DCM 2019 - Mentored Novices Thread

Doing a bit of analysis of my 2014 marathon out of curiosity and being reminded of the potentially painful finish if the training goes wrong. Looking back I didn’t do many long runs at all, only 13 over 10 miles and I never even actually hit the 20. Every time I ran further it was my longest run ever. Those 13 runs looked like this;
6 July 10.1mi@8.28
13 July 10.02mi@8.20
27 July 13.11mi@9.05
3 August 13.12mi@9.25 - 10.19, 10.23 last couple as I died. Poor route choice didn’t help with a serious climb in the middle.
10 August 14.01mi@9.24 low nines first half but high nines second. Matched the profile so prob one of my better LRs
17 August 15.6mi@8.47. Super flat 3 mile loop. A 7.53 mile 6, 9.37, 9.50 miles 14 and 15. Warning signs!
23 August RACE 10m@7.23. Hit my target perfectly.
7 September 18.02mi@9.26. 8.33 in mile 4 and mostly under 9 for first 10. 9.50 for 16 and 17 and 13.48 for 18 as I walked. Major warning signs!
14 September 17.7mi@9.47. Again mostly under 9 to mile 10. 10.39, 10.27, 12.38, 11.58 as it unraveled after mile 15 and I walked and quit before even finishing mile 18. Still ignoring the warnings!
20 September RACE Half Marathon 13.1mi@7.26. Great run. Bang on target, even a slight negative split despite the hard finish.
28 September 17.11mi@10.12. More sensible pace early but tough route and fell off the cliff again at mile 15 and finished walking. 11.18, 11.27, 17.51 last 3 full miles. Big flashing warning sign!!
5 October Athlone 3/4 Marathon 19.67mi@9.07. Worst run ever. Wanted to crawl into a ditch. Went with 3.40 marathon goal pace group. Nothing slower than 8.45 to mile 14 mostly under 8.30. Then I hit the wall. Zero energy, pale as a ghost, completely isolated and desperate for someone to pick me up and carry me to the finish. 11.51, 11.13, 10.12, 14.19 for the last four full miles. I’d been away in Romania for work the three days before, arrived back with a dodgy tummy. Didn’t really eat at all before. Add that to all the ignored warnings about lack of stamina beyond 15mi and this was torture. Was also the week my psoriatic arthritis first started to effect me.
By this stage I was also missing chunks of midweek running due to extra rest days taken because of the tiredness from running the LRs too fast and struggling to finish them.
13 October 10.56mi@9.52. This wasn’t actually that bad. Think it was a run home from work and I stopped at the chipper but didn’t stop the watch!!

Overall, I completely ignored all the warning signs about running the long runs too fast and not building the stamina. I absolutely nailed my goals for the 10mile and the Half, but my overall mileage suffered and I only ran 11 times from the half marathon on 20 September to the marathon itself.

The marathon followed the same pattern as training and resulted in an identical pace to the 3/4. I set out on 3.50 pace. Went through half way exactly on target. All miles between 8.35 and 9.17 to mile 20 but my closing 6 miles were; 9.46, 10.16, 9.57, 9.46, 10.52, 10.28. I didn’t suffer as much as Athlone, but it was painful. Finished in 4.00.48. Almost had to stop with cramp in both calves with half a mile to go because I tried to push on and make the 4hr. It was an amazing feeling to finish, and missing the 4hrs wasn’t all that important when I crossed the line and got the medal and the support and congrats from family and friends. But, it’s partly the reason I’m back now and trying to do things sensible.

This year I already have 12 runs over 10 miles. I’m trying to keep the easy stuff easy and not miss midweek runs. Given my history beyond 15 miles, my only slight worry is making a hash of my first 15 mile attempt this year. I’d like to run under 4 this time, and I think it’s possible, despite the fact I won’t get close to my 10 mile and half marathon times from 2014. I’m more concerned though with doing things sensibly and hopefully not having to endure another really painful finish.

I got myself some vividian electrolyte sports fix today...and some beetroot juice. I'll give that a go. Now - how about raisins as the race fuel for long runs?

skyblue46 wrote: »

I am a big fan of Medjool dates. Each one contains 35g of carbs which is more than your average energy gel.

skyblue46 do you put them in a little bag and then into your belt?

Hi everyone - hope this week is going well for all.

How did those on the Boards plan find their PMP session this week? God it's tough! I swear, the sun made an appearance right as I ended the warm up mile and it went into hiding just as I was about to begin the cool down one. Typical.

While I still didn't find today easy, I found today's 5miles easier than the first 4miles we did at PMP, so this gives me hope. At the moment I'm thinking that there is no way I could repeat those 5miles 4 more times at that pace, and then some! But .... right now I can't do 26miles at ANY pace, so what do I expect!

Also a Q for the mentors: When doing the PMP sessions is it okay to do the 1mile warm up, stop a minute, then do the PMP session unbroken, but stop again at the end before completing the 1mile cool down?

I have been stopping after the warm up and cool down (no more than 30secs) but won't anymore if it is best not to.

Thank you

Huzzah! wrote: »

Why do you stop?

I don't really know. Probably because whenever I did warm ups on track days with club we always did warm up, then stopped to be told what the session was, then do the session, stop and take on water before cooling down, so I guess it's a habit. I don't stop out of any need to do it and it hadn't even crossed my mind until today that it might be a poor idea.

Huzzah! wrote: »

That used to drive me mad in track sessions

Em, I think it's no harm to stop if you're taking on some water or doing drills or something but probably best to try and get out of the habit of doing it before and after the meaty part of each session.

Won't stop anymore so! Glad I asked, thanks Huzzah!

Unknownability wrote: »

Looking for a piece of advice please, if I was to do my long run Friday morning, how would people suggest I tailor the plan for the rest of the week?

Greatest distance ever coverved this month 134.5M.

I've the same question. I'm going to the galway races so would like to do it Friday as well.

I'm considering skipping my 3 mile today too as the legs are feeling tired & wanted to be on form for the long run as I'm doing 10miles this week (swapped the 7 and 10 from last week as I was away)

Thoughts?

Comic Book Guy wrote: »

Hi all, just said I would quickly call in after my story from last year sent a small shiver through a few of ye!

First of all when Mr. Guappa asked me about highlighting my story from last year I said yes straight away because I wouldn't like any of this year's batch of Novices to have a last 10k like I did last year! From reading through the thread it seems the majority of ye are sticking to the paces and mileage outlined in the plan so ye have absolutely nothing to worry about.



Now I'm off to change my boards username and change my Strava settings to private!!

Cheers for allowing your story to be shared!! Yes it defo wasn't a pleasant read, i felt your pain for those last few miles!! Took me a while to get it but now i understand the importance of those easy miles In my opinion the best way to improve is to ask questions & get advice from others who have experience

Is anyone else hoping for a 4:30 marathon meaning a PMP of 10:18 min / miles?
Had a look on Strava for the first time in a while & you're all running way faster than I am with my lunch run there of 5 miles at 11:21 min / mile

Am doing the Dun Laoghaire 10km on Monday & can't see how I'm going to do it in the 8 odd mins / miles I'd usually do

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

Yeah that's fine. Maybe do the 3 miles easy Sunday evening then?

My concern with you is the amount of strength classes you are doing. It seems every run mentions a class of some description earlier that morning. Just be careful that you're not doing too much.

Thanks Mr. Guappa. I actually had a chat with my trainer yday about scaling back, so going to do that !!

The reason I'm tired is completely a wrong-doing of my own. We had a charity cycling event in work yday & I was hellbent on beating everyone. In hindsight, maybe not the best idea!!

quick question and prob should be able to find this if I searched a bit but thought id check here anyway

i mentioned earlier finishing last year around 4.15 mark, and this year i would like to come in sub 4 - lets aim for 3.45/3.50 just for now

can anyone advise what pace my LSR should be (in kmph)? i am usually doing LSR at around 6kmph but this is probably a bit too fast?

i guess 6:30kmph would be around 45 seconds more than PMP for 3.50 which is 5.45kmph but i should probably reduce that a bit as i am looking at KM so maybe 6.15kmph for LSR?

if anyone can confirm that would be much appreciated, i have def been running too fast through training this year and last year too. hard to slow down.