Should we in Ireland be concerned about Jihad?

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118507502#Comment_118507502

Not for Christians anyway was what I was taught in school, by the Christian Brothers. Christ changed the old Testament / Bible to the new and everlasting covenant between God an Man for all time. Jews have a different take on it of course, and there are other groupings out there as well, who still follow the Old Testament, certainly Mohammad incorporated quite a lot of it in the Quran. But then why not? He was in close contact with a Christian Cleric in his early days, and learned a lot from him.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118507600#Comment_118507600

The new covenant, god this stuff is kooky.

I think your right catholics certainly don't believe all the old testament and i believe much of it is meant as allegory to them.

I do think some of the morality contained in the OT is still considered cannon though. At a very basic level I know the 10 commandments(there are actually over 600 commandments) are OT and still hold validity to all christians so its certainly not all just swept aside with the new covenant with Jesus.

There are of course many Christians who do hold that the OT is the literal word of God. Don't forgot the leader of the DUP briefly during last year is a young earth creationist. And they believe the story in genesis to be fact and have dated the earths creation to 3900 something BC.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118507600#Comment_118507600

Not for Christians anyway was what I was taught in school, by the Christian Brothers.

That was convenient 😂

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118508007#Comment_118508007

Ah yes,, the DUP..🙂 As for the New Testament Robbie. Jesus Said " I am the new and everlasting covenant between God and Mankind for all time " So it specifically cancels the old Testament and replaces it. So there you have it Robbie, literally from the Man himself. So feel free to accept it or not according to your own beliefs.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118508346#Comment_118508346

Well not literally from the man himself right jmreire?

For that to happen you would have to believe the Bible is the literal word of Jesus.

Which of course is impossible because I don't think he spoke Greek and I believe that is the language of the earliest new testament bibles.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118508583#Comment_118508583

Well for one thing, what we believe in, came from the 12 apostles who travelled with Jesus throughout his time on Earth, and they recorded it, after all they were the "People of the Book", so yes Christian's believe it to be true. Even the translations from the original language, I'm pretty sure that translators of that time were knowledgeable. Besides, its an article of faith, and Christians are bound by it. If you are not a Christian, or are an Atheist, then it does not really matter, does it??

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118509026#Comment_118509026

If one is not Muslim, there’s no reason to be concerned about Jihad either.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118509026#Comment_118509026

And as long as you're happy to believe all that jmreire sure that's all that matters.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118509345#Comment_118509345

Yup, Robbie, I'm fine with that, no conflict,🙂 I take you don't have similar view's Robbie, not that it matters one whit 😂

MarkEadie

I don't think there is any point in trying to debate logically with a religious person. They have already shown that they accept as fact, things that haven't been proven as a fact. These people will go to extreme lengths in order to support their irrational beliefs so conversing with them on an internet forum in an effort to have rational discourse is very much a complete waste of time.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118509831#Comment_118509831

Thats very much a discriminatory post Mark, I'd say.....something on the lines of discrimination based on sex, color, religion etc. So according to you, only non -believers / atheists etc. should post on Boards??? After that ,what's next Mark? Only dedicated followers of Sinn Fein, Labour, Fine Gael, Fianna Fail, Greens etc. ( Take your pic) may post on boards? Because between them they have produced a lot of irrational belief's.....and quite incredible though it may seem, people still vote for them, year after year.

Cordell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118509831#Comment_118509831

As a long time established atheist I tell you that you're dead wrong. Religious people are religious because of faith, not because of reasoning and logic, and you can't use logic to argue against the faith. And this is why with some faiths it's easier to convince people to blow themselves up, there is no reasoning and no logic behind it, only the faith that they are doing right by their prophet and they will get their reward in heaven - what is the logic behind 72 virgins, do you really want that? I would rather have just a couple of "experienced" ones :) but I'm not coming from a culture and faith that commands women.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118511835#Comment_118511835

Sure, regarding religious beliefs, a lot ( if not all ) depends on the society you are born into. If I was born in Saudi, then I'd be a Muslim, no discussion, but I was born in Ireland (more years ago than I care to count, but its a cast iron bet, that unless they invent a remarkable medicine ) I've past the half way point... LOL. So Born into a Catholic family ( as were most back then ) I am where I am religion -wise, and basically, I will go out the same door I came in. And I have no problem with that. Now if I wanted to change my religion, or leave all religion behind, become an Atheist, I can do it, and many have done exactly that, so its not a problem. Now with Islam, its not do straight forward, but that's for a different thread. But like you said Cordell, its question of faith. Either you believe it in which no "convincing " is required, or if a non-believer, no convincing is possible. And there you have it.🙂

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118509831#Comment_118509831

I strongly believe in God... and I'm very clued into logic. They're not mutually exclusive. TBH I find atheists more likely to embrace extremes to justify their positions.

I think the problem is that truly religious people believe... and so, you feel that you can never truly convince them. Hence the desire to discredit them. But then, I would say that science is often as much a religion as Christianity. A lot of reliance on belief... as opposed to hard evidence.

I don't have a lot of patience with formal religions (Catholicism, Islam, Judaism, etc) but there's little real difference between a religion and a faith.

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118507467#Comment_118507467

It’s US policy to cover up any civilian deaths, pretty much every single time you hear of the USA massacring civilians they initially denied it ever happened, only when overwhelming evidence comes to light do they finally admit what happened.

Ten of Swords

Mod - Do not discuss the ongoing Lisa Smith trial

jmreire

In war it happens that innocent people get killed, and the US is not alone in this. There are many other forces who do likewise, but without any kind of accountability. Before the Taliban advance and entry into Kabul, amongst the worst ever attacks took place in Kabul ( and for Afghanistan, that's saying something ) on an almost daily basis. These attacks continued during the withdrawal ( isis K making their presence known ) So yes, they were on high alert, its a well known fact that jihadi's /, suicide bombers / driving VBied's mingle with traffic and people and in this case, a mistake was made. I'm not condoning it, or trying to make excuses for it, just stating a fact. Its also a fact, that many such jihadi attacks were foiled and many lives saved by such actions as a vehicle being attacked and destroyed. But you don't hear too much about that.

hello how are you

I think we need to have a conversation about culture. I know this is impossible, as too much stupid people think criticising culture is racism, but it's a conversation we should have anymore.

There are aspects of muslim countries' culture which are not compatible with Ireland. The two obvious examples are the treatment of women and gays.

However you'll notice there have been no muslim terrorist attacks in Ireland yet. This is likely because we do not participate in the bombing of the Middle East.

But letting people who think women and gays are inferior or disgusting enter our country and walk around with complete freedom is simply waiting for trouble to happen. I'd much rather take a preventative approach and require all immigrants are questioned on their beliefs. I know they can lie, but it's a start.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118538781#Comment_118538781

However you'll notice there have been no muslim terrorist attacks in Ireland yet. This is likely because we do not participate in the bombing of the Middle East.

It's more likely to be related to population amounts, and the general lack of 2nd/3rd generational Muslims in Ireland (from modern immigration). We are simply behind the curve when it comes to immigration and subsequently the problems that comes from the children of migrants.

If terrorist attacks were linked to actions abroad, we'd likely have been attacked for our peacekeeping activities. A lot of people abroad do not welcome the involvement of the UN in their national affairs.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118538781#Comment_118538781

Islamic Jihadists have carried out attacks on Country's who like Ireland, haven't been involved in attacks in Muslim Country's. For extremist Islam, the fact that you are an unbeliever is enough, and where you are from is irrelevant. But how long that will last is anyone's guess. Mr Qaradawi, head of Clonskeagh Mosque is reputed also head of the Muslim Brotherhood, an organization banned in many Country's. To say that there has not been an terrorist attacks in Ireland, is not quite the same as saying that terrorist attacks have not been planned and facilitated in Ireland to be carried out else where. For sure that has happened, and the Guardai have several cases on file if you want to check it out, even here on Boards.

Relax brah

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118540073#Comment_118540073

do you mind sharing these please?

Fandymo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118538781#Comment_118538781

I'm sure the family of Yosuke Sasaki would dispute there being no Muslim terror attacks in Ireland. There have been none that haven't been swept under the carpet.

has anyone any statistics about the likelihood historically of dying in a Muslim attack in Ireland

has anyone any statistics on the number of Irish people going around thinking the wrong things about gay ppl or women

either strand seems like a strange tack to take to me to justify concern

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118543466#Comment_118543466

Search back through this thread, and you will find what you are looking for. The incidents have been mentioned several times.

hello how are you

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118544128#Comment_118544128

I don't think that attack was motivated by religion or culture though, but rather a severely mentally ill homeless man.

Fandymo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118545722#Comment_118545722

Yeah, the whole screaming Allah hu Akbar while attacking multiple people was coincidence? Strange how no mentally ill people say Hail Mary or Amen when attacking people.

hello how are you

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118546116#Comment_118546116

I'm not denying he's a muslim, I just think in this case it was a severely mentally ill psycho.

As a comparison, Osama Bin Laden was not a nutter. He was a psycho though...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118547260#Comment_118547260

As a comparison, Osama Bin Laden was not a nutter. He was a psycho though...

Was he though? He believed in his cause and orchestrated events to support the cause he followed. That's not being a psycho, no more than Patton was a psycho, or Churchill was one. These are ideologically driven people. You can disagree with their views, but that doesn't mean that they were psychopaths.

Ideology is important... and religion can be a strong aspect of an ideological belief system. Muslims tend to be very devout, with their religion being a central part of their motivations for doing just about anything. It's not the same as modern Christianity, or pretty much any modern western ideological movements.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118544149#Comment_118544149

Well snoopsheep,,,, the issue is that world wide there has been many Islamic Jihadi attacks...too many, in fact. And these figures are available , ask Google. So you can ask will we have the same experience as other Country's, or will we be different from them, and if you say that, "No, we will never see an Islamic Jihadi attack in Ireland." Then what would make Ireland different from other Country's that have in some cases suffered many such attack's?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118548714#Comment_118548714

thanks I can Google

that's why I was asking specifically about Ireland as this is a thread where it would seem relevant

apart from saying "oh it might" was there anything else?