Barbie Kardashian is in a women's prison. Taoiseach's response to questions on this are here..

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390503#Comment_120390503

No, a law can be repealed by a new law.

crusd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390341#Comment_120390341

But people are talking here about pulling their children out of a sport entirely because of one instance of a trans person competing in the adult version of that sport.

Let the children play sport. If as a teenager they find themselves competing against a teenage biological male then decide to pull out of that game. If as an adult let them make their own choice. But dont, as people here advocate, withdraw them from the sport entirely for a scenario that they are unlikely to ever face face.

And I say this with the personal belief that no one who as experienced male puberty should be allowed to complete on an equal level as a biological female in a sport where the bone density, muscle mass and overall strength benefits constitute an advantage in that sport, irrespective of any testosterone suppression measures taken.

Also, It wasn't me who brought sport into the discussion of this individual nutcase, just folks trying to suggest this nutcase is equivalent to all trans folks.

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389896#Comment_120389896

I got banned from a thread for daring to say these people have mental health issues.

Another mod just gave me a warning. Of course the ban came from someone who is far from unbiased in this topic.

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390513#Comment_120390513

The usual hysteria..

This isn’t the issue being discussed here. If they are a danger they’d be one no matter what they identify as.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390503#Comment_120390503

I think it’s only time that there will be a case made in the European court of human rights on such issues- be it transgender participation in prisons, sport etc Were definately going to need new legislation

Sport hasn’t got to grips with this issue so not surprising that prisons haven’t either.

However the safety of other prisoners should be paramount - especially in women’s prisons where there’s an obvious threat of manipulation and predatory behaviour and we’ve already seeing that happen- a transgender woman who still has male genatalia is most certainly not a suitable candidate for an all female prison in my view.

Theres certainly a case to explore the building of a transgender prison- and that maybe the choice is given to either go to a prison commensurate with your original birth sex if the prison authorities feel this is a safe option for that person (which would be unlikely in most cases) or a transgender prison.

People who commit crimes and are transgender can’t expect that Ireland in 2024 is in a position to accommodate their particular needs - they’re too far down the list in terms of priorities right now- don’t commit crime is the best advice I’d have for them right now.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390474#Comment_120390474

I think most of us saw this coming 500 miles off- everyone got caught up in changes to equality laws a few years ago - absolutely fine, but FFS , think the whole thing through and not piecemeal like they’ve done.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390840#Comment_120390840

Absolutely not true....

rustynutz

I think it's time for a sensible conversation around the whole trans issue, in biology there are two genders, male and female. If someone was born a biological male, and transitions to female, well there should be another name for that, like transfemale.

And transfemales have their own section in prisons, compete against each other in sports etc.

I don't think it's fair to biological woman for a biological male to be treated exactly like biological women because they have transitioned to female. It is open to too much abuse, and the rights of all the biological women are being violated, to accommodate the rights of the minority trans person. This is exactly what we are seeing here, a violent biological male rapist, has discovered they can spend their prison time around women instead of men, and has decided to identify as female. How long before every rapist facing time does the same thing? Its like locking a paedophile up in a children's prison.

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390840#Comment_120390840

So you reckon the psycho that hates women and wants to kill them presents the exact same risk to men in a mans prison?

Okay

newhouse87

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390801#Comment_120390801

Got banned or a warning from resident pc mod posting link from gript, doesn't matter if story was true or not apparently.

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390017#Comment_120390017

Because it was piggybacked onto the marriage reform legislation and the media were four square behind it as were the politicians in the dail so no public debate

The establishment are very much out of step with the public on this. I see Kier Starmer has taken on board Sturgeons demise and is now saying that Labour will not introduce legislation that is out of step with the publics view

The Emperors lack of clothes is now becoming apparent, expect the Irish establishment not to get the memo though.

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390967#Comment_120390967

Another thread. A different response from 2 people about the same post😁

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390989#Comment_120390989

Don't worry our politicians with skin in the game will be out of power soon. Worry is how much damage they will do in the meantime

TooTired123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390017#Comment_120390017

If you do things really really quietly under the guise of being very “kind” then you can pass ant laws you like.

The absolute worst insult you can throw at any one in Ireland today is that they and their opinions amount to unkindness. Peoples feelings are now far far more important than facts or science.

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120391054#Comment_120391054

Yeah, trans lobbies were literally thanking the government for passing legislation "under the radar".

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/trans-rights-pass-under-radar-smlwqsc3s

You can honestly argue that most legislation passed in Ireland has no mandate, and that should naturally lead people to question our supposed democracy, because none of this has anything to do with the will of the people. It's the will of a select few, who seem to always get their way.

crusd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120391026#Comment_120391026

But it is politicians currently in power who are saying they should not be in the same prisons and politicians not in power who are saying they should be treated exactly like females

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120391113#Comment_120391113

This is why so many are concerned about this upcoming constitutional referendum.

They are selling it (very loudly which is more suspicious) as woman’s equality and removing dated language which is all good but you have to wonder what else they’re going to attach and sneak in.

And it will pass because only the woman’s equality peace will be discussed in the media.

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120391115#Comment_120391115

Certain politicians have been pushing for more rights for lgbtqia+ ( have I missed a letter?) and the dissolution of the meaning of male, female and family for years. The media have been at their beck and call and now we have a situation where anyone who says the king is naked is shouted down and branded a hater.

Time to wake up but I fear it's already too late.

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390958#Comment_120390958

I responded to a poster who said the biggest issue was the danger they’d post past release, but that they were kept in a female prison.

Fwiw I don’t they should be in this prison either but in a different type of facility. Having read about his background I have sympathy and can assure you that “just” locking him up somewhere won’t do much good.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120391263#Comment_120391263

It's multiple experts says they are a danger and will attack woman/girls upon release,

Explain how you would deal with it

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390801#Comment_120390801

You were probably approaching it from a medical and psychologically accepted position.

Others are coming with regard to the nuances of the situation, how the concept and idea of what a woman is. Is highly fluid, maybe beyond definition, that concepts of what a woman are is purely the product of a right wing patriarchal society.

You have probably never even called a woman a terf or believe that women need to be made pay.

Not very progressive of you.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120391026#Comment_120391026

SF would have a much more radical position on this than the Greens or FG.

I say that as someone with 20 years membership from the mid 90s on.

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120391279#Comment_120391279

High security psychiatric hospital.

spaceHopper

From this article I don't see the problem

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/dangerous-transgender-prisoner-barbie-kardashian-29526551

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390947#Comment_120390947

You seem to have the understanding that the word "transition" means that something meaningful has actually taken place. In very many cases the only thing that has happened is that a form is signed. The term transition is so misleading, many people believe it means something completely different.

Male bodied people are in women's toilets, changing rooms, showers, dorms, hospital wards and prisons because they have supposedly 'transitioned', some have signed a form, many others haven't they just claim to be women, who is going to ask to see a GRC? The vast majority of women won't challenge them as they are scared in the moment to do so, rightly scared based on experiences of those that dared. It needs more people to understand what self ID actually means and to challenge it.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120391327#Comment_120391327

Which is very likely the next stop for them ,but I'm sure they may get to go free before that happens, Tusla has done a great sanitizing the media when it comes to her .

But isn't that the same as Just locking her up somewhere, something you seem to be against

Sephiroth_dude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390967#Comment_120390967

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120390801#Comment_120390801

Mod

Do not discuss moderation on thread, if you have a problem contact the mod concerned, anymore of this and you'll be thread banned.

Liath Luachra

He is a predator and anything else is secondary after that. His father according to court reports only engaged with him when encouraging him to partake in abusing his mother. When he and his mother escaped to a refuge, he beat her to the extent he was placed in care. He tore the eyelids off a female carer, wrapping his arms and legs around her head and chest. The only remorse shown was that he hadnt killed her. He seems highly competent at finding opportunities and using them to abuse women. He has abused the system and spotted the loophole - he applied for the GRC around the time he was being charged. it beggars belief how he is in a general prison - surely considerable mental health issues are to the forefront here. His early childhood, where essentially he was trained by his abusive father should have been a huge red flag when placing him in a womens prison. Isolated or not, he can continue to direct verbal abuse towards female prisoners and guards. Cant imagine he will ever be considered safe in the general population, as a predator he will always look for opportunities to abuse women. This is his normality and the government have handed him the golden opportunity on his lap.

The Quintessence Model

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120389896#Comment_120389896

It's nice to see that this nonsense is starting to have it's day in the media spotlight, akin to as in Scotland. There were a few around boards pointing this nonsense out for a few years, across multiple trans threads usually fighting an uphill battle due to the restrictions of what one could reasonably say. Strange that none of the defender of this malpractice are in this thread as of yet. But neither is that a surprise. Can't defend the indefensible.

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120391576#Comment_120391576

The problem with those types, as is seen over and over again, is that they are unwilling to even admit that people may abuse this stuff. They, for some odd reason, choose to view anyone who claims to be trans as one. They corner themselves by not being able to admit basic truths, like the fact some people will abuse these laws for their own gain, and that not everyone claiming to be trans is some sort of angel.

Even if they get to the stage where they admit to abuse, they'll be the first to downplay the extent of it, and try and convince us all that it happens very rarely, so that nothing should be done about. The abuse is worth it in the name of "tolerance" will be the eventual conclusion.