Black people Racism in Workplace in Ireland

KyussB

I mean, I would judge the hysterical claims of white people being censored and of racism - by pointing out the lack of first-hand accounts from black people, in a thread about racism towards black people - as being absurd victimhood - especially given the complete absence of any attempt to shut down peoples views. Ya though, best left there - it's been absurd enough...

AndrewJRenko

Swindled wrote: »

One in our workplace, one who got Irish citizenship through Asylum, regularly flashed around the offices his walled mansion under construction he's building in his hometown thanks to his Irish job. You can't blame these people personally for playing along the wide open system, few people would not in their situation, but let's not pretend what this situation is.

Fair play to him for managing to fund development of a mansion, on an Irish salary, while living in Ireland.

Looks like it's not just black Africans that experience racism here.

https://www.thejournal.ie/asian-hate-ireland-5449600-May2021/

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

You're acting out of disingenuous 'concern', to try and smear me as racist - for pointing out that 'maybe' people shouldn't be coming to sweeping conclusions/judgements about the experiences of black people, absent the presence/contribution of the actual views/experiences of black people on this thread.

To present that as racist is fucking absurd and disingenuous.

After a brief look, you have a history of flippantly throwing the 'racist' accusation around on this forum when it does not apply - except you are the only one who has used racist/bigoted terms and gotten in trouble for that, on this forum.

Based on your disingenuous style of posting on all race related topics, it seems to me like you're trying to tilt the narrative in a racist direction - and you've got the posting history to show it.

What bigoted and racist terms have I used and in which context have I used them?

Remember now, you explicitly said that NO black people have commented here, based on nothing else other than the fact they haven't declared their ethnicity and I can only assume that the reason you said that, is that the words people have used don't sound like black people.

And then you tell people they shouldn't use sweeping accusations.

I do not flippantly throw around the word racist, in fact, my whole point in my posting history is that people throw it around too flippantly and dilute actual racism which I feel is heavily damaging.

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

Again, you're making up stuff that I never said here. Suddenly pointing out the absence of views/experiences from black people, in a thread about the experiences of black people in Ireland - is an attempt to "shutdown others opinions, by claiming the need for black peoples opinions, before that of white people".

That's a load of disingenuous bollocks. Fake concern about a non-existent attempt to 'shutdown' others views.

Nothing is stopping anyone from stating their opinions. Noting the lack of contributions from anyone with first-hand experience of what the topic is about, is relevant to the thread and does fuck all to stop anyone expressing their views.

The point is, you have absolutely NO IDEA how many opinions you've read were non black.

You are being biased to assume otherwise.

It's a little racist to assume ethnicity based on their opinion and nothing else.

KyussB

I've used reasonable checks to ask and verify that nobody posting is black - and I'd be more than happy to be proven wrong about that, as then the first hand points of view I think the thread would benefit from, from black people (since it's their experiences that the topic are about), would be available.

You have a problem with the entire concept of pointing out the lack of first-hand views. Your attempts to portray that as racism, are bizarre smears - when only you have gotten in that kind of trouble, for using racist/bigoted terms, here - you are lying about the content of my posts, to manufacture racism accusations.

I intended to make one post on this thread, pointing out that lack of first hand views, leaving it at that - and your constant attempts at smearing, are dragging that across multiple pages - and have ended discussion on the thread.

If you keep falsely accusing me of racism, I'm going to be reporting your posts.

Kermit.de.frog

hawley wrote: »

People coming here as asylum seekers need to be supported

99% of them need to stop coming here in the first place according to Michael McDowell.

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

I've used reasonable checks to ask and verify that nobody posting is black - and I'd be more than happy to be proven wrong about that, as then the first hand points of view I think the thread would benefit from, from black people (since it's their experiences that the topic are about), would be available.

You have a problem with the entire concept of pointing out the lack of first-hand views. Your attempts to portray that as racism, are bizarre smears - when only you have gotten in that kind of trouble, for using racist/bigoted terms, here - you are lying about the content of my posts, to manufacture racism accusations.

I intended to make one post on this thread, pointing out that lack of first hand views, leaving it at that - and your constant attempts at smearing, are dragging that across multiple pages - and have ended discussion on the thread.

If you keep falsely accusing me of racism, I'm going to be reporting your posts.

Again, what racist bigoted terms have I used? And in what context?

Slightly unfair to claim that I use those words or terms and leave it hanging like an open accusation.

I am not calling you racist. I am merely letting you know that it is undeniably racist to assume someone's colour by their posting style.

The claim you have made "reasonable checks" is laughable. Asking for black people to identify themselves and when they dont, claiming it as proof that everyone is white is a little condescending and presumptuous.

And claiming that I have ended discussion? YOU were the one who attempted to shut down discussion by baselessly alluding that it was an all white echo chamber.

KyussB

And I've stated many times, that portraying my posts as assuming based on posting style is wrong, and that knowingly-false statement about my posts is a smear.

Don't speak for or paraphrase me again - only ever quote my posts - you've made misleading statements and outright lies about my posts several times, and your post again is doing this.

I do not believe your 'concern' here is genuine, I believe you are against the entire concept, of pointing out the lack of first-hand views from black people in the thread - that no matter what method of verification/checks are used, that you will always try to smear it.

Now - we're not discussing the topic - I'm batting down what I view as a smear against me, and you keep coming back to it - dragging us in circles. We aren't saying anything new - I want to leave it there.

Ash.J.Williams

KyussB wrote: »

And I've stated many times, that portraying my posts as assuming based on posting style is wrong, and that knowingly-false statement about my posts is a smear.

Don't speak for or paraphrase me again - only ever quote my posts - you've made misleading statements and outright lies about my posts several times, and your post again is doing this.

I do not believe your 'concern' here is genuine, I believe you are against the entire concept, of pointing out the lack of first-hand views from black people in the thread - that no matter what method of verification/checks are used, that you will always try to smear it.

Now - we're not discussing the topic - I'm batting down what I view as a smear against me, and you keep coming back to it - dragging us in circles. We aren't saying anything new - I want to leave it there.

You’re a disgrace to Kyuss

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

And I've stated many times, that portraying my posts as assuming based on posting style is wrong, and that knowingly-false statement about my posts is a smear.

Don't speak for or paraphrase me again - only ever quote my posts - you've made misleading statements and outright lies about my posts several times, and your post again is doing this.

I do not believe your 'concern' here is genuine, I believe you are against the entire concept, of pointing out the lack of first-hand views from black people in the thread - that no matter what method of verification/checks are used, that you will always try to smear it.

Now - we're not discussing the topic - I'm batting down what I view as a smear against me, and you keep coming back to it - dragging us in circles. We aren't saying anything new - I want to leave it there.

Leave it there all you like.

The fact is, your post made an assumption that nobody that has posted on this thread was black.

You then claimed to have carried out reasonable checks (one post requesting that black people identify themselves as such).

You then go on to say that you believe I am against pointing out that no black people have posted? What?

I am simply against you deciding that no black person has posted here because they haven't declared their ethnicity. Because it's a wildly inappropriate and inaccurate claim.

I have no concern. I am merely pointing out how ridiculous your claim is and how it could be perceived as racist.

Now obviously you don't like that being pointed out because your initial post was an attempt to virtue signal and white knight which has backfired horrifically.

I haven't lied once about you. Everything I have posted about you has been based on your posts and I have highlighted which ones.

You conversely alluded to have checked my posting history and stated I use racist and bigoted language. When I have asked twice to give me examples of their use and context, you have declined.

I assume that my questions are covered in what you regard as reasonable checks so can only come to the conclusion that you don't have any.

Back on topic though,. Black people due to positive discrimination are undoubtedly in a better position within the workplace than ever before. Diversity quotas certainly skew the dynamic. I wonder though will this increase the levels of actual racism in society as people will undoubtedly think that meritocracy is being replaced with tokenism.

It will also have an effect on people of colour as it can't be good to feel you may only be hired because of your ethnicity and not your ability.

KyussB

I think it's pretty hysterical and extreme to take such a nonsensical stance, of declaring someone as racist, for pointing out the lack of first-hand views from any black posters - you're manufacturing a ridiculous/stretched-beyond-breaking-point claim there.

Nobody believes your 'concern' there is genuine - give it a bloody rest already.

Again - you are the only poster who has gotten in trouble for using racist/bigoted terms. Not me. Making it even more ridiculous for you to try and accuse anyone of racism. You're a hypocrite and your posts are disingenuous - and you're guilty of the very thing (shutting down discussion) that you tried to accuse me of.

Now can you end this stupid series of posts?

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

I think it's pretty hysterical and extreme to take such a nonsensical stance, of declaring someone as racist, for pointing out the lack of first-hand views from any black posters - you're manufacturing a ridiculous/stretched-beyond-breaking-point claim there.

Nobody believes your 'concern' there is genuine - give it a bloody rest already.

Again - you are the only poster who has gotten in trouble for using racist/bigoted terms. Not me. Making it even more ridiculous for you to try and accuse anyone of racism. You're a hypocrite and your posts are disingenuous - and you're guilty of the very thing (shutting down discussion) that you tried to accuse me of.

Now can you end this stupid series of posts?

Lol.

Popping up to accuse me of using racist/bigoted terms (and for a third time not providing proof or context) then asking me to stop responding?

And for the last time, you did NOT point out lack of first hand views from black posters. You simply assumed people weren't black.

And again, I have no "concern". I've not been hysterical or extreme.

You do have a habit of making assumptions.

Now, you can leave it there.

Back to the point though, some of the most racist people I have ever met have been non -white. It's purely anecdotal on my behalf but in two separate jobs I have had, the three Indian people I worked with would often call my black colleague the "n" word behind his back and in the second job, there were four black people who would use derogatory words for the couple of Asian guys on the team.

It's far more common in my experience to have white people who go overboard in "inclusivity" to the extent where the people of colour feel patronised.

And before "anyone" accuses me of being a racism denier, I am not denying racism exists. I just don't think it's as common as the media would like us to believe.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Back on topic though,. Black people due to positive discrimination are undoubtedly in a better position within the workplace than ever before. Diversity quotas certainly skew the dynamic. I wonder though will this increase the levels of actual racism in society as people will undoubtedly think that meritocracy is being replaced with tokenism.

I think it could manifest actual direct racism due to the fact that none of us like being sidelined for others, especially when positions become scarce (due to the coming recession). It really depends on how far the government wishes to push this.

I figure we're seeing an end to the woke culture that began in the US elevating minorities (Black people in particular, but women also, as part of feminism). Go woke go broke is definitely a thing, and there's a growing pushback against this philosophy of elevating certain groups over others, all in the misguided notion of promoting equality.

It will also have an effect on people of colour as it can't be good to feel you may only be hired because of your ethnicity and not your ability.

This I wouldn't actually agree with. Most Black people I know are aware of the advantage they have in a western society, and don't think much of it. It's accepted as a counter for the possibility of facing racism.

People take the advantages presented to them, and don't think much of it. We've had years of a wide range of preferential treatment being extended to women in society, and I haven't seen any women complaining that they felt it was inappropriate.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I figure we're seeing an end to the woke culture that began in the US elevating minorities (Black people in particular, but women also, as part of feminism). Go woke go broke is definitely a thing, and there's a growing pushback against this philosophy of elevating certain groups over others, all in the misguided notion of promoting equality

Hopefully If I have to do many more company mandated diversity, inequality, micro-aggressions training courses I'll crack up.....

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Back to the point though, some of the most racist people I have ever met have been non -white. It's purely anecdotal on my behalf but in two separate jobs I have had, the three Indian people I worked with would often call my black colleague the "n" word behind his back and in the second job, there were four black people who would use derogatory words for the couple of Asian guys on the team.

I think it depends on where you are. In France, I'd often see white French people expressing racist sentiments towards the Black people in their society. The same in Germany and Russia... with Italy being possibly the worst for how common it was.

That's not to say that I haven't seen Black or Asians being racist. I have.

IMHO, racism is pretty damn common among all racial groups. However, European society is one of the few groups of societies that seeks to punish those expressions, and educate/condition it's population to be against it. And so most people keep any racist thoughts to themselves, knowing that to express them, risks public censure. Still it really depends where you are.

It's far more common in my experience to have white people who go overboard in "inclusivity" to the extent where the people of colour feel patronised.

I'd suggest that's more of a US (and UK/Commonwealth) thing. I've seen very little demand for inclusivity from the European mainland, except when the governments speak.

And before "anyone" accuses me of being a racism denier, I am not denying racism exists. I just don't think it's as common as the media would like us to believe.

I would feel that genuine racism (as in hate or contempt/superiority) isn't that common. However, when you talk about racism you can quickly find that racism includes all manner of minor things which could easily have been something else. As with most things these days, it's been expanded so much that people can claim racism for just about anything under the sun. With the claims of subconscious bias, that goes even further now. Those activists (as did the US Black community) and outrage queens, expanded the term so that they will always have some kind of basis for their claims.

Oh.. I know I'll get killed for saying this, because victims are always blameless to some.. but I'd say that many Black people (and others) go looking for attention.. and depending on how that behavior manifests, it can easily encourage others to be racist against them. Ever had a Black guy call you the N word? Ever watched how many Black guys treat women? Or how Black women often aggressively mouth off to others? Black culture can be extremely aggressive and "in your face".. which is bound to make others respond negatively. Whether that response is simply in thought or action is another matter. Personally, I tend to avoid such concentrations of Black people because I don't enjoy what goes on...

KyussB

Deleted User wrote: »

...
Oh.. I know I'll get killed for saying this, because victims are always blameless to some.. but I'd say that many Black people (and others) go looking for attention.. and depending on how that behavior manifests, it can easily encourage others to be racist against them. Ever had a Black guy call you the N word? Ever watched how many Black guys treat women? Or how Black women often aggressively mouth off to others? Black culture can be extremely aggressive and "in your face".. which is bound to make others respond negatively. Whether that response is simply in thought or action is another matter. Personally, I tend to avoid such concentrations of Black people because I don't enjoy what goes on...

At what point do you think generalizations about a group cross a line? Some of what you says there is caveated to not be applied to a majority - but some of it, like the last sentence, is more ambiguous. Not saying that crosses a line - it leaves it unclear where you'd draw the line, though.

I recall another post (not this thread) where you discuss a majority of nations with black people not having moved past their colonial history, as evidence of a 'victim complex' among black people (due to referencing 80-year-past colonialism, for these countries more recent and current ills).

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

At what point do you think generalizations about a group cross a line? Some of what you says there is caveated to not be applied to a majority - but some of it, like the last sentence, is more ambiguous.

I think in an online discussion, generalisations are unavoidable.. unless you want to stutter the entire discussion, and even then those who object to generalisations will still be unhappy.

As for the last sentence, ever been to a nightclub where the majority are Black? In any case, it's hardly ambiguous since I gave three examples (in that paragraph) of things I didn't like.

I recall another post (not this thread) where you discuss a majority of nations with black people not having moved past their colonial history, as evidence of a 'victim complex' among black people.

Context. I realise that you struggle with it's importance but it is actually very important. Should I be remembering what you've written in other threads and taking them out of context? You won't like it much.

KyussB

This post:
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=114699222

Generalization may be needed, but where do you draw the line on when a generalization starts to cross a line into not being ok? Am I interpreting the last sentence in your post that I referenced above, as being that you avoid concentrations of black people? (is that avoiding a majority of black people?)

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

This post:
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=114699222

Excellent. You've just shown why context is so important, and how your memory was inaccurate.

Generalization may be needed, but where do you draw the line on when a generalization starts to cross a line into not being ok? Am I interpreting the last sentence in your post that I referenced above, as being that you avoid concentrations of black people? (is that avoiding a majority of black people?)

I avoid large groups of Black people under certain circumstances, like a nightclub, bars, or house parties. Oh.. and before you go nuts on this, I lived and worked (as a volunteer) in Africa when I was younger.. so.. no.. don't go reading too far into what I wrote trying to connect it to me being racist. I simply don't like the culture and behavior of many Black people, so I avoid it.

As for generalisations crossing the line... nah. The generalisations aren't what crosses the line. It's the content of the sentence. The meat of it. Unless, someone is intentionally using a generalisation to trigger a response.. which tends to be rather obvious.

Now... are you going to discuss racism.. and the thread.. or continue trying to push buttons?

Ten of Swords

thedunne and KyussB give it a rest, can we move the thread on please rather than having a back and forth match between the two of you

KyussB wrote: »

I intended to make one post on this thread

Nobody is forcing anyone to post, if you can't find any common ground but don't see any point in further arguing then put each other on ignore

Cal4567

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I think it depends on where you are. In France, I'd often see white French people expressing racist sentiments towards the Black people in their society. The same in Germany and Russia... with Italy being possibly the worst for how common it was.

That's not to say that I haven't seen Black or Asians being racist. I have.

IMHO, racism is pretty damn common among all racial groups. However, European society is one of the few groups of societies that seeks to punish those expressions, and educate/condition it's population to be against it. And so most people keep any racist thoughts to themselves, knowing that to express them, risks public censure. Still it really depends where you are.



I'd suggest that's more of a US (and UK/Commonwealth) thing. I've seen very little demand for inclusivity from the European mainland, except when the governments speak.



I would feel that genuine racism (as in hate or contempt/superiority) isn't that common. However, when you talk about racism you can quickly find that racism includes all manner of minor things which could easily have been something else. As with most things these days, it's been expanded so much that people can claim racism for just about anything under the sun. With the claims of subconscious bias, that goes even further now. Those activists (as did the US Black community) and outrage queens, expanded the term so that they will always have some kind of basis for their claims.

Oh.. I know I'll get killed for saying this, because victims are always blameless to some.. but I'd say that many Black people (and others) go looking for attention.. and depending on how that behavior manifests, it can easily encourage others to be racist against them. Ever had a Black guy call you the N word? Ever watched how many Black guys treat women? Or how Black women often aggressively mouth off to others? Black culture can be extremely aggressive and "in your face".. which is bound to make others respond negatively. Whether that response is simply in thought or action is another matter. Personally, I tend to avoid such concentrations of Black people because I don't enjoy what goes on...

Really good post, thanks. I have worked in the US, the UK and France. Experienced a lot of what you describe here.

jmreire

Cal4567 wrote: »

Really good post, thanks. I have worked in the US, the UK and France. Experienced a lot of what you describe here.

Likewise. The default position is often shouting racism, loudly in your face. The chippy happy smiling man can change in a split second to one of agression. Even when the person in question is 100% at fault, and being challenged on it. I've seen it many times. As they say, "the best defence is attack".

jmreire

jmreire wrote: »

Likewise. The default position is often shouting racism, loudly in your face. The chippy happy smiling man can change in a split second to one of agression. Even when the person in question is 100% at fault, and being challenged on it. I've seen it many times. As they say, "the best defence is attack".

Well, we (those willing to see it anyway) all saw how BLM or Black people in the US used their race as an excuse to behave aggressively, so that any reaction could be used to present the excuse of racism. The shouting, the aggressive gestures, and even the violence, thrown out at people, and when they reacted, it was a justification of that behavior, as if to defend yourself against it (verbally/physically) was racist.

This isn't solely restricted to the US and BLM. When you have an advantage, you'll likely use it. At least, many will.. It's common enough, at least in my experience, for minority/disadvantaged groups, to use their status as a shield, to allow some of them to behave in a manner that wouldn't be acceptable for anyone else. Like with radical feminists who throw paint, or physically attack men, because they know that most men won't fight back, and any that do, will be good propaganda for their cause. A shield to behave in a way that others can't.

Which is why racism is likely to increase. With the continued rise of identity politics, and the success of BLM in getting recognised, we're going to see more of this kind of behavior... because it works in most situations. And those racial groups, white people and Asians in particular, will respond to it. Leading to real and direct racism.. which will be further compounded by the media, NGOs and politicians presenting the minorities as being completely innocent, and the only victims of the whole situation.

It's going to get nasty.

KyussB

Keeping it simple (stripping down a long post): Do you view any minorities, such as black/BLM folk in response to police killings/etc., as victims?

I've tuned out of identity politics for years, due to the particularly low signal to noise ratio - but some of the narratives I've seen at play lately, really need dissecting (if not for the last days of nonsense, I'd just ignores threads like this - now I'm wondering wtf I'm seeing...).

It's worth remembering that much of the harmful/divisive identity politics narratives, are primarily pushed by groups who are already comfortably in power - and who have an interest in divide-and-conquer narratives, for staying in power.

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

Keeping it simple (stripping down a long post):

That's not a long post, and you haven't stripped it down.. you've decided to ask/pursue other points instead

Do you view any minorities, such as black/BLM folk in response to police killings/etc., as victims?

Well.. here's the thing. I don't live in a black/white world where everything that be broken down to simplistic perceptions of one state of being. Every group can be victim, aggressor, bully, sadist, etc.. and even victims can place themselves into positions to become that victim because of their own choices..

The US cultural racism/discrimination of African Americans does not extend victimhood status to all African Americans equally, and even more importantly, to all Black people around the world. And that victim status even if appropriate for some is not an eternal status to be retained, nor should it be transferable to others, just because they share a skin colour.

I've tuned out of identity politics for years, due to the particularly low signal to noise ratio - but some of the narratives I've seen at play lately, really need dissecting (if not for the last days of nonsense, I'd just ignores threads like this - now I'm wondering wtf I'm seeing...).

It's worth remembering that much of the harmful/divisive identity politics narratives, are primarily pushed by groups who are already comfortably in power - and who have an interest in divide-and-conquer narratives, for staying in power.

Which is a distraction.

Oh, sure, White people on the left (some on the right), or those White people who want to virtue signal have adopted these causes as a way to gain publicity, and social approval/proof. That surge of adrenaline that comes when the mob of activists applaud your insights, and declarations.

But America has produced over three/four decades of Black and other minority activists who have promoted identity politics, in one way or another. People who have little interest in resolving issues, and more focus on using the situation to further their own interests. As with everything in the US, it becomes a profitable business, with speeches, tours, books, TV/Radio interviews, etc. An endless cycle of attention and payment. Consumerism, except that it's consumerism based on emotional outbursts.

If you look at US academia, where a lot of these Identity politics started, you'll find more than White professors publishing papers, and advocating this divisive nonsense. Oh, they're still the majority, as in the past, White people were the majority population, but that's been changing for twp decades now. The composition of US academia has been shifting, especially when it comes to the Social sciences.

KyussB

It was referring to stripping down my own post that was originally long, before I posted it.

I was asking with an example of BLM and police killings, so that would limit it to the US. I'm not asking if the elite-level black folk, in positions of power, are subject to the same discrimination.

You seem ok with generalizing somewhat, right? So do you not think, generally, that black people in the US are victims of police violence, and that the BLM movement is a legitimate response to this?

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

It was referring to stripping down my own post that was originally long, before I posted it.

I was asking with an example of BLM and police killings, so that would limit it to the US. I'm not asking if the elite-level black folk, in positions of power, are subject to the same discrimination.

You seem ok with generalizing somewhat, right? So do you not think, generally, that black people in the US are victims of police violence, and that the BLM movement is a legitimate response to this?

haha... you're being selective so that you can drive a particular point. Come on, we're all veterans of boards here.

Yes, I'm fine with generalising most times in these kind of discussions. Yes, I do believe that African Americans, and other Black people to a lesser degree, are victims of police violence, and systematic discrimination. I also believe that African Americans have latched on to the status of being the victim.

As for BLM, I don't believe it is a suitable expression to respond to this. BLM are not the inheritor of MLK. They're closer to the Black Panthers than anything else, with an attention to the militant side of Black civil rights. A desire to bring destruction and discord... as opposed to bringing people together, and healing the divisions.

BLM could have been a voice for good. Initially, they presented themselves as such, but they've strayed far away from that, seeking to punish and reinforce the stereotypes that the Black community has, doing little to improve the culture of Black people.

As I said, I don't have a Black/White Good/Bad perspective on things. I sympathize with African Americans, and the manner of the nation they live in, but at the same time, I recognise that they've contributed much to that situation, and quite a bit of that has been negative. BLM is another aspect of that negative contribution.

KyussB

I'm being selective so that I can keep a focus on one thing.

What bad things has the BLM movement done, that you view as being discreditable - especially relative to the police killings of black people? Why should the BLM movement - a reaction against systemic discrimination/violence against black people - be responsible for bringing people together (other than to fight the discrimination/violence), is it not the responsibility for those managing the systemically discriminatory police/legal/political/etc. systems to heal divisions?

It's not adjustments to the culture of Black people that's going to fix the problems in the US, so I don't understand the focus on that.

When we compare BLM as a civil rights movement, to civil rights movements that have existed on this island, morphing into something more extreme - they're pretty tame, really.

It's good that the violence/discrimination against black people are acknowledged, mind - tbh, the last pages of the thread had me wondering what slant posters had on that, which is part of why I'm asking.

KyussB

KyussB wrote: »

I'm being selective so that I can keep a focus on one thing.

What bad things has the BLM movement done, that you view as being discreditable - especially relative to the police killings of black people? Why should the BLM movement - a reaction against systemic discrimination/violence against black people - be responsible for bringing people together (other than to fight the discrimination/violence), is it not the responsibility for those managing the systemically discriminatory police/legal/political/etc. systems to heal divisions?

It's not adjustments to the culture of Black people that's going to fix the problems in the US, so I don't understand the focus on that.

When we compare BLM as a civil rights movement, to civil rights movements that have existed on this island, morphing into something more extreme - they're pretty tame, really.

It's good that the violence/discrimination against black people are acknowledged, mind - tbh, the last pages of the thread had me wondering what slant posters had on that, which is part of why I'm asking.

There is nothing tame about BLM. They are race baiting agitators.

Disgusting organisation

jmreire

KyussB wrote: »

I'm being selective so that I can keep a focus on one thing.

What bad things has the BLM movement done, that you view as being discreditable - especially relative to the police killings of black people? Why should the BLM movement - a reaction against systemic discrimination/violence against black people - be responsible for bringing people together (other than to fight the discrimination/violence), is it not the responsibility for those managing the systemically discriminatory police/legal/political/etc. systems to heal divisions?

It's not adjustments to the culture of Black people that's going to fix the problems in the US, so I don't understand the focus on that.

When we compare BLM as a civil rights movement, to civil rights movements that have existed on this island, morphing into something more extreme - they're pretty tame, really.

It's good that the violence/discrimination against black people are acknowledged, mind - tbh, the last pages of the thread had me wondering what slant posters had on that, which is part of why I'm asking.

Well for one thing seeing as how their whole platform is based on making Black Lives better, and exposing discrimination ( and rightly so) they should divert some of their energy towards reducing the black on black deaths, and make themselves truly representative of Blacks. But that might not suit the agenda.