Is Paddy Cosgrove the biggest wanker in Ireland?

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121281579#Comment_121281579

Have Google, Meta, Stripe, Siemens, Amazon, Intel, IBM - the multinationals which suddenly ran a mile from Cosgrave's web summit because of his political utterances - announced any new jobs in Ireland recently, and if and when worldwide cut-backs are needed, will they be as quick to boycott Mary Lou and Michael D as they were to boycott Cosgrave? Would be surprised if not. Even you have hinted "multinationals are the problem". Not too long ago the military wing of SF were murdering and kidnapping foreign industrialists. Not everyone remembers that. I do.

Why would'nt at least some of the multinationals go to a country which is at least not perceived as being the most hostile in the western world to Israel? Would they support a government with Mary Lou / S.F. in charge - the same Mary Lou and SF who very much support the Palestinians? Who is it again who has praised Hamas in the past? Which party met Hamas and said they must NOT be demonised?

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121281676#Comment_121281676

Intel opens €17bn manufacturing expansion in Kildare | Independent.ie

And before you run off misquoting, I said 'multinationals are the problem IF they don't wish to see war crimes treated equally, whosoever commits them'.

I don't think that is their issue and that is why they have no issue that our government and President have said the same.

This is why I believe they pulled out of the Web Summit - brand and profit protection by not getting involved in politics within the tech industry:

 This incident highlights the sensitivity of discussing sensitive geopolitical issues within the tech industry. The withdrawal of industry giants like Google and Meta sends a strong message about maintaining neutrality and sensitivity in global conflict discussions.

Google and Meta withdraw from Web Summit after founder's remarks on Israel | Digital Watch Observatory

That was blunder Cosgrave made, involving them in politics - stupid in a business sense even if he was correct.

Bobson Dugnutt

A few withdrawals from this thread would be no harm.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121281812#Comment_121281812

When you are in a hole Francie, stop digging.

The multinationals say left the web summit because of political utterances from Cosgrave, and because they did not want to support him financially or by being there.

If your comrade Mary Lou was in government - and do not forget the S.F. Party has in the past met with key figures including the then-overall leader Khaled Mashal, and S.F. said Hamas must "not be demonised or excluded", do you not really think at least multinationals would want to distance them selves at least a bit from Mary Lou and her Palestinian flags?

After all, the SF party are more extreme than anything Paddy Cosgrove said or done? Poor old Paddy probably never met Hamas, and even if he did would probably never have said afterwards they must not be demonised.

Imagine a "party" saying those who kidnap and disappear others must not be demonised?

Wonder what the multinationals and the 222 Israeli hostages currently in Gaza would think of that?

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121281853#Comment_121281853

SF thread is that way >>>>

So can you explain why they have not left Ireland given that the President and Taoiseach are saying the exact same things as Cosgrave?

Can you explain how the 'most anti Israeli country in the west' is receiving 17bn in investment from just ONE multinational?

No, you can't with any credibility.

The credible answer is that within the tech industry they cannot be seen to have a side or to get involved in politics - the brand and the profits are much too important.

I

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121281948#Comment_121281948

If Intel is your best example, you are seriously deluded, just as your fellow SF supporter Cosgrave was deluded before he made his comments on the middle east conflict, - when he thought what he was saying would not go down badly in the boardrooms of Google, Meta, Siemens, IBM, VW, Intel, Stripe etc.

In March, Intel announced a 17 billion euro ($18.7 billion) investment to open a new chip fab in Germany, an R&D and design center in France and back-end production facilities in Spain, Ireland, Italy and Poland. Ireland is not the only European country Intel can or does invest in. Like you, Cosgrave thought the multinationals would not drop him - they did. And very very quickly. Like a hot potato.

Even if Ireland lost 50% of new investment, and 50% of the multinationals dropped supporting pro-Hamas regimes / politicians here (looking at SF, who said Hamas must not be demonised) as quickly as they dropped relatively neutral commentators like Cosgrove, would that not be an awful blow for the country?

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282024#Comment_121282024

The mad thing is that in two years time, if Sinn Fein are in government, condemning Hamas for their latest artocity and promising support for the Israeli government, Francie will be here telling us that Sinn Fein were right all along.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282024#Comment_121282024

In March, Intel announced a 17 billion euro ($18.7 billion) investment to open a new chip fab in Germany, an R&D and design center in France and back-end production facilities in Spain, Ireland, Italy and Poland. Ireland is not the only European country Intel can or does invest in.

😁😁😁

You do know what 'multinational means yeh?

And if you are going to quote somebody, quote them correctly because otherwise you might be accused of fabricating quotes again. Here is what SF said:

“no Palestinian political faction or section of society should be demonised or excluded from the conflict resolution process,”

Brendan Bendar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282111#Comment_121282111

Heh heh …. Posting telling folk how to handle quotes correctly…….😂

Gave me a good laugh there in fairness.

You have been blown out of the water Francis, you are not dealing with pork chops here.

Angus beef….23 days matured, buddy.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282083#Comment_121282083

Might be too late then though. As Paddy Cosgrove found out to his cost, multi-nationals do not mess around. And unlike SF, poor old Paddy had not even (as far as I know) Palestinian flags on his website. SF still does, and tonnes of anti-Israeli propaganda on it An Phoblocht, linked on the SF website.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282291#Comment_121282291

Until it becomes an embarrassment and then they vaporize the lot... Eurasia was always at war with Eastasia.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282459#Comment_121282459

😁

The day we see multinationals eschew profit for a moral political standpoint will be quite something.

I briefly worked for one huge and famous one back in the day. Our heads were filled almost daily about their commitment to us and Ireland and all our futures together and work harder to achieve our collective goals and other US style corporate spiels.

Soon as Eastern Europe waved at them with some EU incentives (greenbacks they are called in the US) they were gone and it was f* everyone here.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282516#Comment_121282516

We saw it last week when so many businesses suddenly withdrew from the web summit, because of the political utterances of Cosgrave, who has since resigned and issued a groveling apology but that was not enough. The damage was done, and even more multinationals have withdrawn.

Not surprised the multinational you worked for left and you fell out with them, if you spent all day posting on the internet about politics!

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282583#Comment_121282583

I am spending some of the entitlements I earned with them in my retirement Francis.

You still haven't come up with an example of a multinational pulling out of a country because of the politics of the government there.

How for instance do you explain multinationals investing hugely in China? Or RUssia before it fell foul of International Law as Israel and Hamas have been accused of doing?

You can't of course.

The only credible reason is the one I posted, multi-nationals pulled out of the Web Summit because Cosgrave involved them at a tech-industry level in geo-politics, something they all believe damages their brand.

 This incident highlights the sensitivity of discussing sensitive geopolitical issues within the tech industry. The withdrawal of industry giants like Google and Meta sends a strong message about maintaining neutrality and sensitivity in global conflict discussions.

Fact is again, if Leo, the President or SF want to criticise a country the multinational will stay 'neutral' on that. As they did in Russia, when there, China, India and any other diverse country they are trading in.

The scaremongering hasn't worked up to now and won't work IMO.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282660#Comment_121282660

A lot of Americans feel quite strongly on the middle east : not surprising considering 9/11, and the fact many look on October 7th as the Israeli 9/11, only perhaps worse in that innocents were beheaded, raped in front of families, 222 were abducted ( "disappeared" in pira language). etc.

They boycotted and withdrew, at great cost and inconvenience, because of Cosgrave's comments on the conflict, which he thought were neutral but which the multinationals perceived to be anti-Israeli.

If SF were to be in power, what do you think the multinationals would make of all the Palestinian flags on the SF website, Adams meeting Hamas etc?

Given a choice of western countries to invest in, do you think they would invest in the most Anti-Israel one?

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282839#Comment_121282839

You have identified many of the concerns that ordinary people have about a Sinn Fein government.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282839#Comment_121282839

I don't believe looking at how they operate in the world and where they operate that they care about the political outlook of a government. They went against the US president's criticism and invested in China for instance.

The bottom line is profit and if getting involved in a geo-politics affects that they stay away from it.

Nothing else explains their actions up to now in the world or why they remain in so many countries.

They continue to invest in diversely different political countries = fact. They are even in countries that 'many Americans' think orchestrated and trained the 9-11 bombers.

A few Palestinian flags are not going to affect that. A FG/FF government criticising Israel is not going to affect that nor is the President commenting going to.

They stay neutral on a country's political outlook. Verifiable and consistent fact.

Cosgrave involved them directly and that was his mistake. Far as I know he has no votes here nor does he seem to be interested in standing for any party.

2smiggy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058317133/hamas-strike-on-israel-threadbans-in-op-mod-warning-in-op-updated-19-10-23

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058154947/the-wondrous-adventures-of-sinn-fein-part-3-mod-notes-and-threadbanned-list-in-op

....

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283006#Comment_121283006

Is there a point in that somewhere?

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282901#Comment_121282901

1. How does their (the multinationals ) investment in what you call " even in countries that 'many Americans' think orchestrated and trained the 9-11 bombers." compare to investment in friendlier countries?
2. How much manufacturing, corporation tax etc is paid by American companies in those countries? And per head of population?
3. Do you think Cosgrave, in making comments which he possibly thought were neutral but which the multinationals perceived to be anti-Israeli, got an awful shock when so many multinationals suddenly boycotted and withdrew from the Web Summit because of his comments? (We can assume he did, because he gave such a grovelling apology and resigned....but too late, the likes of Google, Intel, Siemens, VW, IBM, Meta, Stripe etc do not suffer fools gladly, be they Cosgrave, Higgins or Adams (who met Hamas etc, flies the Palestinian flag etc - much more than Cosgrove ever did).

tayto lover

I don't know much about Paddy Cosgrave but he was correct on the war crimes issue. Hamas and Israel operate in the same way. Neither are right and lives are more important than jobs or governments.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283211#Comment_121283211

You said "Hamas and Israel operate in the same way." It seems you not only do not know much about Paddy Cosgrave ( which you admit) but also about Hamas / Israel.

Hamas is a terrorist organization, and is seen and defined as such by both the EU and USA. In its recent invasion in to Israel it murdered, beheaded, raped minors in front of families, burnt babies , beheaded people etc, and kidnapped 222 people.

Israel, though not perfect, (what country is?) is the most democratic country in the middle east. Hamas wants to wipe it off the earth. Go figure.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283196#Comment_121283196

In the history of global corporations they have routinely invested in diversely different countries with different political outlooks and concerns.

There is zero evidence that suggests profit and brand will come before anything else.

The 'level' of their investment will always be related to the level of their activity and the ease of trading their global position gives them. It is that access that has them in Ireland as well as our tax rates.

None of the corporations I have seen comment have made any reference to 'anti-Israeli' comments. You seem to have fabricated that. Could you back that up?

They have commented on the political nature of the comment which was anti - Western countries not treating all war crimes the same.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283248#Comment_121283248

5000 dead already,

https://news.un.org/en/story/2023/10/1142687#:~:text=The%20number%20of%20people%20killed,ceasefire%20and%20more%20aid%20convoys.

222 children in 24 hours.

Israel, 'not perfect'?????

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283291#Comment_121283291

Again you have not answered the questions, you try to deflect. Do try harder.

1. How does their (the multinationals ) investment in what you call " even in countries that 'many Americans' think orchestrated and trained the 9-11 bombers." compare to investment in friendlier countries?
2. How much manufacturing, corporation tax etc is paid by American companies in those countries? And per head of population?
3. Do you think Cosgrave, in making comments which he possibly thought were neutral but which the multinationals perceived to be anti-Israeli, got an awful shock when so many multinationals suddenly boycotted and withdrew from the Web Summit because of his comments? (We can assume he did, because he gave such a grovelling apology and resigned....but too late, the likes of Google, Intel, Siemens, VW, IBM, Meta, Stripe etc do not suffer fools gladly, be they Cosgrave, Higgins or Adams (who met Hamas etc, flies the Palestinian flag etc - much more than Cosgrove ever did).

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121279276#Comment_121279276

In Lebanon I believe every citizen has a vote. In Israel 5 million Palestinians dont have a vote in the Israeli parliament. As Palestine is not independent then they should have representation in the Israeli parliament.

CGI_Livia_Soprano

What does Israel and Hamas have to do with Paddy Cosgrave??

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283339#Comment_121283339

Have you been under a rock for the past few weeks?

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283314#Comment_121283314

I don't have that information and it wasn't the point.

Look, you live with the fear corporations will depart if Leo and the President don't stop criticising Israel or if SF get into power. That's your choice. There is zero evidence to back that up if you look at the world with open eyes.

Nothing is going to change your mind. Done with you on this point.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283314#Comment_121283314

If Cosgrave got an awful shock when so many multinationals suddenly boycotted, then he is demonstrating that he is a naive gobsh!te.