FF/FG/Green Government - part 2

Nobotty

James Brown wrote: »

False narratives should be pointed out IMO. You claimed it would have been the same or worse if they had have followed NPHET advice. That, in my book, is blarney.

What you are saying is Blarney IMO
If they followed Nphet advice fully,there would be a revolution by now and arguably a worse situtation,people dispairingly giving up
Governments are there to take all things into consideration including the wider economy
The difference between me and some here is,some here seem to just want to criticise criticise criticise instead of constructively criticise constructively criticise constructively criticise

FrancieBrady

Deleted User wrote: »

That was pre vaccination. Once vaccination ramps up, we’ll be back in business.

That is also a 'known' and is what is expected from vaccination.

Imagine if the government hadn't ignored the expert advice and caused the death and hardship of the last few months and we where down the vaccination road this far?

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

That is also a 'known' and is what is expected from vaccination.

Imagine if the government hadn't ignored the expert advice and caused the death and hardship of the last few months and we where down the vaccination road this far?

Imagine if Mary Lou hadn’t plugged it so much.

blanch152

Nobotty wrote: »

Staying locked down in november into january ,the run up to and including xmas wouldnt have done it Francie,there would have been multiple upon multiple of house parties and uncontrolable house mixing with the new variant
Pubs were turning people away in droves up untill 3pm xmas Eve,despite dire warnings that day on the news
Huge numbers didnt care
You only have to look at Wales which got worse and worse and then only slow improvement despite a pre xmas and post xmas lockdown
They're still in lockdown,a longer one than ours but only now are much improved but have a third of all adults vaccinated which has helped
This virus is trial and error
Not giving the break from lockdown in november and december I suspect would have lead to even more ignoring restrictions than there is now (and theres a lot!)

Common sense like that will only lose out to hysteria.

Nobotty

Whatisthisnow wrote: »

https://twitter.com/newschambers/status/1367155044731281415?s=19

At least the Hotel Quarantine is underway

Oh actually wait

I wouldnt be worrying about that yet,its probably a rush of people to get in here before qurantine hotels becomes law next week
At least theyre all pcr tested
A glance at sky news after any change in their quarantine list would show you that theres a rush pre quarantine

The people coming in this week are still subject to fines and spot checked home quarantine
Zero covid is impossible in Ireland without the NI Executive on board,Something lost on the Social Democrats
You can evade full hotel quarantine by coming here via NI if we unilaterally said hotels for all
So pointless and a void criticism
The 2000 euro fines next week will help a lot
But to be honest,we'd want to be and Id hope we will be vaccinating millions in 2 or 3 months especially when the Jaansen vaccine comes ,making a huge improvement
We should be requiring vaccine certs fir entry after that IMO

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Imagine if Mary Lou hadn’t plugged it so much.

Doesn't matter if Mary Lou, Micheal Healy Rae or Michael D Higgins dog asked them to do it Brendi...the government made the decision and many people paid with their lives and tremendous hardship.

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Doesn't matter if Mary Lou, Micheal Healy Rae or Michael D Higgins dog asked them to do it Brendi...the government made the decision and many people paid with their lives and tremendous hardship.

Ever hear of ‘ aiding and abetting ‘ Francie .

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Ever hear of ‘ aiding and abetting ‘ Francie .

Ever hear of 'the buck stops here' Brendi?

Jinglejangle69

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Doesn't matter if Mary Lou, Micheal Healy Rae or Michael D Higgins dog asked them to do it Brendi...the government made the decision and many people paid with their lives and tremendous hardship.

Yes and it was agreed upon by SF.

If you think the governments belief it was OK was wrong then you also think SFs belief it was OK was wrong too.

That all we're saying.

Noone is blaming SF.

Just pointing out they would have done exactly the same.

We're constantly told by SF their job in opposition is to hold the government to account.

Well they didn't on this occasion.

Fann Linn

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Yes and it was agreed upon by SF.

If you think the governments belief it was OK was wrong then you also think SFs belief it was OK was wrong too.

That all we're saying.

Noone is blaming SF.

Just pointing out they would have done exactly the same.

We're constantly told by SF their job in opposition is to hold the government to account.

Well they didn't on this occasion.

Not being a Shinner I can say they were wrong, but again they are not in govt.

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Ever hear of 'the buck stops here' Brendi?

Certainly did.

Francie, you can flim-flam all you like but the bottom line is that Mary Lou was the main cheerleader in looking for things to be ‘opened up’ for Xmas.

You’re like the guy who encourages people to take certain actions and then slinks away when it doesn’t work out, and denies any involvement.

No amount of ‘dancing on the heads of pins’ will get you out of that one Francie, so, spare us the tedium.

Top lad.

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Certainly did.

Francie, you can flim-flam all you like but the bottom line is that Mary Lou was the main cheerleader in looking for things to be ‘opened up’ for Xmas.

You’re like the guy who encourages people to take certain actions and then slinks away when it doesn’t work out, and denies any involvement.

No amount of ‘dancing on the heads of pins’ will get you out of that one Francie, so, spare us the tedium.

Top lad.

Bull**** batting for the government as usual there Brendi.

FrancieBrady

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Yes and it was agreed upon by SF.

If you think the governments belief it was OK was wrong then you also think SFs belief it was OK was wrong too.

That all we're saying.

Noone is blaming SF.

Just pointing out they would have done exactly the same.

We're constantly told by SF their job in opposition is to hold the government to account.

Well they didn't on this occasion.

Another 'government does somethng wrong..look at themuns' defensive post. Doesn't wash for a second.

Jinglejangle69

Fann Linn wrote: »

Not being a Shinner I can say they were wrong, but again they are not in govt.

I think we can all agree on that.

Jinglejangle69

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Another 'government does somethng wrong..look at themuns' defensive post. Doesn't wash for a second.

Not at all.

It's a fairly simple point.

Can't deflect what's obvious.

Whatisthisnow

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Yes and it was agreed upon by SF.

If you think the governments belief it was OK was wrong then you also think SFs belief it was OK was wrong too.

That all we're saying.

Noone is blaming SF.

Just pointing out they would have done exactly the same.

We're constantly told by SF their job in opposition is to hold the government to account.

Well they didn't on this occasion.

Sinn Féin this, Sinn Féin that

golfball37

I see a Green TD is bringing a high court action against the CETA Bill, asking if it requires a referendum.
The Greens surely won’t vote for this? It’s years away from approved in Germany so I don’t understand the rush to get it through here unless FFG are afraid the next government won’t pass it

James Brown

Nobotty wrote: »

What you are saying is Blarney IMO
If they followed Nphet advice fully,there would be a revolution by now and arguably a worse situtation,people dispairingly giving up
Governments are there to take all things into consideration including the wider economy
The difference between me and some here is,some here seem to just want to criticise criticise criticise instead of constructively criticise constructively criticise constructively criticise

Okay so
People are looking at things that happened and passing comment.
You are calling in from imagination land. If there was no revolution over the last crash, bail out, austerity, mother and baby homes cover up, there won't be over this.

Whatisthisnow

Nobotty wrote: »

I wouldnt be worrying about that yet,its probably a rush of people to get in here before qurantine hotels becomes law next week
At least theyre all pcr tested
A glance at sky news after any change in their quarantine list would show you that theres a rush pre quarantine

The people coming in this week are still subject to fines and spot checked home quarantine
Zero covid is impossible in Ireland without the NI Executive on board,Something lost on the Social Democrats
You can evade full hotel quarantine by coming here via NI if we unilaterally said hotels for all
So pointless and a void criticism
The 2000 euro fines next week will help a lot
But to be honest,we'd want to be and Id hope we will be vaccinating millions in 2 or 3 months especially when the Jaansen vaccine comes ,making a huge improvement
We should be requiring vaccine certs fir entry after that IMO

You wouldn't worry about 11,000 people arriving into the country. Do you believe all have followed the rules?
Is everyone who stated they arrived on holiday getting checked on regularly to make sure they are following the rules?
Why is their anyone allowed in on their holidays anyway?

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

Common sense like that will only lose out to hysteria.

It's medical expert sense, (not common) we should be listening to during a pandemic.

Whatisthisnow

https://twitter.com/McConnellDaniel/status/1367209117123825676?s=19

Fair play to Micheal for this.

On here we are led to believe alls going great

James Brown

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Yes and it was agreed upon by SF.

If you think the governments belief it was OK was wrong then you also think SFs belief it was OK was wrong too.

That all we're saying.

Noone is blaming SF.

Just pointing out they would have done exactly the same.

We're constantly told by SF their job in opposition is to hold the government to account.

Well they didn't on this occasion.

Is this were you tell us we are obsessed with Varadkar for mentioning him in a FG or Varadkar thread?
Sorry, go on, Sinn Fein...

Jinglejangle69

James Brown wrote: »

Is this were you tell us we are obsessed with Varadkar for mentioning him in a FG or Varadkar thread?
Sorry, go on, Sinn Fein...

Doesn't do anything to address any of the points I made.

Deflect deflect.

Nobotty

James Brown wrote: »

Okay so
People are looking at things that happened and passing comment.
You are calling in from imagination land. If there was no revolution over the last crash, bail out, austerity, mother and baby homes cover up, there won't be over this.

Figuratively speaking there would be a revolt which is what I meant
There already is against restrictions big time
Yes youre passing comment but absolving all of personal responsibility and ignoring reality
Fine on a forum
Different when youve complex decisions to take which the main fan groups party on here agreed with anyway
Im paying zero attention to the zero covid party as thats pie in the sky with the NI back door open

FrancieBrady

Whatisthisnow wrote: »

https://twitter.com/McConnellDaniel/status/1367209117123825676?s=19

Fair play to Micheal for this.

On here we are led to believe alls going great

How long until someone comes up with a way to blame the shinners?

FrancieBrady

After all the pedantry about 'main' Belfast - Galway road traffic volumes and other deflections from the core point by the usual defenders a few days ago - that the lockdown is being ignored - it seems that officialdom is now accepting that normal life has returned in large measure. Main item on the 9 O'Clock news.

James Brown

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Doesn't do anything to address any of the points I made.

Deflect deflect.

I'm deflecting by pointing out you're deflecting? That's some logic.

What do you say to people never voted SF in their lives? Do you think hiding behind SF is good enough? Do you think what others might do or said excuses FF/FG/Green incompetence?

James Brown

Nobotty wrote: »

Figuratively speaking there would be a revolt which is what I meant
There already is against restrictions big time
Yes youre passing comment but absolving all of personal responsibility and ignoring reality
Fine on a forum
Different when youve complex decisions to take which the main fan groups party on here agreed with anyway
Im paying zero attention to the zero covid party as thats pie in the sky with the NI back door open

Everyone is ultimately responsible for their own actions.
I never said otherwise. FF/FG/Greens still defied NPHET advice telling people it was okay to shop and socialise. What about the people who follow Covid instruction? If they went out after being told they could, are they at fault for listening to government?
I get most of my shinner info off these threads. They have no bearing on my opinion and it doesn't excuse the incompetence of FF/FG/Green.

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Doesn't matter if Mary Lou, Micheal Healy Rae or Michael D Higgins dog asked them to do it Brendi...the government made the decision and many people paid with their lives and tremendous hardship.

Thats classic in fairness.
Apparently the opposition according to you gets things done, but when decisions don't work out, its "Nothing to see here"

Having your cake and eat it. Let us not pretend if SF were leading a government that things would be magically better. It wouldn't be, it may well be worse.

Nobotty

James Brown wrote: »

Everyone is ultimately responsible for their own actions.
I never said otherwise. FF/FG/Greens still defied NPHET advice telling people it was okay to shop and socialise. What about the people who follow Covid instruction? If they went out after being told they could, are they at fault for listening to government?
I get most of my shinner info off these threads. They have no bearing on my opinion and it doesn't excuse the incompetence of FF/FG/Green.

Nphet is public health advice,if people were adhering to it,never mind the government,there wouldnt be a car on the road
In my opinion adhering to Nphet and Nphet alone without consideration of anything else is as flawed as the followers of zero covid or the followers of Ivor Cummins on the opposite extreme IMO
You to me look to be driven by an over arching post criticism all the time and dont look at any more considered analysis because the more important thing is the criticism
Thats fine,I dont dig it
Ive a poor opinion of many things about this government but I'm also a realist
Likewise Im confident Ill have a poor opinion on many things in the next one
Hoping Im wrong on that but I doubt it