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President Donald Trump - Formal Impeachment Inquiry Announced

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  • Options
    #992
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    duploelabs wrote: »
    Is ODS (Obama dereangement syndrome) a thing?
    No. It was OWS (Obama Worship Syndrome).

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #993
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    I didn't know Obama was back as President ;)

    Trump is a low grade human being. He's openly attacking Biden and his son, talking about him not being qualified. This is all based on unfounded rumor and even if proven to be true calling on China and strong arming the Ukraine using an unofficial personal Lawyer, (Giuiiania) and compromised Barr to do it is impeachable IMO. The GOP would have a stroke if Obama or Clinton, (either Clinton) pulled that sh*te. Complete unpatriotic hypocrites the Republicans.

    And talk about nepotism and not qualified for the job...

    14KUSHNER1-articleLarge.jpg?quality=75&auto=webp&disable=upscale


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    #994
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    I didn't know Obama was back as President ;)

    Trump is a low grade human being. He's openly attacking Biden and his son, talking about him not being qualified. This is all based on unfounded rumor and even if proven to be true calling on China and strong arming the Ukraine using an unofficial personal Lawyer, (Giuiiania) and compromised Barr to do it is impeachable IMO. The GOP would have a stroke if Obama or Clinton, (either Clinton) pulled that sh*te. Complete unpatriotic hypocrites the Republicans.

    And talk about nepotism and not qualified for the job...

    14KUSHNER1-articleLarge.jpg?quality=75&auto=webp&disable=upscale
    How much are Trump's daughter and son-in-law being paid?

    How was Hunter Biden qualified to sit on those Boards?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #995
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    notobtuse wrote: »
    How much are Trump's daughter and son-in-law being paid?

    How was Hunter Biden qualified to sit on those Boards?

    You think the Kushners aren't going to make out of this? You think these two amateurs should be brokering peace in the middle east?
    You've a weird logic. Hunter Biden, worst case scenario, made a ton of money because of who his father was. The Kushner's are colouring U.S. policy. Does that not scare the bejesus out of you, as an American?
    Also the Biden thing is rumour regarding getting that prosecutor fired. There was a move by the US and the EU to have him removed. He was working in a corrupt environment and not seen to do anything about it.
    Your POTUS held back military aid from a country being undermined by Putin for God sake. Get your priorities straight.


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    #996
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    You think the Kushners aren't going to make out of this? You think these two amateurs should be brokering peace in the middle east?
    You've a weird logic. Hunter Biden, worst case scenario, made a ton of money because of who his father was. The Kushner's are colouring U.S. policy. Does that not scare the bejesus out of you, as an American?
    Also the Biden thing is rumour regarding getting that prosecutor fired. There was a move by the US and the EU to have him removed. He was working in a corrupt environment and not seen to do anything about it.
    Your POTUS held back military aid from a country being undermined by Putin for God sake. Get your priorities straight.
    How has that peace in the middle east been going that’s been brokered for decades by career professionals?

    And how are the Kushners’ going to make out from their work? Hunter Biden became a director of Burisma, the largest natural-gas producer in Ukraine with no prior experience in the gas industry, or with Ukrainian regulatory affairs. His only qualification was his position as the son of the vice president. But in your eyes the Kurshners’, who are working for a better world and taking no salary are evil, yet Biden’s quid pro quo and his son’s slimy leveraging of favors simply because daddy was the VP seem to be socially acceptable corruption to you... do I have that right?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #997
    Veritas Libertas
    Closed Accounts Posts: 579 ✭✭✭Veritas Libertas


    The Phantom Jipper wrote: »
    Trump is being impeached because he asked the Ukrainians to investigate a political opponent, and used taxpayer funds as leverage to get them to do so. His own public statements and transcript confirm this.

    The endless Twitter links and conspiracy theory videos explaining "the real scandal" are unnecessary. It really is an open and shut case.

    "A Political Opponent"- Biden is not the democratic nominee and it is unlikely he will be, Warren is the odds on favourite.
    "There's a lot of talk about Biden's son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it... It sounds horrible to me."
    This is Trump's statements that confirms he used taxpayer funds as leverage to attack Biden?

    You see if you want to impeach Trump for attacking a political rival, at least get his political rival correct.... WARREN.

    But since he asked for an investigation into Biden, it warrants the question; is this investigation based on anything, or is it completely made up?
    If there is nothing about Biden... then it would look like Trump is trying to dig up dirt.

    But if Biden has done something untowards it certainly lowers the 'crime' committed by Trump.

    To dismiss this information as conspiracy and an 'open and shut case' is a sure fire case of Trump Delusion Syndrome.


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    #998
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 81,937 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Days after Ukraine call Trump predicted Biden would win the Primary

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/video/politics/trump-predicts-biden-will-win-democratic-primary-hell-limp-across-the-line/2019/07/30/d6b0f5ae-f221-457e-9de7-8f29b070837c_video.html

    Pull another one


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    #999
    mad muffin
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭mad muffin


    notobtuse wrote: »
    One has to wonder if, as the democrats and media claim, their numerous cases against Trump are so strong, why do they find it necessary to continually lie and make things up about him?


    Trumps presidency in a nutshell…
    https://vimeo.com/362919470

    Beautiful video. Thanks for posting it.


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    #1000
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    notobtuse wrote: »
    How has that peace in the middle east been going that’s been brokered for decades by career professionals?

    And how are the Kushners’ going to make out from their work? Hunter Biden became a director of Burisma, the largest natural-gas producer in Ukraine with no prior experience in the gas industry, or with Ukrainian regulatory affairs. His only qualification was his position as the son of the vice president. But in your eyes the Kurshners’, who are working for a better world and taking no salary are evil, yet Biden’s quid pro quo and his son’s slimy leveraging of favors simply because daddy was the VP seem to be socially acceptable corruption to you... do I have that right?

    Again, we all don't live in the teams mentality you do. They can lock up Biden and his son for all I care.
    Time to put your country ahead of your party comrade.
    Veritas Libertas wrote: »
    "A Political Opponent"- Biden is not the democratic nominee and it is unlikely he will be, Warren is the odds on favourite.....

    To dismiss this information as conspiracy and an 'open and shut case' is a sure fire case of Trump Delusion Syndrome.

    Same to you. Sadly for America, Biden is the only one with a shot.
    At this point I think the only way America has a chance of being great again is if Trump is kicked out of office by American patriots. He's an enemy of the U.S.A.


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    #1001
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    Again, we all don't live in the teams mentality you do. They can lock up Biden and his son for all I care.
    Time to put your country ahead of your party comrade.

    Looking into potential corruption by a Vice President, and a political party and their political appointees to high offices' potential illegal and deceitful attempts with the use of foreign agents to destroy the GOP candidate, and then work to undermine and get the duly elected president out of office once he’s elected isn’t something our country should be concerned with?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #1002
    Igotadose
    Registered Users Posts: 13,077 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Looking into potential corruption by a Vice President, and a political party and their political appointees to high offices' potential illegal and deceitful attempts with the use of foreign agents to destroy the GOP candidate, and then work to undermine and get the duly elected president out of office once he’s elected isn’t something our country should be concerned with?

    And he has the enormous mechanism of the US intelligence apparatus to do this. So, what exactly did Rudy have to do?

    Trump hired Manafort, and as a result got in bed with the Ukranians. Hence the interest in all things Ukraine. And the massive fear evident from Trump's increasingly unhinged behavior as the impeachment investigation continues and what Trump & Manafort got into in Ukraine becomes evidence.

    There's already some interest in Trump's dealings (the story Trump broke about Rick Perry asking for the phone call) and Ukranian energy interests. Seems that the US officials involved are GOP donors with high-level access to Trump: https://apnews.com/d7440cffba4940f5b85cd3dfa3500fb2


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    #1003
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Igotadose wrote: »
    And he has the enormous mechanism of the US intelligence apparatus to do this. So, what exactly did Rudy have to do?

    Trump hired Manafort, and as a result got in bed with the Ukranians. Hence the interest in all things Ukraine. And the massive fear evident from Trump's increasingly unhinged behavior as the impeachment investigation continues and what Trump & Manafort got into in Ukraine becomes evidence.

    There's already some interest in Trump's dealings (the story Trump broke about Rick Perry asking for the phone call) and Ukranian energy interests. Seems that the US officials involved are GOP donors with high-level access to Trump: https://apnews.com/d7440cffba4940f5b85cd3dfa3500fb2
    There has been and are investigations into this. Now we should also look at other improper things, even if they come from the DNC, right?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #1004
    Igotadose
    Registered Users Posts: 13,077 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    notobtuse wrote: »
    There has been and are investigations into this. Now we should also look at other improper things, even if they come from the DNC, right?

    Feel free to start another thread. There's a convenient forum called "Conspiracy Theories" you can use. This thread's the Trump impeachment thread - I brought up the AP story as it's very relevant - Trump's cabinet, Ukraine, energy, etc.


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    #1005
    Junkyard Tom
    Registered Users Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    They always made sausages in the White House - the difference with Trump is that he will just kill the pig, bleed it, and disembowel it in front of you.


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    #1006
    Veritas Libertas
    Closed Accounts Posts: 579 ✭✭✭Veritas Libertas


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    Same to you. Sadly for America, Biden is the only one with a shot.
    At this point I think the only way America has a chance of being great again is if Trump is kicked out of office by American patriots. He's an enemy of the U.S.A.

    Glad we have you around to summize world events in such easily interpretable language, labelling whoever you dislike or disagree with as names designed to ruin their character. Bit like Trump really.

    I would have voted for Hilary, but what we've learned since 2016 I'm glad Trump is now in office; he has revealed the advocacy in journalism and the cronyism in politics and he's the only person capable of withstanding this onslaught of continuous goal-post shifting:
    Since the election of Donald Trump in 2016, almost all legacy media outlets have fixated on resistance to his presidency, at the expense of traditional journalism. Until this summer, that resistance centered on the chimera of an insidious Russian conspiracy. Now, as that canard fades away, the new anti-Trump obsession of racism emerges.

    Think I exaggerate? Then consider actual recent statements from the leadership of the once-vaunted New York Times. At its internal town-hall meeting last week, Executive Editor Dean Baquet bluntly conceded the Times’ preoccupation with the Trump/Russia saga, explaining that “we built our newsroom to cover one story.” But Robert Mueller’s milquetoast report and subsequent disastrous testimony effectively ended the lunacy of the whole Russia imbroglio. Acknowledging this conundrum, Baquet admitted, “Now we have to regroup.”
    [...]
    But Donald Trump showed up uninvited to their soiree. Through his brawling style and communications savvy, he diminishes their influence and threatens their cozy perches. Through social media, raucous rallies and humor, he speaks above and around them, the ultimate media disruptor. Since Nov. 8, 2016, they have assured themselves that our electoral triumph would be undone, first by the Russian charade, and now by a false narrative of racism. But in place of their three R’s of resistance, Russia, and racism, they should become better acquainted with a fourth R … re-election.
    Realclearpolitics


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    #1007
    Junkyard Tom
    Registered Users Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    At this point I think the only way America has a chance of being great again is if Trump is kicked out of office

    Trump is a symptom not the disease. Nothing is going to change from the top down in the US. Obama promised 'hope and change' and delivered fuck all of note. Even if Sanders managed to get into the WH he'd be tied up in knots by the system and get nothing done.


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    #1008
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Igotadose wrote: »
    Feel free to start another thread. There's a convenient forum called "Conspiracy Theories" you can use. This thread's the Trump impeachment thread - I brought up the AP story as it's very relevant - Trump's cabinet, Ukraine, energy, etc.
    Unfortunately for those who comment without knowledge, if an impeachment trial takes place in the Senate, everything is on the table and Trump's lawyers can bring everything I noted into play.

    Thought… If you were worried that you might soon be revealed as illegally partaking in leaks, wouldn’t it make sense to call yourself a whistleblower to obtain certain safeguards and get yourself a lawyer?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #1009
    Veritas Libertas
    Closed Accounts Posts: 579 ✭✭✭Veritas Libertas


    Junkyard Tom wrote: »
    Trump is a symptom not the disease.

    Nail on head.


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    #1010
    mad muffin
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭mad muffin


    As it has been stated umpteen times. Rudy Giuliani was in Ukraine gathering evidence for a possible defence during the Mueller investigation. He was conducting the investigation before Biden even declared he was running.

    He wasn’t even looking into Biden at the time. This was all about the 2016 collusion with the DNC/Hillary/Obama administration with Russia and Ukraine to spy on Trump and get dirt on him for Hillary to use in the the election. Subsequently two high ranking Ukrainians were charged and convicted of meddling in the 2016 election. I posted a video earlier of a tape of them discussing it.

    Giuliani came upon Biden’s corruption because the Ukrainian’s came to him. They didn’t understand why no one in the FBI or state Department were interested in their finding.

    Manafort problems have nothing to do with Trump.

    It’s all well documented. Plenty of evidence out there. Barr, and Pompeo or on it, as is Durham and Horowitz.


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    #1011
    The Phantom Jipper
    Registered Users Posts: 881 ✭✭✭The Phantom Jipper


    Veritas Libertas wrote: »

    "A Political Opponent"- Biden is not the democratic nominee and it is unlikely he will be, Warren is the odds on favourite.
    "There's a lot of talk about Biden's son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it... It sounds horrible to me."
    This is Trump's statements that confirms he used taxpayer funds as leverage to attack Biden?

    You see if you want to impeach Trump for attacking a political rival, at least get his political rival correct.... WARREN.

    But since he asked for an investigation into Biden, it warrants the question; is this investigation based on anything, or is it completely made up?
    If there is nothing about Biden... then it would look like Trump is trying to dig up dirt.

    But if Biden has done something untowards it certainly lowers the 'crime' committed by Trump.

    To dismiss this information as conspiracy and an 'open and shut case' is a sure fire case of Trump Delusion Syndrome.

    This is an absurd response, even by Boards standards. Trump is being impeached because soliciting information from a foreign country is illegal. There isn't an exemption because he solicited information on someone who wasn't the bookies favourite.

    Taking your argument at face value, you seem to be saying that Trump should be impeached if he had sought dirt on the favourite in the race. Are you aware that at the time of the call that this person was Biden? A Fox News poll the day before the call had Biden 18% ahead in the Democrat race, and 10% ahead versus Trump. Even by your own silly made up standard, you think he should be impeached.


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    #1012
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    The Phantom Jipper wrote: »
    This is an absurd response, even by Boards standards. Trump is being impeached because soliciting information from a foreign country is illegal. There isn't an exemption because he solicited information on someone who wasn't the bookies favourite.
    Sorry, but wrong. Trump, in asking for help from Ukraine and China, was looking for help with fighting corruption, not politically motivated, which is completely legal.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #1013
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Looking into potential corruption by a Vice President, and a political party and their political appointees to high offices' potential illegal and deceitful attempts with the use of foreign agents to destroy the GOP candidate, and then work to undermine and get the duly elected president out of office once he’s elected isn’t something our country should be concerned with?

    Using foreign powers to try mount a mud slinging campaign on an elected American citizen for personal gain.
    Using the mechanics of the office of President to strong arm an ally into investigating a political opponent. Calling in China to investigate a political opponent. China :rolleyes:


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    #1014
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Sorry, but wrong. Trump, in asking for help from Ukraine and China, was looking for help with fighting corruption, not politically motivated, which is completely legal.

    So the U.S. is in distress? Asking China to help and strong arming Ukraine who are fending off attacks by Putin?
    There is zero evidence on the Biden's. The above is fact. Your country is a shambles.


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    #1015
    The Phantom Jipper
    Registered Users Posts: 881 ✭✭✭The Phantom Jipper


    notobtuse wrote: »
    The Phantom Jipper wrote: »
    This is an absurd response, even by Boards standards. Trump is being impeached because soliciting information from a foreign country is illegal. There isn't an exemption because he solicited information on someone who wasn't the bookies favourite.
    Sorry, but wrong. Trump, in asking for help from Ukraine and China, was looking for help with fighting corruption, not politically motivated, which is completely legal.

    It's peculiar that the witnesses to his fight against corruption have been called traitors for talking about it, and he has alluded to them getting the death penalty. You'd think they'd be getting a medal for alerting us all to his good work.


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    #1016
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    The Phantom Jipper wrote: »
    It's peculiar that the witnesses to his fight against corruption have been called traitors for talking about it, and he has alluded to them getting the death penalty. You'd think they'd be getting a medal for alerting us all to his good work.

    As it stands, the media tell lies and we shouldn't listen. Members of congress 'hate america' and whistle blowers are nasty, but China can help :)


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    #1017
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    Using foreign powers to try mount a mud slinging campaign on an elected American citizen for personal gain.
    Using the mechanics of the office of President to strong arm an ally into investigating a political opponent. Calling in China to investigate a political opponent. China :rolleyes:
    Fiction is quite unbecoming. Did you not read any of the transcript of the call between Trump and Zelensky? Trump was also asking for help with investigating into the hacking of the DNC server during the 2016 election. Back then your side kept claiming it was orchestrated by Republicans. So I guess if Trump was asking for a political ‘favor,’ it must have been aimed at taking out those within his own party, right? Or is it another case of nothing to see here, please move along?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



  • Options
    #1018
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    So the U.S. is in distress? Asking China to help and strong arming Ukraine who are fending off attacks by Putin?
    There is zero evidence on the Biden's. The above is fact. Your country is a shambles.
    My country is a shambles? Why did nobody tell me? Why am I always the last to know?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #1019
    Outlaw Pete
    Registered Users Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭Outlaw Pete


    The Phantom Jipper wrote: »
    Taking your argument at face value, you seem to be saying that Trump should be impeached if he had sought dirt on the favourite in the race. Are you aware that at the time of the call that this person was Biden? A Fox News poll the day before the call had Biden 18% ahead in the Democrat race, and 10% ahead versus Trump. Even by your own silly made up standard, you think he should be impeached.

    Biden is not above the law and while I don't think Trump should be publically saying he thinks Biden and his son are corrupt (although the Nikelback tweet was funny) there is absolutely nothing wrong with a POTUS asking the president of the Ukraine to investigate reports of corruption involving both their countries, and especially so when someone who was a member of the last administration has in the interim spoke publicly about how when they were Vice-President they threatened to withhold $1billion in approved US aid from that country unless they got rid of one of their prosecutors.

    On the contrary, such a president would be negligent in my opinion, and I have zero doubt that Obama would have had the full support of democrats (and liberals alike) if in the run up to the 2012 election there had been a leak from a Bush holdover in the White House that Obama had requested that the Attorney General investigate Dick Cheney in response to footage surfacing of him saying that he used $1billion in US aid to have a prosecutor of another country fired and also making comments which suggested that Bush was okay with him doing so.


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    #1020
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Outlaw Pete wrote: »
    Biden is not above the law and while I don't think Trump should be publically saying he thinks Biden and his son are corrupt (although the Nikelback tweet was funny) there is absolutely nothing wrong with a POTUS asking the president of the Ukraine to investigate reports of corruption involving both their countries, and especially so when someone who was a member of the last administration has in the interim spoke publicly about how when they were Vice-President they threatened to withhold $1billion in approved US aid from that country unless they got rid of one of their prosecutors.

    On the contrary, such a president would be negligent in my opinion, and I have zero doubt that Obama would have had the full support of democrats (and liberals alike) if in the run up to the 2012 election there had been a leak from a Bush holdover in the White House that Obama had requested that the Attorney General investigate Dick Cheney in response to footage surfacing of him saying that he used $1billion in US aid to have a prosecutor of another country fired and also making comments which suggested that Bush was okay with him doing so.
    Correct about Biden... Only Hillary is above the law.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #1021
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Unfortunately for those who comment without knowledge, if an impeachment trial takes place in the Senate, everything is on the table and Trump's lawyers can bring everything I noted into play.

    Thought… If you were worried that you might soon be revealed as illegally partaking in leaks, wouldn’t it make sense to call yourself a whistleblower to obtain certain safeguards and get yourself a lawyer?
    The Whistleblower Protection Act of 1989, 5 U.S.C. 2302(b)(8)-(9), Pub.L. 101-12 as amended, is a United States federal law that protects federal whistleblowers who work for the government and report the possible existence of an activity constituting a violation of law, rules, or regulations, or mismanagement, gross waste of funds, abuse of authority or a substantial and specific danger to public health and safety. A federal agency violates the Whistleblower Protection Act if agency authorities take (or threaten to take) retaliatory personnel action against any employee or applicant because of disclosure of information by that employee or applicant

    Sounds like you've (and Trump) prejudged the person's motives. Not very open or just is it?


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