Carlow school issues clothing diktat to female students

Piehead

This seems a very odd story. Is there more to it than being reported ?



https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/education/appalling-female-students-at-carlow-school-told-to-not-wear-tight-fitting-clothes-for-pe-39787071.html

J. Marston

Imagine the looks the male teachers are gonna get in that town.

jrosen

I would think it’s possible.
For a start we don’t know who is supposedly distracted. Unclear if any teachers made a complaint and surely it would be job suicide to imply you were distracted by tight clothing on a student.

Perhaps a comment taken out of context and someone is outraged?! School PE must be no more

anewme

I hope the Mods will keep an eye on this thread. The last one unfortunately had to be deleted, due to the disgusting comments passed about children.

If male teachers haven't raised this as an "issue", they should down tools or something.

They're being made look like total nonces.

Ten of Swords

Thread doesn't belong in AH, moved to CA

Given this is the second attempt at a thread on this, and the last one was closed after a large volume of completely unacceptable comments, posters stirring or trolling can expect bans

Piehead

MikeOxsgreen wrote: »

If male teachers haven't raised this as an "issue", they should down tools or something.

They're being made look like total nonces.

True. You’d wonder if there is a Mary Whitehouse type on the school Board of Management

AdrianG08

Its pretty simple. Issue an affordable designated PE uniform for kids in September and have them wear that.

Absolutely stupid statement from the school to say teachers were distracted, what kind of fool is running a school that could not see the implications of a statement like that.

Make the statement that certain attire is inappropriate, which it certainly is. I myself have a teenage daughter and trust me when I say what she would class as sporty fashion (and theres murder in our house for not letting her out in it) would have no place in a school PE lesson.

Im all for freedom of actions, but school is school so follow the rules. Everyone would prob be too afraid of the feminist backlash but some of the get up on these young girls in general leaves no margin for error so to speak, and the only ones sexualising it are the people who are too afraid to parent and tell them no, not the people who object to it.

Some clothing lines for young girls nowadays are quite frankly disgraceful, and its passive parents that are to blame.

jrosen

AdrianG08 wrote: »

Its pretty simple. Issue an affordable designated PE uniform for kids in September and have them wear that.

Absolutely stupid statement from the school to say teachers were distracted, what kind of fool is running a school that could not see the implications of a statement like that.

Make the statement that certain attire is inappropriate, which it certainly is. I myself have a teenage daughter and trust me when I say what she would class as sporty fashion (and theres murder in our house for not letting her out in it) would have no place in a school PE lesson.

Im all for freedom of actions, but school is school so follow the rules. Everyone would prob be too afraid of the feminist backlash but some of the get up on these young girls in general leaves no margin for error so to speak, and the only ones sexualising it are the people who are too afraid to parent and tell them no, not the people who object to it.

Some clothing lines for young girls nowadays are quite frankly disgraceful, and its passive parents that are to blame.

It’s important to point out nowhere has it been confirmed that a teacher made any complaint about being distracted.

Clickbait journalism yet again most likely.

hynesie08

If this is a made up story, someone is an idiot.

If the principal issued the statement without talking to teachers, they can't be trusted to run a bath, never mind a school.

If a teacher actually complained about being distracted by teenagers in leggings, they need to be sacked and the gardai should probably check their hard drive.

.anon.

MikeOxsgreen wrote: »

If male teachers haven't raised this as an "issue", they should down tools or something.

They're being made look like total nonces.

And if they did raise it, they should also down tools.

strandroad

Piehead wrote: »

True. You’d wonder if there is a Mary Whitehouse type on the school Board of Management

The school seems archaic. Apparently they told the girls "not to tighten their jumpers or sweatshirts in any way to accentuate their shape" and not to take their jumpers off even in the summer. Never show their ankles in PE. How do you even show off your body in a sweatshirt ffs.

jrosen

jrosen wrote: »

It’s important to point out nowhere has it been confirmed that a teacher made any complaint about being distracted.

That fact is getting lost in the cacophony of misandry, that men can't control themselves etc.

I'd wager truppence - this did not come from a male teacher.

If it did, he should be sacked

MrMusician18

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Clickbait journalism yet again most likely.

This was the most ridiculous thing RTE has ever run as as a serious story on the main evening news. If I was a local newspaper editor I'd be embarrassed to have this petty school dispute as a story in my paper yet RTE saw it worthy of a three minute segment on the main national news bulletin.

I see that their online coverage comes replete with a "toxic masculinity" quote... That whole rotten organization needs a complete clear out and needs to focus on real news, not this bollocks.

Floppybits

Teachers in that school should go out on strike till the school apologise for that statement and clear up the any issues related to the teachers. Some of the comments about the teachers are outrageous

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

It’s weirdly worded. I’m guessing it’s just “Don’t wear inappropriate clothes” - hardly a new rule. But the whole thing of saying it distracts the teachers makes the teachers sound dodgy when it’s probably more that they’d find skimpy or skintight clothes on minors a bit embarrassing and inappropriate. Granted, there can be pervy teachers but they would be a huge minority.

smellyoldboot

.anon. wrote: »

And if they did raise it, they should also down tools.

I think they should leave their tools well enough alone in the circumstances.

strandroad

MikeOxsgreen wrote: »

That fact is getting lost in the cacophony of misandry, that men can't control themselves etc.

I'd wager truppence - this did not come from a male teacher.

If it did, he should be sacked

I can't imagine a genuine teacher complaining about teens in leggings, or teens showing off ankles, or teens in provocative sweatshirts making them uncomfortable.
Feels more like school ethos running wild.

strandroad

strandroad wrote: »

The school seems archaic. Apparently they told the girls "not to tighten their jumpers or sweatshirts in any way to accentuate their shape" and not to take their jumpers off even in the summer. Never show their ankles in PE. How do you even show off your body in a sweatshirt ffs.

I will most likely be wrong on this. (as usual) :pac:

But I'm going to call bull**** on this story for simple reasons.

1. I went through school 25 years ago and not taking your jumper off would have been a joke even in them old days.

2. Most teachers I am friendly with are female, and they are not stupid people, none of them are living in the 1950s


Its social media driven journo clickbait.

kona

There absoloutley has to be more to this story. I dont believe anybody could be that stupid or out of touch with reality to go down that road and actually say that about kids in their care.

I mean if there is some sort of problem with kids taking the piss out of their uniform rules then just enforce your uniform rule like what happens in most functional schools.

Teach30

strandroad wrote: »

I can't imagine a genuine teacher complaining about teens in leggings, or teens showing off ankles, or teens in provocative sweatshirts making them uncomfortable.
Feels more like school ethos running wild.

Genuine female teacher here not in that school but in a similar one. The leggings parents send girls to school in can often be of a very poor quality there just the in thing at the moment and I for one find it awful to see their knickers through them as they walk down a corridor in front of me. I don’t go looking for it they’re just there. Some wear leggings with see through panels at the side, grand for at home but I dont need to see their upper thighs bad tan lines and the outline of their vagina.
Fair enough if they can’t afford better quality leggings they’re are systems in place to assist there but none of ours would have financial issues.

Leggings are fine if they are designed for PE and sport activities but some types are designed for loungewear and are not appropriate.

Maybe I’m just old fashioned?

strandroad

Teach30 wrote: »

Genuine female teacher here not in that school but in a similar one. The leggings parents send girls to school in can often be of a very poor quality there just the in thing at the moment and I for one find it awful to see their knickers through them as they walk down a corridor in front of me. I don’t go looking for it they’re just there. Some wear leggings with see through panels at the side, grand for at home but I dont need to see their upper thighs bad tan lines and the outline of their vagina.
Fair enough if they can’t afford better quality leggings they’re are systems in place to assist there but none of ours would have financial issues.

Leggings are fine if they are designed for PE and sport activities but some types are designed for loungewear and are not appropriate.

Maybe I’m just old fashioned?

Rest assured you're not going to see the outline of anyone's vagina through their leggings, it's not where their vagina is...

What about them showing their ankles or tightening their sweatshirts?

Quantum Erasure

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

I will most likely be wrong on this. (as usual) :pac:

But I'm going to call bull**** on this story for simple reasons.

1. I went through school 25 years ago and not taking your jumper off would have been a joke even in them old days.
....

I wouldnt be so sure, there were reports of kids not being allowed wear coats when sitting beside open windows all day, because rooms need to be kept ventilated, and rules are rules...

strandroad wrote: »

Rest assured you're not going to see the outline of anyone's vagina through their leggings, it's not where their vagina is...

Vulva so, if that makes it any better...

strandroad

strandroad wrote: »

Rest assured you're not going to see the outline of anyone's vagina through their leggings, it's not where their vagina is...

What about them showing their ankles or tightening their sweatshirts?

Ever hear of camel toe?
Certain leggings are less "accommodating" than others. Grey must be the worst.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

I will most likely be wrong on this. (as usual) :pac:

But I'm going to call bull**** on this story for simple reasons.

1. I went through school 25 years ago and not taking your jumper off would have been a joke even in them old days.

2. Most teachers I am friendly with are female, and they are not stupid people, none of them are living in the 1950s


Its social media driven journo clickbait.

We weren’t allowed to take our jumpers off in school!

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

MikeOxsgreen wrote: »

Ever hear of camel toe?
Certain leggings are less "accommodating" than others. Grey must be the worst.

Think they mean it’s the vulva you would see. The vagina is internal.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Think they mean it’s the vulva you would see. The vagina is internal.

Pedantic, but anatomically correct!

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

MikeOxsgreen wrote: »

Pedantic, but anatomically correct!

I know. Personally I say vagina for my outdoor bits. Vulva sounds too like biology class.

strandroad

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

I know. Personally I say vagina for my outdoor bits. Vulva sounds too like biology class.

There's also labia!
Poor vaginas get blamed for everything.

Gatling

I believe the letter originated from America and has slowly been introduced in the UK and here hence the wording , similar applied to dress codes for teaching staff including a reference to gang affiliated tattoos .

But I believe they should impose stricter uniform controls rather than send a letter like that out ,
Saves hassle for all involved

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

We weren’t allowed to take our jumpers off in school!

What? Why? Were you naked underneath or something? Wierd.

I was in a mixed sex small town local "tech" and (as far as I remember) the girls could take their jumpers off without comment.

Three was no PE as a subject of course, if it was mentioned at all it was just a free class.

strandroad

strandroad wrote: »

There's also labia!
Poor vaginas get blamed for everything.

+1 The first day I touched one, I was in the road to hell.:pac:

Quantum Erasure

Gatling wrote: »

I believe the letter originated from America and has slowly been introduced in the UK and here hence the wording , similar applied to dress codes for teaching staff including a reference to gang affiliated tattoos .

But I believe they should impose stricter uniform controls rather than send a letter like that out ,
Saves hassle for all involved

What letter?

Strumms

Walk into any gym, you’ll see females wearing shorts, leggings, vests, t-shirts, whatever is comfortable and suitable to exercise in. Why that option(s) is denied to students in this case is strange. To quite simply ban suitable exercise clothing... hmmm

If the principal is concerned about the possibility of a ‘reaction’ of a teacher to a girl attired in gym clothing, he needs to address a more substantial problem in his school.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

What? Why? Were you naked underneath or something? Wierd.

I was in a mixed sex small town local "tech" and (as far as I remember) the girls could take their jumpers off without comment.

Three was no PE as a subject of course, if it was mentioned at all it was just a free class.

Oh stop, it was ridiculous. Our vice principal was an officious jobsworth (and commanded no respect for that very reason). Listen to this for pettiness: there was also a rule that we couldn’t wear our coats indoors. Not even in the depths of winter in a cold, cold school. One very cold day, the heating was broken and we informed that we were allowed to wear our coats inside. Just before the last class of the day, the vice principal came on the intercom and told us that the heating had been fixed and to take off our coats immediately. This was 40 minutes before the end of the school day. The class would have been over before you’d feel the effects of the heating. I swear to god, an audible groan rose up through out the school. How petty can you get? As far as I recall, the teacher of my class told us to keep our jackets on.

steinbock123

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Think they mean it’s the vulva you would see. The vagina is internal.

Myself and a female friend were sitting in the car having coffee and sandwiches after our walk, when three girls and three boys came out of the nearby shop and stood close to our car eating ice cream cones. They were in the 12 to 14 age bracket. The three girls were wearing leggings that were (as we used to say) “sprayed on”.
My friend remarked on the girls, at how young they were and how provocative their cloths were. You could clearly see their knickers and my friend remarked “ you can see yer’ wans fanny” , which indeed you could, or certainly the outline of it. Call me old fashioned, but when I was a similar age, the girls never dressed like that. Or wore pyjamas to the supermarket for that matter .
When my daughter was 14, I’d have never let her out in such gear.
I can understand the head teacher calling them out on these sort of outfits, but he shouldn’t have said they were distracting the teachers, that’ll only be a rod for his own back.
I know girls especially are very fashion conscious, but there’s a time and a place for everything.

Larbre34

My God the pendantry. We all know what we're talking about.

The school has a uniform. We're talking about PE and after school sports.

Now, I personally sincerely doubt that any male teacher brought this up as an issue. Why? Because of the VERY stigma being discussed all day since this was publicised. Any male staff member in a school, especially with a 2 to 1 female majority staff, is more aware than any other man alive these days, of the need to be absolutely beyond reproach when it comes to appropriate relationships and association with children. Especially professional educators in loco parentis, who are afraid of their lives to even walk alone with a student in case they end up out of sight of other people.

What I'm saying is, even if the sight of a teenage girl in skintight apparel "distracted me", and lets be honest its very possible, its the very last thing I would ever bring up officially as a problem, UNLESS the students were using their clothing to in some way deliberately create uncomfortable or disruptive situations for teachers and other students.

I suspect, and only suspect mind you, is that the mention of male staff being distracted happened accidentally, under pressure perhaps from indignant students, as a throw away remark that became incendiary.

In any case, the way this was handled was a management failing. What got into their heads singling out the female students for this address is absolutely beyond me. It was overblown and entirely inappropriate, when a simple communication to parents reminding them of the existing dress code would have sufficed, if indeed that much was even necessary. The school's Board of Management will have to investigate that sequence of events.

But, I can tell you if I was a male teacher in that school, and I found myself under a glare of suspicion and derision through no fault of my own or failing of my work or responsibility to the kids, I'd be talking to a solicitor. Because someone in authority just ****ed up life for everyone.

Quantum Erasure

steinbock123 wrote: »

My friend remarked on the girls, at how young they were and how provocative their cloths were. You could clearly see their knickers and my friend remarked “ you can see yer’ wans fanny” , which indeed you could, or certainly the outline of it..

I'd be worried about your friend, noticing things like that, something not right there...

/s

applehunter

If I were a male teacher I’d be getting legal advice.

Quantum Erasure

I suspect, and only suspect mind you, is that the mention of male staff being distracted happened accidentally, under pressure perhaps from indignant students, as a throw away remark that became incendiary.

Do we know if it was even said, or is it just an inference someone drew,

Larbre34

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

I'd be worried about your friend, noticing things like that, something not right there...

/s

Female friend he said.

My wife says the same thing to me all the time, even about her own niece wearing sprayed on sportswear at age 15/16. They do show off their underwear and the contours of their lower bodies and I agree with her that its too much for kids that age.

Rubberchikken

Some leggings nowadays are barely better than a pair of tights.
I personally don't care what anyone wears and will defend to the death the right to dress as you please but I'm guessing not everyone thinks like that.

If it's a comment from the principal then it should be passed to the students in the correct manner and an explanation of the proper attire for p.e. explained to all.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

steinbock123 wrote: »

Myself and a female friend were sitting in the car having coffee and sandwiches after our walk, when three girls and three boys came out of the nearby shop and stood close to our car eating ice cream cones. They were in the 12 to 14 age bracket. The three girls were wearing leggings that were (as we used to say) “sprayed on”.
My friend remarked on the girls, at how young they were and how provocative their cloths were. You could clearly see their knickers and my friend remarked “ you can see yer’ wans fanny” , which indeed you could, or certainly the outline of it. Call me old fashioned, but when I was a similar age, the girls never dressed like that. Or wore pyjamas to the supermarket for that matter .
When my daughter was 14, I’d have never let her out in such gear.
I can understand the head teacher calling them out on these sort of outfits, but he shouldn’t have said they were distracting the teachers, that’ll only be a rod for his own back.
I know girls especially are very fashion conscious, but there’s a time and a place for everything.

I agree! I don’t think what they are asking for is unreasonable. I just think the wording is very bad. Whilst there’s the odd pervy teacher (my school had one), the vast, vast majority are nothing of the sort. I bet the teaching staff of that school are not happy at all.

Larbre34

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

Do we know if it was even said, or is it just an inference someone drew,

The article in the Carlow Nationalist by Elizabeth Lee says

"FEMALE students in Presentation College, Carlow were told not to wear tight leggings to school as it was “distracting” for their male teachers. Female students from sixth year right down to first year were called out class by class on Friday morning to be told that they shouldn’t wear tight clothing because it was too revealing of their bodies and made their teachers “uncomfortable”."

Take from that what you will, but you'd have to imagine the journo had to verify that key detail from several sources.

Aleece2020

Are some of these clothes inappropriate for their age group? Especially leggings with panels cut out and some parts clearly see-through? Absolutely. I agree that it’s not appropriate for young girls to wear things like that and it shouldn’t be happening.

But by all means them being dressed in revealing or tight clothes should not be a “distraction” (we all know that the word distraction has a much more sinister meaning in the context of this story) to an adult man; especially not one who works with children five days a week. If an adult is getting “distracted” by a child wearing shorts or tight leggings then there’s something wrong with the adult and they shouldn’t be allowed to remain around children.

Whichever male teacher(s) said that have some serious questions to answer. And if none of them said it, I’d be seeking legal advice if I were them because the way the principal has presented this makes it 100% seem like some teacher there is sexually attracted to children.

hynesie08

Question for the ladies in here, can you even buy tracksuit bottoms in Penneys? Or is it all leggings and jeans? Because it's all I've ever seen girls buy in there? Can you get a basic black loose fitting tracksuit bottom?

Quantum Erasure

Rubberchikken wrote: »

Some leggings nowadays are barely better than a pair of tights.
I personally don't care what anyone wears and will defend to the death the right to dress as you please but I'm guessing not everyone thinks like that.

If it's a comment from the principal then it should be passed to the students in the correct manner and an explanation of the proper attire for p.e. explained to all.

I'd say the principal thought he was doing the right thing addressing the girls separately, and not calling them out infront of their male peers...

It's a minefield out there these days

Larbre34

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

I'd say the principal thought he was doing the right thing addressing the girls separately, and not calling them out infront of their male peers...

It's a minefield out there these days

Then he needs investigating by the School's Board of Management, because irrespective of it being a minefield, directing this to the students rather than parents and especially doing it by isolating the female students was a dumbass move. Like honestly, pure bloody stupid and contrary to all good practice. His professional judgement must be seriously questioned.

Aleece2020

hynesie08 wrote: »

Question for the ladies in here, can you even buy tracksuit bottoms in Penneys? Or is it all leggings and jeans? Because it's all I've ever seen girls buy in there? Can you get a basic black loose fitting tracksuit bottom?

I don’t wear leggings personally, so I have not actively looked for them in Penny’s but I have seen them in there.

I wear the smallest size I can get in men’s tracksuit bottoms from Pennys. The ones designed for women that they have are made to be more stylish than functional and it’s not what you want when you’re at home trying to relax.

peekachoo

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

I will most likely be wrong on this. (as usual) :pac:

But I'm going to call bull**** on this story for simple reasons.

1. I went through school 25 years ago and not taking your jumper off would have been a joke even in them old days.

2. Most teachers I am friendly with are female, and they are not stupid people, none of them are living in the 1950s


Its social media driven journo clickbait.

I was in an all girls catholic school about ten years ago and we were told not to take our jumpers off during the summer. So I definitely wouldn't be surprised.