screamer wrote: » We are but bones and brains and when we’re gone, we’re gone. There are no past lives, no future lives just the one you have and it’s short, so make it count.
nthclare wrote: » Richie Dawkins who likes talking about rotting away and being an organic computer lol I've no proof of an afterlife or reincarnation, but I like the idea of it. I suppose if one really enjoys life and all it has to offer, they'ed love to come back. But if I was a moany aul kunt hating religion and woo and live a life of being an atheist and battling it out about the non existince of different realms or thinking because I'm an atheist I'm more clever than a thiest etc then I'd prefer to be gone and never exist again. Whether I live for a long time or die tomorrow I'll enjoy it to my best ability. Wait for the all wise Atheists to come in to the discussion dragging their knuckles along the ground, pounding their chests like a bunch of jocks outside Copper's on a Sunday morning at 3am in the fog..
Hand in Your Pants wrote: » You are free to your opinions but you shouldn't present them as facts.
screamer wrote: » I never said these were facts, that’s how you interpreted them. But this is my reality, yes. I have zero belief in anything outside of what we live here and now.
nthclare wrote: » There's no scientific proof of reincarnation or heaven or hell but I like the idea of continuing on after this here and now, I love experiencing all the good things in life. Imagine being a dolphin or an eagle, think about it or being a kid again and your grandfather lifting you up in the air and his lovely smile and the love on his face...
Kaybaykwah wrote: » No amount of fantasizing will solve the problem of longing to stretch your life into another said lifetime. I am not in need of comforting, and I think the idea that Faith and Hope are a more satisfactory option is delusional. There are generations before and after you, why would you want yourself to be brought back as a fawn or a bird? In your strange notion, rational folk don't experience the delight of living in the present, and wonder at the majesty of existence. Thoughts that are bound by scientific knowledge are more liberating and give way to more wonder than constantly disputed scriptures or else New Age constructs that promote wishful or magical thinking.
Deleted User wrote: » A time is going to come in the not too distant future where this viewpoint is looked at in the same way you look at the views of the church and the like.. Everyone will be "ah, the atheist scientific materialists..shower of idiots.. imagine having that shallow a concept of reality.."..
Kaybaykwah wrote: » Yes, that will be a new Dark Age, entirely plausible.
[Deleted User] wrote: » A time is going to come in the not too distant future where this viewpoint is looked at in the same way you look at the views of the church and the like.. Everyone will be "ah, the atheist scientific materialists..shower of idiots.. imagine having that shallow a concept of reality.."..
o1s1n wrote: » Those 'scientific idiots' have a better understanding of the universe and reality around them than most religious people.
Deleted User wrote: » No.. You don't realise how much has to be overlooked as it doesn't agree with your outlook..The scientific method will ensure that a tipping point will arrive where it's just no longer tenable to hold that viewpoint..
nthclare wrote: » You're well read I see, I have an Idea where you copied that from. I think I have that book on my shelf somewhere. Science is very important, but I wouldn't underestimate the power of magic or exploring the human psyche. I'm not talking about makey uppy magic, but it's something way beyond a lot of people's understanding. I'm not new age, woo or follow the Abrahamic God. I've no interest in Wicca or witchcraft either. I'm on a different path of adventure and wonder,I'm sure with your suggestion that I'm not a rational folk, you've already blown up the bridge and made up your own mind about me. That's ok too, to metaphorically go for the jugular without asked any more questions. That's the problem with people who are cock sure, is they're always right and lack humility. I see you've used the word delusional,ouch that's meant to big up your response in a take that theist lol that word delusional has been thrown around many a time in discussions about faith and other ideas. There's nothing wrong with being delusional in my book. It's good to hop on a unicorn and fly over square rainbows now and again,and fly through solid tunnels with wall's of fire.. Whether a person is rational or not rational I'd never suggest they're unable to live in the present, that's a bad statement. Even though people are away with the fairy's, and others are walking through life with inflated ego's they're all living in the present. Maybe their heads are off somewhere else but they are still living and breathing at the same time as you and I, so I think some people are a bit delusional suggesting that some people are not living in the moment.
Kaybaykwah wrote: » Yes, the square rainbows can't be explained away. The unicorns are long lived. I would venture two potential avenues for theists who begin to doubt the actual merits of the fairy tales that were foisted upon their angelic little aureolas from day one. One would be to engage in Artistic pursuits in order to garner more of the same mythical creations. Two, would be to read up on the "magical" aspects of science that indeed seem quite illogical from a mundane point of view. The thing about the Abrahamic god is that there are only foregone conclusions, and over time so much baggage added, disputes over the gospel that the edifice is a crumbling one. Scientific enquiry invites the dispelling of older notions but only after a series of checks and balances allows for the new to take the place of the old. With religion, the new usually happened at the pointy end of a sword.
nthclare wrote: » That there lies the problem, whether it's religion, politics or mass hysteria the new usually happens at the pointy end of the sword, a sharp blade, and it progressed to bullet's, combustion and basically vaporisation... It's hard to figure it all out, different personalities philosophical view's, world views etc Just when people think humanity have a grip on it all then another cause awakens as we've seen recently people who have no say being called racist's because they won't take side's, men and women who don't disclose their opinion on an issue being told to pick a side because if you don't we'll make up your mind for you. I suppose if someone lives a pretty nasty lifestyle and eventually mend their ways, reincarnation seems like a good way to come back and make up for lost time. If people lived a life of misery and suffered abusive childhoods,seen a lot of pain and destruction heaven, and a blissful afterlife seems attractive. If someone is really evil and left a trail of carnage and horror in their wake, it probably gives people comfort thinking that for all that nasty inviduals past they'll end up in the flame's of hell, and getting red hot poker's up their arse for all eternity. A simple solution is hard in a society which is far from lacking complications and contradictions. There's a lot of different people who have different ideas and opportunities, personalities and life stories, painful and joyful lives. All trying to get through life. Politics try to fix it, religion thinks it has the solution, philosophy tries to figure it all out. There's no real answer in the present to a peaceful outcome for humanity.
Ipso wrote: » How does re-incarnation explain exponential population growth? Can people come back multiple times?
Kaybaykwah wrote: » Yes well, that is a short shrift answer to our woes as humans. You can resort to magic thinking again for comfort while claiming there is no solution in our future because we all don't agree on beliefs and scientific compatibility. So, if you offer solace to someone who was abused as a child by promising another life filled with unicorns, leprechauns and santy clauses, is that proper compensation for this present life?
nthclare wrote: » Offering compensation for someone's present life and emotional pain isn't exactly enough really, money doesn't fix a problem sometimes it can enhance it. It's an inside job to recover from any abuse, whether it's mental, physical or sexual. With the help of a good psychotherapist or hypnotherapy one can help themselves, maybe lifestyle changes too and a better diet, plenty of exercise and self motivation and acceptance play's a big part of letting go of the pain from the past. It's always there but learning to live with is better than dying inside for the rest of your life. Coping skills are very important. So what if people believe in God or reincarnation leprechauns or demon's.. You'll always have people who think differently and are more aligned to something spiritual or God like. Science might not have the instruments for measuring a lot of things, supposedly atoms or quarks can communicate through long distances, who's to say that we're not connected to something else outside of our selves. If you've ever worked with optics or photography and seen how reflection and light can look different through a lense, and how orb's and light reflect in different directions. You can see them through optics and photonics, but not with the naked eye. I don't believe in a bearded guy in the sky listening in and watching my every move, judging my thoughts etc But I do believe there's a lot of different realms and dimensions out there. You don't believe that full stop so there's no point in scoring points about all these subjects.
Capt'n Midnight wrote: » Most past lives would have been hunter gatherers who died in childhood. Most people who ever lived were prehistoric. 200 years ago there were one billion people alive , and close to 100 billion dead in the 50,000 years before that.
Kaybaykwah wrote: » Well,not too fast. I didn't argument on realms, dimensions. The difference is in my acceptance of certain truths derived by the need to explain without scientific enquiry. I am open to interpretations of universal phenomena tested, or theorized by physicists, chemists, biologists but am not open to subjective interpretations by unsubstantiated claimants in the religious/spiritual category. There is a strong point to be made about other dimensions in physics. I am not debating the mystical, the puzzling, the magical aspects of universal phenomena, rather the interpretive on purely religious terms. I find the explanatory in scientific satisfying and dazzling in itself, no need for the mumbo jumbo of scriptural verse to define these and other aspects of life, least of all on moral terms. Plenty of room to engage in constructive mumbo jumbo in artistic terms, which can easily replace the hierarchically imparted designs of church teachings.
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