Japan 2019 World Cup draw

PTH2009 · 19-03-2017 11:50pm #1

Mods please delete if similar thread exists

draw taking place on the 10th May 2017, at the conclusion of the 2017 6 Nations England And Ireland are seeds 1, Wales,France and Scotland Seeds 2 and Italy Seeds 4 (i think)

Following teams have qualifed
Japan (HN)
South Africa
Argentina
New Zealand
Austrailia
England
Ireland
Wales
Scotland
France
Italy
Georgia

Qualifers
13 Africa (1 team)- http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/qualifying/africa/fixtures
14 Europe(1 team)- http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/qualifying/europe
15/16 Americas (2 teams)-http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/qualifying/americas
17/18 Oceania (2 teams)- http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/qualifying/oceania

19- One Europe/Oceania play-off qualifier: Europe could gain a second qualifying place, while Oceania could gain a third qualifying place, as the second best Rugby Europe Championship will play a home and away playoff series against the third place team from the World Rugby Pacific Nations Cup, to gain qualification for Rugby World Cup 2019. The loser of that series could give Europe one repechage berth or Oceania one repechage berth (or two repechage berths).

20-https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Rugby_World_Cup_–_play-off_qualifications#Repechage

Ireland could possilby get a group of death ie South Africa/Argentina/Fiji and USA

ScrubsfanChris · 20-03-2017 10:45am

Have Italy qualified automatically? They are 15th behind Samoa, Tonga, Georgia and Fiji in the world rankings

ArmaniJeanss · 20-03-2017 11:02am

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

Have Italy qualified automatically? They are 15th behind Samoa, Tonga, Georgia and Fiji in the world rankings

Yes, Top 3 in every group at the last World Cup qualifies automatically.

*****
Ireland Possible groups.
Ireland(1), South Africa(2), Argentina (3).
Ireland(1), Scotland(2), Japan(3).

ScrubsfanChris · 20-03-2017 11:09am

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Yes, Top 3 in every group at the last World Cup qualifies automatically.

*****
Ireland Possible groups.
Ireland(1), South Africa(2), Argentina (3).
Ireland(1), Scotland(2), Japan(3).

Forgotten about that

Scotland as the 2nd best seed in the group would do nicely.

nc6000 · 20-03-2017 11:13am

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Yes, Top 3 in every group at the last World Cup qualifies automatically.

*****
Ireland Possible groups.
Ireland(1), South Africa(2), Argentina (3).
Ireland(1), Scotland(2), Japan(3).

Is this correct that we'll definitely have one of those groups?

LeinsterDub · 20-03-2017 11:16am

nc6000 wrote: »

Is this correct that we'll definitely have one of those groups?

No it's just a possible group

errlloyd · 20-03-2017 11:16am

nc6000 wrote: »

Is this correct that we'll definitely have one of those groups?

No absolutely not. Ireland can have any of the following.

Scotland OR Wales OR South Africa OR France

And

Argentina OR Fiji OR Japan OR Georgia

ArmaniJeanss · 20-03-2017 11:16am

nc6000 wrote: »

Is this correct that we'll definitely have one of those groups?

Sorry, that was just a best/worst case sort of thing.

Could also get any of the other teams from Pot 2 (France or Wales) or Pot 3.

bilston · 20-03-2017 12:31pm

This is the thing about the rankings. It's great being top 4, but we could still end up with France/South Africa and Argentina in our pool. I've still no idea why they do the draw so far out from the WC (and it used to be earlier than this). I'm sure there must be some sort of logistical reason? Anyone know what it is?

ArmaniJeanss · 20-03-2017 12:54pm

bilston wrote: »

This is the thing about the rankings. It's great being top 4, but we could still end up with France/South Africa and Argentina in our pool. I've still no idea why they do the draw so far out from the WC (and it used to be earlier than this). I'm sure there must be some sort of logistical reason? Anyone know what it is?

Definitely logistical, mainly for ticket sales.
Draw in May, fixture decided around September, then the next 22 months selling tickets.

turnikett1 · 20-03-2017 1:07pm

Is it possible to go to another World Cup without getting knocked out by Argentina for the 4th time?

aloooof · 20-03-2017 1:08pm

bilston wrote: »

This is the thing about the rankings. It's great being top 4, but we could still end up with France/South Africa and Argentina in our pool. I've still no idea why they do the draw so far out from the WC (and it used to be earlier than this). I'm sure there must be some sort of logistical reason? Anyone know what it is?

Would still rather be top 4 than not, mind. Having France or South Africa in your group doesn't appear to be as daunting a task as it would've been in tournaments passed. Though France have improved a lot under Noves already...

LeinsterDub · 20-03-2017 1:13pm

aloooof wrote: »

Would still rather be top 4 than not, mind. Having France or South Africa in your group doesn't appear to be as daunting a task as it would've been in tournaments passed. Though France have improved a lot under Noves already...

September 2019 is along time off. Remember how useless Australia were just 6 months prior to the last world cup.

Peregrine · 20-03-2017 1:14pm

Being top 4 means there is zero chance of having New Zealand, England or Australia in our group. I'll take that over having France or SA instead!

aloooof · 20-03-2017 1:18pm

LeinsterDub wrote: »

September 2019 is along time off. Remember how useless Australia were just 6 months prior to the last world cup.

Agreed, and it is hard to tell this far out, but even allowing for improvements from both France and SA, I'd still rather be in the position we are in.

EDIT: Peregrine's post above sums it up pretty well for me.

PTH2009 · 20-03-2017 10:05pm

I guess Japan will go straight into Group A as there hosts and in fact if we get drawn in that group than we could play them on the first night of the tournament ??

errlloyd · 21-03-2017 9:32am

If my aim was to win the world cup I think I'd rather be in a pool with New Zealand than be Tier 1 in a pool with France (for example). The form of the 2nd to 8th best teams now is still fairly meainginless. The only constant is that New Zealand are the best in the world, and the only way to guarantee avoiding them in the quarter or semi is to play them in the pool.

In two out of the last three world cups, both finalists have come from the same pool.

I also think the most important element of the draw for us is the potential quarter finalists. If we're in a pool with South Africa that will be annoying. But if we're going to play the winner / loser of the pool with Australia, Scotland and Japan I'd back us to beat Aus and Scotland and then semi final time.

If on the other hand, we're in a pool with Scotland and Japan, but we're gonna play the winner loser of the New Zealand, South Africa or Argentina pool we might have a problem. The team that comes second in the pool of death is probably going to be an in form tier 1 nation and I guess the Bayesian part of me thinks theyre likely to be better than the other "losing" quarter finalists.

The Lost Sheep · 02-05-2017 11:38am

The draw is tomorrow week. What draw would people like to get?

aloooof · 02-05-2017 11:45am

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

The draw is tomorrow week. What draw would people like to get?

Anyone but Argentina from pot 3...

The Lost Sheep · 02-05-2017 11:49am

Band 1: New Zealand, England, Australia, Ireland
Band 2: Scotland, France, South Africa, Wales
Band 3: Argentina, Japan, Georgia, Italy
Band 4: Americas 1, Europe 1, Oceania 1, Oceania 2
Band 5: Africa 1, Americas 2, Europe/Oceania play-off, Repechage

CIARAN_BOYLE · 02-05-2017 12:26pm

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

The draw is tomorrow week. What draw would people like to get?

you have to think SA would be somewhat recovered come the rwc. So hopefully not them from pot 2.

wp_rathead · 02-05-2017 12:37pm

Wales and Argentina would be our nightmare

Rightwing · 02-05-2017 12:38pm

Probability is that we will fall at the q/f stage. That is assuming we avoid Argies, mighn't get out of the group in such an event unless we get Scots & Argies.

PTH2009 · 02-05-2017 12:40pm

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Band 1: New Zealand, England, Australia, Ireland
Band 2: Scotland, France, South Africa, Wales
Band 3: Argentina, Japan, Georgia, Italy
Band 4: Americas 1, Europe 1, Oceania 1, Oceania 2
Band 5: Africa 1, Americas 2, Europe/Oceania play-off, Repechage

Scotland, Georgia,America's 1 and Africa 1 please

But we will prob get the hardest possible draw like Wales, Argentina

irishbucsfan · 02-05-2017 12:40pm

Rightwing wrote: »

Probability is that we will fall at the q/f stage. That is assuming we avoid Argies, mighn't get out of the group in such an event unless we get Scots & Argies.

Why on earth would getting Argentina as a 3rd seed increase our ability of getting out of our group? Are you really thinking Argentina are preferable to Georgia, Japan or Italy?

aloooof · 02-05-2017 12:40pm

Rightwing wrote: »

Probability is that we will fall at the q/f stage. That is assuming we avoid Argies, mighn't get out of the group in such an event unless we get Scots & Argies.

If we went by probabilities, nobody would watch any sport... Happily rugby matches aren't decided by probability.

ArmaniJeanss · 02-05-2017 12:42pm

Oceania 1&2 from Pot 4 would probably be good ones to avoid as well.
Likely Samoa, and one of Tonga and Fiji.

aloooof · 02-05-2017 12:42pm

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Why on earth would getting Argentina as a 3rd seed increase our ability of getting out of our group? Are you really thinking Argentina are preferable to Georgia, Japan or Italy?

I think he's saying that if we get Argentina from the 3rd pot, we mightn't get out of the group at all, unless we also had Scotland from pot 2. I think.

irishbucsfan · 02-05-2017 12:44pm

aloooof wrote: »

I think he's saying that if we get Argentina from the 3rd pot, we mightn't get out of the group at all, unless we also had Scotland from pot 2. I think.

Ahhh I think you're right. Yes that would make more sense.

We have the beating of France and Wales for sure and South Africa may be the weakest of all those teams unless they sort their issues out. It may quite a weak group by 2019.

ArmaniJeanss · 02-05-2017 12:45pm

Also from a non Irish pov, I think its wrong that they took the qualifying spot away from Asia just because Japan had qualified automatically.
So now the rest of the Asian teams can only get in through the repechage spot.

Rightwing · 02-05-2017 12:47pm

It is a bit off, but no question the Argies are the team to avoid for all. Japs could also be a handful from Pot 3

irishbucsfan · 02-05-2017 12:49pm

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Also from a non Irish pov, I think its wrong that they took the qualifying spot away from Asia just because Japan had qualified automatically.
So now the rest of the Asian teams can only get in through the repechage spot.

Do you think so? I'm not really sure there's enough quality in the rest of Asia to justify two teams. Maybe I'm wrong.

thomond2006 · 02-05-2017 12:54pm

PTH2009 wrote: »

Scotland, Georgia,America's 1 and Africa 1 please

But we will prob get the hardest possible draw like Wales, Argentina

You're hilarious PTH.

ArmaniJeanss · 02-05-2017 12:54pm

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Do you think so? I'm not really sure there's enough quality in the rest of Asia to justify two teams. Maybe I'm wrong.

Fair point. I guess I was thinking a playoff spot, then into the repechage if they lose that. Sort of multiple bites at the cherry (like Europe2 and Oceania3 get) rather than just the one chance.

irishbucsfan · 02-05-2017 1:02pm

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Fair point. I guess I was thinking a playoff spot, then into the repechage if they lose that. Sort of multiple bites at the cherry (like Europe2 and Oceania3 get) rather than just the one chance.

Yeah maybe a playoff with Americas 2 but I'm not sure if the likes of Korea would be competitive with Canada. I am quite ignorant about Asian rugby though.

pickarooney · 02-05-2017 2:03pm

They should put Australia in the Asia group, like in football.

The Lost Sheep · 02-05-2017 2:06pm

pickarooney wrote: »

They should put Australia in the Asia group, like in football.

For what reason? Australia are in asia in soccer as its a more competive region. The opposites the case in rugby

thomond2006 · 02-05-2017 2:07pm

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

For what reason? Australia are in asia in soccer as its a more competive region. The opposites the case in rugby

Whoosh methinks.

Podge_irl · 02-05-2017 2:36pm

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Do you think so? I'm not really sure there's enough quality in the rest of Asia to justify two teams. Maybe I'm wrong.

I'm pretty sure you're right but it does kind of seem like fudging the rules to suit the situation and get the result they want. I don't even have a clue who the likely Asian qualifier would be though so its hard to argue it would be useful for them to be there.

Sabre0001 · 02-05-2017 2:50pm

Ah the good old underdog mentality. Plenty of other threads where people are talking about how we are capable of beating any team and highlighting what we've accomplished recently. And yet here we are saying "Oh, I hope we don't get x." I doubt the other Tier 1 nations are...We're Tier 1 for a reason; maybe we should have a bit of belief.

Regardless of who we get, it's consistency that we need to sort out. And if that doesn't happen we'll prob go out at QF stage again.

awec · 02-05-2017 2:52pm

It's hard to make a call because it's hard to know how good those pot 2 teams will be in 2 years. If the tournament was tomorrow you'd want SA in pot 2 and Georgia or Japan.

Eod100 · 08-05-2017 9:53pm

Not long to go now.

Pool draw being made at 9am Wednesday morning.

http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/pooldraw

Shefwedfan · 09-05-2017 12:53pm

My group

Band 1: Ireland
Band 2: Wales
Band 3: Argentina
Band 4: Whoever
Band 5: Don't care

Knock either Wales or Argentina out to get back at them for last 2 WC's

What everyone else would like

Band 1: Ireland
Band 2: Scotland
Band 3: Italy
Band 4: Whoever
Band 5: Don't care

kuang1 · 09-05-2017 12:56pm

Give us Wales and Argentina fcuk it.

Battle harden us for the QF.

Also hope that the toughest group game we'll play is NOT the last group game we'll play like last time.

#POCSextonPOM...SOB

aloooof · 09-05-2017 1:49pm

kuang1 wrote: »

Give us Wales and Argentina fcuk it.

Battle harden us for the QF.

Also hope that the toughest group game we'll play is NOT the last group game we'll play like last time.

#POCSextonPOM...SOB

#POCSextonPOM...SOBPayne? I certainly remember we were missing 5 players. Think it was Payne off the top of my head...

PTH2009 · 09-05-2017 5:53pm

https://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2017/0509/873803-rugby-woi/

Ireland's ideal group
Ireland
Scotland
Georgia
Europe 1
Repechage winner

Joe Schmidt's worst nightmare
Ireland
Wales
Argentina
Oceania 1
Play-off winner

Podge_irl · 09-05-2017 6:16pm

I think the group that will provide our opponent in a potential quarter final is probably of more importance.

bilston · 09-05-2017 11:55pm

I know this the latest they've done the draw for a World Cup in recent years, but can anyone give me a reason why it's been done almost 2 1/2 years before the tournament starts (better than 3 years I suppose) especially given 40% of the teams haven't even qualified yet!

ArmaniJeanss · 10-05-2017 7:23am

bilston wrote: »

I know this the latest they've done the draw for a World Cup in recent years, but can anyone give me a reason why it's been done almost 2 1/2 years before the tournament starts (better than 3 years I suppose) especially given 40% of the teams haven't even qualified yet!

You need a decent run in to sell tickets.
After todays draw they'll spend 4/5 months working on a schedule with the various partners (tv, hosts, sponsors, travel agencies) then announce the fixtures in September-ish. That'll give them ~22 months to sell tickets around the world, not exactly an easy task given they'll be trying to convince people to part with 5K+ to travel over.
Even England 2015, whilst it was close to a sell-out, and a short trip for five of the participants, had to spend pretty much the full 2 year leadin on a big campaign to ensure that sell-out.

PTH2009 · 10-05-2017 8:38am

Is the draw on any TV station

adelcrowsmel · 10-05-2017 8:43am

PTH2009 wrote: »

Is the draw on any TV station

Not that I know of - thinks it's just live online

Japan 2019 World Cup draw

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