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Ibrahim Halawa acquited(mod warning in op-Heed it)
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dreamliner wrote: »no matter how hard people on here try to hide it the racism is blatant, if it isn't a direct attack on the individual it's a joke about Islam. Can't any of you have any basic respect? Were ye not taught that?
I went to the same school as Ibrahim at the holy rosary in firhouse, he was brought up like any other Irish teenager. If you ever met him i can guarantee you will all have different opinions. I rarely ever comment on boards and have been a casual observer of this thread until now, but the level of nonsense is quite high.
Can someone tell me how they have concluded he was purposely sent there on a "mission"? I distinctly remember his facebook posts when he went, it was all about a holiday, pictures of the plane, airport, arriving with his family and friends there etc, so please lay off with the absolutely unfounded nonsense about the purpose of his trip.
As for those claiming he is not Irish, if he had scored the winning goal at the aviva to get Ireland to the world cup ... would he not be Irish? Do me a favour.
Whatever your view of IH. It's bizarre to sign up and refer to one persons religious beliefs as "madness" and denigrate same in another thread and then accuse others of similar here . Where is the "respect" in that?
Whatever you have seen on Social Media - it's irrelevant- most was deleted and that which remains was fortunately copied by others and remains as evidence as to what occured during that time in Egypt. The video evidence of the Halawas involvement in the MB organised protests remains for all to see. I suggest you take a look at this again.
You will see if you read the thread that the consensus is not that he is not Irish but that his own declarations were that he was from "Egypt" and living in "Ireland"
Calling such facts out is not "racism" - not do so because of any specific race or otherwise would be at best be duplicitous and untruthful.0 -
dreamliner wrote: »no matter how hard people on here try to hide it the racism is blatant, if it isn't a direct attack on the individual it's a joke about Islam. Can't any of you have any basic respect? Were ye not taught that?
I went to the same school as Ibrahim at the holy rosary in firhouse, he was brought up like any other Irish teenager. If you ever met him i can guarantee you will all have different opinions. I rarely ever comment on boards and have been a casual observer of this thread until now, but the level of nonsense is quite high.
Can someone tell me how they have concluded he was purposely sent there on a "mission"? I distinctly remember his facebook posts when he went, it was all about a holiday, pictures of the plane, airport, arriving with his family and friends there etc, so please lay off with the absolutely unfounded nonsense about the purpose of his trip.
As for those claiming he is not Irish, if he had scored the winning goal at the aviva to get Ireland to the world cup ... would he not be Irish? Do me a favour.
Jog on with your "racism" bu11****.
I've black friends, Muslim friends. But they don't lie through their teeth like this family.
If you believe that nonsense about the cinema, I've some magic beans you might be interested in
He is Irish. He's also Egyptian.0 -
dreamliner wrote: »no matter how hard people on here try to hide it the racism is blatant, if it isn't a direct attack on the individual it's a joke about Islam. Can't any of you have any basic respect? Were ye not taught that?
I went to the same school as Ibrahim at the holy rosary in firhouse, he was brought up like any other Irish teenager. If you ever met him i can guarantee you will all have different opinions. I rarely ever comment on boards and have been a casual observer of this thread until now, but the level of nonsense is quite high.
Can someone tell me how they have concluded he was purposely sent there on a "mission"? I distinctly remember his facebook posts when he went, it was all about a holiday, pictures of the plane, airport, arriving with his family and friends there etc, so please lay off with the absolutely unfounded nonsense about the purpose of his trip.
As for those claiming he is not Irish, if he had scored the winning goal at the aviva to get Ireland to the world cup ... would he not be Irish? Do me a favour.
That is all well and good, but tell me, how was he in the cinema one day and addressing a crowd of Pro-Morsi supporters the next? It doesn't add up. His body language last night on the late late was terrible.0 -
Spanish Eyes wrote: »..........
Fk sake this country will never be good enough for them all, so why the heck are they still here. Why don't the female cohort join their husbands abroad. Just baffled sorry.
Sorry, but could you explain that?0 -
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Whatever your view of IH. It's bizarre to sign up and refer to one persons religious beliefs as "madness" and denigrate same in another thread and then accuse others of similar here . Where is the "respect" in that?
Whatever you have seen on Social Media - it's irrelevant- most was deleted and that which remains was fortunately copied by others and remains as evidence as to what occured during that time in Egypt. The video evidence of the Halawas involvement in the MB organised protests remains for all to see. I suggest you take a look at this again.
You will see if you read the thread that the consensus is not that he is not Irish but that his own declarations were that he was from "Egypt" and living in "Ireland"
Calling such facts out is not "racism" - not do so because of any specific race or otherwise would be at best be duplicitous and untruthful.
I'm not willing to turn this into a "he/she said" thing, but while he was in egypt in august 2013 this was all over sky news at the time. There was one instance where he was in a mosque and the army/police were attacking from the outside. On Sky I particularly remember them saying the Egyptian government had said they were trying to get the people out the mosque and secure the area, the reality was that any time any of them tried to head for the exits they were met with numerous rounds of gunfire.
See how it's not as simple as people want to make out? "He was there protesting with the MB he's a terrorist lock him up blah blah". Not quite the case.
The next I heard was that he'd been arrested and he was offline. Haven't had any communication with him since, there were letters being sent back and forth with some of his friends and family as he mentioned on the LLS but I wasn't willing to go through that and the potential risks involved all for the sake of a 'hello'.
My own opinion is that he was stupid to do what he did and get engaged at all in the situation whilst there. It was not a wise decision. He was extremely naive to think a 17 yr old from a foreign land (you may see him as egyptian but to the egyptians he is a foreigner) can change anything, especially in a country like that. But as I read elsewhere, young guys can and do get sucked into fighting for something they may feel strongly about. For him it was the illegal ousting of a democratically elected leader. Not a wise decision at all and no one knows that more than him I can assure you.
What people need to realise is that if anyone on the planet had a cause, or the strongest of desires to keep that lad in prison and find him guilty of anything - it would have been the Egyptian state prosecutors. They have a lot more hatred for the lad than every single person on here combined together. Were they able to prosecute him or find any evidence? No. Why? Because there was none. The fact they could not find anything, with 4 yrs on their hands to do so and a burning desire to want to make a major example of him, yet they still weren't able to should say it all.
Whilst silly to do so in a place like Egypt, speaking at a protest is not a crime.0 -
dreamliner wrote: »
Whilst silly to do so in a place like Egypt, speaking at a protest is not a crime.
Perhaps true, but again he is in my opinion lying about his status there. If he just admitted that he got tied up with the Muslim Brotherhood people would be much more forgiving. But he is acting like Gerry Adams, that he was never in the IRA.0 -
Perhaps true, but again he is in my opinion lying about his status there. If he just admitted that he got tied up with the Muslim Brotherhood people would be much more forgiving. But he is acting like Gerry Adams, that he was never in the IRA.
his cause was not so much the muslim brotherhood, it was more the fact that the country went through hell to get rid of housni mubarak, they held what i think were their very first elections in the country and the people voted and made their voices heard, whatever you think of him (i don't know much about him), but Morsi won, then was ousted ... ibrahim made it very clear to me his cause was that democracy was being done away with after the place went through so much change.
Personally I don't think he is as hooked with the MB as posters here want to make out.0 -
You said he was innocent of ALL allegations....
correct. he is exactly that.you have no possible way of knowing that.
oh i do. the allegations made have no evidence to back them up.Like I said before,not guilty of allegations brought before Egyptian courts,not ALL allegations.
So yes you are wrong,as usual.
nope, innocent of all allegations. if evidence comes to light to prove otherwise, then if they are of a criminal nature, the gardai will have a duty to deal with him.Whatever your view of IH. It's bizarre to sign up and refer to one persons religious beliefs as "madness" and denigrate same in another thread and then accuse others of similar here . Where is the "respect" in that?
Whatever you have seen on Social Media - it's irrelevant- most was deleted and that which remains was fortunately copied by others and remains as evidence as to what occured during that time in Egypt. The video evidence of the Halawas involvement in the MB organised protests remains for all to see. I suggest you take a look at this again.
You will see if you read the thread that the consensus is not that he is not Irish but that his own declarations were that he was from "Egypt" and living in "Ireland"
Calling such facts out is not "racism" - not do so because of any specific race or otherwise would be at best be duplicitous and untruthful.
the supposed video "evidence" is just him at the rally, something never denied. so, it has proved jot.Perhaps true, but again he is in my opinion lying about his status there. If he just admitted that he got tied up with the Muslim Brotherhood people would be much more forgiving. But he is acting like Gerry Adams, that he was never in the IRA.
how so? he isn't going to admit to something he wasn't guilty of to suit you and others. if you have evidence that ibriham was in the mb, pass it on to the authorities.ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.
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end of the thread0
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end of the road wrote: »correct. he is exactly that.
oh i do. the allegations made have no evidence to back them up.
nope, innocent of all allegations. if evidence comes to light to prove otherwise, then if they are of a criminal nature, the gardai will have a duty to deal with him.
the supposed video "evidence" is just him at the rally, something never denied. so, it has proved jot.
how so? he isn't going to admit to something he wasn't guilty of to suit you and others. if you have evidence that ibriham was in the mb, pass it on to the authorities.
You are a blatant liar.0 -
dreamliner wrote: »I'm not willing to turn this into a "he/she said" thing, but while he was in egypt in august 2013 this was all over sky news at the time. There was one instance where he was in a mosque and the army/police were attacking from the outside. On Sky I particularly remember them saying the Egyptian government had said they were trying to get the people out the mosque and secure the area, the reality was that any time any of them tried to head for the exits they were met with numerous rounds of gunfire.
See how it's not as simple as people want to make out? "He was there protesting with the MB he's a terrorist lock him up blah blah". Not quite the case.
. No one is making it out is was simple. The protests (plural) attended by the Halawas were organised and led by the MB. I have read many accounts of the protests and what occured but one things remain constant there is no consensus on what actually did happen - even amongst the Egyptians themselves. See for example
http://daliaziada.blogspot.ie/2016/08/three-messages-behind-confessions-of.html?m=1dreamliner wrote: »The next I heard was that he'd been arrested and he was offline. Haven't had any communication with him since, there were letters being sent back and forth with some of his friends and family as he mentioned on the LLS but I wasn't willing to go through that and the potential risks involved all for the sake of a 'hello'.
My own opinion is that he was stupid to do what he did and get engaged at all in the situation whilst there. It was not a wise decision. He was extremely naive to think a 17 yr old from a foreign land (you may see him as egyptian but to the egyptians he is a foreigner) can change anything, especially in a country like that. But as I read elsewhere, young guys can and do get sucked into fighting for something they may feel strongly about. For him it was the illegal ousting of a democratically elected leader. Not a wise decision at all and no one knows that more than him I can assure you.
What is strange is that IH has made the statement that he had no interest in politics at that time. BTW I did not say IH was an Egyptian - he made the statement online that he was from Egypt himself. There is a link to this on this Thread.dreamliner wrote: »What people need to realise is that if anyone on the planet had a cause, or the strongest of desires to keep that lad in prison and find him guilty of anything - it would have been the Egyptian state prosecutors. They have a lot more hatred for the lad than every single person on here combined together. Were they able to prosecute him or find any evidence? No. Why? Because there was none. The fact they could not find anything, with 4 yrs on their hands to do so and a burning desire to want to make a major example of him, yet they still weren't able to should say it all.
Tbh all we know is that he was acquited. That is all - nothing more. VIdeo and other evidence exists showing that his presence at the MB led protests and his addressing the crowd on stage etc. The Halawas addressed the MB organised protest in the video under the banner of "Egyptians Abroad For Democracy" (EAD) - a pro-Muslim Brotherhood group
I'm not sure the Egyptian Government were that enthused to make "an example of him" tbh. I also believe the Irish goverment were strongly instrumental in ensuring his aquital and release.dreamliner wrote: »Whilst silly to do so in a place like Egypt, speaking at a protest is not a crime.
No not at that point in time. But for a foreign national who had ignored a DFA travel advisory it was a very very stupid thing to do. For an Egyptian national living in Egypt to do so might be understandable - for a young guy from Dublin who later claims no interest in Politics it's quite incredible imo.
That is a summation I suppose what covers most if which this thread is about. It does not constitute racism imo.0 -
end of the road wrote: »oh i do. the allegations made have no evidence to back them up.
That doesnt mean hes innocent.
You really cant be that stupid.0 -
end of the road wrote: »the supposed video "evidence" is just him at the rally, something never denied. so, it has proved jot.
The video evidence is not "supposed" it is very real and available for inspection by any one who can be bothered to do so. The original line from the Halawas - was that they had just happened upon the protests - accidently like. "I was in the cinema etc".
The Halawas attended the MB organised protest in the video under the banner of "Egyptians Abroad For Democracy" (EAD), which is a pro-Muslim Brotherhood group
Of note you have deliberately conflated the term 'charges" with "allegations" in order to ignore that there IS clear evidence of IH attending MB led protests in Egypt. The is clear unequivocal evidence of IH addressing the crowds at those protests. There is audio of that address which clearly shows he had a knowledge and direct interest in the politics of the protests at that time.
What exactly the charges made by the Egyptian government we are not privy to. However the general allegations made as to the level of involvement in the MB led protests now stand proved due in no small part to the diligence of others.0 -
You are a blatant liar.
nope. try again.That doesnt mean hes innocent.
You really cant be that stupid.
it very much means he is innocent as innocent until proven guilty is the method of operation in most countries in relation to allegations.The video evidence is not "supposed" it is very real and available for inspection by any one who can be bothered to do so. The original line from the Halawas - was that they had just happened upon the protests - accidently like. "I was in the cinema etc".
The Halawas attended the MB organised protest in the video under the banner of "Egyptians Abroad For Democracy" (EAD), which is a pro-Muslim Brotherhood group
Of note you have deliberately conflated the term 'charges" with "allegations" in order to ignore that there IS clear evidence of IH attending MB led protests in Egypt. The is clear unequivocal evidence of IH addressing the crowds at those protests. There is audio of that address which clearly shows he had a knowledge and direct interest in the politics of the protests at that time.
What exactly the charges made by the Egyptian government we are not privy to. However the general allegations made as to the level of involvement in the MB led protests now stand proved due in no small part to the diligence of others.
nope. the only thing proved was that they attended a rally and spoke. something that was never deniedticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.
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dreamliner wrote: »My own opinion is that he was stupid to do what he did and get engaged at all in the situation whilst there. It was not a wise decision. He was extremely naive to think a 17 yr old from a foreign land (you may see him as egyptian but to the egyptians he is a foreigner) can change anything, especially in a country like that. But as I read elsewhere, young guys can and do get sucked into fighting for something they may feel strongly about. For him it was the illegal ousting of a democratically elected leader. Not a wise decision at all and no one knows that more than him I can assure you.
What people need to realise is that if anyone on the planet had a cause, or the strongest of desires to keep that lad in prison and find him guilty of anything - it would have been the Egyptian state prosecutors. They have a lot more hatred for the lad than every single person on here combined together. Were they able to prosecute him or find any evidence? No. Why? Because there was none. The fact they could not find anything, with 4 yrs on their hands to do so and a burning desire to want to make a major example of him, yet they still weren't able to should say it all.
I'd be willing to give the kid the benefit the doubt, maybe he didn't have a clue of "politics". Which makes it even worse that someone put him in that situation, someone sent him to Egypt to get stuck in. A responsible parent would not have put their children in such a situation.
He was a pawn, between the MB and the government because of who he is. He wasnt a random Irish Egyptian kid caught up. They didn't want to make an example of him, they wanted to use him, just as his auld lad used him. No evidence me hoop, he was acquitted for political expediency. If they wanted him in the nick they'd have surely trumped something up in the absence of actual evidence.
Maybe there is a positive out of the whole thing. Maybe he genuinly wants nothing to do with the MB. If so, I wish him well.0 -
end of the road wrote: »....
nope. the only thing proved was that they attended a rally and spoke. something that was never denied
Oh do at least try to keep up and make an effort. Otherwise your replies are pathetic and barely worth responding to.
As detailed they were not "rallies" they were clearly protests - that were led and organised by the Muslin Brotherhood. - You ignored that.
You ignore the original claims by the Halawas accidently fell into the protests. That is clearly not the case
They maintain that they had no knowledge / interests of the politics of the situation - thi is clearly not the case from the audio transcriptions. You ignored that.
Deny/ ignore all you like - you fool no one - not even yourself....0 -
end of the road wrote: »how so? he isn't going to admit to something he wasn't guilty of to suit you and others. if you have evidence that ibriham was in the mb, pass it on to the authorities.
Plenty of circumstantial evidence, just look at the tweet I posted a few posts back. Most people know that he is full of ****e. If you want to believe his version of events, that he was chilling at the cinema one day and he was in front of a pro Morsi rally the next be my guest.0 -
dreamliner wrote: »no matter how hard people on here try to hide it the racism is blatant, if it isn't a direct attack on the individual it's a joke about Islam. Can't any of you have any basic respect? Were ye not taught that?
I went to the same school as Ibrahim at the holy rosary in firhouse, he was brought up like any other Irish teenager. If you ever met him i can guarantee you will all have different opinions. I rarely ever comment on boards and have been a casual observer of this thread until now, but the level of nonsense is quite high.
Can someone tell me how they have concluded he was purposely sent there on a "mission"? I distinctly remember his facebook posts when he went, it was all about a holiday, pictures of the plane, airport, arriving with his family and friends there etc, so please lay off with the absolutely unfounded nonsense about the purpose of his trip.
As for those claiming he is not Irish, if he had scored the winning goal at the aviva to get Ireland to the world cup ... would he not be Irish? Do me a favour.
Wow, why not get onto the media with this Facebook stuff, it would go a long way to proving his story...0 -
dreamliner wrote: »his cause was not so much the muslim brotherhood, it was more the fact that the country went through hell to get rid of housni mubarak, they held what i think were their very first elections in the country and the people voted and made their voices heard, whatever you think of him (i don't know much about him), but Morsi won, then was ousted ... ibrahim made it very clear to me his cause was that democracy was being done away with after the place went through so much change.
He had a "cause"? That's weird because he said on national prime time television last night that he had no political knowledge at all as a 17 year old....0 -
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end of the road wrote: »nope. the only thing proved was that they attended a rally and spoke. something that was never denied
Pretty weird thing to do for someone who had no political persuasions/leanings at all since he was just a simple 17 year old kid. And they're his own words EOTR, uttered in front of the nation on Friday night in on live tv. Someone's telling porkies.0 -
Plenty of circumstantial evidence, just look at the tweet I posted a few posts back.
there is no actual evidence. just speculation with nothing to back it up. "circumstantial" evidence my footMost people know that he is full of ****e.
some people have decided that he is whatever they have decided he is . he is what they want him to be because it fits their agenda or narrative.
if there is evidence ibriham is or was involved with the mb, then one has a duty to report that to the authorities as the mb are now a proscribed organisation.Pretty weird thing to do for someone who had no political persuasions/leanings at all since he was just a simple 17 year old kid. And they're his own words EOTR, uttered in front of the nation on Friday night in on live tv. Someone's telling porkies.
no evidence of porkies. one can have little interest in politics but still know that over-ruling democracy and killing people who took part in democracy is wrong.ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.
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end of the road wrote: »there is no actual evidence. just speculation with nothing to back it up. "circumstantial" evidence my foot
some people have decided that he is whatever they have decided he is . he is what they want him to be because it fits their agenda or narrative.
if there is evidence ibriham is or was involved with the mb, then one has a duty to report that to the authorities as the mb are now a proscribed organisation.
No they don't...0 -
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https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057805033
Go see if you find yourself being described in this thread,Im done with your bollox.
Mod note: Enough of the abuse. Don't post in this thread again.
Buford T. Justice.0 -
end of the road wrote: »
no evidence of porkies. one can have little interest in politics but still know that over-ruling democracy and killing people who took part in democracy is wrong.
You must be wrecked from all the reaching.
Did you even read the transcript provided? Ibrahim was quoting Morsi, he was chanting to a crowd of thousands "what do we want, when do we want it".
There's your evidence.0 -
end of the road wrote: »correct. he is exactly that.
oh i do. the allegations made have no evidence to back them up.
nope, innocent of all allegations. if evidence comes to light to prove otherwise, then if they are of a criminal nature, the gardai will have a duty to deal with him.
the supposed video "evidence" is just him at the rally, something never denied. so, it has proved jot.
how so? he isn't going to admit to something he wasn't guilty of to suit you and others. if you have evidence that ibriham was in the mb, pass it on to the authorities.
You are a blatant liar.
I already proved that he is not a legitimate account earlier in the thread, I'm baffled at how he still manages to get a rise out of people when his posts are so blatant.
All he ever does is try to derail threads by posting some banal statement followed by one of the following suffixes;
End of story.
Fact.
Nope, your (sic) wrong.
This in turn instigates page after page of posters discrediting his claims which he will predictably ignore, only to appear a number of days later with a different, if not dissimilar statement only to start the whole cycle again.
He's as predictable as the day follows night.
I have my opinions, and I'm more than happy to debate with those who do not share my views, but I see no point conversing with a poster who lies so shamelessly.
I have been called a racist, a biget (sic), and a troll by this poster with no repercussion by the moderators, what I've posted above is no way a personal attack, it's a statement of my belief that said poster wishes only to shut down free speech on this forum by provoking reactions that get posters infracted.0 -
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Dreamliner. Your posts are a bit confusing. In one you say that you've had no communication with Ibrahim since his arrest. In another you say that he told you his cause was democracy. Was this before he headed to Egypt?0
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