Ryanair Pilots put it up to O'Leary

737max · 15-12-2017 8:23pm

my shareholding is doing fine thanks very much. I won't be voting for him to step down at the next AGM.

kona · 15-12-2017 8:52pm

737max wrote: »

my shareholding is doing fine thanks very much. I won't be voting for him to step down at the next AGM.

Youve lost 10% it seems!

eeguy · 15-12-2017 9:27pm

Heard on the news that Ryanair management won't (or can't) meet with strikers before Wednesday, so the strikes are still on.

Wonder how this will play out in the media.

Comhrá · 15-12-2017 9:34pm

Poor Ingrid Miley is in for a long hard weekend....

737max · 15-12-2017 9:54pm

kona wrote: »

Youve lost 10% it seems!

I have enough gain out of my Ryanair shares at this stage to buy a modest new car. I'm not complaining. Don't worry about me. The share price is recovering nicely at the moment and I'm waiting for more funds to hit my share account so that on Monday I decide whether I buy more Ryanair shares or not. I haven't decided yet and there are other companies I want to invest in.
I see a long term price of 22 to 24 euro per share before Ryanair have to extend their business in to other parts of the airline industry.

15-12-2017 10:11pm

Comhra wrote: »

Poor Ingrid Miley is in for a long hard weekend....

It ain’t over till the fat lady sings.

Muahahaha · 16-12-2017 4:37pm

Well you have changed your tune in the space of a couple of days from this:

737max wrote: »

The union movement is an octopus trying to uncork the bottle, slither in and destroy whatever is inside the company.

To now hearing that the company is set to become unionised and saying that you are set to invest even more money in them

Why would you do that if you believe the union is out to destroy the company

737max wrote: »

This is an example of a thread where those with agendas wish to win popular opinion while skirting over the facts.

I suppose at least you have admitted you have an agenda on here, as all shareholders do.

737max · 16-12-2017 5:13pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

Well you have changed your tune in the space of a couple of days from this:

To now hearing that the company is set to become unionised and saying that you are set to invest even more money in them Why would you do that if you believe the union is out to destroy the company

I suppose at least you have admitted you have an agenda on here, as all shareholders do.

My agenda is that I'm a very frequent flyer who uses the services of Ryanair amongst other airlines.
I'm a consumer first, shareholder second.
My views on the power grab by the Irish trade union movement would be the exact same irrespective of how few or how many shares I owed in Ryanair or IAG or Lufthansa or whichever airline you are talking about.

end of the road · 16-12-2017 5:20pm

737max wrote: »

My agenda is that I'm a very frequent flyer who uses the services of Ryanair amongst other airlines.
I'm a consumer first, shareholder second.
My views on the power grab by the Irish trade union movement would be the exact same irrespective of how few or how many shares I owed in Ryanair or IAG or Lufthansa or whichever airline you are talking about.

yeah but you were whining about the union coming in, now you are investing more in the company. so the poster was accurate in what he stated in relation to your posts.

737max · 16-12-2017 5:41pm

whining. I see an opportunity for a share which is oversold.
BTW Thanks for talking the share down(temporarily).

Brendan Bendar · 17-12-2017 12:21pm

The thin edge of the wedge has been inserted...... Watch the cascade effect as the cabin crew, ground staff, baggage handlers try to get in on the act aided and abetted by Impact.

Rest assured on this though, once the pilots get what they want,they will have little interest any other categories of staff.

Trust me on that one.

end of the road · 17-12-2017 2:46pm

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

The thin edge of the wedge has been inserted...... Watch the cascade effect as the cabin crew, ground staff, baggage handlers try to get in on the act aided and abetted by Impact.

and it's absolutely fantastic to see. collective bargaining finally in ryanair where it should be.

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Rest assured on this though, once the pilots get what they want,they will have little interest any other categories of staff.

Trust me on that one.

the union has an obligation to represent it's members regardless of grade. if one doesn't, another will. so i'm afraid your statement isn't true.

suicide_circus · 17-12-2017 2:54pm

Bad for shareholders
Bad for customers
Good for (some) staff

Brendan Bendar · 17-12-2017 3:09pm

end of the road wrote: »

and it's absolutely fantastic to see. collective bargaining finally in ryanair where it should be.

the union has an obligation to represent it's members regardless of grade. if one doesn't, another will. so i'm afraid your statement isn't true.

Exactly what part of my statement isn't true?

Dr Brown · 17-12-2017 9:55pm

suicide_circus wrote: »

Bad for shareholders
Bad for customers
Good for (some) staff

I'd say it's good for customers.

It's not a good idea to be flown by pilots who are not happy in their jobs.

devnull · 17-12-2017 11:00pm

Strike has now been suspended by the union:
http://www.impact.ie/statement-ryanair/

IMPACT has this evening (Sunday 17th December) suspended a planned one day strike of Ryanair pilots next Wednesday (20th December) after company management agreed to recognise the union as the representative of Irish-based pilots.

The union has agreed to meet management on Tuesday evening, but says it is available to meet sooner.

The union asked management to release its Ryanair pilot representatives to prepare for and attend the meeting.

The union acknowledged the principled determination of Ryanair pilots, which it said had made this breakthrough possible, and said it looked forward to establishing a positive relationship with Ryanair company management.

IMPACT added that it hoped the suspension of industrial action would remove any uncertainty for passengers intending to travel on Wednesday.

keith_sixteen · 19-12-2017 3:24pm

Strong and commendable words from Peter Bellew today:

A senior Ryanair executive has described the mood at the airline as wounded, miserable and adversarial, and has pledged to try to turn around the staffing crisis that has forced the company to recognise unions, and triggered the cancellation of thousands of flights.

He told the Stansted pilots he was shocked to find that the airline had more pilots than at any time since he had worked there - but was even more shocked to find that in lots of places pilots were doing as few as 650 hours per year, well below the 900 maximum permitted hours.

He said there had been no attempt to manage people's hours, and that was a major cause of the roster collapse that triggered the cancellation of over 20,000 flights.

He said he did not believe the problems were primarily about money and criticised senior management for failing to make a serious effort to retain departing pilots by addressing their concerns.

He said the airline from the very top including the board and CEO Michael O'Leary were sincere about fixing the situation for the long term.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2017/1219/928382-ryanair/

Commendable and honest stuff from Bellew. And it directly contradicts some of the nonsense posted in this thread such as:

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the rostering issues were a one-off caused by the change in the calendar year. they handled it badly but that change wont be happening again.

737max wrote: »

@Keith Sixteen; You are playing semantics.
I said "It benefits Ryanair not one jot to have pilots working zero hours".
Pilots are flying for Ryanair because they know for a fact that they'll get as many hours as they are legally allowed.

This is an example of a thread where those with agendas wish to win popular opinion while skirting over the facts.

FTA69 · 20-12-2017 2:17pm

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/business/2017/dec/19/first-pilots-now-cabin-crew-ryanair-recognises-other-unions

Jig is up for O’Leary entirely now, cabin crew also beginning to organising across Europe. Just as well because I’ve heard appalling stories about heir treatment, including victimising them for not selling any of those scam scratch cards which were exposed last year.

20-12-2017 3:44pm

That’s all fine and dandy. However, all Ryanair staff knew the terms and conditions when they took the job, same as Ryanair passengers know to read the small print when booking. The losers here are those passengers.

FTA69 · 20-12-2017 4:05pm

Deleted User wrote: »

That’s all fine and dandy. However, all Ryanair staff knew the terms and conditions when they took the job, same as Ryanair passengers know to read the small print when booking. The losers here are those passengers.

I trust then you would have been totally opposed to workers fighting for holiday pay, the weekend, the end of the 70 hour week and health and safety?

After all, they knew the terms and conditions when they accepted the job. Exploitation and profiteering isn't a God-given right. If you treat workers like sh*t then don't expect them to put up with it forever.

doolox · 20-12-2017 4:19pm

Michael O'Leary has brought too much heat into discussions around industrial relations and employer-employee relations.

Now is the time for cool heads to prevail. O'Leary would be best advised to stay in the background and away from the public gallery until a new relationship is trashed out in a calm and constructive manner between the low cost airlines and the unions.

You can be sure all the low cost airlines and the unions will have to come to some sort of arrangement. The worst thing that could happen is an increase in uncertainty and wildcat striking which will damage reputations and result in customers doing something else with their money aside from travel.

Brendan Bendar · 20-12-2017 4:25pm

Looks like this dude Bellew, who was parachuted in from Malaysian is the bull goose for the company in this.

Michael seems to be staying on the bench.

Interesting times ahead in FR.

20-12-2017 5:14pm

FTA69 wrote: »

Deleted User wrote: »

That’s all fine and dandy. However, all Ryanair staff knew the terms and conditions when they took the job, same as Ryanair passengers know to read the small print when booking. The losers here are those passengers.

I trust then you would have been totally opposed to workers fighting for holiday pay, the weekend, the end of the 70 hour week and health and safety?

After all, they knew the terms and conditions when they accepted the job. Exploitation and profiteering isn't a God-given right. If you treat workers like sh*t then don't expect them to put up with it forever.

Do you know, I still rue the day children were no longer allowed up chimneys!!

Different times and all that. You can take it as fact that I’ve no time for present day unions. They seem to be only interested in their own jobs. Without members there’s no need for them.

FTA69 · 20-12-2017 5:21pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Do you know, I still rue the day children were no longer allowed up chimneys!!

Different times and all that. You can take it as fact that I’ve no time for present day unions. They seem to be only interested in their own jobs. Without members there’s no need for them.

Point still stands though, the exact same argument you’re making was made back then by the way - namely that a worker freely signed on with an employer for agreed terms and as such that was that. What’s the difference like? Why was low-pay and precarity and exploitation unacceptable back then but totally fine nowadays?

If you’re going to put forward the whole “they knew what they were signing up for” lark then you have to accept that that point was a cornerstone of bosses suppressing wages and workers’ rights since time immemorial.

Mr.Micro · 20-12-2017 5:26pm

doolox wrote: »

Michael O'Leary has brought too much heat into discussions around industrial relations and employer-employee relations.

Now is the time for cool heads to prevail. O'Leary would be best advised to stay in the background and away from the public gallery until a new relationship is trashed out in a calm and constructive manner between the low cost airlines and the unions.

You can be sure all the low cost airlines and the unions will have to come to some sort of arrangement. The worst thing that could happen is an increase in uncertainty and wildcat striking which will damage reputations and result in customers doing something else with their money aside from travel.

Maybe Ryanair should consider getting rid of O Leary. This a the man who for years antagonised and insulted his customers. Passengers were virtually mugged for money at every opportunity. Then after years and probably hundreds of thousands of euro in consultation fees he was told , be nice to the customers, and it was that simple, yet beyond the strategy of O Leary.

If he was treating his customers that badly, no surprises his staff fare no better. Now claiming it was his idea to recognise the unions, lol, like he has a choice. He is fooling nobody. Simple logic and practically has evaded O Leary for years. He is driving Ryanair into the ground.

MIKEKC · 20-12-2017 5:33pm

Mr.Micro wrote: »

Maybe Ryanair should consider getting rid of O Leary. This a the man who for years antagonised and insulted his customers. Passengers were virtually mugged for money at every opportunity. Then after years and probably hundreds of thousands of euro in consultation fees he was told , be nice to the customers, and it was that simple, yet beyond the strategy of O Leary.

If he was treating his customers that badly, no surprises his staff fare no better. Now claiming it was his idea to recognise the unions, lol, like he has a choice. He is fooling nobody. Simple logic and practically has evaded O Leary for years. He is driving Ryanair into the ground.

Fact is he built it from below the ground.ineficiencies will now creep in, leading to higher fares

FTA69 · 20-12-2017 5:37pm

MIKEKC wrote: »

Fact is he built it from below the ground.ineficiencies will now creep in, leading to higher fares

What inefficiencies are these? A lack of zero-hour contracts and bullying young people to sell bogus scratch cards?

end of the road · 20-12-2017 5:39pm

MIKEKC wrote: »

Fact is he built it from below the ground.ineficiencies will now creep in, leading to higher fares

there won't be any inefficientsies. the only thing that will change is fairer terms and conditions for workers, and there will be a good relationship between staff and management, something which is vital for a company. this is a huge victory for the workers, a huge victory for ryanair, and a huge victory for it's customers.

20-12-2017 5:41pm

end of the road wrote: »

MIKEKC wrote: »

Fact is he built it from below the ground.ineficiencies will now creep in, leading to higher fares

there won't be any inefficientsies. the only thing that will change is fairer terms and conditions for workers, and there will be a good relationship between staff and management, something which is vital for a company. this is a huge victory for the workers, a huge victory for ryanair, and a huge victory for it's customers.

And higher prices for the customers. All just to keep fat cat union officials on the gravy train. A real victory.

FTA69 · 20-12-2017 5:56pm

Deleted User wrote: »

And higher prices for the customers. All just to keep fat cat union officials on the gravy train. A real victory.

Yeah it's all about the nasty union barons. Nothing of course to do with the fact workers were getting treated like sh*te and working in precarious, zero-hour contracts.

Ryanair Pilots put it up to O'Leary

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