Should we in Ireland be concerned about Jihad?

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118491271#Comment_118491271

A chunk of the problems in the Middle East do come out of interference from Western states, but trying to lay all the blame on them is rather myopic.

The results of the Arab spring in Egypt highlighted the issue where if the people are allowed pick their own government a hell of a lot of them pick right wing islamists.

They are not interested in democracy ala the West which means secularism and a division between religion and the state.

What happened when Saddam was removed by the US and it's coalition is yes in some part due to the limited thinking of the US and UK, but also due to the tribalism that still exists in the Middle East.

The US's limited thinking was not understanding all Arabs are not the same, all muslims are not the same, all Iraqis that hated Sadam are not the same.

Something often highlighted by some posters around here (particularly the "not all muslims" posters) is that the vast majority of people killed by islamists are islamic.

That is indeed true, a lot of the people killed in Afghanistan or Iraq were killed by fellow muslims, all because they believed in a different or less strict brand of islam, or because they just wanted to get on with their lives and try make the best of their country and thus worked with the coalition forces.

The narrative by some is that the Americans are responsible for hundreds of thousands of dead civilians when the truth is a huge chunk of them were slaughtered by their countrymen.

Oh yes one can argue that these people wouldn't have been killed if the Americans hadn't invaded.

But from my knowledge of Afghanistan they were killing each other long before uncle Sam showed up and they were killing each other without the assistance of the US.

Likewise Iraqis were killing each other before the Americans got to Bagdad.

Trying to claim that things like islamist terrorism and incidents like taharrush gamea have nothing to do with islamic beliefs and islamic based cultures is ridiculous.

Maybe 5 years ago I saw some footage from an early 2000s (post-9/11) documentary, pretty sure it was BBC. Interviewed Muslims on the street, some of whom later got locked up. Anyway, one of their reasons for hating Britain were NATO's actions in the Balkans and their killing of Muslims in Yugoslavia in the 90s. That's the kind of politics involved in jihad.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118491495#Comment_118491495

in the same way that you explain Irish terrorism by blaming the British in northern Ireland🙄

Glock17

Just look at the amount of honour killings that happen within the Islamic community... if people are willing to kill sisters and daughters they arent going to feel bad about killing infidels...

I've read there are about a dozen honour killings in the UK a year. How many British muslims go back to pakistan and are killed? Hundreds?

Glock17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118491446#Comment_118491446

In WW2 german cities were fire bombed and millions died. The yanks dropped nuclear weapons on two japanese cities.

You never hear about German or Japanese terrorism though?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492173#Comment_118492173

How many are there? Can you post some links?

In India there are a massive amount of honour killing also.

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492199#Comment_118492199

You must be having a laugh.

Glock17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492220#Comment_118492220

There seems to be a few links online that say there are a dozen honour killings a year in the UK...

I'd guess in pakistan it must be thousands a year (if not tens of thousands).. I've read that a lot of women have "accidents" where they get killed in a cooking fire....

I'd honestly think a lot of muslim women that get sent back to pakistan are getting killed....

It's absolutely horrific.

Glock17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492241#Comment_118492241

No?

Your argument is that terrorism is a reflection of wars in the Middle East? I'm just saying that we never had similar terrorism from germany or japan after WW2.

Your argument seems to lack merit.

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492025#Comment_118492025

I never said all the problems in the middle east are because of the west I was explaining why terror attacks actually happen, it has little to do with religion.

Western media paint this picture mainly focusing on religion and people twisting the words of the quran as the reasoning people have for committing these attacks, which is simply not true, they generally hide the real reasons these terror attacks happen which is to put pressure on the governments and brings attention to western action in the middle east, here's a quote from an interview by Al Jazeera of one of the 7/7 bombers.

''I and thousands like me are forsaking everything for what we believe. Our drive and motivation doesn't come from tangible commodities that this world has to offer. Our religion is islam, obedience to the one true God and following the footsteps of the final prophet messenger. Your democratically-elected governments continuously perpetuate atrocities against my people all over the world. And your support of them makes you directly responsible, just as I am directly responsible for protecting and avenging my Muslim brothers and sisters. Until we feel security you will be our targets and until you stop the bombing, gassing, imprisonment and torture of my people, we will not stop this fight. We are at war and I am a soldier. Now you too will taste the reality of this situation''

The people who commit these atrocities are devout Muslims there's no doubt about that but to say that they commit these attacks solely out of religious belief is nonsense, if it wasn't for these terror attacks nó one in the west would give a s*** about what their governments are doing in the middle east.

Harryd225

The media paint some picture of islamist extremists quoting verses from the quran as the main reason these attacks happen as a way to stop people from seeing the real reason.

Not to stop people like me and you from understanding the reason but to stop other young Muslims from understanding the ideology of why people do this in case it makes sense to them and then gains support for the cause of the terrorists.

I used to have the exact same thinking as a lot of the people on this thread, ten years ago I was a bit of a bigot to be honest I used to blame the Muslim religion and people taking it too literal as the reason these things happen, it was only when I gained far more knowledge on world conflicts and started reading up on it more did I realise it had little to nothing to do with that.

Harryd225

Anyone who thinks Islam is the cause of these terror attacks can you please tell me which terror attacks in the west were caused by religion and not western interference in the middle east?

It's hilarious people see things so straight forward, they really don't believe there's any more to anything than the narrative we are fed in the media.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492120#Comment_118492120

In the Balkans, it was NATO who kept all three protagonists apart with their safe zones. Alia Izetbegovic the Bosnian president, did get a lot of support from the Saudi Arabia in the form of cash, and Mujahideen Fighters though. Some of whom never went home, and have been active in propagating Wahhabism there ever since.

Glock17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492676#Comment_118492676

Sweden hasn't been involved in the Middle East... they've still had terror attacks...

Fandymo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492676#Comment_118492676

Charles Hebdo was because of a drawing.

The beheaded teacher was because a student lied about him drawing Muhammed.

Relax brah

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492676#Comment_118492676

I don’t know if this is a real question or if you are trolling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492286#Comment_118492286

Right so you have no links to anything you say here. You post all sorts of things, you remind me a bit of Donald Trump

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492115#Comment_118492115

I wouldn't have thought the old Serbs would be fans of Nato, after all they forced them to stop in Bosnia and then there is Kosovo.

I suppose they probably hate Australia more now than Nato. 😯

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118493686#Comment_118493686

Yeah but the Serbs are not Muslim. Don't know where that poster came up with that crazy post

Glock17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118493310#Comment_118493310

Tbh, I really dont know what you want me to prove?

Everyone knows there are honour killings within the islamic community..

wikipedia says there are 5000 women killed a year in pakistan in domestic violence....

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violence_against_women_in_Pakistan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118494171#Comment_118494171

Well domestic violence isn't honor killing.

Also, honor killings take place in many different cultures around the world. In particular India, which is majority Hindu. So not at all restricted to the Islamic community.

Cordell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118495239#Comment_118495239

Also, honor killings take place in many different cultures around the world

Except for the western culture - shall we keep it so, or enrich it with these regressive traits? Or maybe it's already too late to be asking such a question?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118495452#Comment_118495452

You do know murder is illegal in every country of the world? Why would you think that we would start to commit honour killings?

Cordell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118495546#Comment_118495546

"We" well that is an interesting word. Does "We" means we the people of Europe which now include people, incidentally all of muslim heritage, that DID commit honor killings? Or does "We" only include white christian europeans? I'm getting some mixed signals here.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118495600#Comment_118495600

No mixed signals. We, are western culture, that you brought up. Merely answering your inane posts.

Cordell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118495627#Comment_118495627

Right, so are you saying that we the western culture will keep our superiority even when next door we will have people from an inferior culture that does honor killings. Or are you saying that the inferior culture will be elevated by its exposure to "WE"?

In case you got confused: here, WE, in our Europe, we have people that respond to jokes with mass murder, that kill youngsters, that kill their own when they perceive dishonor, that mutilate young girls. And what, we should be contempt because there is some bad sht also happening elsewhere in India?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118495662#Comment_118495662

People commit crimes everywhere. Every person can commit crime.

Glock17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118495239#Comment_118495239

Oh sorry, I wasn't aware we had a problem with Hindu jihad?

I was just making the point that if muslims are willing to kill family members they aren't going to have much problem with killing infidels....

A lot of muslim women are killed for becoming too western....

Glock17

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118496060#Comment_118496060

Are you being obtuse? When was the last time a non muslim went into a music concert and killed 20 kids?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118496381#Comment_118496381

Lots of people kill others. Not just Muslims. Lots of other cultures have honor killings also. So, proving nothing

You just keep making statements, lots of Muslim women, lots of honour killings, nothing to back up anything you say, Donald