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F1 2021 :Round 1 Bahrain

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    #512
    lolie
    Registered Users Posts: 2,330 ✭✭✭lolie


    Really disappointed Max didn't win but that was the stewards fault for not warning Mercedes earlier in the race for going wide at turn 4.
    Max got the pass done but it was his tiny error and great driving from Hamilton that lost him the race.


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    #513
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,134 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Faugheen wrote: »
    To everyone saying Mercedes cheated.

    Show me where Lewis Hamilton overtook someone in this race with all four wheels off the track?

    Otherwise, you’re comparing apples and oranges.

    Perez had a time deleted yesterday.

    Where was Hamilton/Bottas punishment today


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    #514
    artanevilla
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,275 Mod ✭✭✭✭artanevilla


    Even with the bad pit stop Bottas was well off the pace.


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    #515
    FourFourRED
    Registered Users Posts: 8,539 ✭✭✭FourFourRED


    lolie wrote: »
    Really disappointed Max didn't win but that was the stewards fault for not warning Mercedes earlier for going wide at turn 4.
    Max got the pass done but it was his tiny error and great driving from Hamilton that lost him the race.

    He had his chances. Wasn’t able to take it. Maybe next time.

    Regardless, what a season we may have in store for us. It would be great to see a competitive race every week.

    https://twitter.com/fourfourred



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    #516
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Gaoth Laidir wrote: »
    How much of a cumulative advantage did he get from all those laps when he went out of limits? Add it up and see what you get at the end of the race.

    Blinkers.

    How much of an advantage did Max get for doing the same thing before the overtake?

    How much of an advantage did Max get when they were side-by-side?

    Hamilton got a track-limits warning. Did you know that?


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    #517
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    Perez had a time deleted yesterday.

    Where was Hamilton/Bottas punishment today

    Hamilton got a warning and told next time was a penalty.


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    #518
    Irishjg
    Registered Users Posts: 335 ✭✭Irishjg


    FourFourRED wrote: »
    He had his chances. Wasn’t able to take it. Maybe next time.

    Regardless, what a season we may have in store for us. It would be great to see a competitive race every week.

    Amen to that FourFourRed. We’re in for a mega season if this continues.


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    #519
    skipper_G
    Registered Users Posts: 14,614 ✭✭✭✭skipper_G


    artanevilla wrote: »
    Even with the bad pit stop Bottas was well off the pace.

    Nothing unusual there


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    #520
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,134 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Hamilton got a warning and told next time was a penalty.


    and he did it one or two times more from what i could see


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    #521
    Cool_CM
    Registered Users Posts: 4,937 ✭✭✭Cool_CM


    Not much in the way of celebrations after that - how many races in a row is that without champagne on the podium?


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    #522
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    and he did it one or two times more from what i could see

    That’s nice. How many cars did he overtake when doing it?


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    #523
    McFly85
    Registered Users Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭McFly85


    Faugheen wrote: »
    To everyone saying Mercedes cheated.

    Show me where Lewis Hamilton overtook someone in this race with all four wheels off the track?

    Otherwise, you’re comparing apples and oranges.

    The stewards should either enforce track limits or not. Not just start enforcing them once RB start doing it.


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    #524
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    McFly85 wrote: »
    The stewards should either enforce track limits or not. Not just start enforcing them once RB start doing it.

    It’s always against the rules to overtake a car while off the track.

    How are you having trouble understanding that?


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    #525
    Widdensushi
    Registered Users Posts: 5,156 ✭✭✭Widdensushi


    McFly85 wrote: »
    The stewards should either enforce track limits or not. Not just start enforcing them once RB start doing it.

    I wonder if redbull had not flagged it could we have had a different result


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    #526
    quokula
    Registered Users Posts: 3,570 ✭✭✭quokula


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Hamilton got a warning and told next time was a penalty.

    Hamilton did it dozens of times and got a meaningless warning. Verstappen did it once and was told to hand certain victory that he’d earned over to Lewis.

    The mental gymnastics trying to justify the way Mercedes got away with cheating is astonishingly.


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    #527
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    Faugheen wrote: »
    To everyone saying Mercedes cheated.

    Show me where Lewis Hamilton overtook someone in this race with all four wheels off the track?

    Otherwise, you’re comparing apples and oranges.

    You don't need to be overtaking someone to gain an advantage or be breaking the rules. If you do it lap after lap then you're eating into the gap to the car ahead. It's all fairly simple, really. How come Perez got called up on it immediately yesterday?


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    #528
    ricimaki
    Registered Users Posts: 650 ✭✭✭ricimaki


    I hope Perez can qualify well this year. We could have some more battles at the front.

    Great to see McLaren and Ferrari so closely matched. Still disappointing that Bottas had plenty of margin for a pitstop in front of them.
    Difficult to judge exactly where Alpha Tauri, Alpine and Aston Martin fall in the order. They all showed some promise of being close the McLarens.

    Mick spinning could highlight some issues with the Haas, which is definitely the worst car this year. At least he held it, though....

    Looking like an exiting year so far!


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    #529
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,134 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Faugheen wrote: »
    It’s always against the rules to overtake a car while off the track.

    How are you having trouble understanding that?


    its also against the rules to run wide consistently to gain an advantage. So they clearly gained an advantage by doing it so much and they only applied this rule when RB told Max to do it.

    Why was Perez and others getting lap times deleted in the previous 2 days and the Mercs not getting any form of punishment today?


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    #530
    McFly85
    Registered Users Posts: 2,971 ✭✭✭McFly85


    Faugheen wrote: »
    It’s always against the rules to overtake a car while off the track.

    How are you having trouble understanding that?

    Not talking about the overtaking, I’m talking about Mercedes going off track as part of their racing line. RB started doing it after Merc weren’t punished, then the stewards told everyone to stop.

    Mercedes were allowed a faster racing line for the starting laps, basically.


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    #531
    skipper_G
    Registered Users Posts: 14,614 ✭✭✭✭skipper_G


    McFly85 wrote: »
    The stewards should either enforce track limits or not. Not just start enforcing them once RB start doing it.

    But that's not what happens. They do not have somebody monitoring every car at every corner for track limits. They do not have sensors in the tarmac to automatically detect them. What actually happens is, the race director forwards suspected infringements to the stewards for investigation. Assuming that was triggered By Red Bull's commenting on it via team radio, Hamilton was then instructed to stop or risk a black and white flag and subsequently a 5 second time penalty.


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    #532
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    quokula wrote: »
    Hamilton did it dozens of times and got a meaningless warning. Verstappen did it once and was told to hand certain victory that he’d earned over to Lewis.

    The mental gymnastics trying to justify the way Mercedes got away with cheating is astonishingly.

    No no, Max overtook a car while off the track, which is not allowed.

    That was always a rule no matter where the race is or whether track limits are in play or not.

    When did Hamilton overtake a car while off the track in this race?


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    #533
    Inquitus
    Registered Users Posts: 13,734 ✭✭✭✭Inquitus


    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    its also against the rules to run wide consistently to gain an advantage. So they clearly gained an advantage by doing it so much and they only applied this rule when RB told Max to do it.

    Why was Perez and others getting lap times deleted in the previous 2 days and the Mercs not getting any form of punishment today?

    Simply because the rules in Qually and the race as laid down by the stewards were different, comprende?


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    #534
    ctrl-alt-delete
    Registered Users Posts: 13,793 ✭✭✭✭ctrl-alt-delete


    Faugheen wrote: »
    That’s nice. How many cars did he overtake when doing it?

    That isn't always the only way to gain an advantage.

    The thing I can make out from all the talk on Sky was that the track limits issue needs sorting. Whether it is Practice, Qualification, or the race itself it needs to be the same limits and the same enforcement - from what I got from Brundle they left it open for the race in the notes.

    I think we can agree there should be a track and they should stick to it. It should be pulled up in the race as quickly as they did for qualifying yesterday.


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    #535
    Irishjg
    Registered Users Posts: 335 ✭✭Irishjg


    You cannot overtake beyond the track limits period. Red Bull have no complaints about it. Christian Horner has no complaints just finished a full interview.


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    #536
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Gaoth Laidir wrote: »
    You don't need to be overtaking someone to gain an advantage or be breaking the rules. If you do it lap after lap then you're eating into the gap to the car ahead. It's all fairly simple, really. How come Perez got called up on it immediately yesterday?

    But Max gained a massive advantage by going off the track, he gained a position.

    Why do you have an issue with this rule now? It’s been in place for years.


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    #537
    quokula
    Registered Users Posts: 3,570 ✭✭✭quokula


    ricimaki wrote: »
    I hope Perez can qualify well this year. We could have some more battles at the front.

    Great to see McLaren and Ferrari so closely matched. Still disappointing that Bottas had plenty of margin for a pitstop in front of them.
    Difficult to judge exactly where Alpha Tauri, Alpine and Aston Martin fall in the order. They all showed some promise of being close the McLarens.

    Mick spinning could highlight some issues with the Haas, which is definitely the worst car this year. At least he held it, though....

    Looking like an exiting year so far!

    I think the Haas has had those issues for some time. Grosjean and Magnussen are both much better drivers than they’ve been able to show.

    Am I right in saying Mazepin has now started three actual competitive laps in his F1 career and spun in all of them? Other teams might start having to account for him in their strategies if that keeps up.


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    #538
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,134 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Inquitus wrote: »
    Simply because the rules in Qually and the race as laid down by the stewards were different, comprende?

    so why were they warning hamilton after RB told max to run wide if the rules were different


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    #539
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,134 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Faugheen wrote: »

    When did Hamilton overtake a car while off the track in this race?

    By running wide at turn 4 consistently while doing the undercut


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    #540
    Inquitus
    Registered Users Posts: 13,734 ✭✭✭✭Inquitus


    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    so why were they warning hamilton after RB told max to run wide if the rules were different

    Qually, lap deleted, Race, only penalised if gaining an advantage, which usually means overtaking, they only got involved because Horner whines like a......


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    #541
    quokula
    Registered Users Posts: 3,570 ✭✭✭quokula


    Faugheen wrote: »
    No no, Max overtook a car while off the track, which is not allowed.

    That was always a rule no matter where the race is or whether track limits are in play or not.

    When did Hamilton overtake a car while off the track in this race?

    You seem to either be unfamiliar with the rules or be intentionally ignoring them.


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