Donald Trump discussion Thread IX (threadbanned users listed in OP)

StringerBell

Pretty sure Jones has overtly distanced himself from trump on standard Jones fashion alright, no need for a bit mic but yeah would make sense that he just got caught on one talking about his audience.

In fairness to these lads, and I mean the likes of Cruz also. They are certainly no fools, they just understand that the audience they have is so they con them.

kowloon

Itssoeasy wrote: »

He also belittles his audience because of how easy it is to sell them stuff.

His grifts are worse than the worst infomercials I've seen, it's hard not to think some of his audience are gullible.

aloyisious

StringerBell wrote: »

In fairness to these lads, and I mean the likes of Cruz also. They are certainly no fools, they just understand that the audience they have is so they con them.

When you come to Cruz, that definitely applies. Travelling by public airliner to Mexico wearing a Texas Lone Star mask on a mercy mission for his daughters.

Itssoeasy

It’s hardly a surprise that Americans fell for trumps dog and pony show in 2016. I mean just watch John Oliver’s piece on televangelists. That crowd are taking peoples genuine faith in god and ripping them off in a disgusting way which isn’t that different to trump who made money off his supporters by peddling utter lies.

Detritus70

Itssoeasy wrote: »

It’s hardly a surprise that Americans fell for trumps dog and pony show in 2016. I mean just watch John Oliver’s piece on televangelists. That crowd are taking peoples genuine faith in god and ripping them off in a disgusting way which isn’t that different to trump who made money off his supporters by peddling utter lies.

It is surprising to me, because Trump's level of doing business is somewhere around Dr. Quack's Miracle Cure Tincture or a flea circus.
It has been apparent for decades that he is a piece of shizzle.
But when soundbites from him came out, grab 'em by the p*ssy, Mexicans are drug dealers and rapists, block Muslims from entering, build a wall, go back to oil and coal, certain people took notice.
The type of people who would say "I'm not a racist, but" and "those damn queers just struttin' around like they own the place" and "women have enough rights already!" and to them it was a message.
Just look at the people who stormed the Capitol, it was the final outcome of those "very fine people" being told that they don't have to hide anymore.
If you believe that Jesus did turn water into wine and the world is 6000 years old, you can make yourself believe anything. Even that Trump is a competent politician, instead of the figurehead of racism, intolerance and hate that he is.

aloyisious

It look's like Biden and the Democrats have managed to get the 1.9 Trillion Covid-19 relief bill passed through both chambers, though the Senate vote was 50 to 49. A lot of U.S households and families should sigh with relief on the news, along with small and medium businesses.

Detritus70

aloyisious wrote: »

It look's like Biden and the Democrats have managed to get the 1.9 Trillion Covid-19 relief bill passed through both chambers, though the Senate vote was 50 to 49. A lot of U.S households and families should sigh with relief on the news, along with small and medium businesses.

And every single POS republican voted against it.
If the Dems don't act now by eliminating the filibuster and reforming the electoral system, they are as useless and evil as the republicans.

Wanderer78

Detritus70 wrote:

And every single POS republican voted against it. If the Dems don't act now by eliminating the filibuster and reforming the electoral system, they are as useless and evil as the republicans.

Useless and 'evil', how come?

Detritus70

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Useless and 'evil', how come?

Republicans are the party of God, guns and the Bible. They don't care about the general population, it's about profit for billionaires and spitting on poor people.
It would demonstrate that none of them care about 90% of the population and it's all about maintaining the status quo, stuffing their pockets, enriching their billionaire buddies and clinging onto power.
If the democrats don't change things significantly (filibuster, tax breaks for billionaires, voter suppression, gerrymandering, letting companies run roughshod over the environment, eliminating social nets and healthcare), then they demonstrate that they like to call these things out, but ultimately don't care about them.
What they need to do now is ram everything through and let the Rs fcuking howl all they want, but the US is a broken country and badly needs to be fixed.
They already balked at the minimum wage, what else will they chicken out of?
The next few years will be telling.
Don't think that people will just applaud the nice facade of the democratic party, they criticised Trump, but Biden won't get an easy ride.
That's what sets democratic supporters apart from republicans. They don't just brainlessly clap like seals being thrown a few fish heads.

Wanderer78

Detritus70 wrote: »

Republicans are the party of God, guns and the Bible. They don't care about the general population, it's about profit for billionaires and spitting on poor people.
It would demonstrate that none of them care about 90% of the population and it's all about maintaining the status quo, stuffing their pockets, enriching their billionaire buddies and clinging onto power.
If the democrats don't change things significantly (filibuster, tax breaks for billionaires, voter suppression, gerrymandering, letting companies run roughshod over the environment, eliminating social nets and healthcare), then they demonstrate that they like to call these things out, but ultimately don't care about them.
What they need to do now is ram everything through and let the Rs fcuking howl all they want, but the US is a broken country and badly needs to be fixed.
They already balked at the minimum wage, what else will they chicken out of?
The next few years will be telling.
Don't think that people will just applaud the nice facade of the democratic party, they criticised Trump, but Biden won't get an easy ride.
That's what sets democratic supporters apart from republicans. They don't just brainlessly clap like seals being thrown a few fish heads.

is there really much difference between both parties?

EltonJohn69

Wanderer78 wrote: »

is there really much difference between both parties?

I would say the most significant difference are their their stance on global warming. Actively opposing action on the issue is going to be catastrophic for the planet.

duploelabs

Wanderer78 wrote: »

is there really much difference between both parties?

Stance on equality? pro or anti immigration? Yes there's quite a bit

Detritus70

Wanderer78 wrote: »

is there really much difference between both parties?

Well, I don't prejudge, I'll see how they do over the next few years.

rossie1977

Wanderer78 wrote: »

is there really much difference between both parties?

Between Republicans and Democrats?

If so yes huge difference. Just check their senate voting records past decade

Basically asking is there much difference between DUP and FG.

kowloon

Wanderer78 wrote: »

is there really much difference between both parties?

There are huge differences even within the parties. But it doesn't matter as long as it's a two-party system. You saw Trump refusing to split the GOP. As far as most politicians there are concerned STV is something you get from one too many hookers.

ancapailldorcha

Wanderer78 wrote: »

is there really much difference between both parties?

Yes.

The Democrats are an absurd coalition of trade unionists, social democrats, liberals, environmentalists, socialists and corporatists. As you'd expect, it's a mess. Functional but cumbersome and riven by factionalism.

The Republican party in its current form has no place in a modern liberal democracy based on its response to the Capitol incident. It's gone wholly for white nationalism, dog whistling and pie-in-the-sky positions made possible by gerrymandering and outsized influence offered to its voters.

ancapailldorcha

Mod: Just pasting images here isn't permitted. A post has been removed.

ancapailldorcha

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Mod: Just pasting images here isn't permitted. A post has been removed.

Post with insults deleted.

Ash.J.Williams

My post ?

ancapailldorcha

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

My post ?

Yes. Don't discuss mod actions on thread please.

Infini

Detritus70 wrote: »

And every single POS republican voted against it.
If the Dems don't act now by eliminating the filibuster and reforming the electoral system, they are as useless and evil as the republicans.

They need to limit the filibuster sure, its an abuse of power but remember that they got rid of it on the SCOTUS appointments only for the republicans to ram through their nominees. Thing is to be rid of it they need a clear majority in the senate anyways to have the room to do so. One or 2 of the Dem side are squarely against its removal so that limits their options.

Tell me how

Infini wrote: »

They need to limit the filibuster sure, its an abuse of power but remember that they got rid of it on the SCOTUS appointments only for the republicans to ram through their nominees. Thing is to be rid of it they need a clear majority in the senate anyways to have the room to do so. One or 2 of the Dem side are squarely against its removal so that limits their options.

Saw a tweet late last night that suggested that Biden is not going to push to end the filibuster.

https://twitter.com/mehdirhasan/status/1368778349284388864

Detritus70

The last vote has demonstrated that working with republicans is not an option.
Every single vote will.go this way, with every republican voting squarely against every democrat bill.
Should the Dems lose the senate, republicans will simply brickwall again.
It is idiotic to think otherwise.

Leroy42

The theory of the filibuster makes perfect sense. Having to get bipartisan support for big changes makes stops the back and forth that would happen, such as we see with EO's. POTUS A (GOP) pushes through a law, requiring massive changes and huge resources to enact, followed by POTUS B (Dem) who then reserves everything and leads to most costs and more time wasted.

The problem is not the filibuster, it is that Senators are only acting in the interests of their party and not the country.

It works (a simple majority) in most other countries because overall the political parties tend to agree on the big-ticket items. Universal health care, control on guns, abortion, schools etc. The problem in the US seems to be that the two parties are almost diametrically opposed to one another.

Take Judges for example. It seems that one of the main advantages to winning POTUS is that you can appoint a rake of judges that follow your particular view on certain legal issues, rather than appointing judged based on merit.

Headshot

This guy is going to spoil alot of Democrats work

https://www.thewrap.com/john-oliver-democrats-dont-seem-remotely-prepared-to-fight-republican-threats-video/

He's excuse for defending the filibuster is ridiculous

Water John

Tell me how wrote: »

Saw a tweet late last night that suggested that Biden is not going to push to end the filibuster.

https://twitter.com/mehdirhasan/status/1368778349284388864

It quite clearly states Biden's preference, as it always has been, doesn't say the won't do it.

aloyisious

One way to limit the damage filibustering does to actual debating on the content and aims of a bill would be to limit the time given to each "contributor" to speak from the floor would be 10/15 minutes top in a continuous speech, no breaks or prevarications, no long-windedness to prevent the business of the house proceeding. It can be done when the parties agree, as shown in the impeachment trial. Change the rules of the chamber to outlaw the practice as it's an abuse of privilege.

We hear examples of filibustering every day here in Ireland when a politician is interviewed on the news as he/she keeps prattling to the interviewer knowing there is a time-limit imposed for each interview as the programme has to cover a lot of items in a 40 minute slot and the interviewer has to walk away from the politician business unfinished.

aloyisious

On the issue of blocking free speech to Trump, and Texas AG Ken Paxton decision to launch an investigation into Twitter barring Trump from accessing the site after the Capitol insurrection attempt, Twitter has sued Paxton in Federal Court in California asking for a temporary restraining order against Paxton's ordered investigation into Twitter's decision.

banie01

aloyisious wrote: »

On the issue of blocking free speech to Trump, and Texas AG Ken Paxton decision to launch an investigation into Twitter barring Trump from accessing the site after the Capitol insurrection attempt, Twitter has sued Paxton in Federal Court in California asking for a temporary restraining order against Paxton's ordered investigation into Twitter's decision.

One would hope that someone who has finished law school has a better grasp on the 1st amendment than Mr Paxton and his stance that twitter bad!

Trump is free to say what he likes, noone has impinged upon his ability to bluster and screech.
There is no guarantee to a platform, particularly one that's managed by a private company!
Nor an audience.

Those cases that reinforced the rights of business to refuse service are all going to bite any litigant taking a right to service on their arse stateside.

Retr0gamer

aloyisious wrote: »

On the issue of blocking free speech to Trump, and Texas AG Ken Paxton decision to launch an investigation into Twitter barring Trump from accessing the site after the Capitol insurrection attempt, Twitter has sued Paxton in Federal Court in California asking for a temporary restraining order against Paxton's ordered investigation into Twitter's decision.

Twitter:

Ticket completed. Freedom of speech functioning as intended.