Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings and threadbans - updated 5/1/24*

Nosler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172229#Comment_120172229

Places like Japan and Saudi don't have any refugees?

Honestly, refugees would stop coming to ireland if they weren't given so much free stuff....

Ireland doesnt owe places like Afghanistan, Somalia, Nigeria, Algeria , Egypt anything at all.....

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172281#Comment_120172281

Japan has lots of refugees. Saudi has very few. In the gulf states there is no concept of refugee status. THEY DO HAVE PEOPLE FLEEING WAR THOUGH they dont give them a certain status though. So they have nearly one million syrians there but they are working as migrants prob in not great conditions.

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/JPN/japan/refugee-statistics

https://www.lejournalinternational.fr/Syrian-refugees-why-won-t-the-oil-rich-Gulf-States-take-them-in_a3477.html

You say ireland doesn't owe any country anything. Ok well no country owes us anything either. And immigrants don't owe ireland anything so we stop exploiting them and making money from them and the state loses all that income along with the language schools etc etc etc.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172290#Comment_120172290

You make it sound like we are holding them prisoner 😂

They do owe us nothing, they are here for a reason.

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172311#Comment_120172311

That is a fair point.

However the truth is many are given a hard sell by said entities. Partic in latin america it seems and few stay and many dont have a lot of good things to say.

Also its not like people in DP can afford flights anywhere.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172318#Comment_120172318

Many of them could afford flights to Ireland, even ones which require multiple stops. Even if getting here through trafficking means it's pretty costly. We're not getting the poorest from other nations.

Also, the UK is only a shared border away. If its so bad they can move.

I don't really understand in the case of the Mexican dentist why he doesn't move, as you say, he owes the country nothing.

Maybe it's our lax approach to entry and overstaying, I don't really know. I would agree with you on a number of your points made here btw.don't want to be seen to purely oppose.

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172332#Comment_120172332

He will I would say when he gets an English qualification and good enough english. I would say his idea is to open up dentistry in mexico to americans for a cheaper price for which he will need english. Kind of like turkey does plastic surgery for irish people etc.

Its a pity we couldn't get him to stay i mean we are crying out for dentists.

The govt did a reciprocal deal with many latin american countries for this purpose. It also involved business deals.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172348#Comment_120172348

So it's worth putting up with the pain for long term gain which makes sense 👍 being immersed is still the best way to learn. And honestly fair play to them. My issues would be with policy, not people.

It's just hard to see why people would choose Ireland over say the UK now, as in the days of the internet, all this must be known before they come. Wonder is it purely laxer entry criteria/loopholes, or will we see it change.

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172356#Comment_120172356

The Uk has higher unemployment with brexit. We are doing a lot better than them they have even higher prices and cost of living and they are losing jobs. That is why.

Why they would choose us over America or OZ? I dunno.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172363#Comment_120172363

Its entry requirements for Oz id reckon. Even the US is probably harder legally.

I also wonder why he needs to be in Dublin for this, a regional UK or Irish Town would work just as well for English. Though I guess the offering needs to be there in those places.

Anyways off topic! I guess despite all the worries we have about our country, its still one of the more desirable in the world.

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172367#Comment_120172367

They have to go where the college is. A lot of them are actually doing these courses in places like trinity and UCD by the way. They are not just fly by night courses.

I think Europe and the EU is desirable. Or the perception is that. I don't know.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172376#Comment_120172376

I am a number of years out of college at this stage, but from my experience hiring it does seem some courses are very much mostly foreign nationals.

Short term its ok, but long term I do think the government needs to look at how we help Irish do these highly desirable courses. Being very cynical, a better educated person, in a desirable field, should get more wages, and thus pay more taxes long term.

But off topic, and probably involves actually planning and thinking, and not just reactive policy making from our leaders

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172384#Comment_120172384

Its all about money. Foreign students pay more than the govt subsidies through the CAO. There is no motivation for universities to change it.

These courses are often run through unis but private ...and even if they are through the cao system the foreign students still pay thousands more than the govt subsidies for irish students.

And of course funding for state schools in areas that would have a lot of social housing is an issue.

And the mentality too ....we here often oh middle class people dont want to do a trade (and i think they underestimate how hard trades can be but anyway) but there is the mentality in some areas of not going to college or leaving school to do a trade or just getting any old job. Its money now etc.

Hamachi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172367#Comment_120172367

It’s 100% laxer entry requirements. Visas are granted more liberally and Ireland is the only English-speaking country that allows them to work on a stamp 2 visa. This visa permits them to work 20 hours per week. In reality, many are working multiples of that.

This is yet another bogus migration stream that needs to eliminated. It’s not good for the Latin American students, who are often crammed in 20, to a house. From an Irish perspective, it’s exacerbating an already acute housing crisis.

As someone mentioned earlier, most of them are pretty unhappy here and who can blame them. I happen to know a couple of Brazilians with pretty bad living situations. Even on a human level, they find Irish people very ‘cold’ and feel like we want nothing to do with them, which is probably correct in many cases.

All in all, it’s just another barely legitimate migration stream, exploited mercilessly by unscrupulous employers. It’s certainly not to the benefit of Irish people or the students themselves.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172399#Comment_120172399

I totally agree with this. And the more dependent they get on foreign money, the more places they offer abroad etc etc.

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172403#Comment_120172403

Yeah ..they dont really advise the foreign students on the situation here either though. And you asked earlier why they stay ..a lot of the courses can be 3 or 4 years long and they need to finish etc to get it.

The colleges tend to treat the students terribly. And i mean these students ARE PAYING. I have heard stories like teachers wouldn't answer questions etc or they can't speak to college authorities etc.

Bobtheman

We have to be careful that proposing a zero refugee policy doesn't lead to racism. Such a policy is not racist.

We just don't have the room at present.

I'm drawing an exception with Ukrainians even though we are running out of space here too.

To turn our back on them is to encourage Russian oppression in our continent.

Some on this site depict this as anti foreigner but it's not. We had successfully integrated thousands from Eastern Europe and Asia.

We need legal immigration.

We just don't have the room for refugees. Particularly those arriving without any documentation

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120170777#Comment_120170777

Many families, including my own, have twenty-somethings and thirty-somethings never having lived anywhere but the family home - full blown adults with no concept of what independence even feels like as an experience - two straight generations of them

And that's the governments fault is it? 🙄

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172449#Comment_120172449

if you rent you can't save ...and when you save the prices keep going up. I'm saying its entirely the govts fault. Im not saying its the fault of immigration either. But it has to be solved.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172461#Comment_120172461

Nah, if are approaching your 40s and have never lived independently, that's a personal choice.

Nosler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172290#Comment_120172290

Japan has lots of refugees? Your data shows they accept about 1500 a year... Japan has a population of 125 million.

Ireland accepted 70,000 refugees last year? Irelands population is 5 million...

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172528#Comment_120172528

fair nuff

ILoveYourVibes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172529#Comment_120172529

60 k of which are ukrainians tho

Nosler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172544#Comment_120172544

The way it works is that you have asylum seekers coming over and they eventually get an irish passport. They then bring their family over....

Nosler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172449#Comment_120172449

Yeah, it's their fault for not having rich families that can help them buy a house.

Honestly, if you're a kid from dublin and your family arent loaded you'll be lucky to buy a house.

It hardly seems right that someone travels half way round the world then gets a free house...

Tbh, I don't know why there aren't riots. You have irish families working and paying tax that live in small houses. You then get people coming to ireland and get free money and houses while doing nothing, however if you're against this you're obviously a far right extremist racist.

Clown world.

riddles

In the morning if we announced without any questions there’d be a 3k grant cash To get into archery - we’d have a lot of archers suddenly. The international protection farce is no different. It’s a failed system.

The Ukrainians are coming here expecting to retain normality in their lives which includes a family home and access to education.

No one coming here is willing to accept the conditions of crisis which is what our accommodation shortage is so it’s best spell things out as they are. International protection and economic migration are one and the same - specially as it seems most are coming from other EU destinations.

socially housing EU nationals here is also something that has to be questioned- specifically those who’ve never had a job here.

A few real back bone decisions at an EU wide level would start to bring this topic to some sort of road to a solution.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172575#Comment_120172575

Honestly, if you're a kid from dublin and your family arent loaded you'll be lucky to buy a house

Someone approaching their 40s is not a kid and if they have never lived independently that's their choice.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172227#Comment_120172227

This thread is about a zero refugee policy. Literally the opposite of a 'no cap' policy

And it seems like an offshoot of stormfront

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172420#Comment_120172420

Why do you make an exception for Ukraine?

Jinglejangle69

Just back from a few days away.

Had to show my passport 3 times leaving Ireland and entering.

How are they getting away with destroying their documents and just been chauffeured off to a hotel with all the trimmings????

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120172709#Comment_120172709

This is exactly the problem with certain people. There's no point where the system become so overburdened that you think it's valid to have these views. No matter how just people are, they are akin to Nazis in your view. Essentially you're admitting that reality doesn't matter, you'll call people Nazis no matter what. It's honestly amazing that the left still thinks that they are smart ones at the table, when all the have is insults and bad policies, and nothing to really offer the people, but more suffering.