Allow me to explain why the 'All Live Matter' hashtag is awful.

katiek102010

ELM327 wrote: »

the tweet?
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/blm-accused-of-spreading-hate-in-tweet-on-west-bank-6dbhdcfkk


Or the companies rolling back on blm?



https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/01/bbc-tells-staff-not-wear-black-lives-matters-badges-on-air/


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-8478173/Fans-social-media-droves-Sky-Sports-pundits-ditch-Black-Lives-Matter-badges.html

Cool, now it can be seen for what it really is.

Tony EH

BattleCorp wrote: »

From what I can see in the video is that the white couple are in their car in the process of driving away but the black woman is having none of it. It looks like she hit the car and was trying to stop them from leaving.

I'm not one for pulling a gun willy-nilly but a pregnant woman can't afford to take any chances.

So she stops the car and gets out with her pop gun?

Nah, I'm not buying that. She's exposing herself to more danger, not less. She's a clown, who probably couldn't wait to point a gun someone's face.

She could have just driven off.

There's no good side here. Both dumbasses.

Hannibal36

Tony EH wrote: »

So she stops the car and gets out with her pop gun?

Nah, I'm not buying that. She's exposing herself to more danger, not less. She's a clown, who probably couldn't wait to point a gun someone's face.

She could have just driven off.

There's no good side here. Both dumbasses.

I didn't dissect the video to see exactly what went on for her to pull the gun but it's amazing how soft some westerners have become and live in a kind of Utopian bubble that doesn't see murders and injustice anywhere.

This is real life,it is like the people expecting a cop working for a normal salary to somehow take some time and make sure he makes the perfect moral action,right in the middle of being attacked and having his weapon stolen.

JimmyVik

joe40 wrote: »

No I disagree with you on this one. Obviously we haven't seen the whole incident but it is similar to any no. Of road rage incidents that take place everywhere including Ireland.

I could easily imagine such a confrontation in Ireland. It may get heated and even threatening but no one would pull a gun.

That brought everything to a whole new level of crazy.

I'm not downplaying the black woman's actions, she was an arrogant knob and took race into the situation for no reason.

Didnt a guy kill another guy with a hurl a few years ago over road rage?

JimmyVik

joe40 wrote: »

She was in her car driving away. Where was the danger.

Pulling the gun was a total over reaction. Your justification for the action shows your bias.
If a black woman had pulled a gun in a similar situation you would be lambasting her for it.

She was calm, being attackled and tried her best to get away.
She is reversing out. Someone is standing behind her car. There is a load bang.
Now she has to stop, but also get out to see if she just ran over someone.
Not surprised she was terrified and used the gun to get them to back off.
Not my choice, but then i probably wouldnt feel as vulnerable as she did.

BattleCorp

Tony EH wrote: »

So she stops the car and gets out with her pop gun?

Yes, that is what happened.

Nah, I'm not buying that. She's exposing herself to more danger, not less. She's a clown, who probably couldn't wait to point a gun someone's face.

How do you know what she was thinking?

She could have just driven off.

No she couldn't, the other woman was standing behind the car preventing them from driving off.

There's no good side here. Both dumbasses.

Maybe.

JimmyVik

BloodBath wrote: »

It's not an over reaction. It's permissible by the conceal carry laws in that state. Brandishing the firearm can be done against a perceived threat of violence or damage to property which this falls under in both counts imo but that's ultimately up to the states judicial system to determine. Considering the video evidence I would say shes safe from prosecution.

As far as I can see the gun was not pulled with the intent to use it. Nobody dies if the aggressors back down and back off which they should have done before this. They still continued with the aggression even after the gun was brandished. It's really hard to side with the other party.

The gun laws themselves are another matter completely.

I would say she is not safe from the twittermob now.
The other side of this now will be the relentless bullying of this woman.
God knows what damage it will do to her mentally.
This is my biggest problem with these movements on social media.

hots

ELM327 wrote: »

the tweet?
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/blm-accused-of-spreading-hate-in-tweet-on-west-bank-6dbhdcfkk


Or the companies rolling back on blm?



https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/01/bbc-tells-staff-not-wear-black-lives-matters-badges-on-air/


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-8478173/Fans-social-media-droves-Sky-Sports-pundits-ditch-Black-Lives-Matter-badges.html

Cheers, it doesn't exactly seem antisemitic though?

1800_Ladladlad

img

Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, were each charged with one count of felonious assault, which is punishable by up to four years in prison.

Eric Wuestenberg, a veterans support services coordinator at Oakland University, has been fired from his job.

Oakland County Sheriff Michael Bouchard said the suspects each had legal handguns and concealed pistol licenses, but the charges stem from them using their guns to threaten the victims.

It was only after the videos had gone viral, state Sen. Rosemary Bayer made this statement

"There is nothing acceptable about what happened in Orion Township last night at the Chipotle, It is abhorrent to think that some in this country have such a sense of self-righteousness and entitlement that the idea of pulling a gun out on an unarmed child and her mother is okay."

Source

For every one of these videos, we see what the consequences are for otherwise law-abiding citizens, versus the consequences for the purveyors of hate and violence. Hopefully, justice prevails.

The full video so clearly reveals that they were being antagonized by the two people as they tried to leave. And it seems all of this was precipitated by a f*cking incidental bump. Which is not seen to have happened. So irrational, so juvenile.

Meanwhile, this couple will have their lives irreparably ruined. When will it finally be enough? The people filming clearly felt untouchable, because they are. They can antagonize freely knowing full well that the white people will be ruined if they dare to stand up for themselves.

ELM327

hots wrote: »

Cheers, it doesn't exactly seem antisemitic though?

Here's why it is, if you don't understand why.


https://www.glamourmagazine.co.uk/article/black-lives-matter-antisemitic-tweet

Not normally a source I would use, but as a black jewish woman she does a good job explaining why the tweet was antisemitic.

Rodin

Nothing in that video showed any racist language from the white lady towards the two (presumably) black shrieking banshees.

The pregnant woman was calm, collected and driving away.
Who steps behind a reversing car? It was the only way the car could leave.

I'd have pulled a gun on them too. Job done.

AbusesToilets

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

img

Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, were each charged with one count of felonious assault, which is punishable by up to four years in prison.

Eric Wuestenberg, a veterans support services coordinator at Oakland University, has been fired from his job.

Oakland County Sheriff Michael Bouchard said the suspects each had legal handguns and concealed pistol licenses, but the charges stem from them using their guns to threaten the victims.

It was only after the videos had gone viral, state Sen. Rosemary Bayer made this statement



Source

For every one of these videos, we see what the consequences are for otherwise law-abiding citizens, versus the consequences for the purveyors of hate and violence. Hopefully, justice prevails.

The full video so clearly reveals that they were being antagonized by the two people as they tried to leave. And it seems all of this was precipitated by a f*cking incidental bump. Which is not seen to have happened. So irrational, so juvenile.

Meanwhile, this couple will have their lives irreparably ruined. When will it finally be enough? The people filming clearly felt untouchable, because they are. They can antagonize freely knowing full well that the white people will be ruined if they dare to stand up for themselves.

Probably some counter suits for wrongful dismissal on their way.

Tony EH

BattleCorp wrote: »

No she couldn't, the other woman was standing behind the car preventing them from driving off.

She's backing up so that she has enough space to make her turn out of the carpark. The black woman then bangs on the rear of the car. When she gets back into the car she's turns left and carries on.

She could have just driven off instead of getting out of the car to wave her popgun around.

BattleCorp wrote: »

Maybe.

There's no "maybe" about it.

Cupatae

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

img

Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, were each charged with one count of felonious assault, which is punishable by up to four years in prison.

Eric Wuestenberg, a veterans support services coordinator at Oakland University, has been fired from his job.

Oakland County Sheriff Michael Bouchard said the suspects each had legal handguns and concealed pistol licenses, but the charges stem from them using their guns to threaten the victims.

It was only after the videos had gone viral, state Sen. Rosemary Bayer made this statement



Source

For every one of these videos, we see what the consequences are for otherwise law-abiding citizens, versus the consequences for the purveyors of hate and violence. Hopefully, justice prevails.

The full video so clearly reveals that they were being antagonized by the two people as they tried to leave. And it seems all of this was precipitated by a f*cking incidental bump. Which is not seen to have happened. So irrational, so juvenile.

Meanwhile, this couple will have their lives irreparably ruined. When will it finally be enough? The people filming clearly felt untouchable, because they are. They can antagonize freely knowing full well that the white people will be ruined if they dare to stand up for themselves.

Honestly thats a disgrace, she did nothing wrong they had conceal carry licenses and correctly used the firearm after trying to leave the situation, this is nothing more than political pandering... what did that man lose his job for?

Shes a license to carry that gun and use it in self defense which is exactly what was done.

Disgusting carry on, and a distinct bias and political pandering.

1800_Ladladlad

The NFL plan to play Black national anthem before the first week of games this 2020 season. What is a black national anthem? I didn't even know there was one! I don't see how playing a national anthem of one race would work to mend race relations that was been worsened in the US? Do black Americans not consider themselves to be citizens of the US. This is simply more division. BLM wants equality and inclusion but then accept for separate for their national anthem to be played in the fight for their "cause".



img


https://nypost.com/2020/07/02/nfl-plans-to-play-black-national-anthem-before-week-1-games/?utm_source=NYPTwitter&utm_medium=SocialFlow&utm_campaign=SocialFlow

Cupatae

I honestly have to laugh at people that try to argue against the use of guns in these situations, the fact that this man is being viewed in a negative and going by the current climate will prob lose his job or some other repercussions imposed on him for defending his property.

I guess he coulda just walked away from his home... someone could have been killed! let the mob take there course and morons that support this.

Its basically a crime now a days to not let a crime happen to you.

oyvey

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

The NFL plan to play Black national anthem before the first week of games this 2020 season. What is a black national anthem? I didn't even know there was one! I don't see how playing a national anthem of one race would work to mend race relations that was been worsened in the US? Do black Americans not consider themselves to be citizens of the US. This is simply more division. BLM wants equality and inclusion but then accept for separate for their national anthem to be played in the fight for their "cause".

I would think that should be a concern for everyone here, regardless of what your overall views of BLM are.

joe40

oyvey wrote: »

I would think that should be a concern for everyone here, regardless of what your overall views of BLM are.

From the newspaper article it looks like it is only for week 1, not for the full season.
Bit like playing Ireland's call at the Rugby..

It is obviously a response from the NFL for the lack of support given to Colin Kapernick when he was carrying out peaceful protest during the Anthem.

I do agree though it would be better to sort the issues but sow less division. Try to get everyone invested in the political system for real sustainable change.

On a slightly side note surely the confederate flags and memorbhalia, are even more divisive. They're literally celebrating a civil war with the United States of America. I could never understand how people can support both.
I know way off topic, just something that confuses me.

Cupatae

joe40 wrote: »

From the newspaper article it looks like it is only for week 1, not for the full season.
Bit like playing Ireland's call at the Rugby..

It is obviously a response from the NFL for the lack of support given to Colin Kapernick when he was carrying out peaceful protest during the Anthem.

I do agree though it would be better to sort the issues but sow less division. Try to get everyone invested in the political system for real sustainable change.

On a slightly side note surely the confederate flags and memorbhalia, are even more divisive. They're literally celebrating a civil war with the United States of America. I could never understand how people can support both.
I know way off topic, just something that confuses me.

How is playing a national anthem for one race Abit like Ireland's call ?

If anything black people should be outraged that they have a separate national anthem to every other American, are they american or not?

BLM is run by stupid people and supported by them. They are litterally doing black people a disservice at this stage.

MOH

joe40 wrote: »

Bit like playing Ireland's call at the Rugby..

No, not remotely

joe40

Cupatae wrote: »

How is playing a national anthem for one race Abit like Ireland's call ?

If anything black people should be outraged that they have a separate national anthem to every other American, are they american or not?

BLM is run by stupid people and supported by them. They are litterally doing black people a disservice at this stage.

Way to go sir. Sit here on an Irish message board and tell black people in America what they should be outraged about.

This is much wider than just the BLM movement.

BattleCorp

As an Irish person, I find Ireland's Call cringey. It's a pile of sh1te.

Cupatae

joe40 wrote: »

Way to go sir. Sit here on an Irish message board and tell black people in America what they should be outraged about.

This is much wider than just the BLM movement.

At the very root of all this is BLM that's just a fact, your damn right this stupidity is spreading further than BLM were now removing words like master , slave ,blacklist, whitening ECT...

You have people losing there jobs for saying all lives matter in a text message, you have mobs roaming around destroying shops and property, then you have the likes of urself speaking broadly on behalf of black people , telling people the phrase "white privilege" isn't racist or divisive, and on the other hand telling other people not to have an opinion. .

The hypocrisy and nonsense is strong in your posts joe but we already knew that. Your attempt at faux outrage is fairly predictable and lame.

joe40

Cupatae wrote: »

At the very root of all this is BLM that's just a fact, your damn right this stupidity is spreading further than BLM were now removing words like master , slave ,blacklist, whitening ECT...

You have people losing there jobs for saying all lives matter in a text message, you have mobs roaming around destroying shops and property, then you have the likes of urself speaking broadly on behalf of black people , telling people the phrase "white privilege" isn't racist or divisive, and on the other hand telling other people not to have an opinion. .

The hypocrisy and nonsense is strong in your posts joe but we already knew that. Your attempt at faux outrage is fairly predictable and lame.

I haven't expressed any outrage at all.
So where are you going with the "faux outrage" comment.?

Your post on the other hand is a simply a rant.

Where did I tell people not to have an opinion? That's just nonsense.

BTW the "Irelands call" reference was tongue in cheek I know the two are not comparable, not that I have a problem with the NFL decision.

Cupatae

joe40 wrote: »

I haven't expressed any outrage at all.
So where are you going with the "faux outrage" comment.?

Your post on the other hand is a simply a rant.

Where did I tell people not to have an opinion? That's just nonsense.

BTW the "Irelands call" reference was tongue in cheek I know the two are not comparable, not that I have a problem with the NFL decision.

Do you forget what you post instantly after you post it ? What's with the random bouts of amnesia?

Ireland's call ... Tongue in cheek ? Jaysus..

joe40

joe40 wrote: »

I haven't expressed any outrage at all.
So where are you going with the "faux outrage" comment.?

Your post on the other hand is a simply a rant.

Where did I tell people not to have an opinion? That's just nonsense.

BTW the "Irelands call" reference was tongue in cheek I know the two are not comparable, not that I have a problem with the NFL decision.

Jesus Joe. I was sticking up for you earlier in this thread.

Stand by your statements or don't make them.

Do you think that white people have it better than black people? Is that just in America or in Ireland too?

Do you think that alienating white people and making them kneel or encouraging segregation of races to be a positive step?

Do you believe that positive discrimination is good?

Do you feel, as a white person, you should feel responsible to make amends for bad things that historically happened to black people?

joe40

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Jesus Joe. I was sticking up for you earlier in this thread.

Stand by your statements or don't make them.

Do you think that white people have it better than black people? Is that just in America or in Ireland too?

Do you think that alienating white people and making them kneel or encouraging segregation of races to be a positive step?

Do you believe that positive discrimination is good?

Do you feel, as a white person, you should feel responsible to make amends for bad things that historically happened to black people?

Q1 just in America, not in Ireland

Q2 absolutely not,

Q3 depends on the circumstances, but maybe for short periods of time, but too complex to give a short answer.

Q4 Again absolutely not. I as a white person don't feel guilty. People are not responsible for the sins of their fathers or fellow countrymen.

I honestly haven't say anything to contradict those points, and honestly don't know what people want.

The ****ing "Ireland's call" reference was not a serious comment. I stand by absolutely everything else I have said.

My views are not particularly radical, millions of white people in the US would largely agree.

joe40

joe40 wrote: »

Q1 just in America, not in Ireland

Q2 absolutely not,

Q3 depends on the circumstances, but maybe for short periods of time, but too complex to give a short answer.

Q4 Again absolutely not. I as a white person don't feel guilty. People are not responsible for the sins of their fathers or fellow countrymen.

I honestly haven't say anything to contradict those points, and honestly don't know what people want.

The ****ing "Ireland's call" reference was not a serious comment. I stand by absolutely everything else I have said.

My views are not particularly radical, millions of white people in the US would largely agree.

Fair enough Joe. Apart from the answer to question 3 and question 1 we are in agreement.

Positive discrimination is racism. Tacking on "positive" to the start of it doesn't mask the fact that it is discrimination based on skin colour or ethnicity. The very fact that anyone could see any positive from it because it hinders white people is disgusting.

Also, being white in majority black neighborhoods in America, is not a positive thing.

Cupatae

joe40 wrote: »

Way to go sir. Sit here on an Irish message board and tell black people in America what they should be outraged about.

This is much wider than just the BLM movement.

joe40 wrote: »

Q1 just in America, not in Ireland

Q2 absolutely not,

Q3 depends on the circumstances, but maybe for short periods of time, but too complex to give a short answer.

Q4 Again absolutely not. I as a white person don't feel guilty. People are not responsible for the sins of their fathers or fellow countrymen.

I honestly haven't say anything to contradict those points, and honestly don't know what people want.

The ****ing "Ireland's call" reference was not a serious comment. I stand by absolutely everything else I have said.

My views are not particularly radical, millions of white people in the US would largely agree.

I could go on but ya get the jist.

joe40

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Fair enough Joe. Apart from the answer to question 3 and question 1 we are in agreement.

Positive discrimination is racism. Tacking on "positive" to the start of it doesn't mask the fact that it is discrimination based on skin colour or ethnicity. The very fact that anyone could see any positive from it because it hinders white people is disgusting.

Also, being white in majority black neighborhoods in America, is not a positive thing.

Thanks for your reply. On the topic of positive discrimination in any walk of life I would be very reluctant to implement it. For example quotas for female politicians is controversial, many women themselves are against it others see a benefit for a limited time to fix an imbalance.

When the PSNI was first set up they had a 50:50 recruitment policy, I'm sure they had more protestant applicants so I imagine there was some positive discrimination for Catholic applicants which was a good thing.

But overall I don't think positive discrimination is a good tool to fix inequality, it is much better to fix the inherent inequalities in a society.