Past lives

Kaybaykwah

I don't want to finish in one of those bat soups, but if I'm lucky might end up doing a mile in a bat coupe.

Wanderer2010

Its very hard to believe by virtue of the fact that you can attribute practically any mental health or cognitive function to a "remembering" of a past life. Someone further up your family tree may have been great with boats and when a young kid shows a lot of interest in all types of ships, its often put down to trite sayings like "Oh he was here before" or "This isnt his first time here" instead of a natural evolutionary trait.

Or another example being getting gut feelings about a person good or bad and putting this down to seeing their spirit as some point in the past, whereas a lot of that is purely subconscious labelling of people and certain facial expressions which may have left an imprint on a developing brain so that their school bully suddenly is a demon from a past life or a helpful stranger who picked you up when you tripped is suddenly an amazing new friend who happens to have a similar face and body..

Mind you im not completely closed to the idea. I find it beyond logical that we are only on this earth for a few decades and then never exist again. This body is our earth suit as such and this planet is our school where we address, evolve and mature any aspects of our being that need attention. Does this happen successfully every lifetime? Of course not so you may have to repeat it a few times before you can evolve spiritually.

Hand in Your Pants

Despite what all the ten-a-penny dullards who read a popular science book once will tell you, we really haven't a clue why we are here or what the conditions or limitations of consciousness are. Try to find a way to be happy and make sense of the world whichever way you like.

screamer

We are but bones and brains and when we’re gone, we’re gone. There are no past lives, no future lives just the one you have and it’s short, so make it count.

Hand in Your Pants

screamer wrote: »

We are but bones and brains and when we’re gone, we’re gone. There are no past lives, no future lives just the one you have and it’s short, so make it count.

You are free to your opinions but you shouldn't present them as facts.

nthclare

Richie Dawkins who likes talking about rotting away and being an organic computer lol

I've no proof of an afterlife or reincarnation, but I like the idea of it.

I suppose if one really enjoys life and all it has to offer, they'ed love to come back.
But if I was a moany aul kunt hating religion and woo and live a life of being an atheist and battling it out about the non existince of different realms or thinking because I'm an atheist I'm more clever than a thiest etc then I'd prefer to be gone and never exist again.

Whether I live for a long time or die tomorrow I'll enjoy it to my best ability.

Wait for the all wise Atheists to come in to the discussion dragging their knuckles along the ground, pounding their chests like a bunch of jocks outside Copper's on a Sunday morning at 3am in the fog..

Wanderer2010

nthclare wrote: »

Richie Dawkins who likes talking about rotting away and being an organic computer lol

I've no proof of an afterlife or reincarnation, but I like the idea of it.

I suppose if one really enjoys life and all it has to offer, they'ed love to come back.
But if I was a moany aul kunt hating religion and woo and live a life of being an atheist and battling it out about the non existince of different realms or thinking because I'm an atheist I'm more clever than a thiest etc then I'd prefer to be gone and never exist again.

Whether I live for a long time or die tomorrow I'll enjoy it to my best ability.

Wait for the all wise Atheists to come in to the discussion dragging their knuckles along the ground, pounding their chests like a bunch of jocks outside Copper's on a Sunday morning at 3am in the fog..

There will always be disbelievers as long as humans exist. I feel sorry for them but thats their world, they are entitled to live it that way.

screamer

Hand in Your Pants wrote: »

You are free to your opinions but you shouldn't present them as facts.

I never said these were facts, that’s how you interpreted them. But this is my reality, yes. I have zero belief in anything outside of what we live here and now.

screamer

screamer wrote: »

I never said these were facts, that’s how you interpreted them. But this is my reality, yes. I have zero belief in anything outside of what we live here and now.

Really?.. kind of strikes me as pretty sad really..I'm not judging you or anything, but like, yeah..

nthclare

screamer wrote: »

I never said these were facts, that’s how you interpreted them. But this is my reality, yes. I have zero belief in anything outside of what we live here and now.

There's no scientific proof of reincarnation or heaven or hell but I like the idea of continuing on after this here and now, I love experiencing all the good things in life.
Imagine being a dolphin or an eagle, think about it or being a kid again and your grandfather lifting you up in the air and his lovely smile and the love on his face...

Kaybaykwah

nthclare wrote: »

There's no scientific proof of reincarnation or heaven or hell but I like the idea of continuing on after this here and now, I love experiencing all the good things in life.
Imagine being a dolphin or an eagle, think about it or being a kid again and your grandfather lifting you up in the air and his lovely smile and the love on his face...

No amount of fantasizing will solve the problem of longing to stretch your life into another said lifetime. I am not in need of comforting, and I think the idea that Faith and Hope are a more satisfactory option is delusional. There are generations before and after you, why would you want yourself to be brought back as a fawn or a bird? In your strange notion, rational folk don't experience the delight of living in the present, and wonder at the majesty of existence. Thoughts that are bound by scientific knowledge are more liberating and give way to more wonder than constantly disputed scriptures or else New Age constructs that promote wishful or magical thinking.

ger vallely

Someone I was close to growing up was convinced she had been an Egyptian princess in a previous life. I mean convinced. Said she had seen, many times in her memories, when slaves were sacrificed for her. I always found it odd though that this person was reincarnated in Finglas. Odd too that she had to have been a princess, not just a regular Joe.
She also 'hears' the nebulizer of another departed close person. It starts up, apparently, every so often in the upstairs bedroom. Just that person hanging around, letting her know they are still with her. Pain in the arse, eternal life but spending it on a feckin nebulizer. Not in the peak of your health.

Kaybaykwah

Kaybaykwah wrote: »

No amount of fantasizing will solve the problem of longing to stretch your life into another said lifetime. I am not in need of comforting, and I think the idea that Faith and Hope are a more satisfactory option is delusional. There are generations before and after you, why would you want yourself to be brought back as a fawn or a bird? In your strange notion, rational folk don't experience the delight of living in the present, and wonder at the majesty of existence. Thoughts that are bound by scientific knowledge are more liberating and give way to more wonder than constantly disputed scriptures or else New Age constructs that promote wishful or magical thinking.

A time is going to come in the not too distant future where this viewpoint is looked at in the same way you look at the views of the church and the like..

Everyone will be "ah, the atheist scientific materialists..shower of idiots.. imagine having that shallow a concept of reality.."..

Tiger20

Personally, I don't believe in reincarnation, and I didn't believe in it in my previous life as well

housetypeb

Deleted User wrote: »

A time is going to come in the not too distant future where this viewpoint is looked at in the same way you look at the views of the church and the like..

Everyone will be "ah, the atheist scientific materialists..shower of idiots.. imagine having that shallow a concept of reality.."..

Really? What's going to happen in the near future?

Kaybaykwah

Deleted User wrote: »

A time is going to come in the not too distant future where this viewpoint is looked at in the same way you look at the views of the church and the like..

Everyone will be "ah, the atheist scientific materialists..shower of idiots.. imagine having that shallow a concept of reality.."..

Yes, that will be a new Dark Age, entirely plausible.

Kaybaykwah

Kaybaykwah wrote: »

Yes, that will be a new Dark Age, entirely plausible.

No..

You don't realise how much has to be overlooked as it doesn't agree with your outlook..The scientific method will ensure that a tipping point will arrive where it's just no longer tenable to hold that viewpoint..

o1s1n

[Deleted User] wrote: »

A time is going to come in the not too distant future where this viewpoint is looked at in the same way you look at the views of the church and the like..

Everyone will be "ah, the atheist scientific materialists..shower of idiots.. imagine having that shallow a concept of reality.."..

Those 'scientific idiots' have a better understanding of the universe and reality around them than most religious people.

o1s1n

o1s1n wrote: »

Those 'scientific idiots' have a better understanding of the universe and reality around them than most religious people.

No..

They like to think they do..

But they don't..

housetypeb

Deleted User wrote: »

No..

You don't realise how much has to be overlooked as it doesn't agree with your outlook..The scientific method will ensure that a tipping point will arrive where it's just no longer tenable to hold that viewpoint..

Can you explain what you mean instead of hinting?
What's being overlooked?

nthclare

Kaybaykwah wrote: »

No amount of fantasizing will solve the problem of longing to stretch your life into another said lifetime. I am not in need of comforting, and I think the idea that Faith and Hope are a more satisfactory option is delusional. There are generations before and after you, why would you want yourself to be brought back as a fawn or a bird? In your strange notion, rational folk don't experience the delight of living in the present, and wonder at the majesty of existence. Thoughts that are bound by scientific knowledge are more liberating and give way to more wonder than constantly disputed scriptures or else New Age constructs that promote wishful or magical thinking.

You're well read I see, I have an Idea where you copied that from.
I think I have that book on my shelf somewhere.

Science is very important, but I wouldn't underestimate the power of magic or exploring the human psyche.

I'm not talking about makey uppy magic, but it's something way beyond a lot of people's understanding.

I'm not new age, woo or follow the Abrahamic God.
I've no interest in Wicca or witchcraft either.
I'm on a different path of adventure and wonder,I'm sure with your suggestion that I'm not a rational folk, you've already blown up the bridge and made up your own mind about me.
That's ok too, to metaphorically go for the jugular without asked any more questions.
That's the problem with people who are cock sure, is they're always right and lack humility.

I see you've used the word delusional,ouch that's meant to big up your response in a take that theist lol that word delusional has been thrown around many a time in discussions about faith and other ideas.

There's nothing wrong with being delusional in my book.
It's good to hop on a unicorn and fly over square rainbows now and again,and fly through solid tunnels with wall's of fire..

Whether a person is rational or not rational I'd never suggest they're unable to live in the present, that's a bad statement.

Even though people are away with the fairy's, and others are walking through life with inflated ego's they're all living in the present.

Maybe their heads are off somewhere else but they are still living and breathing at the same time as you and I, so I think some people are a bit delusional suggesting that some people are not living in the moment.

Kaybaykwah

nthclare wrote: »

You're well read I see, I have an Idea where you copied that from.
I think I have that book on my shelf somewhere.

Science is very important, but I wouldn't underestimate the power of magic or exploring the human psyche.

I'm not talking about makey uppy magic, but it's something way beyond a lot of people's understanding.

I'm not new age, woo or follow the Abrahamic God.
I've no interest in Wicca or witchcraft either.
I'm on a different path of adventure and wonder,I'm sure with your suggestion that I'm not a rational folk, you've already blown up the bridge and made up your own mind about me.
That's ok too, to metaphorically go for the jugular without asked any more questions.
That's the problem with people who are cock sure, is they're always right and lack humility.

I see you've used the word delusional,ouch that's meant to big up your response in a take that theist lol that word delusional has been thrown around many a time in discussions about faith and other ideas.

There's nothing wrong with being delusional in my book.
It's good to hop on a unicorn and fly over square rainbows now and again,and fly through solid tunnels with wall's of fire..

Whether a person is rational or not rational I'd never suggest they're unable to live in the present, that's a bad statement.

Even though people are away with the fairy's, and others are walking through life with inflated ego's they're all living in the present.

Maybe their heads are off somewhere else but they are still living and breathing at the same time as you and I, so I think some people are a bit delusional suggesting that some people are not living in the moment.

Yes, the square rainbows can't be explained away. The unicorns are long lived.

I would venture two potential avenues for theists who begin to doubt the actual merits of the fairy tales that were foisted upon their angelic little aureolas from day one. One would be to engage in Artistic pursuits in order to garner more of the same mythical creations. Two, would be to read up on the "magical" aspects of science that indeed seem quite illogical from a mundane point of view.

The thing about the Abrahamic god is that there are only foregone conclusions, and over time so much baggage added, disputes over the gospel that the edifice is a crumbling one. Scientific enquiry invites the dispelling of older notions but only after a series of checks and balances allows for the new to take the place of the old. With religion, the new usually happened at the pointy end of a sword.

nthclare

Kaybaykwah wrote: »

Yes, the square rainbows can't be explained away. The unicorns are long lived.

I would venture two potential avenues for theists who begin to doubt the actual merits of the fairy tales that were foisted upon their angelic little aureolas from day one. One would be to engage in Artistic pursuits in order to garner more of the same mythical creations. Two, would be to read up on the "magical" aspects of science that indeed seem quite illogical from a mundane point of view.

The thing about the Abrahamic god is that there are only foregone conclusions, and over time so much baggage added, disputes over the gospel that the edifice is a crumbling one. Scientific enquiry invites the dispelling of older notions but only after a series of checks and balances allows for the new to take the place of the old. With religion, the new usually happened at the pointy end of a sword.

That there lies the problem, whether it's religion, politics or mass hysteria the new usually happens at the pointy end of the sword, a sharp blade, and it progressed to bullet's, combustion and basically vaporisation...

It's hard to figure it all out, different personalities philosophical view's, world views etc
Just when people think humanity have a grip on it all then another cause awakens as we've seen recently people who have no say being called racist's because they won't take side's, men and women who don't disclose their opinion on an issue being told to pick a side because if you don't we'll make up your mind for you.

I suppose if someone lives a pretty nasty lifestyle and eventually mend their ways, reincarnation seems like a good way to come back and make up for lost time.

If people lived a life of misery and suffered abusive childhoods,seen a lot of pain and destruction heaven, and a blissful afterlife seems attractive.
If someone is really evil and left a trail of carnage and horror in their wake, it probably gives people comfort thinking that for all that nasty inviduals past they'll end up in the flame's of hell, and getting red hot poker's up their arse for all eternity.

A simple solution is hard in a society which is far from lacking complications and contradictions.

There's a lot of different people who have different ideas and opportunities, personalities and life stories, painful and joyful lives.
All trying to get through life.

Politics try to fix it, religion thinks it has the solution, philosophy tries to figure it all out.

There's no real answer in the present to a peaceful outcome for humanity.

Kaybaykwah

nthclare wrote: »

That there lies the problem, whether it's religion, politics or mass hysteria the new usually happens at the pointy end of the sword, a sharp blade, and it progressed to bullet's, combustion and basically vaporisation...

It's hard to figure it all out, different personalities philosophical view's, world views etc
Just when people think humanity have a grip on it all then another cause awakens as we've seen recently people who have no say being called racist's because they won't take side's, men and women who don't disclose their opinion on an issue being told to pick a side because if you don't we'll make up your mind for you.

I suppose if someone lives a pretty nasty lifestyle and eventually mend their ways, reincarnation seems like a good way to come back and make up for lost time.

If people lived a life of misery and suffered abusive childhoods,seen a lot of pain and destruction heaven, and a blissful afterlife seems attractive.
If someone is really evil and left a trail of carnage and horror in their wake, it probably gives people comfort thinking that for all that nasty inviduals past they'll end up in the flame's of hell, and getting red hot poker's up their arse for all eternity.

A simple solution is hard in a society which is far from lacking complications and contradictions.

There's a lot of different people who have different ideas and opportunities, personalities and life stories, painful and joyful lives.
All trying to get through life.

Politics try to fix it, religion thinks it has the solution, philosophy tries to figure it all out.

There's no real answer in the present to a peaceful outcome for humanity.

Yes well, that is a short shrift answer to our woes as humans. You can resort to magic thinking again for comfort while claiming there is no solution in our future because we all don't agree on beliefs and scientific compatibility.

So, if you offer solace to someone who was abused as a child by promising another life filled with unicorns, leprechauns and santy clauses, is that proper compensation for this present life?

Capt'n Midnight

Ipso wrote: »

How does re-incarnation explain exponential population growth? Can people come back multiple times?

Most past lives would have been hunter gatherers who died in childhood.

Most people who ever lived were prehistoric.

200 years ago there were one billion people alive , and close to 100 billion dead in the 50,000 years before that.

nthclare

Kaybaykwah wrote: »

Yes well, that is a short shrift answer to our woes as humans. You can resort to magic thinking again for comfort while claiming there is no solution in our future because we all don't agree on beliefs and scientific compatibility.

So, if you offer solace to someone who was abused as a child by promising another life filled with unicorns, leprechauns and santy clauses, is that proper compensation for this present life?

Offering compensation for someone's present life and emotional pain isn't exactly enough really, money doesn't fix a problem sometimes it can enhance it.

It's an inside job to recover from any abuse, whether it's mental, physical or sexual.

With the help of a good psychotherapist or hypnotherapy one can help themselves, maybe lifestyle changes too and a better diet, plenty of exercise and self motivation and acceptance play's a big part of letting go of the pain from the past.
It's always there but learning to live with is better than dying inside for the rest of your life.

Coping skills are very important.

So what if people believe in God or reincarnation leprechauns or demon's..

You'll always have people who think differently and are more aligned to something spiritual or God like.

Science might not have the instruments for measuring a lot of things, supposedly atoms or quarks can communicate through long distances, who's to say that we're not connected to something else outside of our selves.

If you've ever worked with optics or photography and seen how reflection and light can look different through a lense, and how orb's and light reflect in different directions.

You can see them through optics and photonics, but not with the naked eye.

I don't believe in a bearded guy in the sky listening in and watching my every move, judging my thoughts etc
But I do believe there's a lot of different realms and dimensions out there.

You don't believe that full stop so there's no point in scoring points about all these subjects.

Kaybaykwah

nthclare wrote: »

Offering compensation for someone's present life and emotional pain isn't exactly enough really, money doesn't fix a problem sometimes it can enhance it.

It's an inside job to recover from any abuse, whether it's mental, physical or sexual.

With the help of a good psychotherapist or hypnotherapy one can help themselves, maybe lifestyle changes too and a better diet, plenty of exercise and self motivation and acceptance play's a big part of letting go of the pain from the past.
It's always there but learning to live with is better than dying inside for the rest of your life.

Coping skills are very important.

So what if people believe in God or reincarnation leprechauns or demon's..

You'll always have people who think differently and are more aligned to something spiritual or God like.

Science might not have the instruments for measuring a lot of things, supposedly atoms or quarks can communicate through long distances, who's to say that we're not connected to something else outside of our selves.

If you've ever worked with optics or photography and seen how reflection and light can look different through a lense, and how orb's and light reflect in different directions.

You can see them through optics and photonics, but not with the naked eye.

I don't believe in a bearded guy in the sky listening in and watching my every move, judging my thoughts etc
But I do believe there's a lot of different realms and dimensions out there.

You don't believe that full stop so there's no point in scoring points about all these subjects.

Well,not too fast. I didn't argument on realms, dimensions. The difference is in my acceptance of certain truths derived by the need to explain without scientific enquiry. I am open to interpretations of universal phenomena tested, or theorized
by physicists, chemists, biologists but am not open to subjective interpretations by unsubstantiated claimants in the religious/spiritual category. There is a strong point to be made about other dimensions in physics. I am not debating the mystical, the puzzling, the magical aspects of universal phenomena, rather the interpretive on purely religious terms. I find the explanatory in scientific satisfying and dazzling in itself, no need for the mumbo jumbo of scriptural verse to define these and other aspects of life, least of all on moral terms.

Plenty of room to engage in constructive mumbo jumbo in artistic terms, which can easily replace the hierarchically imparted designs of church teachings.

joeguevara

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Most past lives would have been hunter gatherers who died in childhood.

Most people who ever lived were prehistoric.

200 years ago there were one billion people alive , and close to 100 billion dead in the 50,000 years before that.

You are right but also the theory (don't know what to ca) it) isn't limited to human to human. It is to every living thing so human population isn't the only thing that should be looked at.

nthclare

Kaybaykwah wrote: »

Well,not too fast. I didn't argument on realms, dimensions. The difference is in my acceptance of certain truths derived by the need to explain without scientific enquiry. I am open to interpretations of universal phenomena tested, or theorized
by physicists, chemists, biologists but am not open to subjective interpretations by unsubstantiated claimants in the religious/spiritual category. There is a strong point to be made about other dimensions in physics. I am not debating the mystical, the puzzling, the magical aspects of universal phenomena, rather the interpretive on purely religious terms. I find the explanatory in scientific satisfying and dazzling in itself, no need for the mumbo jumbo of scriptural verse to define these and other aspects of life, least of all on moral terms.

Plenty of room to engage in constructive mumbo jumbo in artistic terms, which can easily replace the hierarchically imparted designs of church teachings.

Not everyone can get their heads around science but I respect your position.
If your cognitive make up makes scientific research and explaination click more power to you.

Some people can't figure it out, not because they're thick it's because they're wired differently and that's ok too.
But I respect people's ability to make sense of it all.

I once used to ridicule religious scripture and religious people too, but it showed me that I was being a bit of a bell end.

I often described the Abrahamic God as being a destructive sand demon from the middle east, and that was pissing Christians off so I stopped pissing them off and now I keep those conversations with my pagan heathen like friends.

I like mysticism and mysteries, the Skinwalker ranch is very interesting.
So is the phenomenon of the Sasquatch and cryptoids.
The Paterson video is very interesting.

joeguevara

Science versus religion and being looked down upon always interests me. One thing where it really could integrate is string theory and infinite versions of universe. Reincarnation into that could fit quite well. Don't know much about it really but I never disregard something just because I don't believe in it.