Arcade Fire - 3Arena 31 August

Vinle

Because in SJW logic, women have no agency, are always the weak, helpless victims and always right whereas men are predators. No room for any grey areas or realistic appraisal of the situation which is that he was a creep and the women involved were naive

Still Ill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119558952#Comment_119558952

What did Conor Oberst do? Seems I've had quite the week with Arcade Fire Tuesday and Wednesday and Bright Eyes last night.

c.p.w.g.w

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119559732#Comment_119559732

He was accused of an assault but the "alleged victim" later stated it was a 100% fabrication

flasher0030

I was at the Wed night gig. I had presumed that the wife, Regine was the lady in the background playing the violin (I think). Cause I had read beforehand that there was no chemistry or communication at all between Butler and the wife on stage on Tuesday. Just out of curiosity, I googled her there. And saw that she has the big frizzy hair.

Am I right in saying so that the wife was the lady that was in the green sparkly dress? The main female singer. I presumed it wasn't her, cause I felt that there was plenty of communication between her and Win. And also, I thought it was an afro that was on her head!!!!

cheese sandwich

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119560052#Comment_119560052

Eh yeah. The woman on the violin was Sarah Neufeld.

TBH I didn’t think there was much interaction between Win and Regine, but then I don’t recall more at previous gigs. I suppose people weren’t scrutinising them in the same way before though - at times I felt there were some serious Fleetwood Mac vibes on stage!

jill_valentine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119559438#Comment_119559438

For one thing, because he was doing stuff he was explicitly told not to even by his own admission. In some cases he's describing the same events, he just doesn't think there's anything wrong with it - showing up after being told not to, sending explicit texts after you've been told not to, etc

Win Butler is an extremely intelligent guy, he knows 18-22 year olds are not on the same footing as a well loved 36-40ish celebrity. He knows there's a huge imbalance there. And we can see some of the reasons why here in this thread, where some posters were quick to claim all sorts about these girls motivations despite not even reading the article.

And again, he thinks it's a defence that he googled a girl's age. Which means he knew she was young enough for that to be in doubt, and carried on anyway. If my local postman was sending photos of his cock to girls who haven't been to their debs yet on the basis ah shur, he knew they were 18, I wouldn't be impressed either, it is not an especially high bar.

hynesie08

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119559498#Comment_119559498

Nah, it's cos he admitted it.

Vinle

He admitted the interactions happened but that in his view they were consensual. So who's to say who is right and who is wrong. Can it not be true that he was a creep AND they were a bit naive? Why does there always have to be a goodie and a baddie?

Jill, you frame it as "people who haven't even been to their debs", what proof do you have that they were still in high school? Could have just as easily been at university, like many others at that age. It can also be framed as "someone who can vote, drink alcohol, apply for a mortgage or loan, get a tattoo" and so on. All those things we know are facts so why are you zoning in on something you don't know to be true, I.e that they're still in high school

As for the postman analogy, I'd think he was a creep but I wouldn't be demanding he acknowledge it or explain himself to me nor would I be trying to get him fired from his job as postman

jill_valentine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119560052#Comment_119560052

She was, to be fair, giving it socks on Wednesday, though I heard otherwise about Tuesday. When people say there wasn't much communication between them though, it's a bit relative - it isn't/wasn't uncommon for them to jam together, share mics, two step or kiss onstage at previous shows, so I would say it was a little more... "professional" than I'd usually expect. Not too visibly, and not as dramatically as the distance from Sarah/Richard/Tim, but you wouldn't normally be left in any doubt they were the married ones.

Incidentally, Régine is multiracial, though most of her family are darker than she is, so you're not wrong about an afro.

Cheese Sandwich - it's funny you say that, Fleetwood Mac was the comparison in my group too.

Howard Beale

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119560136#Comment_119560136

There is a real irony to you saying 'where some posters were quick to claim all sorts about these girls motivations despite not even reading the article' as you keep banging on and on and on about Win being in his forties when all this happened but the article is very clear he was in his thirties. Doesn't make it better or anything but why lie incessantly about it?

Also you say ' If my local postman was sending photos of his cock to girls who haven't been to their debs yet on the basis ah shur' Do you really need to be so crass and vulgar? That's misandry in effect. I can guarantee you be crying misogyny if men were saying well she was sending pictures of her saggy old pussy to young 18 year old teenagers but it's perfectly fine for you to demonize men with vulgar talk of cocks etc. The double standards are staggering here!

But the lies hypocrisy and double standards don't mean diddly squat to you as you keep going on about Win being in his forties when the issues happened which is blatantly not true. 😎

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119560282#Comment_119560282

Send some unsolicited dick pics now to whoever you want and we'll see who is in the wrong

jill_valentine

He admitted the interactions happened but that in his view they were consensual. 

"I really hate sexting" -> Sexts anyway

"Don't come to my house." -> Goes to house anyway.

"This is not a sex thing for me" -> Treats it as a sex thing

Gosh, all these mixed messages!

Jill, you frame it as "people who haven't even been to their debs", what proof do you have that they were still in high school? Could have just as easily been at university, like many others at that age. It can also be framed as "someone who can vote, drink alcohol, apply for a mortgage or loan, get a tattoo" and so on. All those things we know are facts so why are you zoning in on something you don't know to be true, I.e that they're still in high school

This is rhetorical desperation. I never said they were literally in school, I said they were school aged, which is the point. She was young enough to be in school, which is fuckin young.

You want to squirm around what is technically legal for an 18 year old, as Butler did.

I don't care about that - the point of the thing is how young an 18 year old actually is, and it's Leaving Cert age. That's what we're talking about here. These are real people, he's a grown man who tours the world for a living, with a lot of sway, fame and fortune to his name, and he's creeping on girls who are exactly the same kind of 18 as any 18 year old you know.

Just in case though, let me clarify for you, if you're approaching your forties and think it's fine to send unsolicited dick pics to the 18 year olds in your life, it is not. And I'm not sure which reflects worse, if you'd actually put up with the postman doing it or you're just saying you would.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119560282#Comment_119560282

when describing the alleged victims as “naive” you fail to mention that Win Butler purposefully sought out/targeted women between the ages of 18-21 when he was in his mid to late 30’s.

Vinle

Keep going with the smears even when it has been said multiple times that he acted like a creep 😅 What do you mean "put up with the postman doing it"? In the unlikely event of me finding out that a postman did this, what do you expect is the right thing to do here? Take matters into my own hands?

Vinle

And I think he's a creep for that @Fanirish . Again, it can both be true that he was a creep and the women were naive "I decided I wanted to be friends even after he wanted sex" was what one of them said

jill_valentine

as you keep banging on and on and on about Win being in his forties when all this happened but the article is very clear he was in his thirties. Doesn't make it better or anything but why lie incessantly about it?

This kind of strain is going to give you piles.

Again, my posts are right there for people to read, so misrepresenting them is a waste of time.

Also you say ' If my local postman was sending photos of his cock to girls who haven't been to their debs yet on the basis ah shur' Do you really need to be so crass and vulgar? 

What happened was vulgar.

Your impulse to clutch your pearls when its described to you in real terms ought to be prompting a little more thought on your part, but I know you're just frustrated it makes it harder to pretend something more innocuous happened.

That's misandry in effect. I can guarantee you be crying misogyny if men were saying well she was sending pictures of her saggy old pussy to young 18 year old teenagers but it's perfectly fine for you to demonize men with vulgar talk of cocks etc. The double standards are staggering here!

Still on the aul' "making stuff up to argue with" kick then I see, ah maybe 8th or 9th attempt is the charm.

Vinle

Jill, to put your mind at rest- if I found out a friend was doing that I would have very very strong words as it *is* creepy. Would probably view him in a different light afterwards in all honestly, depending on circumstances. But as has been repeated multiple times, Arcade Fire or any other musicians are not our friends. They are strangers to us

The postman doing it, again as I said, I would see him as a creep but I also don't get involved in the personal lives of strangers, nor would I try to get him fired

Bit ageist and patronising of you to assume all 18 year olds are the same, some are immature, some aren't

Also: you have just assumed my age bracket and gender despite having no proof of either

MyPeopleDrankTheSoup

I think a lot of women would be shocked if they had a mind-reader on what their husbands/boyfriends find attractive, what they really find attractive, not what they say. society dictates that 40yr (or 50, or 60...) old men usually don't go for 18-25 aged women and obviously married men shouldn't be cheating anyway but the dichotomy between what is socially acceptable and what moves the head or gets the blood flowing can be shocking. your male body gets older and one day you're a dirty old man.

HalloweenJack

It's one thing to have those thoughts; it's something else to act on them, especially when you're married, especially when it's unsolicited (as the story suggests).

There's alot.about the allegations to be concerned about. The age difference, imo, is not the biggest concern, though I feel it's very naive to simply dismiss it as 'she's legal age'. There's a big gap in the lived experience of the two people involved; regardless of legality or consent or maturity, an 18yo simply does not know as much about people and the world as someone in their late 30s and the older party is going to know uow to manipulate (if that way inclined).

Vinle

For the millionth time, he acted like a creep. There is of course a huge gap between the lived experience of an 18 year old and a man in his 30s but there is no legislation for lived experience. If he didn't act illegally and the allegations are unfounded as yet what are people suggesting be done?

Is a Pitchfork article and Twitter now judge and jury?

circular flexing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119561520#Comment_119561520

The allegations might not be proven in a court of law but in the court of public opinion, I'm more inclined to not believe the person who has the most to lose.

In terms of what people want done, some genuine remorse from Win would be a good start, some acknowledgement from Regine that the victims are not lying, offering refunds to those who want them for the current tour (I think postponing it would be a better idea but that's not going to happen).

lordgoat

Let's leave it there, ye have both made the point a few times now.

and why is no one mentioning the fact this guys have turned into this generations Bon Jovi/Coldplay/ with a few gimmicks?

Same shtick now as 5 years ago and it really doesn't hit as hard.

Regine songs far stronger.

The encore on Wed night was as dull as an eagles concert condensed into 3 songs.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119561561#Comment_119561561

They aren’t looking for money. They didn’t report it at the time but they were taken advantage of by a hero of theirs.

He used his profile and position to get what he wanted.

I was there Tuesday and it was the first time I saw them. They put on a serious show. However, you could see that it’s not normal between him and Régine.

There mustn’t be many acts that can reach this level live which tells you how much they would miss it if it was gone and also how an audience could be fooled by a slightly lesser performance.

I believe the statement he issued was inadequate and dosent show him reflecting on the impact of his behaviour. I think it was a quick response fire fighting job. Sure he has supposedly been on the straight and narrow for two years. Why didn’t he come clean of his own before now?

I like their music but I wouldn’t say I am a massive fan. I regret not seeing them live more often in the past.

It’s not snowflake territory to expect the guy would properly address these victims concerns and make amends for it. He was way out of order as shown by four victims coming forward

MyPeopleDrankTheSoup

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119562944#Comment_119562944

gotta agree, even without the allegations, their time is up. the last album was shít. everything now was OK I thought.

it's a real band of the 2000s, their zenith was then and you could tell that by the average age on tuesday night.

lordgoat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119563147#Comment_119563147

Maybe a little hasty, like some songs are great for me - Sprawl II is head and shoulders above everything else. Reflektor as well, not an album favourite - but live it's a monster. I just have seen AF since Elec Picnic and a fair few times since and it's more or less the same formula. I mean musically (key change, key change and some call and answer ooooahhhhs), the gimmicks for each tour do change. Still waiting for someone to explain the Blowy-men and their version of Bez. But plenty seemed to love the show and that's great.

H8GHOTI

I think the new album is good. I like 6 of the songs on it.

Somewhat similar to previous albums in terms of how many tracks I like & how many I skip. But ya I guess I would say that the best songs on WE wouldn’t be as good as the best songs from earlier albums. Definitely not a sh!t album though.

RolandGoose

I am surprised that there is not more outrage over seated ticket prices being nearly 90e here, compared to 31.50 pounds for every date on their UK tour!

As the pitchfork story broke just a couple of days before the gigs, I'm inclined to think the poor sales is down to people drawing the line with concert prices. 100e plus becoming the norm to go to see a concert is absolutely ludicrous!

A poster a few pages back responded to me asking if I'd been to an arena gig lately, 100e a ticket is normal these days... It's outrageous imo! Hopefully it is only a matter of time before people put their foot down and say no more. The greed of performers, promoters et al is disgusting!

Vinle

Two nights was very ambitious even without the Pitchfork story, it was also very close to Electric Picnic. There was loads of cheap tickets going at the last minute for Malahide. Tickets are about £60 something in London by the way. Before fees, so not hugely different

RolandGoose

Glasgow is showing as 31.60 pounds. All the UK dates I looked at 2 days ago had tickets at 31.40, including London. Maybe they are pushing to shift tickets by reducing the price. Rotten company, platinum tickets is as dirty as it gets! Springsteen tickets are currently been sold for 480 pounds each, by Ticketmaster. Dispicable!

rogerywalters

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119558952#Comment_119558952

No but him being creepy isnt bolix at all. Hes admitted to enough.