Off Topic Chat. (MOD NOTE post# 3949 and post#5279)

tac foley · 04-05-2019 2:35pm

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Scary thing is Clonan should know the basics of firearms terminology as he was a comissioned officer in the Irish army...Or maybe officers arent required to know this anymore?Considering it was a clown from the US army who gave us the term "full semi auto" on CNN last year.

It is difficult to imagine the level of ignorance of things that have been a major part and parcel of the human condition since the middle end of the 14th C.

However, I look carefully for mistakes in reporting, and in all my years I have never been disappointed. I've just s**t-canned a book sent to me for contextual proof-reading, in which an otherwise superb story is ruined, for me, at least, by the invention of a totally fictitious brand of present-day English handgun makers that is the basis of a lot of the story.

When will authors realise that it is not necessary to invent a name of a gun? Or to invent a new calibre? Or to do the impossible, as in the case of the story, in which a British-made copy of the Colt SAA of 1873 is not only sold as new to the armed forces, but carried in action in WW1. AND fitted with a moderator - in the book, a 'silencer'?

Nekarsulm · 04-05-2019 3:09pm

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Scary thing is Clonan should know the basics of firearms terminology as he was a comissioned officer in the Irish army...Or maybe officers arent required to know this anymore?Considering it was a clown from the US army who gave us the term "full semi auto" on CNN last year.

I know a recently retired Irish Army man. In the service since his teens.
Was telling me last Sunday about the Steyr they had in Lebanon: "They call it the AUG, its the most advanced rifle in the world".
Lots of lads in armies with zero interest in weaponry, it seems.

BattleCorp · 04-05-2019 3:16pm

Nekarsulm wrote: »

I know a recently retired Irish Army man. In the service since his teens.
Was telling me last Sunday about the Steyr they had in Lebanon: "They call it the AUG, its the most advanced rifle in the world".
Lots of lads in armies with zero interest in weaponry, it seems.

One of my mates is in the army. Apparently they only have to go to the range twice a year. Well, that's according to him anyway.

On the article by Cloonan, you'd think at least he'd have some idea of what 'point blank' means.

Nekarsulm · 04-05-2019 3:38pm

BattleCorp wrote: »

One of my mates is in the army. Apparently they only have to go to the range twice a year. Well, that's according to him anyway.

On the article by Cloonan, you'd think at least he'd have some idea of what 'point blank' means.

I'd well believe it.
He also informed me that the inventor of the AUG was captured by the Germans when they invaded Czechoslovakia in WW2, and when they discovered the AUG prototype they demanded to know what government he was working with ( as it was so advanced)
When he denied all their claims, they shot him as a spy.

.Makes you wonder about what the hell soldiers are actually instructed about....
And we'll not talk about Army Intelligence ......

Cass · 04-05-2019 4:42pm

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Considering it was a clown from the US army who gave us the term "full semi auto" on CNN last year.

Ah yes, retired Lieutenant General Mark Hertling

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYjjWPvL9j0

I find it incredulous that he says:

"I've seen men hit with this weapon, and it tears the insides out"

Maybe i'm wrong, but if his men were throwing their guns at people their training needs some touch up because it's not the weapon that hits you, it's the bullets.

You know the same ones that go into this:

Goes into this:

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQXKYJcHIFpEWSkIIXEKvzrPf97y1KEQ4aTWOx5uny2vH6GmpuocQ

Grizzly 45 · 04-05-2019 8:58pm

I belive the US armed forces have an acrynom for this ...REMF/ Rear Echelon Mother F33ker.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Hertling
Seems to have the same role as Clonan with RTE,except his gig is with CNN.

Grizzly 45 · 04-05-2019 9:08pm

tac foley wrote: »

I've just s**t-canned a book sent to me for contextual proof-reading, in which an otherwise superb story is ruined, for me, at least, by the invention of a totally fictitious brand of present-day English handgun makers that is the basis of a lot of the story.

When will authors realise that it is not necessary to invent a name of a gun? Or to invent a new calibre? Or to do the impossible, as in the case of the story, in which a British-made copy of the Colt SAA of 1873 is not only sold as new to the armed forces, but carried in action in WW1. AND fitted with a moderator - in the book, a 'silencer'?

Alternative history fiction ala Harry Turtledove??Agree,crap gun handling and descriptions are an utter crasher in good stories.Am reading at the moment a UK author [Frank Tayell,surviving the outbreak on amazon kindle for those who like this sort of stuff]who does zombie apocalypse stories,and its intresting as some is partly set in Ireland.Anyhoo, what is peeing me off is he has most of his people equipped with UK SA 80s Mk1 with silencers!! Short of throwing rocks at hordes of the zombie undead,I couldnt think of a worse gun to face the zombie apocalypse with.:eek:

tac foley · 04-05-2019 9:13pm

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Alternative history fiction ala Harry Turtledove??Agree,crap gun handling and descriptions are an utter crasher in good stories.Am reading at the moment a UK author [Frank Tayell,surviving the outbreak on amazon kindle for those who like this sort of stuff]who does zombie apocalypse stories,and its intresting as some is partly set in Ireland.Anyhoo, what is peeing me off is he has most of his people equipped with UK SA 80s Mk1 with silencers!! Short of throwing rocks at hordes of the zombie undead,I couldnt think of a worse gun to face the zombie apocalypse with.:eek:

I'd be all for giving the A1 to the Zombies - they'd go wrong so fast they'd be virtually unarmed after the first stoppage.

yubabill · 07-05-2019 8:28am

yubabill wrote: »

Putting this here for future reference.

Article by Tom Clonan the other day on Drogheda gun feud quoting a research paper which concludes there is no link between gun ownership and firearm homicide.

Duhhhh.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/281282103_Firearms_and_Violent_Deaths_in_Europe_An_Exploratory_Analysis_of_the_Linkages_Between_Gun_Ownership_Firearms_Legislation_and_Violent_Death

https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/opinion-ireland-is-the-homicide-by-firearm-capital-of-the-eu-so-why-is-our-government-so-complacent-4615315-May2019/

Isn't it interesting, 10 years after new firearms legislation whose introduction was justified by gun violence here, that Tom Clonan's article and others are still complaining about said gun violence, which seems to have increased?

Someone should ask the politicians and AGS who promoted the legislation so vigorously why they targeted licensed firearms owners? The legislation seems to have had less than zero effect.

Further - and I'm putting this all up here for future reference - the Flemish Peace article, which establishes no link between legal gun ownership and homicide, was well-buried at the time of the last attempted gun ban in 2015 - said article mentions a link between gun ownership and suicide: first, it appears many suicides are done with shotguns and second, having studied Australian suicide methods before and after their 1996 gun ban, it can be said that the ban did not affect the number of suicides since, just the methodology

https://www.aihw.gov.au/getmedia/8d8a8344-59b4-43a7-8bd9-f4827a6105bb/injcat-121-10754.pdf.aspx?inline=true

The relevant data is on page 8 above.

Another link between gun ownership and domestic homicides was established in the Flemish peace article, which I do not question, but it is likely that shotguns predominate in this relationship, also.

I am not trying to justify any of the crimes and atrocities mentioned above, but I am definitely condemning wilful misdirection of blame by legislators, lobbyists and enforcement agencies.

tac foley · 07-05-2019 9:54am

In any rural society, which Ireland, for the most part, still is, the shotgun is an everyday part of life, and can often be the means of leaving it when the need is felt.

The point about legislation having 100% lack of effect on gun crime is plainly obvious to anybody with the ears to listen and the eyes to read. also plainly obvious, to the point of exhaustion, is reminding the PTB that the criminal will never obey a gun law.

Grizzly 45 · 07-05-2019 12:38pm

Even scarier is that politicians ACCEPT the fact that gun laws will not stop criminals,and have admitted to such,as did that cripple from Louth who inflicted this on us and as did the toe fetishist in the UK with the handgun ban. Gun control is never about controlling crime or criminals it is about as a government, controlling the people under you.:mad:

Grizzly 45 · 07-05-2019 12:43pm

Nekarsulm wrote: »

I'd well believe it.
He also informed me that the inventor of the AUG was captured by the Germans when they invaded Czechoslovakia in WW2, and when they discovered the AUG prototype they demanded to know what government he was working with ( as it was so advanced)
When he denied all their claims, they shot him as a spy.

.Makes you wonder about what the hell soldiers are actually instructed about....
And we'll not talk about Army Intelligence ......

Army Intelligence ....There's an oxymoron if there ever was one!

BattleCorp · 07-05-2019 2:22pm

yubabill wrote: »

Someone should ask the politicians and AGS who promoted the legislation so vigorously why they targeted licensed firearms owners? The legislation seems to have had less than zero effect.

.

Well seeing as the legislation had zero effect, obviously they need new legislation to target us law abiding gun owners even harder to teach those pesky criminals a lesson. :mad::mad::mad:

tac foley · 07-05-2019 3:12pm

Gun control is all about control.

As a group of people, NOBODY has to put up with so much red tape and intervention into our lives as we do here in the British Isles. Except, of course, those places where private ownership of firearms is prohibited or made so expensive as to make it out of reach for the ordinary citizen.

tac foley · 07-05-2019 3:13pm

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Army Intelligence ....There's an oxymoron if there ever was one!

Be careful there, Mr G. You are sailing too close to my particular wind.....:cool:

Grizzly 45 · 07-05-2019 6:07pm

Blame the late Robin Williams for that one...It's a line from Good morning Vietnam.:P

Grizzly 45 · 10-05-2019 12:54pm

Hard to belive that one person in the most gun controlled state in the USA,had more handguns in his possesion than we do in the entire 26 counties.:eek::(

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-48221967/more-than-1000-guns-seized-from-los-angeles-home?fbclid=IwAR1u2pyk-rnODZuVDYS2csPL3XB7XYMoNkKjH7K79dqVmXYfrkNUNSQAc9Q

Gorgeousgeorge · 10-05-2019 9:51pm

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Hard to belive that one person in the most gun controlled state in the USA,had more handguns in his possesion than we do in the entire 26 counties.:eek::(

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-48221967/more-than-1000-guns-seized-from-los-angeles-home?fbclid=IwAR1u2pyk-rnODZuVDYS2csPL3XB7XYMoNkKjH7K79dqVmXYfrkNUNSQAc9Q

Noting looks manufactured? Maybe was just kitting them out.

One hell of a collection though

GolfVI · 12-05-2019 2:05pm

Nekarsulm wrote: »

I know a recently retired Irish Army man. In the service since his teens.
Was telling me last Sunday about the Steyr they had in Lebanon: "They call it the AUG, its the most advanced rifle in the world".
Lots of lads in armies with zero interest in weaponry, it seems.

From my experience in the army there was definitely lads who simply had no interest in the gun aspect of it. Definitely not the history of the firearms anyway. They did their range practices every year and after that they were happy to never fire it again

Then for those of us like myself who were interested, the over exposure and daily use removed somewhat of the “awe” factor. After a year or two it simply became a work tool , no different than a spanner to a mechanic.

I guess its sometimes hard for civvie shooters to understand because they look at military firearms in wonder. I know i did anyway

After you fire a 105mm L118 howitzer for years theres very little out there that’ll make you go wowðŸ˜

Grizzly 45 · 12-05-2019 7:58pm

GolfVI wrote: »

After you fire a 105mm L118 howitzer for years theres very little out there that’ll make you go wowðŸ˜

A 155mm M777 perhaps?:)

tac foley · 14-05-2019 9:27pm

This is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more fun.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoZdJwlqmGg

Melodeon · 16-05-2019 8:48am

Anyone got access to the Irish Farmers Journal site?
100000 farmers' guns at risk from lead ban
https://www.farmersjournal.ie/100-000-farmers-guns-at-risk-from-lead-ban-464110

Grizzly 45 · 16-05-2019 2:29pm

Same article...https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/forestry-enviro/environment/over-100000-guns-could-be-banned-under-new-eu-rules-38117388.html?fbclid=IwAR1Tr37NTCy7UkZTDb5Yw1SfmcQAwAus9pOZlAQUBaOQfIp-eFgmR6KxIxg

TBH the bigger problem would be the ban on lead use over "wetlands" Which under EU definition would be 80% of Ireland,as our fields with poor drainage would fit into about a dozen definitions of "wetland".
We have EU elections coming up folks,make sure your prospective MEP hears about this.

Grizzly 45 · 18-05-2019 1:37pm

The usual Bagdad Broadcasting Central [BBC] anti gun hyper drivel.But this is a critical kick tomrrow for all of Europe too.If the swiss follow the EU diktat,they will lose ,a long held right and tradition.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-48299708?fbclid=IwAR2nr1ggzHies2TFPvCs6mc0mhtrbLE1ueNFSTZmcCG8AnmQcILRHtQ09lM

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2019/05/17/gun-control-vote-switzerland-may-19-could-take-away-swiss-weapons/1186889001/

Grizzly 45 · 19-05-2019 2:41pm

Looks like the Swiss have fallen to the lure of the EU Soviet Shenegen deal.:(:(
https://www.euronews.com/2019/05/18/are-switzerland-s-gun-laws-about-to-change-euronews-answers?fbclid=IwAR1zLEZDy5MEOMxaTyWxft_Jzc1B2wSSnJ5TLKi0cBIuOI2uyfbzXB0EabI

tac foley · 19-05-2019 4:36pm

indeed. I blame the French-speaking cantons for this. Back-stabbing b*st*rds.

oldgit1897 · 19-05-2019 5:42pm

A post explaining things from Bloke on the range, on youtube.

Bloke on the Range
1 hour ago
A quick (heh) FAQ:

Yes, unfortunately we lost the referendum. The new law is likely to enter into force on 1 July (people have been saying 1 June, but the Bericht des Bundesrates says 1 July).

Yes, this sucks.

Yes, it could have been far, far worse - initial drafts of the law were jaw-droppingly bad. Small mercies and all that...

No, this will not affect the continued existence of BotR. We will keep calm and carry on.

Yes, this will be a bit more of a PITA for acquiring semiauto rifles with 11+ round magazines or pistols with 21+ round magazines in the future. Cost mostly. And having to prove you're a sports shooter (club membership or regular private range shooting, no German-style nonsense with "disciplines" though) or collector.

No, "collector" is not defined. So each canton will make it up for themselves.

Yes, buying exactly the same firearm with a smaller magazine is unaffected.

Yes, it's whether the firearms is equipped with such a magazine, not whether it's capable of receiving one.

No, what "equipped with" actually means isn't finalised (the rules contained a provision that was clearly unworkable and would have criminalised 2 people sharing a car to the range if 1 had a 10-round Stgw 90 and the other a 20-round Stgw 90. Hopefully that definition will go away).

No, affected firearms already acquired before entry into force are unaffected.

No, there is no change with respect to full auto or downconversions from full auto.

Yes, there's a variant of an SBR law coming in - semiauto rifles which can be folded or telescoped down to under 60cm OAL without losing function are affected too. The wording doesn't affect fixed stock carbines that are always below 60cm OAL and doesn't seem to affect folders/telescopers which are already below 60cm OAL with the stock deployed.

Yes, this will probably result in newly-sold short rifles having their stocks fixed or a firing mechanism disconnect built in.

Yes, I have bought ahead pretty much everything affected I think I need for the channel.

No, we won't be doing a video on this until the Implementing Regulations ("Waffenverordnung") are finalised, cos there are too many loose ends at the moment. I'm planning on doing it with Ines Elena Kessler who did excellent work as a leading light of the No campaign in the media and is part of the Kessler Auktionen family.

No, we won't be relocating to the US just yet

Yes, the EU are extremely likely to come back in a few years' time for another bite at the apple.

Yes, if you have a general question not in this list, the answer is likely "we don't know yet" cos the Waffenverordnung hasn't been finalised.

Thank you for your attention

Cass · 19-05-2019 9:12pm

I see the Offensive Weapons act of 2019 has been signed into law in the UK.

The Act introduces new prohibitions under the Firearms Act 1968 on certain rapid-firing rifles, including lever release and MARS rifles.

Prohibited “rapid firing rifles” are those with a chamber from which empty cartridge cases are extracted using (i) energy from propellant gas, or (ii) energy imparted to a spring or other energy storage device by propellant gas, except for anything chambered in .22 rimfire (which i don't know if it covers magnums, etc).

Grizzly 45 · 19-05-2019 9:38pm

oldgit1897 wrote: »

Yes, the EU are extremely likely to come back in a few years' time for another bite at the apple.

And we must be ready for them again in 2020.IOW next year when the directive is under review.Folks,I'm blue in the face in saying this.But you MUST support both FUN and FACE as much as possible...They are your lobby groups where it counts now.Do not expect the lot in Dubblin to help at all.They are a bunch of EU Yes men and have nowadays as much power and influence as the Ballymagash town council[For those of you who remember Halls pictorial weekly:pac:]

Grizzly 45 · 19-05-2019 9:44pm

Cass wrote: »

I see the Offensive Weapons act of 2019 has been signed into law in the UK.

Pity they cant export them...They would have been good craic over here,as they arent semi auto rifles per se.So it would be an intresting liscense job.

Anyhoo did you see the planned protest about handing them in. Strip them of any accessories and other parts that can be used as a rebuild,and paint the remainder PINK! So it will preclude any chance of some police cheif and smirking politican doing a press conference with a whole pile of scary" black assault rifles that have been taken off the streets that might fall into criminal hands" type PR event without them looking like utter tools surrounded by heaps of pink guns.:D

Shooting Forum - Firearms licencing information

Off Topic Chat. (MOD NOTE post# 3949 and post#5279)

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