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Aer Lingus Fleet/ Routes Discussion Pt 2 (ALL possible routes included)

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    #422
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,853 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Sunny Brief Huntsman wrote: »
    Where does it say it only applies to existing bookings? I know the EI website is famous for hiding terms and conditions

    It'll be in the T&Cs on the new booking

    This is not going to work - and discussion is completely off topic here.


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    #423
    Jack1985
    Registered Users Posts: 2,497 ✭✭✭Jack1985


    Sunny Brief Huntsman wrote: »
    due to travel on flights up to 30 June 2020 and on cancelled flights.

    That reads as Any flights up to 30 June and on cancelled flights with no deadline.

    We are going around in roundabouts here. Your question has been answered if you can't grasp what you are being told with effort and multiple times, then please try your proposed theory you will find it will not work. For the final time you cannot switch to a flight that is cancelled and claim a refund. The only flights you can switch to will be services that will be operating.

    Good afternoon.


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    #424
    TrueDub
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators Posts: 2,639 Mod ✭✭✭✭TrueDub


    This may be a stupid/off-topic/repeat question - if so, please redirect me or delete, please.

    I have a booking to travel to Boston on 15/07 with Aer Lingus, home on the 02/08. Booking is for 2 adults & 2 kids, total value around 2.5k

    There is still a travel ban in place on people from the EU going to the US - even if the flight operates, is this a sufficient reason for a cancellation by Aer Lingus and thus a refund to me? I'd very reluctantly accept a voucher, but I'm concerned that the flight will operate, and even if we will be prevented from entering the US (actually stopped in Dublin Airport) we won't be entitled to change booking or receive refund/voucher.


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    #425
    MickeyLeari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 917 ✭✭✭MickeyLeari


    TrueDub wrote: »
    This may be a stupid/off-topic/repeat question - if so, please redirect me or delete, please.

    I have a booking to travel to Boston on 15/07 with Aer Lingus, home on the 02/08. Booking is for 2 adults & 2 kids, total value around 2.5k

    There is still a travel ban in place on people from the EU going to the US - even if the flight operates, is this a sufficient reason for a cancellation by Aer Lingus and thus a refund to me? I'd very reluctantly accept a voucher, but I'm concerned that the flight will operate, and even if we will be prevented from entering the US (actually stopped in Dublin Airport) we won't be entitled to change booking or receive refund/voucher.

    I don’t think it is an excuse to seek a refund from Aer Lingus if the flight actually goes. The question then is if you can change the flights with no charge including to other US destinations or whether you will be offered a voucher. You can test the change on manage booking without actually carrying it out.


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    #426
    Tenger
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 9,735 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tenger


    EI-9022 on Friday looks to be the last PPE flight.

    Unless they lay on another due to the return today due mechanical issues.


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    #427
    goingnowhere
    Registered Users Posts: 4,142 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    No flights so far but EI9022 is showing as scheduled to fly today

    Are we sure EI9022 return was mechanical, they flew back at FL400 and landed without fuss. Could it have been they got a message that there was no stuff to collect and due the duty time they couldn't sit on the apron to wait for it?

    They have WiFi up there and EI has CPDLC so no problem get a message to them


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    #428
    Tenger
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 9,735 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tenger


    goingnowhere wrote: »
    .............
    Are we sure EI9022 return was mechanical, they flew back at FL400 and landed without fuss. Could it have been they got a message that there was no stuff to collect and due the duty time they couldn't sit on the apron to wait for it?
    .............
    They wouldn't have departed without confirmation that the shipment was at the airfield.

    Tech issue with cargo hold apparently.


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    #429
    dfx-
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 15,665 Mod ✭✭✭✭dfx-


    Jack1985 wrote: »
    Now bookable,

    Service increases/adjustments on following services from 20 JUL;
    Below EU services resuming ops from 20JUL:

    Surprised BHX is still not going, always full in the Before Times. Ryanair have operated it through the lockdown and are increasing it from July.


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    #430
    Stephen Strange
    Registered Users Posts: 982 ✭✭✭Stephen Strange


    dfx- wrote: »
    Surprised BHX is still not going, always full in the Before Times. Ryanair have operated it through the lockdown and are increasing it from July.

    BHX was always a very connection heavy route, both from the US and AUH, so that could be why


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    #431
    MickeyLeari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 917 ✭✭✭MickeyLeari


    Stephen Strange wrote: »
    BHX was always a very connection heavy route, both from the US and AUH, so that could be why

    As well as trade fairs which will not have been running in recent months.


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    #432
    goingnowhere
    Registered Users Posts: 4,142 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    Stephen Strange wrote: »
    BHX was always a very connection heavy route, both from the US and AUH, so that could be why

    EI regional are resuming service also in July/August so BHX should be picked up there


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    #433
    dfx-
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 15,665 Mod ✭✭✭✭dfx-


    Stephen Strange wrote: »
    BHX was always a very connection heavy route, both from the US and AUH, so that could be why

    A reduction was always on the cards, but it was something like the top five-ish most passengers from/to there at Dublin to support 72 flights a week..


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    #434
    Mc Love
    Registered Users Posts: 14,015 ✭✭✭✭Mc Love


    If EI are operating all of those flights from DUB, why doesnt it operate some from SNN too? Surely if there is demand for the flights then they could easily fly from SNN


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    #435
    Jack1985
    Registered Users Posts: 2,497 ✭✭✭Jack1985


    Mc Love wrote: »
    If EI are operating all of those flights from DUB, why doesnt it operate some from SNN too? Surely if there is demand for the flights then they could easily fly from SNN

    EI have 3 aircraft out of 56 based at Shannon, it makes a lot more sense to restore flights from the hub airport to create sufficient levels of demand to keep the fleet operating even at low levels of utilisation. I don't envisage Shannon operations to LHR returning before end of Aug, the US/EU services may have a while to go longer yet. More operations will be resumed from Cork from mid Aug to be confirmed yet.


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    #436
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Mc Love wrote: »
    If EI are operating all of those flights from DUB, why doesnt it operate some from SNN too? Surely if there is demand for the flights then they could easily fly from SNN

    Because Shannon has proven in recent decades that there really isn't much of a market down there to sustain much beyond the basic routes.


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    #437
    BZ
    Registered Users Posts: 705 ✭✭✭BZ


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Because Shannon has proven in recent decades that there really isn't much of a market down there to sustain much beyond the basic routes.

    Still demand to operate LHR and transatlantic if the travel ban lifts.


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    #438
    Van.Bosch
    Registered Users Posts: 2,851 ✭✭✭Van.Bosch


    BZ wrote: »
    Still demand to operate LHR and transatlantic if the travel ban lifts.

    Is there really though?


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    #439
    goingnowhere
    Registered Users Posts: 4,142 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    EI had made a big bet on Shannon this year with basing the first A321NEO there and adding CDG and BCN as routes. That sadly is history and at best it will be 2 aircraft in Shannon

    1 to cover JFK/BOS every other day and this covers LHR morning
    1 for anything else summer only...


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    #440
    HTCOne
    Registered Users Posts: 869 ✭✭✭HTCOne


    goingnowhere wrote: »
    EI had made a big bet on Shannon this year with basing the first A321NEO there and adding CDG and BCN as routes. That sadly is history and at best it will be 2 aircraft in Shannon

    1 to cover JFK/BOS every other day and this covers LHR morning
    1 for anything else summer only...

    I don't think we'll see any trans Atlantic services from Shannon this year, and it wouldn't surprise me if the EI LRs are all needed in DUB next year too. EWR, YYZ, IAD, BDL, second daily rotations to ORD, BOS & JFK if and when these return might not justify a 330 for quite some time, and the next batch of LRs were already delayed and must be even more delayed now with Airbus themselves and the global supply chain having shut down in various parts of the world due lockdowns, and now likely working much slower due social distancing in factories etc.


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    #441
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    BZ wrote: »
    Still demand to operate LHR and transatlantic if the travel ban lifts.

    Hence my “basic routes”, Heathrow would be basic as would JFK and BOS. Beyond that pretty much everything else has flopped unless it’s a Ryanair bucket and spade route.

    You can argue if you want but facts and history prove the point.


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    #442
    BZ
    Registered Users Posts: 705 ✭✭✭BZ


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Hence my “basic routes”, Heathrow would be basic as would JFK and BOS. Beyond that pretty much everything else has flopped unless it’s a Ryanair bucket and spade route.

    You can argue if you want but facts and history prove the point.

    Paris and Barcelona didn't even get a chance to operate this year. Vienna was also due to start with lufthansa returning to Frankfurt. Are these defined as "basic routes" and pretty sure they aren't bucket and spade.


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    #443
    Van.Bosch
    Registered Users Posts: 2,851 ✭✭✭Van.Bosch


    BZ wrote: »
    Paris and Barcelona didn't even get a chance to operate this year. Vienna was also due to start with lufthansa returning to Frankfurt. Are these defined as "basic routes" and pretty sure they aren't bucket and spade.

    Shannon has always punched above its weight in terms of TA services due to historical reasons. I would fear that this crisis will lead to a massive realignment.

    A lot of the US carriers aren’t coming back until next summer at best case and as pointed out above, EI May use the A321’s out of Dublin as demand drops.


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    #444
    Tenger
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 9,735 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tenger


    BZ wrote: »
    Paris and Barcelona didn't even get a chance to operate this year......... Are these defined as "basic routes" and pretty sure they aren't bucket and spade.
    Considering they were only being added as EI grew its market I would emphatically state that they are not "basic routes"


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    #445
    cson
    Registered Users Posts: 14,417 ✭✭✭✭cson


    goingnowhere wrote: »
    EI had made a big bet on Shannon this year with basing the first A321NEO there and adding CDG and BCN as routes. That sadly is history and at best it will be 2 aircraft in Shannon

    1 to cover JFK/BOS every other day and this covers LHR morning
    1 for anything else summer only...

    A big bet because Pre Clearance in DUB was bursting at the seams.

    Anecdotally, SNN seems to get good inbound traffic from the US in terms of package vacations and golfers during the summer. Any SNN routing I've taken the past few years has had a high load factor.


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    #446
    goingnowhere
    Registered Users Posts: 4,142 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    High load doesn't mean high yield


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    #447
    Cookiemunster
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 11,849 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    goingnowhere wrote: »
    High load doesn't mean high yield


    True, but would the US carriers have continued to return year after year after year if they weren't making enough of a profit?


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    #448
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    BZ wrote: »
    Paris and Barcelona didn't even get a chance to operate this year. Vienna was also due to start with lufthansa returning to Frankfurt. Are these defined as "basic routes" and pretty sure they aren't bucket and spade.

    I would agree they aren't basic routes but I did use the word in my first post "sustain", as they were only new routes Shannon hasn't proven that it could sustain them.


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    #449
    Jack1985
    Registered Users Posts: 2,497 ✭✭✭Jack1985


    goingnowhere wrote: »
    High load doesn't mean high yield

    Have you access to EI’s Business yields previously on SNN TA’s?


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    #450
    HTCOne
    Registered Users Posts: 869 ✭✭✭HTCOne


    Shannon seems to elicit unusually emotive responses from people in our industry. Facts are because of the large number of US multinationals based operating in the Shannon Free Zone, Limerick and Galway, there has always been a decent amount of premium traffic to the States, certainly more than you would expect for such a small airport. The inbound US demand is also high but very seasonal.

    On the other hand, routes to Paris and Barcelona have been tried and failed numerous times. The DLH FRA route mentioned above was 1 x weekly, to a major hub....1 x weekly. It’s my local airport, I work in the town. My fellow locals will moan and moan about how policy wise it is neglected, great airport, Dublin is too big, and then they’ll happily drive up to Dublin because the flight was cheaper, or there were more options, or the direct flight wasn’t operating from Shannon.

    The Shannon group made a profit last year, but it was all from property they own / manage / let out across the country, the airport itself.....I don’t think it could survive without Government help it receives.


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    #451
    Avoation1091
    Closed Accounts Posts: 104 ✭✭Avoation1091


    HTCOne wrote: »
    Shannon seems to elicit unusually emotive responses from people in our industry. Facts are because of the large number of US multinationals based operating in the Shannon Free Zone, Limerick and Galway, there has always been a decent amount of premium traffic to the States, certainly more than you would expect for such a small airport. The inbound US demand is also high but very seasonal.

    On the other hand, routes to Paris and Barcelona have been tried and failed numerous times. The DLH FRA route mentioned above was 1 x weekly, to a major hub....1 x weekly. It’s my local airport, I work in the town. My fellow locals will moan and moan about how policy wise it is neglected, great airport, Dublin is too big, and then they’ll happily drive up to Dublin because the flight was cheaper, or there were more options, or the direct flight wasn’t operating from Shannon.

    The Shannon group made a profit last year, but it was all from property they own / manage / let out across the country, the airport itself.....I don’t think it could survive without Government help it receives.

    Not sure if id agree on Barcelona. Reus outside Barcelona is still operating with FR. Its also due to resume next week. BCN with EI wont get the chance to start this year so thats also unclear whether that would have failed. It also would have provided an alternative to REU. Sunway were also using this flight for holidays to Salou.

    Ive also flown SNN-JFK twice in the past 2 years and the flights have been 90-100% full in economy. Business class also looked very healthy. Demand is definitely there for students and people living / working in US as well who commute back to Ireland.

    I would also like to no how the poster above knows SNN is only getting 2 a/c based. Im sure schedules for August arent even confirmed. Everything is subject go change. I have read SNN expect LHR to resume in Sept with the T/A ops resuming short time after. As I said all subject to change depending on restrictions as I read this before the increase in US cases.


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