasm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,603 ✭✭✭Ectoplasm


    Alrigghtythen wrote: »
    What size is the class and how many pupils?

    You've seen many many teachers saying on here that schools don't have the room for social distance. Is it that you think we are all lying? Serious question. Do you really believe that?

    I desperately want to get back to the classroom, to real teaching because online is not the same. I am not, however, so desperate that I want to see a load of my kids, their families or my colleagues get sick because of poorly thought out or ineffectual guidelines. Teachers would be doing everyone a disservice if they didn't point out the flaws in the plan. I haven't seen anyone saying don't open schools...all we are saying is open them properly and sustainably i.e. in a way that won't result in rapid reclosures.


  • #8847
    KerryConnor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 149 ✭✭KerryConnor


    OK I was just throwing out a guesstimate.. . But if a cluster of 100 happened within a school. Which is very possible based on other incidents abroad. That might be 300 or 400 cases in the community within a few weeks which might result in a few deaths. Or no deaths or 10 deaths we just don't know.

    Yes proportion suffering "long term" is less if of all cases true.. 3 or 4 months (and counting.. ) for a virus seems pretty long term to me. It's a shocking length of time to feel unwell.

    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    I would agree, the underlying tone is of it being teachers fault for not just sucking it up.

    Where did these 3/4 deaths happen?

    A third of 'mild' cases seem(?). Is it not a third of all cases? And secondly, 3/4 months, is not long term.


  • #8848
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    Ectoplasm wrote: »
    You've seen many many teachers saying on here that schools don't have the room for social distance. Is it that you think we are all lying? Serious question. Do you really believe that?

    I desperately want to get back to the classroom, to real teaching because online is not the same. I am not, however, so desperate that I want to see a load of my kids, their families or my colleagues get sick because of poorly thought out or ineffectual guidelines. Teachers would be doing everyone a disservice if they didn't point out the flaws in the plan. I haven't seen anyone saying don't open schools...all we are saying is open them properly and sustainably i.e. in a way that won't result in rapid reclosures.

    Again, it's all a charade, everyone is getting their story straight till the week before school and it becomes stalemate.

    As an Irish society, we need to move on now, start thinking about how we can effectively home-school and work with employers and financial institutions to lessen the burden.


  • #8849
    Ectoplasm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,603 ✭✭✭Ectoplasm


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Again, it's all a charade, everyone is getting their story straight till the week before school and it becomes stalemate.

    As an Irish society, we need to move on now, start thinking about how we can effectively home-school and work with employers and financial institutions to lessen the burden.

    What do you mean a charade? Who is getting their stories straight?


  • #8850
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    KerryConnor wrote: »
    OK I was just throwing out a guesstimate.. . But if a cluster of 100 happened within a school. Which is very possible based on other incidents abroad. That might be 300 or 400 cases in the community within a few weeks which might result in a few deaths. Or no deaths or 10 deaths we just don't know.

    Not sure on proportion suffering "long term" and 3 or 4 months (and counting.. ) for a virus seems pretty long term to me. It's a shocking length of time to feel unwell.

    So a complete hypothetical. As a society we have to decide if that is worth the risk, and by the sentiment here, it seems to be worth it.

    Anecdotally, as a fit/healthy 21 yr old, I had the flu, and was effed for about 3 months after it.


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  • #8851
    sideswipe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,439 ✭✭✭sideswipe


    There really should be an online learning system developed for the coming year. Kids with health issues or those that have vulnerable family members or even those who don’t want to risk the school environment could learn from home.
    Less kids physically in school means reduced risk for everyone.


This discussion has been closed.
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