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The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

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    #3842
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users Posts: 11,031 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    Rams all in for this season despite starting 3-3.

    Their depth is already showing issues due to selling their future with previous trades. Will take some creative deal making to keep all the players they have coming into FA at the end of the year, while paying the guys they've already signed.


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    #3843
    Big Pussy Bonpensiero
    Registered Users Posts: 7,776 ✭✭✭Big Pussy Bonpensiero


    How the hell are they going to pay everyone.


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    #3844
    brinty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,333 ✭✭✭brinty


    Big Pussy Bonpensiero wrote:
    How the hell are they going to pay everyone.

    They can't and won't be able too.

    It's won or bust now surely. Five years without first round picks is not how to build a team.

    2017 to Tennessee - used to get Goff in 2016
    2018 to Patriots - traded for Brandon Cooks
    2019 to Atlanta - traded picks in first and sixth for second and third round picks, then traded the Atlanta second for a second and third from the Patriots (picks 56 and 101) and then traded the Patriots second for second and a fifth...
    2020 to Jaguars - traded to get Jalen Ramsey
    2021 to Jaguars - traded to get Jalen Ramsey


    If 2019 is how they intend to build out their roster that's a recipe for hit and miss.

    Also noticed there's three former Jaguars first round picks in their roster with Blake bortles and Dante Fowler Jr with jalen Ramsey now joining them


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    #3845
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Big Pussy Bonpensiero wrote: »
    How the hell are they going to pay everyone.

    One season rental?


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    #3846
    Optimus Caesar
    Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭Optimus Caesar


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    One season rental?

    Don’t think so. You don’t give up that much unless you plan on locking him down long term.


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    #3847
    Knex*
    Registered Users Posts: 22,477 ✭✭✭✭Knex*


    That is going to bite Rams in the ass, long term.

    Their OL is tragic this year and Goff isn't winning a Super Bowl with it. They've mortgaged their future to win now, but I think they've gambled incorrectly here.


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    #3848
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Brockers, Cooks and Whitworth are all free agents and would free up significant funds.

    Re-signing Ramsey is possible but it's going to cost them on other areas of the team. The Rams will need to hit on cheap mid-round rookies to bolster the lineup.


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    #3849
    Optimus Caesar
    Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭Optimus Caesar


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    Brockers, Cooks and Whitworth are all free agents and would free up significant funds.

    Re-signing Ramsey is possible but it's going to cost them on other areas of the team. The Rams will need to hit on cheap mid-round rookies to bolster the lineup.

    Whitworth will retire. I was surprised he came back this year but I’d say the prospect of another super bow run persuaded him.
    I don’t know if Brockers will be kept as I like him but his production is down on last season so far.

    Cooks will be interesting. I’d like to keep him but don’t think it’ll be possible.


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    #3850
    Knex*
    Registered Users Posts: 22,477 ✭✭✭✭Knex*


    It's just a hell of a lot of capital, both in picks and the impending salary demands, to give up.

    A somewhat maligned QB that just threw for 70 yards on a 140m contract. A RB who is seemingly now a perennial injury report member on a 60m contract, and no OL to talk about.

    It seems to be a shortsighted panic move.


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    #3851
    Adamcp898
    Registered Users Posts: 5,469 ✭✭✭Adamcp898


    I'd kinda get it if they had started similarly to how they did last year. But at 3-3 and with so many question marks hanging over the aspects of their game that got them that super bowl run last year, I just don't think it's wise to go all-in. All of Goff's weaknesses that people said were there are finally being exposed, the star running back is a shadow of his former self, and even though they have a star receiving core they can't seem to scheme well enough to take full advantage of it, either due to Goff's limitations or the coaching staff's.


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    #3852
    Christy42
    Registered Users Posts: 7,870 ✭✭✭Christy42


    It does seem weird. It does make the defense very good. Even with Talib on IR.

    Still Goff seems very much like a QB who takes what his team mates give him. With a better oline and Gurley at full I think he looks great again and takes full advantage (damning with faint praise but this is a rare enough skill against NFL defenses). Without that Goff won't drag them out of trouble like the top QBs, indeed he seems to suffer more than most.


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    #3853
    Optimus Caesar
    Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭Optimus Caesar


    I think you’re right about Goff Christy.
    With a functional O Line and a good running game he is more than fine and he can be very productive in that. But take that away and he cannot handle pressure.
    Gurley is the bigger issue and IMO he’ll be cut in offseason if this is what he is going to be now. They are paying him too much for that.


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    #3854
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Optimus Caesar wrote: »
    I think you’re right about Goff Christy.
    With a functional O Line and a good running game he is more than fine and he can be very productive in that. But take that away and he cannot handle pressure.
    Gurley is the bigger issue and IMO he’ll be cut in offseason if this is what he is going to be now. They are paying him too much for that.

    Gurley's guarantees lock him in for 2020.


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    #3855
    Optimus Caesar
    Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭Optimus Caesar


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    Gurley's guarantees lock him in for 2020.

    How much would it cost them to cut him?
    Given how little they used him before the quad injury and his production with what touches he did get, he’s massively overpaid.
    Don’t get me wrong, what he had done since he came in to the league earned that contract but the business of the NFL demands that the Rams take a look at it if he’s now going to be a 10-15 touches guy going forward.


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    #3856
    boccy23
    Registered Users Posts: 2,933 ✭✭✭boccy23


    Is there a worse DC than Steve Spagnuolo.

    If you take away his first two seasons with the Giants ('07 & '08) in coaching stints either as DC or HC with the Rams, Saints, Giants and now the Chiefs, he has a top half of the league rated defence once - the '16 Giants which finished at 10.

    Other than his team rank as follows:
    29
    19
    22
    32
    32
    31
    31

    And now with the Chiefs, they are currently ranked at 27.

    Why is he still getting a chance and he has killed the chances of so many teams - currently the Patrick Mahomes Chiefs.

    The last two weeks have proven that the Chiefs run D is awful (30th). So run the ball and keep Mahomes off the field. Just 20 mins possession for them last week.


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    #3857
    cosatron
    Registered Users Posts: 2,014 ✭✭✭cosatron


    boccy23 wrote: »
    Is there a worse DC than Steve Spagnuolo.

    If you take away his first two seasons with the Giants ('07 & '08) in coaching stints either as DC or HC with the Rams, Saints, Giants and now the Chiefs, he has a top half of the league rated defence once - the '16 Giants which finished at 10.

    Other than his team rank as follows:
    29
    19
    22
    32
    32
    31
    31

    And now with the Chiefs, they are currently ranked at 27.

    Why is he still getting a chance and he has killed the chances of so many teams - currently the Patrick Mahomes Chiefs.

    The last two weeks have proven that the Chiefs run D is awful (30th). So run the ball and keep Mahomes off the field. Just 20 mins possession for them last week.

    I think letting go Houston and dee ford is having a bigger impact on the defence, Houston was the heartbeat of that defence and he is still only 30.


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    #3858
    Knex*
    Registered Users Posts: 22,477 ✭✭✭✭Knex*


    He also seemingly gets picked to coach teams with little talent on defense. So whether he is a scapegoat of sorts, or a man who can help mask some of the inefficiencies with his complex scheme, I don't know.

    When he has talent, you could argue that he seems to do fine? Definitely a weird one though, as he has some of the worst defenses of all time under his name.

    The Chiefs had a bad defense last year and they let two big players walk, as cosatron said above, so not sure it's a great situation for any coordinator.


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    #3859
    boccy23
    Registered Users Posts: 2,933 ✭✭✭boccy23


    cosatron wrote: »
    I think letting go Houston and dee ford is having a bigger impact on the defence, Houston was the heartbeat of that defence and he is still only 30.

    I'm not arguing about the situation per say, but why does he keep getting these chances? Are there not any other DCs or potential DCs wither in the HFL or college. There are loads of HCs and OCs brought from college but none of the D side of the ball.

    He reminds me of a nicer(?) version of Rex Ryan.


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    #3860
    cosatron
    Registered Users Posts: 2,014 ✭✭✭cosatron


    boccy23 wrote: »
    I'm not arguing about the situation per say, but why does he keep getting these chances? Are there not any other DCs or potential DCs wither in the HFL or college. There are loads of HCs and OCs brought from college but none of the D side of the ball.

    He reminds me of a nicer(?) version of Rex Ryan.

    there does seem to be a lack of young defensive coaches in the league and any prominent dc seems to always get a head coaching job at some stage and when it doesn't work out they return to dc and this also applies to college football.


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    #3861
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users Posts: 11,031 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    Christy42 wrote: »
    It does seem weird. It does make the defense very good. Even with Talib on IR.

    Still Goff seems very much like a QB who takes what his team mates give him. With a better oline and Gurley at full I think he looks great again and takes full advantage (damning with faint praise but this is a rare enough skill against NFL defenses). Without that Goff won't drag them out of trouble like the top QBs, indeed he seems to suffer more than most.

    Problem is that unless they get lucky they now aren't going to be able to improve their OL through FA or the draft to give Goff that support. They are improving in an area where they didn't really have a huge issue, while ignoring areas they did.

    An interesting comment I saw was that Ramsey isn't going to be of huge benefit when it comes to in division rivals. None of the other teams in the NFC West have a clear #1 receiver that they focus their offense through. Obviously Rams probably have bigger fish to target in a hopeful Super Bowl run but they have to make it to the playoffs first.


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    #3862
    The_Honeybadger
    Registered Users Posts: 4,155 ✭✭✭The_Honeybadger


    They will do well to make it out of the division with San Fran and Seattle in there. Not sure I like this signing either but good luck to them.


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    #3863
    Jolly Red Giant
    Registered Users Posts: 3,434 ✭✭✭Jolly Red Giant


    I see Brock Osweiler has retired - taking his $41.3million in career earnings with him.


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    #3864
    phatkev
    Registered Users Posts: 3,636 ✭✭✭phatkev


    Jolly Red Giant wrote: »
    I see Brock Osweiler has retired - taking his $41.3million in career earnings with him.

    Not bad going for 7 odd years!


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    #3865
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,520 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    phatkev wrote: »
    Not bad going for 7 odd years!

    Not bad going for 697 completed passes.
    Just under 60K for every successful pass.


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    #3866
    Xavi6
    Registered Users Posts: 40,861 ✭✭✭✭Xavi6


    boccy23 wrote: »
    I'm not arguing about the situation per say, but why does he keep getting these chances? Are there not any other DCs or potential DCs wither in the HFL or college. There are loads of HCs and OCs brought from college but none of the D side of the ball.

    He reminds me of a nicer(?) version of Rex Ryan.

    He got the gig because he's Andy Reid's mate from their Philly days, lots of Chiefs fans were very unimpressed with the appointment and they're being proved right. Run the ball, keep Patrick Mahomes off the field, profit.

    Chris Jones, Eric Fisher, Sammy Watkins and Kendall Fuller are all out for the trip to Denver while Mahomes hobbles around on a bad ankle behind a bad o-line. The Chiefs don't tend to do primetime games well so could easily be 4-3 tomorrow night when Phillip Lindsay rushes for 150+ yards, not good after all the hype.


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    #3867
    MileHighGuy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,700 ✭✭✭MileHighGuy


    What's extremely strange about the Ramsey trade.... there is no contract extension agreed upon. Ramsey has them over a barrel when the negotiation comes up. What are they going to do in 18 months time? Release him? After giving up the opportunity to draft 2 top tier players on team friendly contracts to get him?

    The Rams sputtered through the playoffs last year, (offensively) ground to a halt in the Super Bowl, and have not recovered. Goff contract looks like it will be an albatross around their neck for years to come. It wouldn't surprise me if they tried to trade him in the offseason. Is the drop off from him to Bortles so big? $36m v $1m in salary and could net them some badly needed draft capital.


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    #3868
    Shedite27
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭Shedite27


    MileHighGuy wrote: »
    What's extremely strange about the Ramsey trade.... there is no contract extension agreed upon. Ramsey has them over a barrel when the negotiation comes up. What are they going to do in 18 months time? Release him? After giving up the opportunity to draft 2 top tier players on team friendly contracts to get him?
    I can't believe any team or GM would be that stupid to let that happen. Presumably they've something in the workings behind the scenes. I've read it a few places now, for every analyst and fan to spot the problem, and the Rams to have missed it? Doesn't seem likely.


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    #3869
    The_Honeybadger
    Registered Users Posts: 4,155 ✭✭✭The_Honeybadger


    MileHighGuy wrote: »
    What's extremely strange about the Ramsey trade.... there is no contract extension agreed upon. Ramsey has them over a barrel when the negotiation comes up. What are they going to do in 18 months time? Release him? After giving up the opportunity to draft 2 top tier players on team friendly contracts to get him?

    The Rams sputtered through the playoffs last year, (offensively) ground to a halt in the Super Bowl, and have not recovered. Goff contract looks like it will be an albatross around their neck for years to come. It wouldn't surprise me if they tried to trade him in the offseason. Is the drop off from him to Bortles so big? $36m v $1m in salary and could net them some badly needed draft capital.

    Ramsey will be the highest paid CB in football before the start of next season, a deal in principal may already be worked out but for details. Move makes no sense otherwise. Rams are really rolling the dice here going with a very top heavy roster. The Gurley and Goff contracts look bad as others have said and they may lose solid guys like Littleton as a result.

    It doesn’t look like a sustainable way to build a roster to me. It’s going to be fun watching how it unfolds though.


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    #3870
    MileHighGuy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,700 ✭✭✭MileHighGuy


    Shedite27 wrote: »
    I can't believe any team or GM would be that stupid to let that happen. Presumably they've something in the workings behind the scenes. I've read it a few places now, for every analyst and fan to spot the problem, and the Rams to have missed it? Doesn't seem likely.

    Agreed, you would have to *think* they have something in principal, and certainly it will be the richest contract on a per year basis for a CB, but what else....there's guaranteed money he can demand, a fully guaranteed contract, he can dictate the terms that's for sure.


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    #3871
    MileHighGuy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,700 ✭✭✭MileHighGuy


    Jolly Red Giant wrote: »
    I see Brock Osweiler has retired - taking his $41.3million in career earnings with him.

    Some fond memories of Brock from 2015... he was able to complete some great throws every now and again....check out this 50 yard bomb, right into the receivers hands.

    https://twitter.com/thecheckdown/status/1184580835179220992


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