Allow me to explain why the 'All Live Matter' hashtag is awful.

joe40

Cupatae wrote: »

I could go on but ya get the jist.

No I don't get the jist of anything.

You saying black people should be outraged about something, is not related in any way to me saying my views aren't that radical and would be largely supported by millions of white Americans.

My statement I can back up, your statement on the other hand is just your own unfounded, rather arrogant, opinion, on what black Americans should be outraged about.

Cupatae

joe40 wrote: »

No I don't get the jist of anything.

You saying black people should be outraged about something, is not related in any way to me saying my views aren't that radical and would be largely supported by millions of white Americans.

My statement I can back up, your statement on the other hand is just your own unfounded, rather arrogant, opinion, on what black Americans should be outraged about.

So i cant suggest black people should be outraged over having a separate anthem to everyone else...they shouldn't be segregated like that as they are as american as the next person. :eek:

But you can categorically speak for millions of white Americans? :rolleyes:

Joe i didnt think you could top your white privilege OG but bravo! you ve out done yourself this time! :D

joe40

Cupatae wrote: »

So i cant suggest black people should be outraged over having a separate anthem to everyone else...they shouldn't be segregated like that as they are as american as the next person. :eek:

But you can categorically speak for millions of white Americans? :rolleyes:

Joe i didnt think you could top your white privilege OG but bravo! you ve out done yourself this time! :D

Black people themselves can choose what to be outraged about and that is exactly what they're doing. You don't you need to suggest anything.

I fully accept millions of white Americans don't agree with everything BLM say nor do I for that matter. Abolish the Police for example is a stupid idea.

But millions do support the idea of a fairer society with better policing etc. and millions accept this is not the case at the moment.

The polling numbers for Joe Biden at the moment are very strong, and he has supported these ideas.
Also the thousands of white people that took part in the actual protests are proof that my views are not particularly radical, they're shared by plenty of normal Americans.

Support for these issues on mainstream media would also indicate fairly popular acceptance/support.

I don't claim to speak everyone, obviously there is a wide range of opinion, my point was my views are pretty much mainstream for many Americans.

I'm not saying anything that would be considered particularly controversial in America.
That is not the same as saying everyone would agree but many would.

You can keep repeating all you want about OGs it doesn't make it so.

1800_Ladladlad

https://twitter.com/BasedPoland/status/1279233631840600065


The McCloskeys became aware of plans that this “protest” was going to happen. Bother them and their attorney had called the st Louis police dept to make them aware of the plans and request help but they refused. Iv read today authorities will be looking for individuals who went on their property without permission that has been captured on their surveillance systems. Why are officials afraid to confront degenerates harassing and intimidating people. What I found to be funny is that they are making a clear effort to stay on their side of fence/gate.

1800_Ladladlad

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

https://twitter.com/BasedPoland/status/1279233631840600065


The McCloskeys became aware of plans that this “protest” was going to happen. Bother them and their attorney had called the st Louis police dept to make them aware of the plans and request help but they refused. Iv read today authorities will be looking for individuals who went on their property without permission that has been captured on their surveillance systems. Why are officials afraid to confront degenerates harassing and intimidating people. What I found to be funny is that they are making a clear effort to stay on their side of fence/gate.

Because dealing with mobs is very unpredictable and easily can escalate. Misunderstandings happen on both sides.. (and there's a lot of agendas at play) I suspect the Police don't want to be placed in situations which might give further ammo to those advocating against them.

Danzy

Deleted User wrote: »

Because dealing with mobs is very unpredictable and easily can escalate. Misunderstandings happen on both sides.. (and there's a lot of agendas at play) I suspect the Police don't want to be placed in situations which might give further ammo to those advocating against them.

That is what is happening and it is very dangerous when the police will step aside for the mob to target people in their own homes.

If the police are frightened of escalation to the degree that people cannot be secure then that is a fundamental failure

1800_Ladladlad

Deleted User wrote: »

Because dealing with mobs is very unpredictable and easily can escalate. Misunderstandings happen on both sides.. (and there's a lot of agendas at play) I suspect the Police don't want to be placed in situations which might give further ammo to those advocating against them.

Surely preventative measures would better than the situation escalating to the point where both parties could become injured or result in a fatality. Look at Chaz and the lack of action taken. Relentless "protests" like these only serve one purpose. to antagonize the homeowners, harass, intimidate and provoke them into reacting. Nobody should have to experience this in the safety of their homes. That goes for the mayor Seattle too when the CHOP gang turned up at it. The stance of waiting until a person/s to become injured or fatality wounded, in madness. Especially the couple in question

1800_Ladladlad

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

Surely preventative measures would better than the situation escalating to the point where both parties could become injured or result in a fatality. Look at Chaz and the lack of action taken. Relentless "protests" like these only serve one purpose. to antagonize the homeowners, harass, intimidate and provoke them into reacting. Nobody should have to experience this in the safety of their homes. That goes for the mayor Seattle too when the CHOP gang turned up at it. The stance of waiting until a person/s to become injured or fatality wounded, in madness. Especially the couple in question

Which is all very well and good when you have strong leadership who is willing to make the hard choices, but from what I've seen so far, the US doesn't have that. I'm not even talking about Trump. Right down to the city/district level, there is an absence of strong leadership. Everyone is covering their own asses, and that's not going to inspire the Police to set up, because they know that they're already on the line for everything that's gone before now.

I get what you're saying. I really do. In a logical world, it would be as you say, but we're past that now. Even before Chaz/CHOP we were past that. Public and online opinion has shown the power of the mob. The police are going to be very careful with regards to what they commit themselves to doing because they know they don't have any political backup. Not really.

Just as the police know that they're not going to get much support from the general population either. IMHO, people in the US are too quick to forget that the polce will remember how they're treated, and be less willing to place themselves at risk, just so people can turn away from them.. People love to talk about higher values, but it's always someone else who is expected to uphold them. The police, for instance, while excuses are found for individuals. Honestly, I suspect we're going to see the Police withdraw from these conflicts even more as time goes by, until they see some actual support from others..

Cupatae

joe40 wrote: »

Black people themselves can choose what to be outraged about and that is exactly what they're doing. You don't you need to suggest anything.

I fully accept millions of white Americans don't agree with everything BLM say nor do I for that matter. Abolish the Police for example is a stupid idea.

But millions do support the idea of a fairer society with better policing etc. and millions accept this is not the case at the moment.

The polling numbers for Joe Biden at the moment are very strong, and he has supported these ideas.
Also the thousands of white people that took part in the actual protests are proof that my views are not particularly radical, they're shared by plenty of normal Americans.

Support for these issues on mainstream media would also indicate fairly popular acceptance/support.

I don't claim to speak everyone, obviously there is a wide range of opinion, my point was my views are pretty much mainstream for many Americans.

I'm not saying anything that would be considered particularly controversial in America.
That is not the same as saying everyone would agree but many would.

You can keep repeating all you want about OGs it doesn't make it so.

When you condone the use of "white privilege" and see nothing wrong with it, when you see positive discrimination as acceptable... but claim to be about equality and ending racism...your scoring OG's

You get faux outrage about other people having an opinion but happily speak for millions urself in the very next post.. good lad..

Danzy

One outcome from the BLM protests will be a lot more dead black people, a lot more crime in black areas, less jobs, less services.

Large swathes of businesses in African American communities were burnt out and looted and won't be back. Less jobs, less services.

Not only is it dangerous now for police officers to defend their life but even normal policing can lead to political leadership and media hammering you nevermind the risk of a riot.

It is now career suicide to police black areas and it is political suicide in these Democratic run cities to increase policing in areas that are so violent and crime ridden that they are akin to cities in failed countries.

Sinzo

Danzy wrote: »

One outcome from the BLM protests will be a lot more dead black people, a lot more crime in black areas, less jobs, less services.

Large swathes of businesses in African American communities were burnt out and looted and won't be back. Less jobs, less services.

Not only is it dangerous now for police officers to defend their life but even normal policing can lead to political leadership and media hammering you nevermind the risk of a riot.

It is now career suicide to police black areas and it is political suicide in these Democratic run cities to increase policing in areas that are so violent and crime ridden that they are akin to cities in failed countries.

I agree with a lot of what you say.

But the police must have a root and branch reform to address:
- how militarised it has become
- retrain officers to become less authoritarian in their approach to enforcement
- weed out those candidates that are not mentally or psychologically suitable to perform the role.

This is more important than ever after the events of the past few months..

Danzy

Sinzo wrote: »

I agree with a lot of what you say.
But the police has to have a root and branch reform of how militarised it has become, retrain officers to become less authoritarian in their approach to enforcement and weed those candidates that are not mentally fit enough to perform the role.
This is more important than ever after the events of the past few months..

True

Sinzo

Sinzo wrote: »

I agree with a lot of what you say.
But the police has to have a root and branch reform of how militarised it has become, retrain officers to become less authoritarian in their approach to enforcement and weed those candidates that are not mentally fit enough to perform the role.
This is more important than ever after the events of the past few months..

It's just going to produce a force that is less capable of dealing with the problems that arise. I understand the need for reform within the police. They definitely need it. However, I feel that the police have changed to reflect the environment that they face.

However, the movement ignores/dismisses other causes for the trouble. And that is the high incident rate of black crime. Even if we were to assume that half of all Black 'crime' happens because of racial profiling and police racism, the remainder is disproportionate to the actual size of the population compared with other ethnic groups (apart from the Hispanic population). For real change to occur, there needs to be more than just focus on the Police, but hard questions being asked by the Black community about their own behavior, and attitudes. I've seen no interest in removing firearms from black communities, or breaking up the gangs... gangs which have been rather prominent throughout Chaz/CHOP, with real firepower.

There's just too much willingness to ignore/dismiss the Black peoples responsibility in all of this and focus entirely on the Police. Change within the police would be a good thing, but it's not the only thing that needs changing.

Sinzo

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It's just going to produce a force that is less capable of dealing with the problems that arise. I understand the need for reform within the police. They definitely need it. However, I feel that the police have changed to reflect the environment that they face.

However, the movement ignores/dismisses other causes for the trouble. And that is the high incident rate of black crime. Even if we were to assume that half of all Black 'crime' happens because of racial profiling and police racism, the remainder is disproportionate to the actual size of the population compared with other ethnic groups (apart from the Hispanic population). For real change to occur, there needs to be more than just focus on the Police, but hard questions being asked by the Black community about their own behavior, and attitudes. I've seen no interest in removing firearms from black communities, or breaking up the gangs... gangs which have been rather prominent throughout Chaz/CHOP, with real firepower.

There's just too much willingness to ignore/dismiss the Black peoples responsibility in all of this and focus entirely on the Police. Change within the police would be a good thing, but it's not the only thing that needs changing.

Well I do agree that everyone has to take responsibility.. the white AND the black community both have to look at themselves.

The State has to lead the way, afterall, it has to perform objectively on behalf of all citizens.

The blacks need to look at the deterioration of their family units, lack of positive adult male influence and a significant overrepresntation in crime.

However, poverty is a major determinant of crime.

Blacks are the poorest group in America. Are blacks the poorest group because of their higher prorata participation in crime or has poverty and disenfranchisement led them to crime.

As always, imo, the truth is a combination of factors.

The media; CNN and NBC on one side and Fox on the other, has become predominanyly partisan in their reporting. This has heightened tensions even more.

A balanced approach is required in order to find a solution.

Sinzo

Sinzo wrote: »

Well I do agree that everyone has to take responsibility.. the white AND the black community both have to look at themselves.

The State has to lead the way, afterall, it has to perform objectively on behalf of all citizens.

The blacks need to look at the deterioration of their family units, lack of positive adult male influence and a significant overrepresntation in crime.

Completely agree.

However, poverty is a major determinant of crime.

Blacks are the poorest group in America. Are blacks the poorest group because of their higher prorata participation in crime or has poverty and disenfranchisement led them to crime.

Actually, Native American Indians are the poorest group in America, and once you factor in those who are employed in the service industry but still needing help with poverty, whites are actually still the largest group. Which makes sense due to population, but it's important to consider that Black communities aren't alone with these problems. Racial problems exist for many groups, but so too do other social/cultural concerns for subgroups in the US.

As always, imo, the truth is a combination of factors.

The media; CNN and NBC on one side and Fox on the other, has become predominanyly partisan in their reporting. This has heightened tensions even more.

A balanced approach is required in order to find a solution.

Completely agree.

Sinzo

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Completely agree.



Actually, Native American Indians are the poorest group in America, and once you factor in those who are employed in the service industry but still needing help with poverty, whites are actually still the largest group. Which makes sense due to population, but it's important to consider that Black communities aren't alone with these problems. Racial problems exist for many groups, but so too do other social/cultural concerns for subgroups in America

Well I didn't include native Americans because they are less than 1 percent of the population. Also the main talking point at the moment is a out BLM.

Obviously there are numerically many more white Americans that are poorer than the average considering they make up between 66 and 75 percent of the population.

Sinzo

Black communities aren't alone with these problems. Racial problems exist for many groups, but so too do other social/cultural concerns for subgroups in the US.

I completely agree.

Sinzo

Sinzo wrote: »

Obviously there are numerically many more white Americans that are poorer than the average considering they make up between 66 and 75 percent of the population.

Yes, but that poor white population is on par with the Black community for lack of education, lack of investment/services etc. The US has allowed many areas of the country to slide into 'almost' 3rd world conditions. And while crime exists in these areas, it's not similar to what happens with regards to Black populations.

Which is why it's important to take a long hard look at Black culture and how that contributes to crime, in addition, to the external problems of racism, poor investment, unemployment etc.

But I think we're pretty much in agreement. A balanced approach is needed. one that considers all of the problems as opposed to just focusing on one.

Sinzo

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yes, but that poor white population is on par with the Black community for lack of education, lack of investment/services etc. The US has allowed many areas of the country to slide into 'almost' 3rd world conditions. And while crime exists in these areas, it's not similar to what happens with regards to Black populations.

Which is why it's important to take a long hard look at Black culture and how that contributes to crime, in addition, to the external problems of racism, poor investment, unemployment etc.

But I think we're pretty much in agreement. A balanced approach is needed. one that considers all of the problems as opposed to just focusing on one.

We appear to be singing from the same hymn sheet then.

I'm not sure that crime rates in disadvantaged white areas are any better than those in disadvantaged black areas...

oyvey

https://twitter.com/i/status/1279350600703115264

An example that some of these people are as much a danger to themselves as anyone else. Partly I think it's a new generational thing where they're so entitled they think traffic on a highway will just stop for them.

1800_Ladladlad

Two white females were mowed downed. Summer Taylor, 24, of Seattle is now deceased. Diaz Love, 32, of Bellingham is in critical care.

Police have been identified as the driver as 27-year-old Dawit Kelete. Kelete was booked into the King County Correctional Facility at 7:24 a.m. Saturday on two counts of vehicular assault, Bail was denied. Troopers say "impairment was not considered a factor."


img

Danzy

Sinzo wrote: »

We appear to be singing from the same hymn sheet then.

I'm not sure that crime rates in disadvantaged white areas are any better than those in disadvantaged black areas...

The difference is that quite a few black urban areas have crime rates that are so severe that they are some of the most violent places on earth.

Most countries in the world would station the army in places so put of control.

South Chicago, 600k blacks, bout 500 shot si far this year

joe40

Danzy wrote: »

Their rich kid revolution came to an end.

A young woman was killed, do you have to be so flippant.

I'm not expecting an expression of sympathy, but the loss of life at 24 years old is a tragedy regardless of the circumstances.

I hope the other person involved makes a full recovery.

Sinzo

Danzy wrote: »

The difference is that quite a few black urban areas have crime rates that are so severe that they are some of the most violent places on earth.

Most countries in the world would station the army in places so put of control.

South Chicago, 600k blacks, bout 500 shot si far this year

That is a good point. The crime is more extreme in those areas. I wonder does that have anything to do with the more concentrated nature of the living arrangements I.e. in the projects/public housing estates.

AbusesToilets

Sinzo wrote: »

That is a good point. The crime is more extreme in those areas. I wonder does that have anything to do with the more concentrated nature of the living arrangements I.e. in the projects/public housing estates.

A lot of those urban neighborhoods were terribly planned from the start. The food desert phenomenon, lack of adequate public transportation, lack of social spaces like parks or community centers. Good luck enticing businesses into these areas too.

AbusesToilets

AbusesToilets wrote: »

A lot of those urban neighborhoods were terribly planned from the start. The food desert phenomenon, lack of adequate public transportation, lack of social spaces like parks or community centers. Good luck enticing businesses into these areas too.

Yeah, but it's more than just that. You make do with what you have. Businesses move to areas which are stable. Even with a population base on the lower end of the income bracket, businesses would be set up to take advantage. Had businesses been allowed to continue, people would have been employed, salaries would rise naturally, and the services in the areas would improve... not by State intervention, but through the local community and local businesses investing in the area. But in many black communities, they didn't because they were essentially run out by the crime, and the gangs.

A lot of those communities are so run down, that they're easily comparable with the poor areas in third world communities.

Danzy

joe40 wrote: »

A young woman was killed, do you have to be so flippant.

I'm not expecting an expression of sympathy, but the loss of life at 24 years old is a tragedy regardless of the circumstances.

I hope the other person involved makes a full recovery.

It is sad, it could just as easily have been the driver, who found a mob had taken over the interstate.
His life is now ruined as well, just because he took a wrong turn.

Hopefully the other person will recover, she'll have a lot to live with.

SFC1895

Defund the police is it? Prepare to be run down by lawless savages so

Cupatae

SFC1895 wrote: »

Defund the police is it? Prepare to be run down by lawless savages so

Its a tragic way to find out how moronic their logic is, less police for a better society...

This BLM nonsense needs ending, causing too much damage to everyone involved and doing no good, its no leadership no clear goal, just a bunch of SJW, virtue signalers and a whirlpool of dumb ideas...the most productive thing they ve done is remove the word whitening off some L'Oreal products.

Cupatae

Cupatae wrote: »

Its a tragic way to find out how moronic their logic is, less police for a better society...

This BLM nonsense needs ending, causing too much damage to everyone involved and doing no good, its no leadership no clear goal, just a bunch of SJW, virtue signalers and a whirlpool of dumb ideas...the most productive thing they ve done is remove the word whitening off some L'Oreal products.

I'd love to know where all the money that people gave them has gone. There's been a lot of donations, and it adds up to a rather hefty chunk of money. It would be interesting to know... because I've seen no indication of them investing it in black communities.