SPHE Teacher's Interview - What Happens in the Classroom... - Mod Note Added to OP PLEASE READ

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122819964#Comment_122819964

Try reading the thread.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122826574#Comment_122826574

Did you miss the bit about where they claimed to have only heard about this issue today despite having posted the same claim a couple of months ago? And the bit about the supposed furries being in Australia?

And you swallow it hook line and sinker?

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122823516#Comment_122823516

Another one who doesn't know that school books in Ireland are produced by private companies.

The Dept of Education sets the curriculum, it has no role in producing school books.

Necro

Mod: Folks, purifol0 doesn't have the right of reply for a few days as they've been given a holiday so probably no point in quoting them at present.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122826574#Comment_122826574

An article on the Irish mirror about an article on the Belfast live site.

Would you consider this a credible source of information?

"Belfast Live understands at least four schools in Northern Ireland have pupils who openly identify as furries and all schools have been subject to advice and support from the Department of Education as a matter of 'emotional health and well-being"

Belfast Live understands. Not even from a source, just that the website understands!

🤣🤣🤣

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122826574#Comment_122826574

So not actually something the posters friends told him yesterday about their child's school. Otherwise known as lies

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122826090#Comment_122826090

I've never felt obliged to actively advocate or support events or initiatives.

If groups want to carry out any legal activities to support their beliefs that's ok with me.

This is really about more than people's sex lives.

Someday society will get to a more complete understanding of the issues.

This thread is an indication that we have a way to go.

magicbastarder

Even if you were to take that news article at face value, it says nothing about the kid's ideas of being furries 'catered to'. It stated the schools are getting advice. There's nothing in the article about how the schools are handling it.

crusd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122819844#Comment_122819844

Acknowledging it exists it seems

crusd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122821022#Comment_122821022

This must be a parody🤣

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122826868#Comment_122826868

Not really, fundamentally it's all the same issue.

It's no one else's business who someone else fancies/sleeps with, and likewise it's no-one else's business how they see themselves in terms of their identity.

That's all fine SO LONG AS they understand that others are not obliged to agree with some or all of it. All those others are obliged to do in a civil society is be tolerant or at least apathetic. They don't have to agree or advocate for that person's beliefs or feelings if they choose not to or hold differing beliefs/values themselves.

Gay/Straight/Bi is pretty straightforward. These are sexual orientations and we've moved to a point where no-one particularly cares as it's down to attraction and preferences. The difference with Trans is it requires others to buy-in to the individual's personal view of themselves, regardless of what is biologically and historically true of that person. It becomes even more complex when that person expects the same rights and access as their preferred identity, or when that identity is in flux, and conflict arises when this isn't validated by others/general society.

It come down to facts vs feelings given that there is no scientific or biological evidence (that I'm aware of but I admit it's not a topic I actively keep up on) to support the individual's expression of self. As such, some are OK with valuing or accepting the latter over the former and so be it, however for many that is just a bridge too far. Again that's fine - they just need to be civil and tolerant. If they can manage that then that's all that can and indeed should be expected.

However given that the (LGBT+) community is frequently at odds with itself and its various component elsements, it's no wonder that everyone NOT directly involved is not only confused, but resistant to what seems like a constantly changing set of "rules" that even said community themselves don't always agree on.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122827718#Comment_122827718

Have you spoken to many trans people in coming to your conclusion that they are now "out and free to live their lives"?

Hamsterchops

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122827718#Comment_122827718

Bravo Kaiser 👏🏻 couldn't have put it better myself, and I'm way down the rabbit hole at this point thanks to my kids SPHE school books and what gender ideology lurks therein.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122827718#Comment_122827718

The difference with Trans is it requires others to buy-in to the individual's personal view of themselves, regardless of what is biologically and historically true of that person.

No, all it requires is people to treat them as equal to the rest of society and be respectful.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122827735#Comment_122827735

I did actually have a staff member in the past who transitioned from male to female. US-based but the local office community was very accepting and supportive which was great, but the individual themselves was very aware and upfront about knowing that it would take some getting used to for many, that mistakes would be made, compromisess on both sides needed, and that it was more about their own happiness than the validation of others for them.

From my perspective it made zero difference to how they performed their job so there was no issue (not that I would have expected any) from that perspective. I called them by their preferred name and that was the end of it really which is how it should be in a work environment (or any enviroment) really.

My own personal beliefs on the topic don't come into it.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122827801#Comment_122827801

You made a broad statement about how they are free to live their lives. If you try speaking to trans people, including the large numbers of trans people who are not out, you'll hear a very different message.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122827793#Comment_122827793

You said it before I could. 👍️

Dial Hard

I can't believe the "Kids identifying as cats" thing is still actually doing the rounds. And that people believe it, god love them.

crusd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122827793#Comment_122827793

This is what I dont get. All people are being asked is to be respectful, even if in your personal opinion you find it odd.

I for one do not understand people wanting to change their gender. I don't believe all of those wanting to change their gender are doing it for reasons of gender dysphoria which I do believe exists. But I cant judge who is genuine and who may have other issues contributing to their feeling that they don't conform to the pre conceived gender expectations. So I treat them with respect. Respect their wishes. Hope they get the support they need. And hope society becomes a more accepting place for people who wish to live in a way that doesn't conform to the standard norms for their gender.

Hamsterchops

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122827852#Comment_122827852

Never mind the cats, it's girls identifying as boys, and boys identifying as girls, (and being affirmed as such by the teachers). This is the burning issue, why? because a boy CANNOT turn into a girl, and a girl CANNOT turn into a boy, and I know there's all the messing about with "identity" Vs biology, but this is where it gets really blurred and messy with the SPHE book interchanging the words gender & sex, sex & gender, then it adds in misgendering & pronouns and you have a whole lot of ideology going on that kids should be protected against, and not introduced to in their SPHE class ⚠️

Kids are also taught to accept non-binary as being a thing, which is a non biological, non scientific, non realistic idea, and just a feeling really.

At this point I should say I don't believe in gender ideology at all. I don't don't believe in kids changing gender, I don't believe in the concept of non-binary either … in a binary species.

However, I do believe in two sexes & two genders, and I do NOT believe one can turn into the other. A man is an adult human male, and a woman is an ….. ….. …… I've used dots this time so that I don't get banned again.

These are my beliefs, so please respect them.

Dial Hard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122828036#Comment_122828036

I'll do you a deal, I'll afford your beliefs the same level of respect you give everyone else's. Sound reasonable?

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122828036#Comment_122828036

YoYou Want people to respect your beliefs, but you dont respect other's beliefs? Why should that work one way only.

Also, you seem to ignore the law, which we have in place since 2015.

Hamsterchops

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122828053#Comment_122828053

Yes, ok then, you can believe in 78 genders if you like and I'll stick with two. Respect.

Regarding man-made laws, well they come and they go. Look at Scotland, which was on the cusp of bringing in a Gender self id law until it was shot down in flames by Westminster. Now kook at the States where a whole lot of sex & gender laws are about to be rewritten as gender ideology is pushed back, and pushed pushed out.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122828088#Comment_122828088

So what? The law is the law in thsi country and I don't see or hear of anyone trying to change it. Where was the opposition before 2015?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122828036#Comment_122828036

The above post demonstrates perfectly why information and understanding of what gender identity is, and what biological sex is - and the differences between them - needs to be given to young adults as part of the SPHE curriculum.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122827852#Comment_122827852

Some actually believe it, and some just tell lies about it, as happened here.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122828036#Comment_122828036

So you believe that there are no transgender people then?

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122824965#Comment_122824965

This thread has completely jumped the shark.

I’m not sure ‘twas ever on the near side of the shark to begin with tbh, particularly given the histrionics in the opening post about what was likely a CPD course that was being delivered to teachers, not students, to enable teachers to be more confident in delivering the RSE part of the SPHE curriculum. The intention was always laser focused on what is merely a very small part of the overall curriculum.

I don’t know whether or not most of this stuff is irrelevant to the vast majority of parents, but it’s also not an either/or question in any case for the Department of Education as to whether or not the focus of delivering a comprehensive education should be solely around SPHE, or a solid grounding in mathematics, science, English, Irish, modern languages, etc. I don’t know if you’re aware, but quite a few subjects have undergone revisions to their curricula -

The existing subjects for which new curriculums have been developed are: Biology, Chemistry, Physics, Business, Arabic, Latin and Ancient Greek.

https://www.rte.ie/news/education/2024/0903/1468025-education-curriculum-updates/

Regardless of the parents nationality, there are parents whose focus is indeed on academic achievement, and there are parents whose focus is on sporting achievement, and there are parents whose focus is on social achievement, all with the idea and intentions of preparing their children for future success as those parents measure success, and that varies widely between one family and another, and is certainly not based upon any stereotypes you’ve got floating around in your imagination of Irish, Indian or Chinese parents, ambitious or otherwise.

It’s for the reasons above that I wondered where you were coming from in suggesting that you were qualified to teach when you hadn’t mentioned any kind of training to provide education that you’d received from a recognised academic institution, but it transpired you were actually referring to your ability to educate your own children in terms of teaching them about technology, which had nothing whatsoever to do with an ability to impart knowledge of SPHE to a classroom of approximately 30 students. Being a parent or not has no bearing whatsoever on a person’s ability to do that, and there are people who are qualified to do it, and there are plenty of people who imagine they could do it, who are not qualified. That’s the difference between being qualified, and just thinking one is qualified to do something. Being a parent requires no training or specialist knowledge whatsoever.

Hamsterchops

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122828611#Comment_122828611

This thread is about the SPHE whistleblower, and while I think it's a great subject, I do think they should leave out the ideological stuff and concentrate on the biological, scientific, sexual (age appropriate) and reality based educational aspect, instead of pushing gender identity ideology, like its going out of fashion, which I hope it will.

Adults can claim to be anything they like. Eddie Izzard now claims to be a woman. Pips Bunce claims to be a woman on Tuesdays, which I find belittling to women, for they are so much more than a costume and lipstick.

pjohnson

the thread jumped the shark when feckin SPHE started being taken seriously.