Amnesty scheme for undocumented migrants in Ireland

olestoepoke

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574514#Comment_118574514

I think a party with a similar approach here in Ireland would do very well at the polls. At the moment the only parties willing to talk about immigration are the maniacs like Barrett and Gemma who the vast majority of us despise.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574609#Comment_118574609

Australia has proper policies in place for emigrating there. I'd have no issues in following their procedures.

I wasn't aware that they had race based policies in place for Asians and Pacific Islander minorities. I'll look into it, sounds awful though.......if true....🙃

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574609#Comment_118574609

I've lived 13-14 (ish) years abroad, including Australia and China. In every place I've lived I had a valid visa. With Australia, I had applied for residency, but due to a clerical error, I was refused due to the max applications being reached for the Queensland region.

So, I do understand the process involved, and it hasn't changed my mind. If people are suitable for that nation, then they will jump through the various hoops to get the legal recognition of the visa. Nations have the right to choose for themselves who is likely to be the fit for their culture.

That's not a far-right policy. It's simple common sense. Ensure that the native population are protected.

walkonby

.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574530#Comment_118574530

Agreed but unfortunately "Minister for Social Justice and Virtue Signalling" would probably be too close to the bone for her, Leo and the rest of the new generation of FGers.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574702#Comment_118574702

But see that's the issue... completely sensible and justified responses are now being labelled as "far right" by people who really should take a break from Twitter and the likes.

This is Ireland FFS.. we don't even have a "right" anymore, never mind a "far right" - just various shades of left. We need to stop importing the racial and identity politics and culture war issues of primarily the US and trying to paste it into a society where it has no relevance or fit - namely, ours!

Cyclingtourist

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118573398#Comment_118573398

Don't know about Tyrrellstown but the NCR (stretches from Pheonix Park to Five Lamps) and Dorset Street aren't 'turning into ghettos'. I know because I live in the vicinity of both.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574820#Comment_118574820

One person's "completely sensible and justified response" is another person's xenophobic reaction to inflammatory rhetoric.

We need to stop importing the racial and identity politics and culture war issues of primarily the US and trying to paste it into a society where it has no relevance or fit - namely, ours

And yet some here are advocating exactly that in their treatment of migrants

tommybrees

People getting rewarded for breaking the law is what it is.

Wonder if I stop paying the mortgage will the banks reward me by giving the house? Or will the government help, think we all no the answer.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574905#Comment_118574905

Nope. People are rightfully asking for controls and rules around immigration - or at the very least, respecting the ones we already have!

We are a small island on the edge of Europe with long-standing and in many cases worsening problems in healthcare, housing, costs of living, welfare costs, justice, rural/city inequality of opportunity and investment, and many others that we haven't been able to properly tackle through successive governments. We cannot afford to take on all the problems of anyone who rocks up in a plane, boat or shipping container.

We absolutely have a right to verify that such people have a legal basis for entry, can support that claim with the proper documentation and verification, and equally the right to reject anyone who doesn't meet that criteria or who abuses our hospitality while their application is processed.

This is OUR country. Immigration should be a benefit to our society, culture and economy - not just benefitting those who arrive or acting as a drain on those things - and we have a right to expect that those arriving will have skills we need, the ability to support themselves, and will respect our laws and culture.

If they can't/won't do those things, then back where they came from or let them try their luck elsewhere!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574975#Comment_118574975

Your rant has little to do with the topic at hand i.e. Amnesty for illegal immigrats.

What you are ranting about is stopping illegal immigration.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118575110#Comment_118575110

One and the same... one leads to the other and both need to be controlled at the point of entry subject to the criteria I outlined above.

But in regards to the amnesty, refer to my post a page or two back or to summarise for you.. its McEntee and co chasing Twitter likes and appeasing people for whom virtue signalling is more important than reality. She shouldn't be in office in the first place and certainly not implementing measures likes this for which there is no evidence of actual public support for but where that same public will be dealing with the consequences for decades to come.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118575110#Comment_118575110

You're deflecting. He answered your previous post, and you've just dismissed his response entirely.

He didn't rant. It was a measured and reasonable post without any emotional baggage attached.

Other nations have been dealing with immigration for longer than us, and the patterns of results is pretty well established. The same patterns happened in Germany, France, Denmark, etc.. but people like yourself would have us follow in the steps of these countries, who have come to the realisation that immigration carries a host of dangers.. but we should ignore all of that, just to show how open/fair we are. It's a ridiculous stance, and will result in a wide range of problems that Irish people will have to pay for.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574800#Comment_118574800

Is that not O Gormans job?

RobbieTheRobber

I'd ban the words deflection and deflecting from this forum. It only ever seems to be used when posters don't want to deal with the content of posters posts.

Oh someone will probably be along now to accuse me of deflection. 🤣

Spanish Eyes

We need a Red C poll on this issue and many others. Carefully worded not to lead one way or the other. Independently funded, how I don't know but no political involvement etc.

Seems that would be one way to gauge the views of the country, since it is a fait accompli with no evidence of public support, otherwise.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574609#Comment_118574609

when irish emigrate to Australia, we get our applications and visas sorted before rocking up at their border...so no we do not have to go through the same process. If an Irish person rocked up and claimed asylum at an Australian port should go through the "same process"

Someone else mentioned earlier in the thread that the amnesty is not going to be "once in a generation" thing and is more likely to be a regular occurrence every few years.

Here's hoping! 😊

Mr. teddywinkles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118575457#Comment_118575457

So absolutely no counter arguement just good feels.

I notice your the same guy advocating in the green policies forum about renewable as well.

It's all magic to you where resources comes from isn't it.

Pulled from someone's hole. In this case tax payers holes.

McHardcore

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118572434#Comment_118572434

You are attempting to re-frame your original post to be about illegal immigrants, when it was in response to to a post about Asylum Seekers.

Asylum seekers are not illegal. Your refusal to see the error after @bubblypop, @trashcan and myself corrected it is bewildering.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118575492#Comment_118575492

Did you want to argue with the xenophobia, bigotry and far-right nonsense? Knock yourself out

Meanwhile the world moves on, amnesty will be offered to thousands and the country will be better for it.

Some won't like it but then some folk are never happy unless they see others suffering.

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574463#Comment_118574463

Macron has copped on that Le Pen's support is not because loads of people in France have gone back to their Vichy ways, but that ordinary people are tired of the shyte, tired of Calais, tired of seeing priests and teachers decapitated in public.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574514#Comment_118574514

So have you given up on lecturing farmers about the environment and decided to lecture us here on open borders.

No wonder most people despise the greens.

Have you ever given any thought as to why populous parties and populous politicians have risen around the western world ?

I suppose it is because everyone suddenly became racist. 🙄

Ever thought that some of those populous ideas might actually be good ?

Why do some clowns nowadays think that peoples and states have no right to protect their own integrity ?

As someone said earlier if we take this notion to extreme then why lock you door and instead just let a bunch of freeloaders into your home to do as they wish.

Then again most of the proponents of these ideas never have to deal with the affects of all the freeloaders, they just make sure it is other less well off types that suffer so that they can get their social media likes for their ever so liberal agendas.

It is marvellous how many liberals are liberal with other peoples money and rights to services.

What was that old line about socialists giving away other people's money ?

But it is much more dangerous these days because not alone is it about giving away money today, it is giving away people's futures and right to safety.

jmayo

Anyone notice the ad appearing on their browser when in this thread.

It is a fooker advertising Irish Immigration advice.

Yep another of the migrant industry leeching off the Irish taxpayers.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118575583#Comment_118575583

No wonder most people despise the greens.

ROFL, another one blaming the Greens for something. What that has to do with anything I've posted is beyond me given the fact that I am not a GP member and have never voted for a GP candidate. 😊

Have you ever given any thought as to why populous parties and populous politicians have risen around the western world ?

I find that support for populist nonsense increases the lower the intelligence /education level achieved.

There's also a pretty clear correlation between the growth of extreme religious views and populism. Take a look at places making moves to restrict access to abortion and you're sure to find a populist govt that is shored up by extremist religion.

As I said, some have a need to make others suffer to make them feel better about themselves.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118575508#Comment_118575508

Nope, I've used the same language in all three posts. There was no reframing involved.

malinheader

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574415#Comment_118574415

Australia yes,big fan of the way they handle their emigration control.

I totally agree people should have their application heard before entering a country.

Pity our government don't give a damn and couldn't organize nothing on a scale like this.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118575457#Comment_118575457

OK, I'll play along... and these are genuine questions:

• Why are you hoping for this? What do you see as the positives/benefits - not just to the applicants but to our country and existing society?
• How do you expect that the additional demand on housing, healthcare, welfare, infrastructure etc will be funded and by whom? Over what timescale?
• Do you have concerns that this "wipe the slate clean" approach will encourage others to try to bypass/game the system in a similar way? If not, why not?
• Given that we are a small country with finite resources and lots of existing issues that we are struggling to deal with (as I outlined above) and bearing in mind the aforementioned additional demand on those resources, do you see any limits or conditions on this? If so, what are these? If not, why not?

Look forward to your answers!

hawley

In a briefing prepared for the department, they said a person had come into the restaurant to collect food, which was put into two normal containers used for takeaway items.

It said: “The waiter was getting another container when [an individual] went over to the fruit section, took a white bag and handed it to the waiter to put food in.

“The waiter said to [the individual] that this was not allowed by management. He said he did not care what management said and insisted the food be put into the bag.” 

The operators of the Eglinton Direct Provision Centre said they could “categorically state” that food is either served on plates or in plastic takeaway containers when requested by residents.

Their briefing said: “The food we provide for our residents is of the highest quality and standard. Our suppliers provide records of food tracing, and a HACCP [food safety management] system is in place with our chefs and kitchen staff.” 

They said the whole episode had been “staged” to cause trouble for them and that they would be happy to provide CCTV footage of what happened.

The viral sharing of the video caused consternation in the department, with one senior official expressing anger about how it had spread.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40797903.html

Events like these are used as "evidence" of awful, inhumane treatment in Provision.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118576431#Comment_118576431

So this is about asylum seekers in direct provision what is the link to undocumented hawley?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118576380#Comment_118576380

Why are you hoping for this? What do you see as the positives/benefits - not just to the applicants but to our country and existing society?

A more diverse population is never a bad thing. Right before covid unemployment in Ireland was just 4.9% in 2019, at that point its considered full employment. Simply put, we need more people to work in more jobs.

What you also find is the ones that come here are the ones that are less afraid of risk and are more likely to become business owners, entrepreneurs, than most.

There is also a massive body of research showing that migration has huge positive impacts on an economy and society

https://www.oecd.org/migration/OECD%20Migration%20Policy%20Debates%20Numero%202.pdf

https://www.bushcenter.org/catalyst/north-american-century/benefits-of-immigration-outweigh-costs.html

How do you expect that the additional demand on housing, healthcare, welfare, infrastructure etc will be funded and by whom? Over what timescale?

With or without inward migration, those demands exist. As for funding, items under the public service remit are funded through the central exchequer. Timescale? How long is a piece of string? Seriously. Take a look at the Metro, thats been coming for 2-3 decades at this point while silly projects like the WRC swallow whole swathes of public funding on an annual basis. Being honest I can find little rhyme or reason as to the sequence or scheduling of publicly funded infrastructure.

Now I will freely admit that more people = more demand, it would be silly not to, however the numbers you are talking about are negligible in the grand scheme of things and removing the equivalent of the population of Clonmel from Ireland would appear as little more than a blip in any graph charting demand.

Do you have concerns that this "wipe the slate clean" approach will encourage others to try to bypass/game the system in a similar way? If not, why not?

No I don't. Since the dawn of time there has been migration and there will always be migration. The US has had several amnesties over the years that many Irish have availed of, yet I don't see a stampede to go there every time they announce one.

There is also a lot who come for a set period than return home. I've known several over the last few decades who have come for 1-2 years to save up and then return home. Its a well known and documented phenomenon.

Given that we are a small country with finite resources and lots of existing issues that we are struggling to deal with (as I outlined above) and bearing in mind the aforementioned additional demand on those resources, do you see any limits or conditions on this? If so, what are these? If not, why not?

Not sure what you mean by "do you see any limits or conditions on this?". Can you clarify as I believe I've answered that above. Not sure if you mean something else

Now I've answered your questions, allow me to return the favour

1. What do you see as the negatives to our country and existing society?
2. How would stopping illegal immigration / not following through on the amnesty / deporting etc, address the demand on housing, healthcare, welfare, infrastructure? Given that the estimate from the govt is 17,000 you are talking about removing the equivalent of Clonmel from the country so I'm curious how that would, in any way, make any real difference to the 4 items listed.
3. Why are you so worried that this "wipe the slate clean" approach will encourage others to try to bypass/game the system in a similar way?