What part-if any-should Ireland play in the defence of Ukraine if Russia invades?

dxhound2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118503828#Comment_118503828

We are the new Skibbereen Eagle.

MFPM

You should perhaps read some history, it would help you add some objective critique to your rather one sided 'analysis'.

patnor1011

Every armchair general and call of duty enthusiast is free to volunteer in some of ukraine nationalist militia. They do have plenty of them with questionable ideology but that should not deter our internet warriors. They will be able to stick it up to russkies. Or not, but no doubt that rest of us will benefit simply by getting rid of crazies.

dxhound2005

This part of the world, and much of Central Europe is constantly redrawing borders. Sometimes Poland expands, or Ukraine expands, other times they disappear completely. So history does not stand still, and there should be no expectation in our time that this could not keep happening. Crimea is already back in Russian hands, having been part of Russia before.

patnor1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118503647#Comment_118503647

Yeah right. Highly motivated with what? EU do not want them, Nato is not really unified thinking they want them either.

Also somehow you failed to realize that one in 5 of ukrainians is actually a russian.

dxhound2005

Ukraine won the last war between Ukraine and Russia. But Poland won the last war between Ukraine and Poland.

patnor1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504562#Comment_118504562

Ukraine was always just a part of some other country like Poland, Lithuania, Russia... Even Mongols held it longer than any period of "independence" Ukraine actually existed/experienced.

delboythedub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118503209#Comment_118503209

And the 700000 lives lost on America's War On Terror. Human life loss means nothing to them

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504585#Comment_118504585

Same utterly bogus argument can be used to negate all rights to self determination of Ireland (or whatever country you come from most likely).

Amount of justification/excuse making for Putin/Russia and their droit du seigneur over neighbours that goes on in this forum is a bit sick making.

dxhound2005

There is no comparison between the ever shifting lines on the map in that part of the world, and the generally settled position for hundreds of years in Ireland and Britain.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504833#Comment_118504833

There are many things I'd consider Northern Ireland circa 1968 to 1998, but 'generally settled' is not one of them.

Gatling

We don't have large stock piles of surplus modern weaponary that could be sent to Ukraine, our best assets would be the ARW who could be deployed to help in a training role along side other foreign units ,

But in saying that we hide behind the UN and neutrality like it's some kind of magic shield.

Nato and the Baltics will have to do the bulk of any fighting ,it would be a massive mistake on putin to invade , because he won't stop at ukraine if he does ,

We seen what happened to Saddam's great army with it's millions of men and thousands of tanks ,one of the biggest militaries in the world, who had the same doctrine as russia , we're so big our enemies will just fall ,

But when the other army are better trained , equipped and have the ability to hit targets 24/7 365 huge armoured columns become grave yards pretty quickly

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504833#Comment_118504833

It is not settled for "hundreds of years" plural. The current still somewhat unstable setup has just turned 100 (roughly speaking).

The portion of Irish history with large parts of what is now Ireland under jurisdiction of the English Crown, then later the entire island an integral part of the UK / British Empire etc. is pushing towards an order of magnitude longer than our history as an independent nation state.

The other poster was taking about "the Mongols" and the middle ages etc. in ref. to Ukraine to argue it's not a real country/people. So setting the clock back a little and looking at the broad sweep of Irish history, we also have no right to self determination as a people and are a piece of the bigger island's "sphere of influence".

edit: Funny, I mentioned "this forum" making excuses for Russia's aggression towards Ukraine but was thinking of the Current affairs thread on it which was worse for that!

dxhound2005

Since WW2 the Soviet Union expanded then retreated, giving independence to many countries. Germany reunified. Czechia and Slovakia divided. Yugoslavia became six different countries. The Soviet Union granted Crimea to Ukraine, Russia took it back.

Up to now there was never a unified state on the island of Ireland, independent from Britain.

corner of hells

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118505288#Comment_118505288

Ah Jayzus , here we go .

BringingSexyBack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058228755/what-part-if-any-should-ireland-play-in-the-defence-of-ukraine-if-russia-invades

Russia has the gas pipes, so you might not hear a peep from Ze Germans and many of our Continental chums. Remember almost 10 years ago, things were dicey around that region and Russia, and The Irish farmers and exporters were worried about the price of wheat etc. .............

We shat ourselves when Russia fighter jets were acting the bollox getting close to Irish airspace and only for the British Airforce who knows what might have happen

We can do sweet FA - in any shape or form

Considering most of the world turned their backs on Ireland since 1918..................sod them

Examples of above - refusal to recognise Ireland as a sovereign State during the Versailles Peace Conference . Second example : UN refusing to intervene with NI despite the endless diplomatic campaign by Dr Paddy Hillery - they saw it as an internal matter for the UK - Only the European Court on Human Rights played any real role in the 1950-1970s to highlight the human rights abuse of Crown Forces and RUC .

Only through the EU , can Ireland offer anything constructive, as a total unit.

One poster made a good suggestion - offer asylum to those fleeing persecution

It might be a good excuse and chance to round up any commies and socialists in this country and eh, send them packing , one way or another. Wicklow Mountains could be a suitable location.

Other than that, we will bow to our Russian overlords.

JupiterKid

Well, we do have the iodine tablets if things really escalate...

...and these public service films on how to survive a nuclear attack might come in handy... ☢️ 💥 🤯🤯

...would be better entertainment than the Late Late. 😁

https://youtu.be/yNVMm2KpiDI

BurgerFace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058228755/what-part-if-any-should-ireland-play-in-the-defence-of-ukraine-if-russia-invades

I'd say we should do the same as we have done in the past. Let Russian troop carriers land at Shannon and refuel before they pulverise Kiev like we let American ones do so on their way to levelling Baghdad.

After that we can bitch about Ukrainian refugees arriving here.

BurgerFace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118498489#Comment_118498489

Good call, Einstein, and then let's forego the third of a billion quid's worth of imports from Russia and get them elsewhere for twice the price. Perhaps after we close the Russian embassy and they close ours in Moscow we can pay the Brits to represent Irish diplomatic needs in Russia. Then any cargo plane traversing Russian airspace and bound for Ireland full of cheap crap from Bangladesh or Beijing is subject to additional tariffs that need to be paid by the Irish Exchequer (i.e. YOU) and any fuel from Russia sold to Ireland is again subject to additional surcharges. Perhaps we pay a bit more for our communications that bounce off Russian satellites or ones that were put into orbit via Russian rockets.

But yeah, let's send Dimitry and his secretary Katarina, packing from their viper's nest in Ballsbridge.

Any more brainfarts?

kowloon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118503652#Comment_118503652

At what point would you say the rest of the world needs to step in and do something? Do we just let powerful nations eat up the small ones and turn a blind eye to atrocities?

BurgerFace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118500347#Comment_118500347

Isn't it just as disgusting that a Russian diplomat was beaten up by Dutch agents?

BurgerFace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118500410#Comment_118500410

But dumplings are nicer than Twinkies. Tschaikovsky sounds better than Cindy Lauper. Some of us want to be controlled by a superpower with a bit of panache.

BurgerFace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118501982#Comment_118501982

"Anyway, Russia has the capability to invade, but probably not the capability of occupying and quelling a guerilla force.!

I dunno. Apparently Russia invaded Crimea and had them all vote (against their will) to become part of Russia again. They [Russia] seem to be doing a good job at keeping the Crimean guerilla resistance movement at bay.

BurgerFace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118502929#Comment_118502929

Since the Russians defeated the Nazis and lost over 20 million of their citizens in the process perhaps we should be a bit more thankful to Joe Stalin. Putin is a tough guy but he ain't no Josef.

You see there are some people who care about the plight of others no matter who they are. I care about the Palestinian granny being booted out of her house at gunpoint as the bulldozers come in to level her house and Havi and Rebecca move in and look around and say "yes, our villa will be very nice here". But anyone who attends a demonstration against this, you will call a bunch of **** with their flags and posters.

Where were you when Iraq was invaded and occupied and ultimately destroyed. Afghanistan likewise or Libya? Are you saying that the people of Ukraine are more important to you than the people of Cuba or Venezuela? The butchery in East Timor at the hands of America and the Australians? Was that none of your business either?

Either they are ALL your business or none of them are your business. Don't pick one and blithely ignore a load of others Or is that going to be dismissed as "whatiffery"?

You also talk about neighbours, oh so caring. I hope you aren't referring to the British. So let's look at our closest neighbours.

The Dutch, French, Belgians, British, Spanish, Portuguese.....AHHH bollocks they're all good guys, feckit, I'm ranting. FCUK the RUSSIANS!

BurgerFace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118503516#Comment_118503516

If Russia could avoid a single casualty [that is if you believe the bullshit fantasy that they have any interest in invading Ukraine] wouldn't they just shut off gas, oil and electricity to Ukraine rather than send in a single tank?

"Yeah comrades...let's invade a country but continue to supply them with the resources to fight us back." ....and then some bright spark pipes up and says "Actually, why invade? Let's just cut off their energy supply and let them eat each other. Then we deliver them humanitarian aid. These sanctions that the West use seem to have a certain impact. Let's try them with the Ukrainian bastards"

HAHAHA!

BurgerFace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118503636#Comment_118503636

Don't underestimate the ability of an Irish person to defend his/her country from foreign aggression.

BurgerFace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504952#Comment_118504952

Since you're bloviating about whose dick is bigger and whose tanks are weaker and all that other adolescent crap, would not the smart money not be on the scummy Russians to not even bother with tanks and planes and just fire a barrage of ICBM's at Kiev, maybe the odd one with a nuclear payload? Not a single Russian live lost in combat or a tank burnt out. Just defeat. I mean you seem to think that Russia just wants to invade and/or obliterate Ukraine. So why would they waste time and fuels and energy and lives doing so? Why not just have a sub from Sevastopol spray Ukraine with a load of ballistic missiles?

You want to know why they don't? Because you are living in a fcuking comic-book world coupled to a video game and low-budget Chuck Norris movie. That's why.

riddles

The West should address Russian citizens directly and ask do they feel military aggression and further chaos is going to address any of their major problems?

climate change

Covid

pollution

food supply and affordability

employment

dealing with an ageing population

Housing

Calling out Putin’s small man syndrome and his BS deflection tactics as he is not winning domestically. Simply asking Russian citizens to reject his nonsense.

The EU is to a large extent culpable by pursuing half baked green solutions which ensure reliance on this clowns major stick.

Any aggression the West should disconnect Russia completely from IT economically - maybe the penny drops in Russia that nationalistic sabre rattling is a concept from the early to mid 20th century.

Freezing the foreign assets of Russian elites will test Putin’s resolve fairly quickly.

[Deleted User]

Question from someone (me) who can’t be bothered googling it -

What’s the difference between an incursion and an invasion?

migrant

Perhaps Ireland could manage to match the efforts that it put into defeating Naziism. Is that too high a bar?