Winter 20/21 - General Discussion

Arduach

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

It’s not. The prevailing wind direction in Newfoundland is off the North American continent.

https://www.meteoblue.com/en/weather/historyclimate/climatemodelled/gander_canada_5959335

By that logic you would expect Labrador and Newfoundland to have warmer summers than us with wind blowing off a very warm continent.

However the island of Newfoundland has an average summer temperature of 16°C (61°F), much the same as the southern half of ireland?

Arduach

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

There is unbelievably STILL multiple patches of snow lying about above 200 metres! Unbelievable given the constant rain we have had.

Could depend on what way the ditches are facing. I see it at home often enough, compacted snow with a high ditch sheltering the snow from rain. In February 1996 we had snow lying until the end of February that fell on the 30th January. Same with snow that fell around the 2nd Feb 2009, it was there until the end of the month in favoured spots. We're 336m asl.

Tyrone212

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

The Gulf Stream isn’t directly responsible for our mild weather. It’s the winds.

Well without the gulf stream winters in this part of the world are estimated to be 5c or more cooler.

Tyrone212

Arduach wrote: »

4C is a big difference Nqp when it comes to moderating air flows. Of course next week's airflow has far less ocean to travel over. But in general most weather coming from the other directions are being moderated by gulf stream ocean. Hence the difference between Labrador and Ireland being at the same latitude but their climate being much colder.

I completely agree.

St. John's newfoundland

The average water temperature in St. John's in winter reaches 1°C/33.8°F, in spring 1°C/33.8°F, in summer the average temperature rises to 11°C/51.8°F, and in autumn it is 9°C/48.2°F.

Average sea temperature in galway in winter is 8c. 10c in spring. 15c in summer.

So a 7c difference in winter. Which has massive impacts. How often does cold air get modified travelling over the relatively mild ocean and we end with cold rain or sleet. 7c cooler you wouldn't have to worry about that. So the ocean currents make a massive difference.

circadian

Seymour20 wrote: »

A bleak climate similar to ours on the west coast of Canada would be Haida Gwaii. Believe it’s pretty bleak climate wise.

Pacific BC is both spectaculary wet and spectaculary beautiful.

Nqp15hhu

Arduach wrote: »

By that logic you would expect Labrador and Newfoundland to have warmer summers than us with wind blowing off a very warm continent.

However the island of Newfoundland has an average summer temperature of 16°C (61°F), much the same as the southern half of ireland?

No. The average summer highs is around 22-23c which is similar to southern England.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Falls-Windsor

Nqp15hhu

Tyrone212 wrote: »

Well without the gulf stream winters in this part of the world are estimated to be 5c or more cooler.

I seriously doubt it. We would possibly be in between Reykjavik and Torshavn. Cold spells wouldn’t be moderated as much.

But the ocean would still be relatively mild at 5c.

Nqp15hhu

Tyrone212 wrote: »

I completely agree.

St. John's newfoundland

The average water temperature in St. John's in winter reaches 1°C/33.8°F, in spring 1°C/33.8°F, in summer the average temperature rises to 11°C/51.8°F, and in autumn it is 9°C/48.2°F.

Average sea temperature in galway in winter is 8c. 10c in spring. 15c in summer.

So a 7c difference in winter. Which has massive impacts. How often does cold air get modified travelling over the relatively mild ocean and we end with cold rain or sleet. 7c cooler you wouldn't have to worry about that. So the ocean currents make a massive difference.

The air in Newfoundland doesn’t travel over ocean. It moves east from the Plains or SE from Baffin Island.

Tyrone212

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

I seriously doubt it. We would possibly be in between Reykjavik and Torshavn. Cold spells wouldn’t be moderated as much.

But the ocean would still be relatively mild at 5c.

Where are you getting your figure the ocean temperature would be 5c. Just a guess?

BBC climate
"The Gulf Stream brings warmth to the UK and north-west Europe and is the reason we have mild winters. Without this steady stream of warmth the British Isles winters are estimated to be more than 5C cooler, bringing the average December temperature in London to about 2C."

Tyrone212

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

The air in Newfoundland doesn’t travel over ocean. It moves east from the Plains or SE from Baffin Island.

You completed ignored what was said.

The sea temperature is 1c at St johns New foundland in winter due to the cold labrador current. Its 8c in Galway due to the gulf stream.

If we didn't have the gulf stream and a cold current instead like newfoundland our climate would be a lot colder due to much less modification of air masses.

Nqp15hhu

Tyrone212 wrote: »

You completed ignored what was said.

The sea temperature is 1c at St johns New foundland in winter due to the cold labrador current. Its 8c in Galway due to the gulf stream.

If we didn't have the gulf stream and a cold current instead like newfoundland our climate would be a lot colder due to much less modification of air masses.

It wouldn’t be a lot colder, it would be marginally colder as the ocean surface temperatures would still be in the “cool” category.

Nqp15hhu

Tyrone212 wrote: »

You completed ignored what was said.

The sea temperature is 1c at St johns New foundland in winter due to the cold labrador current. Its 8c in Galway due to the gulf stream.

If we didn't have the gulf stream and a cold current instead like newfoundland our climate would be a lot colder due to much less modification of air masses.

The mid Atlantic Ocean is not affected by an extensive ocean currents. The average sea temperature there is 4-5c.

Danno

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

It wouldn’t be a lot colder, it would be marginally colder as the ocean surface temperatures would still be in the “cool” category.

If the sea temperatures were 1c in Galway bay and all the way west across the Atlantic at Galway's latitude then any system coming over from Canada would make it here as wet snow right onto the coast too.

Tyrone212

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

It wouldn’t be a lot colder, it would be marginally colder as the ocean surface temperatures would still be in the “cool” category.

So by your own made up figure, a 3 to 4c reduction in sea temperatures around Ireland would only have a marginal impact on the climate. That's ridiculous. Anyway there's no hope or point.

Nqp15hhu

I just said that the mid Atlantic averages 4-5c

Arduach

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

No. The average summer highs is around 22-23c which is similar to southern England.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Falls-Windsor

An average night and day temperature of 16c in summer, same as Ireland. With air off the American continent it should be higher. Not because of the labrador current.

https://www.newfoundlandlabrador.com/about-this-place/climate-and-weather

Nqp15hhu

Continental Climates have a greater diurnal range.

eskimocat

"Evening all!".... wanders in, looks about, yup..."Long time no see!"....well things seem to be the same old, same old,...the charts just don't seem to oconfidently bring the promise of a nationwide blanket of snow, and thus leaves us all with the 'who is gonna get what, when ?' ..... It feels like an old classic of a song that comes on the radio and before you know it you are humming along.... Beast from the East, When the North Wind doth blow, then we shall have snow...and fond memories of previous forecasts and events tumble around your head. Then you show up in the Weather forum of boards.ie

Hope all the gang that I recognise on here are doing well, thanks for continuing to bring the interesting discussions and forecasting experience. To the newier crew, looking forward to seeing your insights and predictions. As for me, I'm just here for the F1 views, so i'll go back to lurking now.

noobsnow95

Would anyone be able to tell me what sort of scenario is best for Limerick in terms of snow? We never seem to benefit greatly from either easterlies or northerly fronts apart from a few flurries. Is a battleground scenario the most favourable?

Danno

eskimocat wrote: »

"Evening all!".... wanders in, looks about, yup..."Long time no see!"...

Lockdown cans bring out the bravery in all of us! :pac:

Welcome back, nice time for an "Eskimo" to turn up, hopefully you'll feel well at home this coming week!

Danno

noobsnow95 wrote: »

Would anyone be able to tell me what sort of scenario is best for Limerick in terms of snow? We never seem to benefit greatly from either easterlies or northerly fronts apart from a few flurries. Is a battleground scenario the most favourable?

For Limerick, the city I presume - you'd need a stalling Atlantic occluded front over Ireland positioned west of the Shannon.

Limerick City, along with west coastal Waterford and East coastal Cork is one of the geographically unlucky areas for snow on this fair isle.

Clonmel1000

Had what I think was about 10 mins sun today. God it was lovely and you could feel the rays. Some talk of icy cold weather again next week however unfortunately for those of us who don’t like cold rain and icy roads. February is still very much a winter month in fairness. For me Patrick’s Day is spring although how many parades have you been at where it’s been cold and wet! Syrah might have a rundown on Paddy’s Day for us closer to the time.

noobsnow95

Danno wrote: »

For Limerick, the city I presume - you'd need a stalling Atlantic occluded front over Ireland positioned west of the Shannon.

Limerick City, along with west coastal Waterford and East coastal Cork is one of the geographically unlucky areas for snow on this fair isle.

Cheers Danno! Here's hoping for something around these parts during the cold snap.

Dickie10

I am teaching climate to my second years at the minute. i love the topic but i think some are getting lost , theres simply so much science involved hard for some 14 year old to take in dosent help if they have neighbours or snapchat banging away in background i guess.

But i noticed sea currents seem to have a huge amount to do with climate. Only this week while researching the class i noticed that a lot of cold water curents that flow past continents inmid latitudes result in desert/dry climate. every day a school day !

Have a few other locations i would love to find out more on thier climate, one such is Kamatchka Russia

Arduach

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

Continental Climates have a greater diurnal range.

You said daily max average was around 22C. Again only a degree or so higher than us. Note my article about a short summer, 16c daily average. Despite wind from the very warm continent. It's obvious the labrador current cools down summers aswell as winters.

Nqp15hhu

Is it just my area? I can hear transatlantic flights at 30,000 feet + very clearly. Almost as if they are 5,000 feet above. Very odd.

Danno

Dickie10 wrote: »

I am teaching climate to my second years at the minute. i love the topic but i think some are getting lost , theres simply so much science involved hard for some 14 year old to take in dosent help if they have neighbours or snapchat banging away in background i guess.

But i noticed sea currents seem to have a huge amount to do with climate. Only this week while researching the class i noticed that a lot of cold water curents that flow past continents inmid latitudes result in desert/dry climate. every day a school day !

Have a few other locations i would love to find out more on thier climate, one such is Kamatchka Russia

Fantastic to read this - keep up the good work.

Nothing beats a teacher who will inquisitively seek out a broader picture of what is a complex science and relay this to their students.

Your students are lucky to have you.

Danno

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

Had what I think was about 10 mins sun today. God it was lovely and you could feel the rays. Some talk of icy cold weather again next week however unfortunately for those of us who don’t like cold rain and icy roads. February is still very much a winter month in fairness. For me Patrick’s Day is spring although how many parades have you been at where it’s been cold and wet! Syrah might have a rundown on Paddy’s Day for us closer to the time.

Interesting you point this out, one of two take away points of the Feb 2018 event for me was spending two hours out in the garden during a break between the streamers. Was with the kiddies building a snowman. I got sunburnt. That and the drifts from the big finale were the two memories.

Getting sunburnt on Feb 27th/28th (can't remember which afternoon) is certainly a novelty!

St. Patrick's day is probably a marker to the end of winter through a pagan calendar somewhere, but I'd never turn my back on snow till March is out.

Clonmel1000

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

Is it just my area? I can hear transatlantic flights at 30,000 feet + very clearly. Almost as if they are 5,000 feet above. Very odd.

Same here I’ve been scrambling to flight radar a lot the last few days staring longingly at the screen wishing it was me up there.

appledrop

Clonmel St. Patricks Day is always a strange one.

We always went to parade in City Centre as a child + yes I can remember freezing cold ones but also remember plenty when you would be lovely and warm in sunshine.

However I can 100% confirm that last few years have definitely been freezing cold/wet as I continue the tradition with my own child, apart from last year.