The Sub 3 Support Thread

squinn2912 · 20-10-2017 12:34am

Just to clarify the pacers aren't to blame for me not achieving my goal time on one occasion. That was 2 years ago and the weather wasn't kind. They are encouraging and pleasant. But they go out harder than necessary. The pace is comfortable for them but if your goal pace is 6:49/6:50 then hitting 6:35-6:40 on hard miles will almost certainly prove your undoing. At 22 miles every time they slacked back but by then many runners were out of the race, guys who perhaps could have made it with different tactics. I think there's room for improvement.
Someone suggested they turn up hungover. I've never seen that and wouldn't be impressed.

davedanon · 20-10-2017 1:31am

squinn2912 wrote: »

Someone suggested they turn up hungover. I've never seen that and wouldn't be impressed.

They turn up hungover as it is.

But seriously, if you're not happy with the service the unpaid pacers do then you should really volunteer and show them all how it's done.

squinn2912 · 20-10-2017 8:37am

Well that's not great form if they do.

If they're volunteering to provide a service then that's wonderful but that doesn't mean they are above criticism. I've unofficially paced people, paying the entry fee, and when I did that I planned to run at an even pace throughout. My advice from the 4 DCMs I have done is to let them go because they go out harder than you need to. Every running world record broken was achieved by running evenly. If the elite follow that then there's a lesson there.

davedanon · 20-10-2017 8:52am

squinn2912 wrote: »

Well that's not great form if they do.

If they're volunteering to provide a service then that's wonderful but that doesn't mean they are above criticism. I've unofficially paced people, paying the entry fee, and when I did that I planned to run at an even pace throughout. My advice from the 4 DCMs I have done is to let them go because they go out harder than you need to. Every running world record broken was achieved by running evenly. If the elite follow that then there's a lesson there.

I was joking. But it's commonly agreed that the Dublin pacers do a consistently excellent job. I think you'll find that your views aren't shared by the majority on here.

squinn2912 · 20-10-2017 9:04am

Hard to pick up a joking tone online…
That's fine. No one has to agree with me at all. I'm going on my own evidence. I think if your borderline sub3 then running with them early on is risky business and I've found that to my cost. Their tactics are at odds with advice given on lots of running sites which all seem to advise even splits and a controlled start. They go out very hard.

dna_leri · 20-10-2017 9:14am

DCM 3hr pacers did a great job last year and many on this forum seem to agree that they provide great service.
I stayed off the back of the 3hr group and went through half way in 1:30. Only disadvantage I found was on the few downhills that I was held back a bit by the group ahead but that may have been a blessing in the end.
@Bittertown - Your mileage is a bit low, your 10K time is slow but your 13 mile MPs are good. While the odds are against a sub3 in your first attempt, only you really know (if anyone does) and if you are prepared for failure, then go for it. If you stay with the 3hr pacers in sight you will be glad of the help and support in the 2nd half. I predict 3:05.

ooter · 20-10-2017 9:38am

Bittertown wrote: »

I've been running about 50 miles on average over the last 4 months. Peaked the last 4 weeks with 65-70 miles per week, with long runs between 18 and 22 miles.
I ran 4 races between June and August, three 5K (19:00, 19:03, 18:53) and one 10K (39:29 in August)
I have done several long-ish MP runs usually mid-week, most notably two 16 miles runs with the last 13 miles at MP (last 13.1 miles in 1:29:15 and then 1:28:45). Those two runs were in the middle of my 70 miles weeks.

It would've been interesting to see what time you would've raced 13.1 in your training cycle.
My only attempt at sub 3 (my 2nd Marathon) I peaked at 55 miles but my 5, 10 and 13.1 times would've been very similar to yours. I went through halfway in 1:32 but the wheels fell off big time in the 2nd half, dread to think what would've happened if I'd went with the sub 3 pacers.
The fact that you've been able to peak at 70 miles training for your first marathon would suggest you're in with a good shot, I'm training for my 7th Marathon now and still don't think I'd be able for 70 miles a week but I certainly feel you need to be doing at least that much to have a realist stab at sub 3.
Best of luck bittertown, let us know how you get on.

dublin runner · 20-10-2017 9:40am

squinn2912 wrote: »

Someone suggested they turn up hungover. I've never seen that and wouldn't be impressed.

Where do I even start with this?

I very happily give up my time to give something back to the race, a race I love and race in which I ran with the pacers for 24 miles in 2014. There they helped me achieve my target and in attempt to repay that in some way, I will attempt do similar for runners whilst pacing next week.

I draw the line when reading the above. Complete rubbish.

If you cannot post something either positive or constructive maybe consider not posting at all.

robinph · 20-10-2017 9:40am

The half times quoted are not quick enough for sub 3, although they were not genuine raced halves or measured and were on the end of longer training runs does give a few more positive signs that they would be capable of significantly quicker. The lack of racing experience is going to be a big issue though and the most recent 10km race wasn't quick enough for sub3. They are definitely capable of sub 3 if the training runs are to be believed....but the lack of miles in the legs over years and running for 3hrs in the middle of a big group of people will go massively against being successful on the first attempt.

Can be done if they are really lucky, but probably more likely to blow up. Going at a more conservative pace for attempt one and then much more likely top be able to smash the sub 3 by multiple minutes at the next attempt.

BeepBeep67 · 20-10-2017 9:42am

I find in these situations it's best to remove emotions from the equation and support with data, here are the stats from 1 of the sub 3 pacers last year.

Nothing to see here.

Remember also that the pacers are pacing to their chip time, you need to adjust based on where you started in relation to them.

Djoucer · 20-10-2017 9:50am

Think people are picking squinn up wrong.

Pacers in general can be terrible as you're always running someone else's race. They may be stronger/weaker on hills so any advantage you might have is gone. They may want to run even pace splits while others think that's a wrong tactic given the course.

When they feel a low, you have to run that low with them.

You'll also have to run with a large group which can be a pain in the arse.

So yeah, pacers can be terrible to run with. That's not to take away anything from the pacers themselves. I certainly wouldn't fancy the pressure of brining a load of people across the line in a certain time.

thomas anderson. · 20-10-2017 9:58am

In Chicago I caught a group of pacers that consisted of 3:15's, 3:10's and 3:05's

Needless to say they were all wrong

robinph · 20-10-2017 10:02am

Depends on if you are viewing the pacers as being someone that you need to stick to like glue in order to get around in the required time, or as the equivalent of the red line they show floating above the swimming pool indicating the world record pace in the Olympics and you just need to cross the finish line infront of. Dublin does have some spots where if running your own pacing it makes sense to bank a couple of extra seconds for making it up a hill on pace, but it's really minimal.

Start from 10 seconds or so behind the pacers, it's too crowded to follow them closely, by half way the pack will have thinned a bit so hide on the back of it, gradually pull infront of the pacers from half way if you're feeling good, always hide behind someone else where possible, make sure the pacers don't overtake you. The pacers should be thought of more as a timing guide as to if you are ahead or behind schedule, not so much as run this speed for this section and this speed for this section.

Bittertown · 20-10-2017 10:04am

Thank you so much to everyone for your opinion/advices! Didn't expect that many replies.
As I expected it seems like most think this is unlikely, but if everything goes right I may have a shot. I think I will go for it, if things go bad I'm thinking of just stopping instead of finishing and suffering for the last 10 miles.

OOnegative wrote: »

DCM can be ****e weather wise, course wise, supporter wise.

I thought the supporter part was a plus for DCM, that there were lots of people cheering etc. Is that untrue?

OOnegative · 20-10-2017 10:09am

Bittertown wrote: »

Thank you so much to everyone for your opinion/advices! Didn't expect that many replies.
As I expected it seems like most think this is unlikely, but if everything goes right I may have a shot. I think I will go for it, if things go bad I'm thinking of just stopping instead of finishing and suffering for the last 10 miles.

I thought the supporter part was a plus for DCM, that there were lots of people cheering etc. Is that untrue?

Nope, i was generalising with the crowd comment, DCM supporters are excellent by all accounts and worth a few seconds with the constant encouragement.

robinph · 20-10-2017 10:19am

Bittertown wrote: »

I thought the supporter part was a plus for DCM, that there were lots of people cheering etc. Is that untrue?

The support is good for DCM.

Between the constant noise of cheering that you get at London with hardly anywhere on course to be able to hear yourself think and highly unlikely to be able to spot any personal supporters out on course, or running up and down the side of a deserted hilside for hours with just yourself and a couple of sheep/ goats/ cows/ horses for company, Dublin is a good level of support.

You know that they are out to support the runners, rather than have pint and listen to a band, and you can spot individuals in the crowd and they can spot individual runners.

fletch · 20-10-2017 10:27am

Bittertown wrote: »

Thank you so much to everyone for your opinion/advices! Didn't expect that many replies.
As I expected it seems like most think this is unlikely, but if everything goes right I may have a shot. I think I will go for it, if things go bad I'm thinking of just stopping instead of finishing and suffering for the last 10 miles.

Make sure to come back and let us know how you get on....really hope you can pull it off! Best of luck

Bittertown · 20-10-2017 10:37am

fletch wrote: »

Make sure to come back and let us know how you get on....really hope you can pull it off! Best of luck

I sure will! Hopefully I won't reply here before noon or something... Cheers!

squinn2912 · 20-10-2017 11:13am

Djoucer wrote: »

Think people are picking squinn up wrong.

Pacers in general can be terrible as you're always running someone else's race. They may be stronger/weaker on hills so any advantage you might have is gone. They may want to run even pace splits while others think that's a wrong tactic given the course.

When they feel a low, you have to run that low with them.

You'll also have to run with a large group which can be a pain in the arse.

So yeah, pacers can be terrible to run with. That's not to take away anything from the pacers themselves. I certainly wouldn't fancy the pressure of brining a load of people across the line in a certain time.

I appreciate that comment.
Folks let me apologise for the language used - terrible isn't an appropriate word to use for guys who in so many cases make the difference between a runner getting a sub3 and being disappointed. On my first in Dublin I chatted to one of them beforehand and high fived another coming to the finish line.
I feel that my contribution was encouraging and positive based on the question put. It was meant to be so.
A valuable comment is made above when advice is given to people to avoid sticking to pacers like glue and to run their own race. That is the kind of point I wanted to make, but accept that my words were chosen poorly. I understand that there are those who feel offended on behalf of the pacers.
For everyone gunning for the sub3 next week I hope it goes well and that if you use the pacers that they are of benefit to you. Go n-éirí libh.

ooter · 20-10-2017 11:23am

Bittertown wrote: »

I think I will go for it, if things go bad I'm thinking of just stopping instead of finishing and suffering for the last 10 miles.

If you are happy to stop then absolutely go for it and best of luck with it.

opus · 20-10-2017 11:36am

Bittertown wrote: »

Thank you so much to everyone for your opinion/advices! Didn't expect that many replies.
As I expected it seems like most think this is unlikely, but if everything goes right I may have a shot. I think I will go for it, if things go bad I'm thinking of just stopping instead of finishing and suffering for the last 10 miles.

Best of luck! I tried that once after a 10m race suggested I had a shout at sub 3 & amazingly it worked out by ~6 seconds but who's counting

It's only this year that I realised what a fantastic pacing service DCM is providing, I run a good few marathons in Germany and you'd never see such a range of times provided. Kudos to all the volunteers who do it.

My own job is moral support for a friend who's hoping to get < 3:10 so gave him a choice of sticking with the pace group or else sticking with me as I plan to start a little slower & speed up as things progress.

robinph · 20-10-2017 12:44pm

ooter wrote: »

If you are happy to stop then absolutely go for it and best of luck with it.

I'd say more if you are happy to drag yourself around the last 6 miles in a world of pain then go for it. But if you are happy to stop then don't.

If you begin with the intention of stopping then you will. It will hurt a lot at some point regardless of if you are on target and having a great run or not. The last thing you need to have floating around in your head though is the idea of getting the bus back to the finish. Stopping is not an option that should enter your thoughts.

davedanon · 20-10-2017 1:45pm

squinn2912 wrote: »

I appreciate that comment.
Folks let me apologise for the language used - terrible isn't an appropriate word to use for guys who in so many cases make the difference between a runner getting a sub3 and being disappointed. On my first in Dublin I chatted to one of them beforehand and high fived another coming to the finish line.
I feel that my contribution was encouraging and positive based on the question put. It was meant to be so.
A valuable comment is made above when advice is given to people to avoid sticking to pacers like glue and to run their own race. That is the kind of point I wanted to make, but accept that my words were chosen poorly. I understand that there are those who feel offended on behalf of the pacers.
For everyone gunning for the sub3 next week I hope it goes well and that if you use the pacers that they are of benefit to you. Go n-éirí libh.

That's absolutely fair enough. I see the point you were attempting to make, and ironically enough I would agree with it. I find running with pacers offputting too - something to do with becoming fixated on the effort of others around me, and finding it draining somehow: don't quite understand it myself - and I tend to avoid them. But you stated that they run too fast as a general rule, and having done a pacing stint at last year's DCM myself I wanted to put something on record.

It's not nearly as 'easy' as some might think. Sure, the 4.20 pace of nearly 10 minutes a mile was, on paper, not a problem for me. And, aerobically speaking, it wasn't. That wasn't the only consideration, though. Physically it was 'tiring' for me having to adapt to a slower rhythm, and one thing that slower runners have more experience of than I is.......being on their feet for a long time. It does make a difference. Mick Clohessy passed me at a gentle jog (for him) yesterday in Raheny, and it occurred to me that his 'longest long run' can't be any more than 2 hours in marathon training (open to correction on that). How would he handle a 5 hour marathon, I wonder?

Anyway, while we did have to make a small pace adjustment at the end of DCM last year in order to bring our charges in at the appointed time, it took a certain amount of effort and concentration on all our parts to keep on track as much as possible. It certainly gave me a valuable insight into the pacer's lot.

squinn2912 · 20-10-2017 4:22pm

That is a whole new perspective for me and I'm glad to hear it from source. If I put myself in the position I'd struggle with the slower pace on a race day. In my experience the pacers move out to the two sides towards the end (if they're not roaring at someone to encourage the last ounce of effort to make the time) and the applaud the runners who are in the process of reaching their holy grail.
I made that remark insensitively. There are many, many points regarding sub3 pacers and not everything can be glowing all the time. I got wrapped up on one point and I think that's been put right. No offense intended but I'll think a bit harder in future. Anyone who read my whole point I hope will understand it was encouraging with some caution based on my own use or poor use of the pacers in the past.
I'm on this thread to contribute, to advise where I can and to pick up tips for myself

dna_leri · 21-10-2017 9:21am

Bittertown wrote: »

Thank you so much to everyone for your opinion/advices! Didn't expect that many replies.
As I expected it seems like most think this is unlikely, but if everything goes right I may have a shot. I think I will go for it, if things go bad I'm thinking of just stopping instead of finishing and suffering for the last 10 miles.

I thought the supporter part was a plus for DCM, that there were lots of people cheering etc. Is that untrue?

Things will go bad at some point. If you're not prepared to dig in you will fail.

Support will help especially at key points

finisklin · 21-10-2017 4:25pm

Start line is on the horizon and with a small injury blip in Sept, have averaged decent miles (68 pw) over the last 4 months to have a crack at sub 3.

I have found the responses to the pacers and whether to run with them or slightly ahead useful. Aim is to reach half way at 1.30.30 and see if I can push ahead if I can. The last 6 miles at 40 mins will be a big ask.

Overall, looking forward to the day and hoping weather is dry with minimal wind. That will be a bonus I am sure.

squinn2912 · 21-10-2017 8:20pm

finisklin wrote: »

Start line is on the horizon and with a small injury blip in Sept, have averaged decent miles (68 pw) over the last 4 months to have a crack at sub 3.

I have found the responses to the pacers and whether to run with them or slightly ahead useful. Aim is to reach half way at 1.30.30 and see if I can push ahead if I can. The last 6 miles at 40 mins will be a big ask.

Overall, looking forward to the day and hoping weather is dry with minimal wind. That will be a bonus I am sure.

Sounds like a sensible plan. First 6 miles are quite tough so get into your rhythm and try to relax. When you have long downhills I'd advise you to glide and allow the hill to help you. Be ready for the hill on 22. It's nothing too amazing but a little climb for 45 seconds and then you fight with everything you have for the last few miles. If the pacers are in view then you're ok. All the best with it and make sure to let us all know how you do. Wish I could run it myself!

noelearly · 24-10-2017 12:43am

squinn2912 wrote: »

Well that's not great form if they do.

If they're volunteering to provide a service then that's wonderful but that doesn't mean they are above criticism. I've unofficially paced people, paying the entry fee, and when I did that I planned to run at an even pace throughout. My advice from the 4 DCMs I have done is to let them go because they go out harder than you need to. Every running world record broken was achieved by running evenly. If the elite follow that then there's a lesson there.

Well that's simply not true, world records are done by negative splits. Radcliffe, Keitany, Kimetto, Kipchoge and myself have all had Pbs this way.

To the poster that has doubts about it, I'll be around the 3 hour mark myself for Dcm, I intend going 1.30 for the first half, then I'm gonna drop the hammer, most likely I'll drop off and hit a brick wall around 21 miles because I'm only after Berlin.

From my experience go on how you feel during the race, don't rely on pacers because everybody is different. I found myself constantly looking at my watch and expending energy worrying if the pacer knew what he was up to, In Berlin they flew outta the traps and I let them off. Look at your watch at 5k intervals and have that as your pacer. Write done what spilt times you need and adjust your pace as such.

noelearly · 24-10-2017 12:49am

finisklin wrote: »

Start line is on the horizon and with a small injury blip in Sept, have averaged decent miles (68 pw) over the last 4 months to have a crack at sub 3.

I have found the responses to the pacers and whether to run with them or slightly ahead useful. Aim is to reach half way at 1.30.30 and see if I can push ahead if I can. The last 6 miles at 40 mins will be a big ask.

Overall, looking forward to the day and hoping weather is dry with minimal wind. That will be a bonus I am sure.

Perfect tactics. No matter how fresh you feel don't deviate from that plan. If you save your energy I'm the first half the 2nd half will just fall into place.

squinn2912 · 24-10-2017 2:47pm

noelearly wrote: »

squinn2912 wrote: »

Well that's not great form if they do.

If they're volunteering to provide a service then that's wonderful but that doesn't mean they are above criticism. I've unofficially paced people, paying the entry fee, and when I did that I planned to run at an even pace throughout. My advice from the 4 DCMs I have done is to let them go because they go out harder than you need to. Every running world record broken was achieved by running evenly. If the elite follow that then there's a lesson there.

Well that's simply not true, world records are done by negative splits. Radcliffe, Keitany, Kimetto, Kipchoge and myself have all had Pbs this way.

To the poster that has doubts about it, I'll be around the 3 hour mark myself for Dcm, I intend going 1.30 for the first half, then I'm gonna drop the hammer, most likely I'll drop off and hit a brick wall around 21 miles because I'm only after Berlin.

From my experience go on how you feel during the race, don't rely on pacers because everybody is different. I found myself constantly looking at my watch and expending energy worrying if the pacer knew what he was up to, In Berlin they flew outta the traps and I let them off. Look at your watch at 5k intervals and have that as your pacer. Write done what spilt times you need and adjust your pace as such.

Ha. I'd thought we'd drawn a line under this but yes you are right. The point I was making was a cautionary one about starting out too hard. If anything all the WRs were achieved by pushing conservatively first half and then putting a bit more pace into the second. PBs are usually the same. Very rarely does it seem to work out well if you push hard early on. I got my wording wrong.
I hope that works out for you ok, fair play going for the sub3 after Berlin (how did it go?) so soon. I'd be very wary dropping the hammer at halfway I'd save it until 18-20 but everyone has their own tactics.

noelearly · 24-10-2017 3:00pm

squinn2912 wrote: »

Ha. I'd thought we'd drawn a line under this but yes you are right. The point I was making was a cautionary one about starting out too hard. If anything all the WRs were achieved by pushing conservatively first half and then putting a bit more pace into the second. PBs are usually the same. Very rarely does it seem to work out well if you push hard early on. I got my wording wrong.
I hope that works out for you ok, fair play going for the sub3 after Berlin (how did it go?) so soon. I'd be very wary dropping the hammer at halfway I'd save it until 18-20 but everyone has their own tactics.

Don't mind me I'm usually full of bravado on the lead up to these things. WHEN I say I'll drop the hammer it's probably wishful thinking, Dublin is just a bonus for me now, only entered when entry was nearly full In case things when astray in Berlin. I actually intend to run on pure feel, have no real target in mind.

squinn2912 · 24-10-2017 3:06pm

Haha I was like that until I got rinced out twice in 2015/16. Then I went to a rigid plan and it worked. This time around I have been injured all summer so am missing out and it's frustrating the life out of me. I'm back running well again though thankfully.
I'd love to do a marathon on feel at some point like that. Be interesting to see how you go. I did something like it once in 2011 when I did 2 in a month. The first I went out too hard and blew up, second I was going for sub3 for a while and then about 6 miles in felt that tired empty feeling in my legs and pulled it back a bit. Finished in 3:12 though that time so it wasn't a bad run. I was very new to it all then though and I've learned the hard way to have fear/respect!

noelearly · 24-10-2017 3:21pm

squinn2912 wrote: »

Haha I was like that until I got rinced out twice in 2015/16. Then I went to a rigid plan and it worked. This time around I have been injured all summer so am missing out and it's frustrating the life out of me. I'm back running well again though thankfully.
I'd love to do a marathon on feel at some point like that. Be interesting to see how you go. I did something like it once in 2011 when I did 2 in a month. The first I went out too hard and blew up, second I was going for sub3 for a while and then about 6 miles in felt that tired empty feeling in my legs and pulled it back a bit. Finished in 3:12 though that time so it wasn't a bad run. I was very new to it all then though and I've learned the hard way to have fear/respect!

Thankfully I haven't had a bad experience in any of my 4 marathons so far, I've got my target in each albeit they were relatively modest in the start. I'm not going to fret about DCM if I blow up. That's what I keep telling myself anyway.

finisklin · 24-10-2017 10:39pm

noelearly wrote: »

Perfect tactics. No matter how fresh you feel don't deviate from that plan. If you save your energy I'm the first half the 2nd half will just fall into place.

Cheers Noel....not sure how it will go though....the anticipation is driving me nuts. Your right in saying run how you feel and be independent of the pacers. It worked for me last year with a marathon PB. Did a really fast 7-8 miles which inspired me along with the conditions and sustained it. Didn't dwell on pacers etc otherwise I would have been well back.....

Being overly focussed on pacers can take away from your running so my aim is to use as a guide and not to get bunched in.

I did Daniels 2Q program which I had to tweak. I wasn't up for the 5m X 3 with 800m easy so did it slightly different for the 12m sessions - 3m X 4 with 800m easy. I found it suited where I was at and got more out of it. The 5m X 3 would have floored me.

Roll on Sunday.....

squinn2912 · 24-10-2017 10:48pm

What pace is that session at? 3x4m

finisklin · 25-10-2017 8:54am

squinn2912 wrote: »

What pace is that session at? 3x4m

Careful I am not quite at the 3X4m level yet. Though I will take the complement.....:pac:

It was at marathon pace....

squinn2912 · 25-10-2017 11:23am

finisklin wrote: »

squinn2912 wrote: »

What pace is that session at? 3x4m

Careful I am not quite at the 3X4m level yet. Though I will take the complement.....:pac:

It was at marathon pace....

Sounds like a really good session. I don't run much at MP. I do 6 building up to 10 at MP minus 20ish seconds and then intervals and the rest of my week is 45-60 seconds slower than MP

squinn2912 · 30-10-2017 12:17am

Well lads I hope you're all raising a glass in celebration with goals met. If not then lessons learnt for the next crack at it. A few mates ran and all did well. How did it go?

kerrylad1 · 30-10-2017 12:40am

squinn2912 wrote: »

Well lads I hope you're all raising a glass in celebration with goals met. If not then lessons learnt for the next crack at it. A few mates ran and all did well. How did it go?

Withcheeseplease,did a sub 3 again,I'm looking forward to the report.

Itziger · 30-10-2017 9:49am

Any other sub 3 heroes? Especially first timers...

davedanon · 30-10-2017 10:31am

Itziger wrote: »

Any other sub 3 heroes? Especially first timers...

Guy in my club went from 3:04 to 2:49

Itziger · 30-10-2017 11:45am

davedanon wrote: »

Itziger wrote: »

Any other sub 3 heroes? Especially first timers...

Guy in my club went from 3:04 to 2:49

Doesn't count m8. If he's not a Boardsie.

davedanon · 30-10-2017 12:04pm

Itziger wrote: »

Doesn't count m8. If he's not a Boardsie.

Well forget I spoke then.

Bittertown · 30-10-2017 4:43pm

Not in a great moral state but I owe you an update as you were all very kind to answer my post.

So it was mostly expected I didn't make it to sub3, I actually DNF at mile 15 (...). Everything was going fine, and better/easier than I expected until mile 12 (I was really scared of the first 6 miles), but after reaching the half I'm not sure what happened, I just slowed down and couldn't keep up the pace. I probably went a bit too fast (42:15 10K and 1:29:15 Half) but obviously that's not the only reason. I think pacers went even faster than this, I guess they must have hit the half in 1:29:05 or something. I finished at mile 15 in an average pace of 6:55 (last 2 miles were probably in 7:15 or something).

I don't really get why because I ran actually 2 or 3 times at the same pace during my training, and I felt way better, even though I was doing it on tired legs and eating junk food all the time. Today I have the worst DOMS I've had in a while, after running "only" 15 miles. I have no idea what's up with all that. On top of it when I stopped I had massive pain in my lower shins (just above the feet) and could barely walk for 10 minutes (didn't feel anything while running).

So yeah, a total fail on my part. I thought the first half would be harder, and while I knew the second part would see me slow down, I didn't expect at all to have my pace drop that fast over 2-3 miles and this soon in the race. I thought that would happen mile 18-20.
I'm not really sure what I'll do from there. In a way I know I am not there at all (obviously...) on the other hand some people I've been training with and that I "beat" easily on every run (intervals, tempo, long runs etc) have ran in 3:12 or 3:16. So that should mean I shouldn't be that far? Hope I don't sound like a dick here, they were way better than me and finished the race yesterday at least.

Thanks again to everyone that gave their opinion on my post and congrats on everyone that achieved sub3.

martyboy48 · 30-10-2017 5:20pm

Itziger wrote: »

Doesn't count m8. If he's not a Boardsie.

LOL ☺

martyboy48 · 30-10-2017 5:22pm

davedanon wrote: »

Guy in my club went from 3:04 to 2:49

Nice. ... Over what time period? ?? Many marathons under his belt????

davedanon · 30-10-2017 5:26pm

He's the right side of 30, but juggling job and college left him unable to devote the kind of time he wanted to training, I think. Finished college now and changed his job, and he's been coming on in leaps and bounds this year. 3:04 in Dublin last year. Done 4-5 marathons, I think.

But you know, it doesn't matter.

martyboy48 · 30-10-2017 5:34pm

davedanon wrote: »

He's the right side of 30, but juggling job and college left him unable to devote the kind of time he wanted to training, I think. Finished college now and changed his job, and he's been coming on in leaps and bounds this year. 3:04 in Dublin last year. Done 4-5 marathons, I think.

But you know, it doesn't matter.

I'm sure Itz comment was tongue in cheek ☺
Looks like a great return from your clubmate, sure he'll progress even more when things settle down and gets decent run of training in.... Fair play to him ☺

noelearly · 30-10-2017 5:39pm

Itziger wrote: »

Any other sub 3 heroes? Especially first timers...

Hero's is a loose term these days.

noelearly · 30-10-2017 5:42pm

davedanon wrote: »

He's the right side of 30, but juggling job and college left him unable to devote the kind of time he wanted to training, I think. Finished college now and changed his job, and he's been coming on in leaps and bounds this year. 3:04 in Dublin last year. Done 4-5 marathons, I think.

But you know, it doesn't matter.

I'm with Itz in this. Doesn't count

The Sub 3 Support Thread

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