Deposit return scheme (recycling)

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121905863#Comment_121905863

Similar set up in Manchester funded by Council Tax.

They have a free bring area where you can get rid of pretty much anything.

I agree with you that we need another look at general waste disposal but I don't see it as an either or.

We can do it and the bottles and cans.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906140#Comment_121906140

I expect you really know from reading this thread that the best way to make sure your cans are recycled is to put them in the RVM.

If you have rejects you can bring them home and put them in the green bin.

You'll even save some money 🙂

marvin42

Just back from skerries. Never seen howth junktion so clean on st patrick's day. Uses to be full of bottles and cans. Deposit should have introduced years ago.....

BoardsBottler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121904527#Comment_121904527

what i meant applies to them overall and at any volume of containers returned, not just the big players with alot to feed the rvm. You was asking about what the best way to protest against them would be and said you did'nt mind losing a few deposits to send a message or something. Buying deposit items and then not returning them to the rvm actually funds them even more and supports them more financially, than actually returning the cans/bottles. Also not buying anything with the return logo kinda shoots oneself in the foot also and helps the scheme keep their percentage numbers up. It's quite tricky to be fair. All outcomes return win. They just win less (financially) if the item is returned, they win more (financially) if the item goes unreturned (by keeping your deposit money), they get cash for the recyclables too, and if a person doesnt buy to begin with, they win (percentage stat wise). Maybe if tetra pack started doing their own carton containers for the same brands, or copy what canada does with milk, but for fizzy drinks, or maybe going to the north for the shopping as a temporary fix for those who can.

Also thank you for the acknowledgement on the €200! i understand the many frustrations of the scheme including a good portion of the ones you've mentioned. The issue i want to highlight is "being willing to losing deposits" will not cause any sort of change or make them rethink anything. Legally i'm really unsure of what can actually be done in protest against the scheme, and make a change in any actual meaningful way. i do admire your motivation though and willingness to sacrifice some deposits in order to do some sort of protest.

LambshankRedemption

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906378#Comment_121906378

As I have said repeatedly on this thread, I get 90% of my groceries delivered and don't drive. What could happen to my green bin so that its contents do not get recycled that could not happen to an RVM?

Sadly I suspect all the things you say that could not happen to an RVM could happen to one, but me proving thus would be considered criminal damage.

zell12

Two out of three machines I tried earlier were out of order aka full. How often are they emptied?

BoardsBottler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906598#Comment_121906598

it would be nice and conveinent if there was a local person in your area who goes around every few days collecting all the depositable containers from you and other residents in the area (or just from you) and pays a small percentage of the deposits to you on the spot for your containers so you get a bit of moneyback there and then, then he/she goes to an rvm and gets to keep the profit from the deposits. How does that sound?

everyones a winner

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906575#Comment_121906575

If everyone protests Re-Turn by putting all recyclables (including those with a deposit) in their black bin that would lower overall recycling rates. Re-Turn would keep more deposits but overall recycling rates suffer and never get near targets. Is that outcome still a win for Re-Turn? Would the scheme stay as it is?

That's the scenario I was describing. It will never happen. It was just a hypothetical to get some discussion on how the scheme could be protested.

byrnefm

I saw that after June 1, all cans/bottles have to have the new logo. Is there any mention of imported cans/bottles, such as US soft drink cans or drinks from afar from shops such as Asian Supermarkets? I doubt all of them would ever be compliant.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906651#Comment_121906651

It doesn't matter where they originate.

This will cause problems for small scale imports.

If they can't comply they will have to exit the market.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121905468#Comment_121905468

This situation was covered by Mr.Foley, the CEO of Return in the run up to launching this ill thought out scheme.

He commiserated and advised the public to phone his office and they would arrange to collect your returnable goods and pay you back deposits presumably.

So get onto him and demand he holds to his word. If nothing happens get onto local councillors and TDs and tell them to light a fire under him. Tell them this is an elections issue for you, neighbours and any family & friends.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906638#Comment_121906638

LOL, how many miles do you propose to drive to collect all this stuff, how many boreens and lanes to negotiate??

This is Foley's problem - get him to sort it.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906598#Comment_121906598

You've sort of proved my point.

What can happen to recyclables in a green bin to render them unusable can be due to carelessness or poor understanding.

In an RVM someone would need to go out of their way.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906651#Comment_121906651

We'll almost certainly see less choice with the result of the market being carved up between bigger suppliers who can use their dominant position to increase retail prices and profit margins. All justified of course by the extra work they say they're putting in. Anti competitive legislation, maybe we'll see a test case taken.

nachouser

I kinda wonder if there's a boards bottler type in the world of green bin collection who is making a mint from this whole charade:-)

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906709#Comment_121906709

Come autumn and the lead up to Halloween there’ll be plenty going out of their way to throw stink bombs and fireworks into the machines. Unfortunately. They will be a hazard, especially placed right inside entrance/exit eg as in Aldi Nutgrove. I foresee closing off sone machines, at least after school closing times.

Mech1

Well my son and I get through approx 12 500ml cans a day and have always been putting them in a separate spare wheely bin that the green bin men collect along with our regular green bin.

So running up to this we had loads of un barcoded cans just sitting there.

Not anymore all labeled up and gone so I'm well ahead and don't mind throwing the odd reject in the bin in future.

Markcheese

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906638#Comment_121906638

Honestly , i was thinking ,local kids football teams, or a charity thing - come round a town or an estate every couple of weeks and collect for their club or charity -

I was at a match on friday evening ,and there were tins of cans and bottles chucked in the bin , a charity bin with a high up chute would be a handy way of recycling and funding..

SteM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906698#Comment_121906698

He commiserated and advised the public to phone his office and they would arrange to collect your returnable goods and pay you back deposits presumably.

You know he didn't say they would arrange to collect individuals returnables. You keep pushing it, but it's not what he said.

Markcheese

I assume if most bottles and cans now go into the recycling machines , the green bin companies will stop sorting yiur green bin for aluminium cans and PET bottles , because theres no point ,

BoardsBottler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906644#Comment_121906644

yeah its an interesting discussion, and i love large scale things like this (and hypotheticals). But ultimately it would only make re-turn increase the deposit on recyclables. Further punishing people for not meeting their goals. We must keep in mind why this scheme even exists to begin with. And thus gave birth to us being charged with a deposit in the first place.

Giving re-turn lots of money from deposits in exchange for them not meeting their targets is still a win for them with the money gained, which they could then keep or build a recycling plant or do whatever with. They would see the large gain of money as a monetary success. They succeed if they reach money goals, OR if they reach target recycling stat percentage number goals.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906706#Comment_121906706

i'm not proposing anything myself/anyone to drive miles to collect anything. was just throwing the idea out there, as it is a good idea for anyone that does'nt have to travel much distance, as well as something that helps those who rely on getting stuff delivered. it seems only fair for others stuck indoors to atleast have some alternative that results in getting a cut of the action and not being stuck with cans and bottles.

Honestly i'm not trying to sort the problem for the schemes sake of things as i couldnt care less if re-turn reach their target goals or not. i just want more power to the people and for some fairness to be done, while at the same time someone somewhere being able to earn a little bit of extra money from it, as well as the person stuck at home being able to get a little something back for their cans/bottles.

LambshankRedemption

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906721#Comment_121906721

Not from my bin their aren't!

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121905733#Comment_121905733

What are the ground rules in this election prediction game ?

If you are going to claim every vote for non government candidates as a success for your "campaign" I might as well give up now.

To make it interesting what percentage of voters do you expect to base their voting preference on whether they approve of Re-turn?

The Ayatolla

I used it for the first two a few days ago.

Was surprised at how fast the machine actually was and that you can just shove the bottles/cans in as fast as you can / want. Relatively painless but annoying nonetheless, I probably recycled 99% of my cans/bottles up to now in my blue bin anyway. Oh well.

BoardsBottler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906764#Comment_121906764

The thing is they never did sort our green bin for cans and bottles to begin with, instead they just sold off recyclables to other countries to sort through, or else incinerated the rest and dump in landfill. This is really what got us into this re-turn mess to begin with (recycle bin companies not actually recycling any of our stuff at all, and then ireland having no proper recycling stats to show the EU when questioned about it and caught with our pants down) and thus re-turn and the drs scheme in ireland was born

Neowise

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121901620#Comment_121901620

I haven't put any money in a trolley in a long time.

I have Santa Bear Appeal Central Remedial Clinic keyring coins on my keyring that unlock the trolleys and come right back out straight away, leaving the trolley usable with out coins.

I return trolley to trolley site, but don't always lock it back up again.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906764#Comment_121906764

Economies of scale will probably dictate that it would be no longer profitable.

Also they will lose their subsidy. Net effect of that is everyone's costs will go up.

Probably cheaper and more environmental to replace your "green bin" with a black burning barrel at this stage.

Cut out the theatre.

ForestFire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121909964#Comment_121909964

Would installing home mini-incinerators work out better in the long run? I mean proper ones, High heat with Filters etc.

Save on Bins and bin collections, Bins companies trucks, driving the Recycle centres wasting our time

And the heat could be returned into the house or heat the water??

BoardsBottler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121906866#Comment_121906866

aww why not? i would appreciate it if you kept your cans in good condition and send them to me with anpost via registered express delivery and insured, so that way i can recycle them for you at no additional cost. Rather than crushing them.

But i'll be keeping the deposits for all my trouble.

i'll even sign the package "boards bottler" when it arrives!

jj880

Had a quick look at the Australian RVM scheme.

https://www.returnit.com.au/faq/

Some highlights:

Once registered, you can use your mobile phone as your identifier at any Return-It refund point to have your refund transferred direct into your bank account.

...

Crushed or damaged containers, will receive the full deposit fee refund, as long as they are eligible for return under the container deposit scheme

...

Return-It has three options for returning containers: Depots, Reverse Vending Machines (RVMs), and Small format refund points such as over-the-counter solutions. Depots accommodate all quantities of containers and provide instant cash refunds.

...

Choose the charity you want to support at the touch screen console in a Return-It Express Stand or a Return-It Depot location. Simply follow the prompts on the console to direct your refund to the charity of your choice.

...

Label each bag with your personal barcode so that the depot can accurately count the containers and issue your electronic refund.

Just shows what a shambles our gombeens have made of Re-Turn.