Is Elon Musk hurting Tesla?

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121895421#Comment_121895421

They are trying to get rid of the showroom from sandyford. Dump it into the outlaws in Dublin City instead 😂

MojoMaker

Not sure there is any evidence on this thread of anyone defending Musk or his behaviour, in general terms. There does seem to be tacit acceptance that he is a divisive character and not liked liked by a large swathe of people around the world.

Is he harming the brand? No hard evidence one way or the other, certainly none demonstrated here. One thing to consider however is how unconscious psychology governs decisions. Musk, being so well-known, almost certainly has steered a lot of buyers towards Tesla as a brand - note I haven't said anything about creating an affinity, just an awareness. The affinity perhaps is created when the vehicles are inspected more closely, test drives booked, reviews absorbed, and deposits placed. Like it or hate it, Tesla do make among the very best EVs in the world right now - will it last forever? Probably not, and time will tell.

Another thing to consider is the level of disingenuity in some of the posts. How many of the "I would never buy a Tesla because of Musk" posts are actually for different reasons entirely? Such as....partner won't let me, boss won't approve, can't afford one now on finance.....and are being passed off as a "principled stand" against the CEO? More than a few I'd hazard.

Anyone that decries Tesla for Musk, and continues to use Twitter has no credibility at all.

drunkmonkey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896025#Comment_121896025

i've asked a few posters what's he actuall done to deserve a boycott by them without any response. I can understand owners been annoyed he dropped prices etc but if someone has a problem with what I see as his "caues" they are the ones with a problem.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896025#Comment_121896025

Yeah that's part of what makes it hard to determine brand damage, it's difficult to quantify how many potential buyers have been put off

There's been a few people here who have said they would have bought a Tesla were it not for Musk being in charge, so the number of lost sales is more than zero

However this doesn't seem to have done any real damage to sales, so not sure it's hurt the company

As I said before, I think he's damaging the company in more subtle ways, such as diverting resources away from more lucrative products towards whatever he wants

Imagine for example if Tesla had delivered the Model 2 this year for the $25k or so instead of a $100k+ Cybertruck. They'd probably have all their lines maxed out trying to meet demand and would have profits secured for the next decade

Instead they've got a meme on wheels which is unlikely to ever pay for it's investment costs, and engineers moonlighting in Musk's various other ventures

From the perspective of a shareholder, you've a CEO who's demanding a very large salary and not delivering value for money

listermint

The last few pages are people literally defending musk and using whataboutery to do so.

Cognitive dissonance off the scale...

Re read your own posts fellas

Also yes he's still damaging the brand simple facts if he was jettisoned and they put a nobody faceless ceo in place they'd sell more.

MojoMaker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896184#Comment_121896184

I don't think there's any evidence for that though, that's conjecture and opinion.

Random posters saying they wouldn't buy a Tesla because of Musk is also not evidence. See the point above about disingenuity as well. Several reasons why someone might want to project onto a "principled stand" whether true or not.

Also, easy to take a "principled stand" when you've no choice in the matter. Definitely seems to be a bit of smoke and mirrors there.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896184#Comment_121896184

Bullshit, nobody's defending Musk. What's being defended here is the car choice people made and the reasons for it. Asking for the same morals and principles to be applied evenly and fairly across all brands.

Such a simple concept lost on the twitter user, the company Musk actually owns ffs🤣

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896234#Comment_121896234

It's not random posters go off and see the numerous feedback sure it even has spawned bumper stickers.

This isn't listermint specific no point making it about me.

A outwardly right wing mouth piece who's thrown thousands out of work isn't someone that many people want to be aligned with. What's funny is you can't see why that may be the case.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896237#Comment_121896237

They have you have whataboutery.

Note I don't judge anyones car choice buy what you want.

I've only ever said elons a prat and he's harming the business . Many tesla owners on here take huge exception to that an really take it personally. That's a bit weird don't you think...

Are you Elon?.

I'm not out here defending volvo ceo or renault ceo or the Chinese government or bmw ceo. Because I wouldn't if they're pricks il say it.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896160#Comment_121896160

I'll bite, although I haven't actually boycotted the brand, but I'm not planning to buy a Tesla anyway

My problem with him is that he's an obnoxious prick who thinks he's the smartest person in the world and has surrounded himself with a group of sychophants who will happily pay to huff his farts

He doesn't seem to engage in any sort of analytical thinking and won't accept any opposing viewpoints. This might be fine when you're in startup mode but as a company leader he should be focusing on a growth strategy rather than vanity projects

I also strongly disagree with his politics. He endorses a very laissez-faire type of world where individual achievements are king and it's everyone for themselves.

Personally I think people are at their best when they pull together to accomplish a task. Individual achievements should be celebrated, but it doesn't automatically confer some degree of superiority upon that person

Okay, so I don't like the guy, but what does that matter?

Well he's also a person in a very influential position due to his wealth and celebrity status. I've always felt people in that position should be open to the opinions and thoughts of those around them and try to find consensus instead of talking about how he's going to put the cocaine back in coca cola

I feel that not calling out his BS is just a silent form of endorsement and that's why I don't support any of his thinking

MojoMaker

But you're presenting "Elon is harming the brand" as a fact, when it's actually just an opinion.

Not disagreeing with your opinion that he's an "outwardly right wing mouth piece who's thrown thousands out of work", but presenting it as anything other than in your opinion he is harming Tesla is just conjecture.

We do have evidence that egregious and abhorrent actions on the part of VW management had little to no negative effect on VW group sales, so any correlation to "Musk must be harming the brand" is just an opinion.

Did it ever occur to you that folks who declare on here that they "won't buy a Tesla because of Musk" may not be telling the truth? After all, it is an Internet forum at the end of the day.

Tesla seems to be doing well in Ireland, certainly as well as their capacity allows, which is probably their business objective for this country achieved.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896257#Comment_121896257

Why do people constantly misrepresent what others have said just to make a point?

Multiple times in this thread I've stated my dislike for Musk and his seemingly fragile ego.

Not once have I tried to defend him in any way.

Bobson Dugnutt

Not buying a Tesla because you find him appalling and intrinsically linked to the brand is as legitimate a reason for not buying as: disliking the conservative and boring design, the shoddy cheap interior, the lack of physical buttons and controls, the enormous depreciation, the horror stories about build quality and reliability etc.

You might think it’s mad or irrational, but that’s on you to manage.

MojoMaker

Not disagreeing, but you're not exactly veiling your bias there really, which erodes the credibility of anything you may try to present as "fact".

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896330#Comment_121896330

That’s fine. It’s your hard earned.

Your post could easily be talking about an ID4 too.

josip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896165#Comment_121896165

You're thinking with your European/Asian hat on about the Model 2. If you've got your US hat on, then Tesla had already made a small car, the Model 3, so it was time to try and target the largest segment in the US market. The cyber truck does look like it was a bit of a moon shot that missed, trying to put too much bleeding edge stuff into the same product at the same time. But I think the decision to target the US truck market was the correct one at the time.

Bobson Dugnutt

There’s no bias to saying you won’t buy a car because it’s intrinsically linked with a blowhard like Musk. That’s a personal value judgement. Tesla owners may not like that, or may disagree with it, but that’s for them to deal with.

MJohnston

Whatever about his actual politics, his tenure at Twitter has proven several things to me:

1. He’s bad at running a company.

2. He’s bad at surrounding himself with smarter people.

3. He makes terrible software engineering decisions and doesn’t really understand software.

4. He reacts badly to people disagreeing with him.

5. He likes to overwork his staff and doesn’t create a pleasant working environment

These aren’t my opinions, they are about as close to objective statements as you can get in a situation like this.

Here’s my opinion though:

Put all these things together and you definitely have a perception of Tesla as a company with shoddy quality standards, and an increasing reliance on bad software over well established hardware.

Put simply: Musk is a total disaster for Tesla past their early scrappy years.

Bobson Dugnutt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896354#Comment_121896354

But it isn’t. It’s about Tesla. Not Hyundai, Audi, BMW. It’s about not buying a Tesla because Musk is associated with the brand. Would I buy one if he wasn’t the CEO and figurehead? Probably not. But it’s easy to rule them out because he is in charge.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896362#Comment_121896362

There’s absolutely no problem with that. In the same way there’s absolutely no problem with saying I wouldn’t touch a BYD because of their Chinese government influence, VW because of their Hitler past, Audi because of their concentration camp use etc etc

Why is is ok to say that about a Tesla but not one of the other brands?

Vw, Byd and Audi owners may not like that or may disagree with it, but that’s for them to deal with.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896371#Comment_121896371

In the same way as it’s easy to rule out other brands because of their CEO or company actions. Personal ethics. Once it’s not hypercritical.

DrPsychia

I only hate Musk because he deleted USS, didn't provide us with proper 360 camera view(because he didn't want to pay Nissan for the rights), no working rain sensor, and is on the path of deleting stalks from all models which is a terrible decision.

I think he has done a lot of positive work for the brand up until the past couple years but I'd love to see him gone now, I think he's doing more harm than good due to his Tesla business decisions. The Cybertruck is nothing more than a train-wreck vanity project, and it's an absolutely ghastly looking thing. All those resources should have been poured into the Model 2 to deliver it quicker which would have put serious pressure on well established brands and the incoming barrage of Chinese brands.

drunkmonkey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896271#Comment_121896271

More of a nibble than a bite, you haven't given any concrete examples of what he's actually done, seems you've made an assumption about his personalty, I don't belive for a second you don't support any of his thinking, i'm sure you support some of his stances, unvetted immigration is a bit of a hot potato but you must support his stance on child protection and free speech for example.

MojoMaker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896362#Comment_121896362

This is the bias bit Bobson......"disliking the conservative and boring design, the shoddy cheap interior, the lack of physical buttons and controls, the enormous depreciation, the horror stories about build quality and reliability etc."

You don't like Tesla, that may be the only "fact" here 🙂

Bobson Dugnutt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896404#Comment_121896404

Do you try and steamroll stuff about immigration and “wokeness” into every post you make?

Bobson Dugnutt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896407#Comment_121896407

It’s not that I don’t like Tesla. I don’t like Musk, he’s associated deeply with the brand, and that would influence my decision not to buy. Same as the other things I listed. They may be exaggerated, biased, no longer the case, but they are what they are. I do think they are as ugly as sin tbh, so that would rule them out for me as well.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896445#Comment_121896445

"I do think they are as ugly as sin tbh, so that would rule them out for me as well."

Valid reason not to buy any car, and I doubt anyone will dispute that with you.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896377#Comment_121896377

Who cares though. I wouldn't defense the Chinese government. There not a great bunch of lads.

That's the point. No ones here saying they are grand.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121896465#Comment_121896465

Enough people care to post why they wouldn’t buy a certain brand because of the CEO or the company actions so it seems that many do care about the actions of the board/CEO/Company of the car they buy.

Equally, nobody on this thread has actually stated Musk is grand either.

Red Silurian

I would say the thing that hurts Teslas brand most is that it is a successful Electric car company. The fact that the CEO is a bit nuts, like most CEO's, makes it a bigger target in the media. The media then for their part jump on him because of his association with Tesla

How many people think of Jamal Khashoggi when they fill their cars with petrol? But they see a Tesla and immediately think of Elon Musk?