Schools closed until February? (part 3)

SusanC10

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

I find it frightening that anyone in education had to be reminded not to have Christmas celebrations/concerts.

They are still singing in our Primary School which is why I want to find the link.

wirelessdude01

khalessi wrote: »

One class out of each year group in my school asked to perform one song for video, teachers of my year group refused due to risks and other advice. Kids school advised kids not to hand out cards this year in school instead make a card and stick it up in class.

My school sent out a note to parents advising no Christmas cards in school this year. What's happening instead is that the cards are being handed out at the gate and in the carpark. I'd told the principal that this would happen and that maybe the teachers if they were willing could hand them out in class after a quarantine period but was told that wasn't acceptable to them as it put more work on the teachers.

wirelessdude01

SusanC10 wrote: »

They are still singing in our Primary School which is why I want to find the link.

Think the no signing is about whole year/school kinda stuff where bubbles would be broken. This impacts massively in our school where the Christmas concert was a massive deal every year.

meeeeh

lulublue22 wrote: »

So we should only act when we are at the point were the death rate is extremely high - higher than the first wave rather than working to prevent a surge in Jan ?

It makes no odds to me the last 2 days are my fav anyhow great atmosphere and craic. However if the gov were serious about reducing / minimising contacts prior to xmas than it does make sense.

No we shouldn't imply that early holidays in Germany are some reward fir hard work or some act of generosity. Unless all lockdown measures are considered reward for hard work. Merkel considers them necessary to curb what is the most severe spread of virus Germany had through the whole of pandemic.

Ireland is not there.

Personally I don't care when kids are off although I do think extra days should be flagged well in advance unless it is absolutely necessary to act quickly. However don't use urgent pandemic measures as proof how unfair things are in Ireland.

JimmyVik

Tony and co have been saying for some time now that we are headed for another lockdown in Jan. Saying that our numbers will go up. Saying that we are at the low figure now and could have 1000 cases a day in January.

Pretty grim predictions.

Imagine if you could take a million people or even half that out of very close contact situations for two weeks before this predicted glut of new close contacts. That would be worth doing. Dont wait for the numbers to increase. Use a simple tool to attack them in advance. Move the holidays forward. Keep enough teachers working during the holidays to babysit the kids of parents who cant mind them. Too late for that obviously now, but I think it would have been worth doing.

Boggles

meeeeh wrote: »

Personally I don't care when kids are off although I do think extra days should be flagged well in advance

How advanced do you think is appropriate?

It's been flagged by public health for months that the reproductive number could double or worse during Christmas.

It was touted as an idea nearly a month ago by the unions.

England brought it in yesterday, Merkel is urging the states to do it now.

meeeeh

the kelt wrote: »

So we should only do something reactive rather than proactive in the fight against the virus??

Take a few days off now, no cant do that! Lets wait till more people are dying then we might do it.

Yep, makes sense!

We should do everything that's necessary but no more. The best thing to fight the virus would be to bolt everyone into their home and not let them out for the whole holiday period. However that would also cause damage in other ways.

The measures are only done if their benefits outweigh damage or hassle they cause. However if you want your grandparents safe then don't visit them. No matter how many precautions you take once you increase contact you will increase chances of transmission. That's how you will say lives not with two extra days off school.

the kelt

meeeeh wrote: »

We should do everything that's necessary but no more. The best thing to fight the virus would be to bolt everyone into their home and not let them out for the whole holiday period. However that would also cause damage in other ways.

The measures are only done if their benefits outweigh damage or hassle they cause. However if you want your grandparents safe then don't visit them. No matter how many precautions you take once you increase contact you will increase chances of transmission. That's how you will say lives not with two extra days off school.

We shouldnt do more, NPHET keep saying opposite though so when it comes to schools bare minimum is enough?

So 2 extra days off wouldnt also possibly save lives as an extra measure?

Dont visit Granny but sit in a room with 30 odd others all unmasked laughing, talking etc cos thats ok!

meeeeh

Boggles wrote: »

How advanced do you think is appropriate?

It's been flagged by public health for months that the reproductive number could double or worse during Christmas.

It was touted as an idea nearly a month ago by the unions.

England brought it in yesterday, Merkel is urging the states to do it now.

I don't it's necessary with our level of transmission. Do you think kids will be sitting at home those two extra days? The numbers show everyone clocked out of level 5 before it finished, what makes you think kids will be kept at home all the time. More likely they will be minded by their grandparents while the parents work.

meeeeh

the kelt wrote: »

So 2 extra days off wouldnt also possibly save lives as an extra measure?

Dont visit Granny but sit in a room with 30 odd others all unmasked laughing, talking etc cos thats ok!

The 30 odd others won't die of Covid but granny could. If you think your granny is in such a danger then it's up to you to stay away.

Boggles

meeeeh wrote: »

The numbers show everyone clocked out of level 5 before it finished

Do they?

Anyway, we are going round in circles, like I said the national campaign about keeping your contacts to a minimum on the run up to Christmas is undermined by having 1 million + people indoors, I passed a garage outside a school yesterday, looked like a Taylor Swift concert.

It was a sound idea when it was floated a month ago, it's a sound idea by the Brits and it's a sound idea by the Germans.

But no, because we want to stick it to those feckless geography teachers, no fúcking way are we having it here.

the kelt

meeeeh wrote: »

The 30 odd others won't die of Covid but granny could. If you think your granny is in such a danger then it's up to you to stay away.

So 2 extra days off wouldnt also possibly save lives as an extra measure?

meeeeh

Boggles wrote: »

Do they?

Anyway, we are going round in circles, like I said the national campaign about keeping your contacts to a minimum on the run up to Christmas is undermined by having 1 million + people indoors, I passed a garage outside a school yesterday, looked like a Taylor Swift concert.

It was a sound idea when it was floated a month ago, it's a sound idea by the Brits and it's a sound idea by the Germans.

But no, because we want to stick it to those feckless geography teachers, no fúcking way are we having it here.

Nephet said they do and that infections stopped falling.

What makes it sound idea. The fact that you agree with it? What are the numbers that support that. What is the actual logic behind. I don't think anyone is saying 7 days is long enough quarantine without test. So what is the benefit except it gives you some false sense of security that is not based on any actual scientific advice.

meeeeh

the kelt wrote: »

So 2 extra days off wouldnt also possibly save lives as an extra measure?

Tell me how many lives would it save. Or is possibly maybe if there is full moon and sun is in third quarter we will save lives.

wirelessdude01

Maybe those saying taking holidays a few days or indeed a day earlier should contact the relevant people in Britain and Germany and tell them they are making a mistake. Maybe ask them for the numbers and such like.

the kelt

meeeeh wrote: »

Tell me how many lives would it save. Or is possibly maybe if there is full moon and sun is in third quarter we will save lives.

Ive no idea.

Do you think it would save any?

NPHET keep telling us reducing contacts, especially contacts with others unmasked, indoors will save lives.

Are they wrong?

Or is it a case that saving lives and reducing case numbers is all ok unless teachers get a day off then whatever measure that may actually save lives should be dismissed?

meeeeh

the kelt wrote: »

Ive no idea.

Do you think it would save any?

NPHET keep telling us reducing contacts, especially contacts with others unmasked, indoors will save lives.

Are they wrong?

Or is it a case that saving lives and reducing case numbers is all ok unless teachers get a day off then whatever measure that may actually save lives should be dismissed?

Nphet are not telling us to close schools early. Are they wrong?

lulublue22

meeeeh wrote: »

No we shouldn't imply that early holidays in Germany are some reward fir hard work or some act of generosity. Unless all lockdown measures are considered reward for hard work. Merkel considers them necessary to curb what is the most severe spread of virus Germany had through the whole of pandemic.

Ireland is not there.

Personally I don't care when kids are off although I do think extra days should be flagged well in advance unless it is absolutely necessary to act quickly. However don't use urgent pandemic measures as proof how unfair things are in Ireland.

Was there an implication that this was a reward for hard work or an act if generosity ? I must have missed that I thought it was to reduce contacts to allow families to celebrate with elderly / vulnerable family members in a safe manner as I indicated in my post. My bad.

Lillyfae

lulublue22 wrote: »

Was there an implication that this was a reward for hard work or an act if generosity ? I must have missed that I thought it was to reduce contacts to allow families to celebrate with elderly / vulnerable family members in a safe manner as I indicated in my post. My bad.

That was what was mentioned in the first sound byte I believe. Acknowledge all the hard work etc etc. The next day, following the avalanche of criticism, there was a mention of reducing contacts before christmas.

mirrorwall14

SusanC10 wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/no-choirs-no-indoor-music-no-parents-schools-get-advice-on-celebrating-christmas-1.4432776

Does anyone have the link to this advice for Schools ?
I can't seem to find it on the DES website.

It’s the fecking 10th of September. DES ‘are’ to issue. Meaning they haven’t yet. Why not? It’s a bit fecking late tbh!

meeeeh

lulublue22 wrote: »

Was there an implication that this was a reward for hard work or an act if generosity ? I must have missed that I thought it was to reduce contacts to allow families to celebrate with elderly / vulnerable family members in a safe manner as I indicated in my post. My bad.

Wirelessdude stated that German essential services were given off extra time at Christmas. They weren't they are trying to implement stricter lockdown measures. That's what I was replying to.

eviltwin

How realistic is it at this stage to close the schools early? I'm working and finishing up early means one of us has to stay home and all the organising that goes with that.

JimmyVik

eviltwin wrote: »

How realistic is it at this stage to close the schools early? I'm working and finishing up early means one of us has to stay home and all the organising that goes with that.

I would say its too late.
You need to plan these things in advance, so both schools and the general population can plan around it. Its too late to plan now.

Boggles

meeeeh wrote: »

What is the actual logic behind. I don't think anyone is saying 7 days is long enough quarantine without test. So what is the benefit except it gives you some false sense of security that is not based on any actual scientific advice.

The median incubation period for COVID‐19 is four to five days. Most symptomatic people experience symptoms within two to seven days after exposure

.

JimmyVik

Boggles wrote: »

Do they?

Anyway, we are going round in circles, like I said the national campaign about keeping your contacts to a minimum on the run up to Christmas is undermined by having 1 million + people indoors, I passed a garage outside a school yesterday, looked like a Taylor Swift concert.

It was a sound idea when it was floated a month ago, it's a sound idea by the Brits and it's a sound idea by the Germans.

But no, because we want to stick it to those feckless geography teachers, no fúcking way are we having it here.

Ive said it before in this thread. I know several people who have said if its safe for 30 kids to sit in a room all day every day, its safe to bring those kids anywhere else.

wirelessdude01

meeeeh wrote: »

Wirelessdude stated that German essential services were given off extra time at Christmas. They weren't they are trying to implement stricter lockdown measures. That's what I was replying to.

Well we've been told often enough in this country that schools and education is an essential service. Before anyone jumps on me I do think we are essential but we are o on called that depending in the narrative that is being espoused in that day.

Boggles

eviltwin wrote: »

How realistic is it at this stage to close the schools early? I'm working and finishing up early means one of us has to stay home and all the organising that goes with that.

It's not going to happen, the time to plan for it was nearly a month ago when it was floated.

the kelt

meeeeh wrote: »

Nphet are not telling us to close schools early. Are they wrong?

Yeah quite possibly. If as below reducing contacts indoors with others not wearing masks etc is advisable and saves lives then its stand to reason that situation is the same in schools. It also stands to reason when you reduce the length of time people are in those situations of contacts the more lives you save.

Surely 2 days off to help curb spread would be an advantage? No?

Perhaps make the teachers go into the schools anyway so they dont get a day off might make it a bit more palatable for you and others?

Again

Do you think it would save any?

NPHET keep telling us reducing contacts, especially contacts with others unmasked, indoors will save lives.

Are they wrong?

Or is it a case that saving lives and reducing case numbers is all ok unless teachers get a day off then whatever measure that may actually save lives should be dismissed?

meeeeh

eviltwin wrote: »

How realistic is it at this stage to close the schools early? I'm working and finishing up early means one of us has to stay home and all the organising that goes with that.

Mine would have to spend at least some time with their grandmother. I can't process the wages and similar with them running around. It's not an issue because she comes over everyday for dinner anyway but if people think time before Christmas is delightful holiday time for everybody they are very much mistaken. A lot of people will be very busy before that and forcing them to quickly find who will mind their kids is an issue.

wirelessdude01

eviltwin wrote: »

How realistic is it at this stage to close the schools early? I'm working and finishing up early means one of us has to stay home and all the organising that goes with that.

Well other countries are doing/suggesting it so where there is a will there is a way.

It was suggested about a month ago in this country but shot down.