Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

sydthebeat

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117614155#Comment_117614155

you can be guaranteed that the ill informed will continue with this as something to denigrate Farrell about.

aloooof

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117614166#Comment_117614166

Or it'll go full circle and he'll be criticised for blooding too many players resulting in a lack of cohesion.

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117614079#Comment_117614079

I'm not sure, I think Doris is probably already ahead of him for Ireland... strange thing to say about a Lion, but I think he has a fight on his hands here

Former Former Former

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117614079#Comment_117614079

I think next season we could see Beirne as the starting six. It's his best position IMO, he's having a decent Lions tour as a blindside and a test jersey could seal it for him.

aloooof

Backrow is amongst the hardest units to call at the moment, imo. Couple that with CJ's departure and Doris' injury during the 6 Nations (and even POM's absence thru suspension) and I'm not sure we could point to anyone being the incumbent. We had 4 different combinations of 6/8 over the 6 Nations, for example. CJ was the only mainstay and he's gone.

I think Beirne's form at the moment demands selection so that decision may come down to personnel in the second-row as much as anything.

Whatever happens with the backrow, I think we'll have some excellent players left disappointed.

Clegg

Farrell has never been conservative when it comes to selection. He threw in Doris, Keenan and Kelleher as soon as he could and all three have become regular starters under him. He's also put a lot of faith in Casey, Baird and Harry Byrne by having them in training camps for the best part of a year now.

Dubinusa

I think Beirne and Conan would be awesome in the same back row. VDF and Connors are neck and neck imo! I Do prefer VDF, but Connors is really good. Leavy needs to get a run of matches and then there's POM.

Coombes and Doris are the future over the next 6 years. But I prefer Conan at the moment!

I think Doak will be involved very soon. He's a serious prospect! Casy may not yet be annointed.

TomsOnTheRoof

Personally I'd go for Beirne in the second row with Henderson. I'd put Baird on the bench. I'd look to give Thornbury some gametime over the Autumn series as well.

I'd like to see Coombes at 8. He has the hands, he's great on the floor, great off the back of the scrum and he is a very powerful runner (both in tight and out wide). Openside is very hard to predict but I'd go with Connors if fit. Stick Doris at blindside. A good powerful carrier but his hands have let him down recently.

Interested Observer

I'll eat my hat if Henderson finds himself on the bench.

Thought the USA game was one of the most enjoyable Ireland games I've seen for a while. The opposition were obviously not good but all the debutants playing some nice rugby, couple of very good tries, and no letting up at all played for the full 80.

Richie_Rich89

Coom bes does look pretty impressive. As long as slipping off tackles doesn't become an obvious issue against quality opposition then he could be a very strong option.

TomsOnTheRoof

Just to clarify my previous post: I meant Beirne and Henderson as the second row pairing with Baird on the bench.

shootermacg

https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/1415750045299773441

Crazy the space Coombes frees up, if he had a 12/13 outside him instead of Baird or Ryan, there might have been more tries.

Murray K has a thread here:

https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/1415750045299773441?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1415750045299773441%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fboards.ie%2Fdiscussion%2F2058137045%2Fireland-team-talk-xii-farrells-first-fifteen%2Fp284

Was a good Irish performance but USA played and built some momentum for the first quarter and then completely packed it in, when Baloucoune cut them open we scored three tries within 13 minutes and the game was a training match from there.

Was good to see Carbery generally execute well, moved the ball nicely and put plenty of players through gaps but all under zero pressure - if he did anything less it would have been concerning. The rest of the team have performed to a higher cj-standard in the Pro-(whatever it is now) and I don't think we learned a huge amount.

USA really need to do better in fixtures like this but with the season that's been I will avoid being too excoriating.

TRC10

I personally, don't think Carbery played well at all in these tests. He just didn't look assured in that 10 jersey and looked a bit lost at times tbh. I was really hoping he'd grasp this opportunity, but he just didn't IMO. Although he goal kicked extremely well.

I thought Harry Byrne was miles better when he came on v the USA.

molloyjh

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117617849#Comment_117617849

Harry came on against a beaten and tired 14 man USA. He should have looked better. His performance was encouraging given he had only played 50 odd minutes in the last 2 1/2 months. But I thought Joey did well enough. Again, the opposition has to be considered, but he did what he needed to do.

I dont think the game changes too much. Both players need time at their province to find some consistent form. If either/both do that then we can look at their future in green a bit more. Obviously Joey will have a far easier time of that than Harry....

arsebiscuits1

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117617849#Comment_117617849

Joey has never been an overly strong defender but always made his tackles.

Since returning from injury I'd go as far as to call him a liability in that aspect now.

Other than that I thought he was fine considering oppostion.

I don't think we can read too much into HB given the 14 man oppo. He had some nice moments

Clegg

I thought it was encouraging that we managed to fix our lineout after a new wobbly throws at the beginning. It's a concern that we're still having those problems, but overall the set piece has improved on where it was a year ago. Back then the problems would have persisted throughout the game.

Also, just a word on Ronan Kelleher. He's developed so much as a player in the last 18 months. Always had a strong carrying game, but his work on the deck and as a link man has improved a lot. If he manages to get more consistent in hitting his throws, which he's already improving on, I think he could be world class. He's clearly impressed Gatland and the Lions coaches.

Interested Observer

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117615842#Comment_117615842

So Ryan out of the 23? Doubt there's any chance of that really.

dudley72

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117614155#Comment_117614155

Joe managed to cap a huge amount of players but was still accused of been conservative.

All coach's will get accused of been conservative especially when they don't pick XYZ from a certain club that the person supports.

arsebiscuits1

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117619254#Comment_117619254

Very, very strong showing from him.

First throw was on the money also and uncharacteristically went straight through James Ryans hands. Second one looked like he threw a smidge early and he'll be disappointed for it if so.

11 won 2 lost is still an good return and he did have 2 excellent throws to the tail which were on the money.

I've seen better throwers than him over the years get a bit yippy after losing the first few lineouts so to see him respond well was promising

Dubinusa

I wasn't impressed with Carberry tbh. I thought he was ok. The Eagles were awful! So we looked good against a poor side. Coombes should have played against Japan imo. Impressing against a poor side is really not impressing.

On another note, James Ryan would probably be better off had he been given the summer off! He hasn't looked good since the concussions. I am concerned for his future, repeated concussions are not a good omen. Hopefully, he returns strong.

Balacoune will be in the running as a starter. Stockdale, Lowe and Larmour will be under pressure. A healthy Conway leapfrogs all 3 imo. Wing is an area of weakness! Our starters can't defend. Maybe Keenan on a wing with Conway or Balacoune. Stockdale at fb? Or Addison.

Paul Smeenus

There's zero reason to swap Stockdale and Keenan.

Agreed on Carbery. This lad is supposed to be the heir apparent. Our next mainstay ten. He only looks alight. We need to keep looking if he doesn't improve.

Podge_irl

Keenan has looked like he is capable of locking down the 15 jersey for the foreseeable. I don't know why you would move him.

arsebiscuits1

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117619707#Comment_117619707

Addison would be well capable of displacing him if he returns to form. Had a very solid showing albeit on the wing.

But I think he's a supremely talented individual

Dubinusa

I'd move him only if we don't produce wings that can defend Lowe is abysmal, Larmour cannot field the garryowen and Stockdale is a poor defender.

Of course, Balacoune and Conway could be the answer.

Podge_irl

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117619745#Comment_117619745

Addison is made of chocolate.

I'm not really discounting the possibility of someone displacing him, but I don't see any reason to [i]search[/i] for someone to replace him which is what putting Stockdale there would be doing.

stephen_n

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117619254#Comment_117619254

Thrower always gets blamed. I felt Ryan was far more at fault for the lineout issues at the start of the USA game than Kelleher.

grumpymunster

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117619747#Comment_117619747

I think it is pretty clear Farrell does not rate Conway - why I have no idea as for me he is way ahead of Stockdale & Lowe.

aloooof

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117619642#Comment_117619642

I think Keenan has the 15 jersey locked down for the foreseeable.

With regards wing, in the short term, you’re also forgetting Earls. For me it’s Earls, Keenan +1 other.

TomsOnTheRoof

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117619289#Comment_117619289

If Ryan's performances haven't lifted by next season then yeah, I'd drop him from the 23. Beirne and Henderson give us a very strong secondrow pairing and Baird is an excellent impact sub. Coombes and Doris can lock up 6 and 8 and Conan will have a say in that area too. On current form Ryan shouldn't be there and it does more harm than good keeping a player in the match day squad in the hopes that they find form, especially when their replacements are performing to a much higher standard.

Having said all of that I don't believe Farrell will drop Ryan from the starting 15, let alone the 23. Nevertheless he shouldn't be considered untouchable.