Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IX *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

gmisk

normanoffside wrote: »

It Depends how you edit the video.
This snippet, for example, on its own makes the Gards look bad

https://twitter.com/juan_guarino/status/1365741680490663937

As you say....that is a snippet....and you have seen the footage before....sooooo why do you think the gardai felt they had to do something like that?....

Perfectly reasonable behaviour by the gardai given what went before imo

Jinglejangle69

normanoffside wrote: »

It Depends how you edit the video.
This snippet, for example, on its own makes the Gards look bad

https://twitter.com/juan_guarino/status/1365741680490663937

Em, no no it doesn't.

JRant

SAMTALK wrote: »

I'm aware there is always a backlog. I was referring to the increase because of covid

This is down to an inadequate health service which is an ongoing problem in this country.

So if we open the country up and numbers rise and we go back to January how does help the health service. No one wants restrictions and while health service is badly run we also need to protect it at the moment

It's a perfect catch 22 then. If we ease restrictions it may lead to more cases but the health system is such a shambles that it may lead to further restrictions. So to avoid going in to a future lock down we have to stay in this one.

As I've said previously, my biggest concern is the governments plan to keep restrictions on the table for other respiratory illnesses this winter.

SAMTALK

JRant wrote: »

It's a perfect catch 22 then. If we ease restrictions it may lead to more cases but the health system is such a shambles that it may lead to further restrictions. So to avoid going in to a future lock down we have to stay in this one.

As I've said previously, my biggest concern is the governments plan to keep restrictions on the table for other respiratory illnesses this winter.

Are you ignoring the fact that the vaccines are being rolled out

super_furry

normanoffside wrote: »

I guess this video shows exactly what happened.
The Gards blocked the bottom of Grafton St and then pushed people further and further back (from about 5 minutes). Finally someone aimed a firework at them (around 12 minutes) and then all hell broke loose.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIQKUtJ5bSc

Look at the muppet losing the head at the Gards at just around the 7 minute mark. He's *ahem* wearing the same clothes and has the same haircut as the lad who fires the rocket at around 12 minutes.

All this video work is saving the Gardai a lot of hassle.

pjohnson

super_furry wrote: »

Look at the muppet losing the head at the Gards at just around the 7 minute mark. He's *ahem* wearing the same clothes and has the same haircut as the lad who fires the rocket at around 12 minutes.

All this video work is saving the Gardai a lot of hassle.

And people claimed it was "middle class well educated people" at the protest. They would have scarpered pretty quick once they realised what was actually planned.

Riodej1578

For Forks Sake wrote: »

Might speed up the purchase of a water cannon for the Garda to use if nothing else.

Bringing out a few fire brigades would have been a good option. Hose them down. Wouldn't be long getting rid of them.

SilentGreenx32

ShadowTech wrote: »

I went into town today with the intention of protesting against government mismanagement of this crisis, specifically the never-ending lockdown. I believe strongly that there are multiple choices available to us to handle this crisis and that the false dichotomy we've been sold of "open it up" or "lock it down" are only the fringe positions (of which the government has obviously chosen the latter). I want some nuance to make this bearable (a handful of personal services and some outdoor activities without the threat of the guards fining you) while we await mass vaccination and I want the government to make clear that if vaccines continue to work as effectively at reducing hospitalisations as we're seeing in other countries that our lives will go back to normal. Real normal, not the propagandised "new normal" that seems to mean whatever is convenient for the person saying it at the time.

What I got today was a complete and utter disgrace. Firstly the guards closed Stephen's Green which pushed everyone there into the crowded space of Grafton Street. "So much for my plans to socially distance", I thought. Then the scumbags that were in amongst the crowd started firing flares directly over the crowd. Within the first 5 minutes of arriving I heard a loud "bang" and then people started running in every direction. I left. What else could I do really?

At the start I was annoyed with the Guards for closing the park off and compressing the crowd. In the end I left furious but not at the Guards. I wanted a protest against the endless lockdowns and the palpable lack of concern from our elected officials regarding the awful social impact of such severe restrictions. What I got was a number of scumbags undermining everyone there. :mad:

There are many people like myself who understand the need for restrictions without agreeing that the current actions are proportional or justified in their length and severity. With the lack of concrete metrics, the lack of an exit strategy, the imposition of more restrictions as we near what was supposed to be the endgame (mass vaccination), I feel hopeless. Today was supposed to be a way not only of voicing our unhappiness with the current approach but of taking back some small bit of control of our own lives and these absolute bastards ruined it for everyone. :mad:

I am the same as you. I was hoping that it wouldn't turn out the way it did even though I knew it more than likely would. This will just dampen any public uproar now as it can just be painted with the same brush as the fools who decided to get violent toda. Such a shame

FintanMcluskey

SAMTALK wrote: »

Are you ignoring the fact that the vaccines are being rolled out

I’m not, those implementing restrictions are

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/ireland-could-face-similar-covid-struggles-next-winter-government-warns-1.4493371%3fmode=amp

There are “real risks” that Ireland could face the same struggles with Covid-19 next winter as in recent months, the Government’s new plan for living with the pandemic has warned.

normanoffside

super_furry wrote: »

Look at the muppet losing the head at the Gards at just around the 7 minute mark. He's *ahem* wearing the same clothes and has the same haircut as the lad who fires the rocket at around 12 minutes.

All this video work is saving the Gardai a lot of hassle.

Yes, looks like him alright and hopefully they will catch him.

normanoffside

pjohnson wrote: »

And people claimed it was "middle class well educated people" at the protest. They would have scarpered pretty quick once they realised what was actually planned.

I was born working class (council estate), am well educated and am now probably what you would call middle class, I was at the protest. Sorry for not falling into your Stereo-type box (or maybe I do?)

pjohnson

normanoffside wrote: »

I was born working class (council estate), am well educated and am now probably what you would call middle class, I was at the protest. Sorry for not falling into your Stereo-type box (or maybe I do?)

It wasnt me that originally used that description to describe the fellows in the video's.

JRant

SAMTALK wrote: »

Are you ignoring the fact that the vaccines are being rolled out

Huh?

Of course not. It's amazing what has been achieved in a short space of time on the vaccine front. The sooner they get the population vaccinated the better.

I believe all restrictions should be lifted once we get 70/80% vaccinated. I haven't seen anything from this government to suggest this will happen. They even call out the need need for restrictions this winter in their most recent plan.

Itssoeasy

normanoffside wrote: »

I was born working class (council estate), am well educated and am now probably what you would call middle class, I was at the protest. Sorry for not falling into your Stereo-type box (or maybe I do?)

Well from the posts I’ve seen of yours describing your experience today you were clearly brought up with common sense and an ability to realise when to leave a situation that was getting out of hand. Common sense and cop on aren’t exclusive to one social class.

alexonhisown

normanoffside wrote: »

I was born working class (council estate), am well educated and am now probably what you would call middle class, I was at the protest. Sorry for not falling into your Stereo-type box (or maybe I do?)

If you don't mind me asking why were you at the protest. What would you like to happen. Easing of restrictions. Which restrictions. Or easing of all of them. You want everything reopened now?
Im just genuinely curious as to what the protesters want.

FintanMcluskey

alexonhisown wrote: »

If you don't mind me asking why were you at the protest. What would you like to happen. Easing of restrictions. Which restrictions. Or easing of all of them. You want everything reopened now?
Im just genuinely curious as to what the protesters want.

I can’t answer for Norman, but restrictions in line with the rest of Europe would be beneficial for anyone I spoke to

jams100

JRant wrote: »

I believe all restrictions should be lifted once we get 70/80% vaccinated. I haven't seen anything from this government to suggest this will happen. They even call out the need need for restrictions this winter in their most recent plan.

That's what concerns me too, are we talking end of spring 2022 before we are talking about normality. I really don't understand why we would need any restrictions after 70% have been vaccinated.

Yes our health system is s**t but it was before covid and we didn't close down things then. Politically it would make sense to drag this on so they can cover up how dysfunctional our health system is for another year. I hope I'm wrong but that's what I think, especially given how NPHET are basically in charge now.

Richard Hillman

If you are under the age of 50 and are afraid of Covid 19 at this stage, you are in need of psychological help.

Airyfairy12

normanoffside wrote: »

I guess this video shows exactly what happened.
The Gards blocked the bottom of Grafton St and then pushed people further and further back (from about 5 minutes). Finally someone aimed a firework at them (around 12 minutes) and then all hell broke loose.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIQKUtJ5bSc

I saw a video of this speaker at the start earlier on social media, in the video he stated like it was fact that the government are trying to kill us with the vaccines by weakening our immune systems with restrictions.
Theyre all crazy, Look at all the people listening to him and nodding their heads in agreement. Its worrying that this many loopy people have the ability to vote, drive cars, have children..

gmisk

Richard Hillman wrote: »

If you are under the age of 50 and are afraid of Covid 19 at this stage, you are in need of psychological help.

You do know there was a 16 year old who died from it in Ireland very recently?

I would rather not get it tbh cheers, so I am taking what precautions I can.

Maybe try showing some empathy, rather than making stupid statements like the above.

retro:electro

gmisk wrote: »

You do know there was a 16 year old who died from it in Ireland very recently?

I would rather not get it tbh cheers.

And the fact that a 16 year old died from/with Covid and we are all remarking on it just goes to show how unusual it is. Unfortunately with any large cohort of deaths there will be outliers that include young ages. It’s not unheard of for young people to die from any kind of disease, virus or illness. We hear the age 16 and picture a young and healthy person but we have no idea of the bigger picture or if the person had other illnesses. I think the fact that it’s so commented upon when a young person dies with/from Covid attests to how rare it is . But young people dying in Ireland isn’t an anomaly sadly, we just aren’t privy to that information every evening on the news, and one young death should not be considered more tragic than the next. The fact remains that it is extremely rare for a young person to die from this virus.

Silentcorner

Like many on here, I am learning more about viral infections than I did about Greek bond yields back in 2010 direction...

Coming into the pandemic the only thing I knew was to stay away from mainstream media as much as possible...I'll be honest, even though I knew this virus is something that is going to require huge action I felt severe lock down's felt like an over reaction but went along with it anyway....

Maybe that affected my search results.

I tried to find video's on Youtube of different medical experts (Irish or British if possible) who made logical sense and came across quiet a few, most have been taken down by Youtube.

The video below is Dr Pat Morrissey, I heard him speak on local radio and he was the most accurate in his assessment and predictions for the coming winter (as in last winter) that I have come across...he didn't get into that in this video but he does give his reasons for speaking out.

He spoke at a rally in Dublin last Oct and was immediately censured by the HSE...

This is what is wrong and why people like me are fed up, there is a justifiable argument that this whole year has been completely one sided and experts have been completely off in their predictions, predictions which justify the severe lock downs.

There is something rotten about all of this, when media, health officials, and politicians are all willing to only consider and only allow us to consider one side of the argument.

The Irish Times poll this week, showed that Tony Houlihan has huge public support, hardly a surprise when his strategy isn't criticized.

Russman

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

I can’t answer for Norman, but restrictions in line with the rest of Europe would be beneficial for anyone I spoke to

Would we not be better off with restrictions to suit our own particular circumstances, especially with regard to, say, hospitals ? I’m not disagreeing that some of ours are harsh, but they’re barely enforced or policed anyway.

Not sure too many would sign up here to curfews and some of the other measures mentioned in the below ...written permission to be out, mandatory FFP2 masks, mask wearing both indoors and out etc etc
Covid: How are European countries tackling the pandemic? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-53640249

Most, if not all, of Europe is in the sh1tter with this and most of the restrictions are broadly similar across the board. For sure we can pick out things we particularly dislike but it doesn’t change what most EU governments are doing to buy time til vaccines take effect.

Penfailed

alexonhisown wrote: »

Im just genuinely curious as to what the protesters want.

Much like this thread, they all want different things. There's a sliding scale. In this thread, at one end, you've got a tiny minority that want lockdowns to continue indefinitely, at the other end there's a tiny minority that want to open up everything and 'let it rip'. The majority of people fall somewhere in the middle but are swayed towards one end or the other. The upshot of this is that the majority of people in this thread want the same thing. Normality. Not 'new' normality. Actual normality.

titan18

gmisk wrote: »

You do know there was a 16 year old who died from it in Ireland very recently?

I would rather not get it tbh cheers, so I am taking what precautions I can.

Maybe try showing some empathy, rather than making stupid statements like the above.

Tbf, as tragic as that is, young people die every week I'd imagine here. We can't lockdown society every time someone dies before their time.

I dont think we should reopen fully (yet anyway), cases are too high for that, but there's a middle ground from fully reopening and what we have now that is more acceptable for the situation we're in. We're not at January numbers anymore and a lot of the most vulnerable have been vaccinated along with hospital workers which was where a lot of the spread was.

For example, we locked down with similar to higher numbers back in October but with construction open, schools open and click and collect available. As of this Monday, about 30% of school is reopened and the other 2 are still closed.

Imo, you could reopen more, and I'd include hairdressers as it's far safer than a lot of stuff with how it was done in their open periods imo.

Silentcorner

Penfailed wrote: »

Much like this thread, they all want different things. There's a sliding scale. In this thread, at one end, you've got a tiny minority that want lockdowns to continue indefinitely, at the other end there's a tiny minority that want to open up everything and 'let it rip'. The majority of people fall somewhere in the middle but are swayed towards one end or the other. The upshot of this is that the majority of people in this thread want the same thing. Normality. Not 'new' normality. Actual normality.

Or maybe a functioning Government who don't just take the most severe route given our demographic and geographical spread across the island.


If the Government recognized the seasonality factor, which the data indicates clearly, and told us that as a precaution we will stay in level 5 until the end of the traditional flu season at the end of March, I could see the logic as much as I hate level 5.

But constantly moving goal posts and pumping fear about variants into us through the complicit media is not what a well organised strong leadership would do.

Airyfairy12

Richard Hillman wrote: »

If you are under the age of 50 and are afraid of Covid 19 at this stage, you are in need of psychological help.

A 16 year old died from it recently, I personally know a 19 year old who died from it, my friends 23 year old brother died from it, a work colleague whose 30 got long covid and has been sick for months, she has to sleep down stairs as climbing the stairs in her house leaves her so short of breath she feels like she's going to pass out, she's so exhausted she sleeps 18 hours a day, she said the tiredness is like having the flu but x100, she's completely floored.

kerrylad1

normanoffside wrote: »

I was born working class (council estate), am well educated and am now probably what you would call middle class, I was at the protest. Sorry for not falling into your Stereo-type box (or maybe I do?)

Look man.Dont waist ur time
A few people know me on boards.I grew up in probly the worst estate in ireland.Moyross.Guess what.Never in trouble.Worked my ass off.Now living in the country side.But yet,i reckon most people on here would tarnish me with the same brush,as those at the march.

py2006

Richard Hillman wrote: »

If you are under the age of 50 and are afraid of Covid 19 at this stage, you are in need of psychological help.

Very silly comment.

Perhaps they are more concerned about spreading it to vulnerable loved ones, neighbours, colleagues.

Perhaps they don't want to be part of the stupid brigade that are part of the reason we are in lockdown anyway.

Airyfairy12

retro:electro wrote: »

And the fact that a 16 year old died from/with Covid and we are all remarking on it just goes to show how unusual it is. Unfortunately with any large cohort of deaths there will be outliers that include young ages. It’s not unheard of for young people to die from any kind of disease, virus or illness. We hear the age 16 and picture a young and healthy person but we have no idea of the bigger picture or if the person had other illnesses. I think the fact that it’s so commented upon when a young person dies with/from Covid attests to how rare it is . But young people dying in Ireland isn’t an anomaly sadly, we just aren’t privy to that information every evening on the news, and one young death should not be considered more tragic than the next. The fact remains that it is extremely rare for a young person to die from this virus.

I think allot of people forget that Ireland is no different to any other country and if we relax restrictions, we'll experience a surge in cases & deaths just like other countries. For example, the US has had over 500K deaths and very few restrictions. New Zealand has had some of the lowest deaths but very regulated restrictions. They continue to tighten restrictions when just one case is confirmed.
500k deaths here, or even 2 or 300k deaths would devastate the country, that many deaths would mean every person in Ireland would lose atleast one loved one to Covid within a couple of months. We dont have the same infrastructure as many of these countries with low restrictions, how do you expect the health care system, the morgues, the nurses & doctors to cope with that many deaths and patients? Whats your solution to these problems?