Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

average_runner

CruelSummer wrote: »

I have heard of some companies bringing back their employees to work full time, while keeping them on the pandemic payment & just topping up their wages...what a waste of our taxpayer's money. The tax-payer paying for private employment. Really hope the Government are aware this is going on, and close whatever loophole is enabling this.

And did u report them?

Ginger n Lemon

Hurrache wrote: »

Oh, you're now going to believe the Irish media, particularly the Irish Times, after being critical of it only a couple of posts before hand?

Like I said, it's a pick and mix with you when it comes to what stories to use.

Irish times own HIQA? didnt know that. Article presents findings according to the report by the Health Information and Quality Authority.

Irish times are shi*e just like broken clock they tell correct time twice a day, this is one of those times.

pjohnson

Gael23 wrote: »

Now Holohan will experience the impact his restrictions have in people.
Not being able to visit his wife in hospital in her darkest hours and having to tell loved ones that they cannot be with you in your time of need

Breathtaking but expected for this thread.

Gael23

Gael23 wrote: »

Now Holohan will experience the impact his restrictions have in people.
Not being able to visit his wife in hospital in her darkest hours and having to tell loved ones that they cannot be with you in your time of need

Real nice guy, aren't you

Damiencm

Hurrache wrote:

Oh, you're now going to believe the Irish media, particularly the Irish Times, after being critical of it only a couple of posts before hand?

Hurrache wrote:

Like I said, it's a pick and mix with you when it comes to what stories to use.

It was a news item on Actual HIQA report, not sure what you are on about

Ginger n Lemon

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

This is getting out of hand

"Donohoe said that the wage subsidy scheme is “responsible for keeping over 400,000 people in a job” and that the government is “looking options in relation to the future of it”.

“What I can confirm now is that it will not come to an abrupt end, because were that to happen that itself creates the risk of jobs being lost,” he said. "

Asked would it be extended to the end of the end of the year, the Minister for Finance said: “This is a decision that needs to be taken by government, as I said, I and the last government brought in these payments, the value of them, and the value of the wage subsidy scheme in particular is recognised very strongly by the government. "

https://www.thejournal.ie/paschal-donohoe-wage-subsidy-2-5140462-Jul2020/

Universal income is here. How does he still believe that 350 euros a week "keeps people in a job" ?? What keeps people in a job is a bloody consumer demand. Its economy working and people being productive. If you give 350 euros a week to someone - are they being productive? no. Its absolutely shocking is is our minister for finance... f hell.

We get it Ginger, you don't understand. The WSS was to prevent viable businesses from going under / being forced to lay off vast numbers of employees when they had low / zero cash flow due to restrictions. This was done to keep the productive capacity of the economy in place as ultimately this is what will drive recovery. Doing otherwise would have destroyed the economy.

AUDI20

Gael23 wrote: »

Now Holohan will experience the impact his restrictions have in people.
Not being able to visit his wife in hospital in her darkest hours and having to tell loved ones that they cannot be with you in your time of need

Dr.Holohan only advised as part of the Covid-19 Medical Team, the Government imposed the restrictions. This post says a lot about the kind of person you are.

Ginger n Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

We get it Ginger, you don't understand. The WSS was to prevent viable businesses from going under / being forced to lay off vast numbers of employees when they had low / zero cash flow due to restrictions. This was done to keep the productive capacity of the economy in place as ultimately this is what will drive recovery. Doing otherwise would have destroyed the economy.

Didnt you say earlier that our economic damage is out our control?

Reality is, 350 euros a week, wage subsidy scheme, all of this just delays 203 euro collection for hundreds of thousands of individuals, at expense of tax payers.

Only way you can prevent this is by allowing tourism, removing restrictions that make businesses nonviable, and actually projecting some confidence as oppose to be talking up 2nd waves and "we can borrow, we have to borrow and we will borrow".

We are at 22.5% unemployment 6 weeks AFTER phase 1. 40k + construction workers sitting at home getting 350 euro a week. Lets keep subsidising? Lets keep that PUP to Xmas?

Ginger n Lemon

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Saw that - article below, will be revisited in the future I am sure

Ireland’s official coronavirus death toll likely to have been overstated, report finds

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/ireland-s-official-coronavirus-death-toll-likely-to-have-been-overstated-report-finds-1.4295324

1,200 excess deaths in 3 months during lockdown. In a typical year we have 1,000 or so deaths due to pneumonia, which a lot of the remaining 500 covid deaths probably borrowed from.

charlie14

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Irish times own HIQA? didnt know that. Article presents findings according to the report by the Health Information and Quality Authority.

Irish times are shi*e just like broken clock they tell correct time twice a day, this is one of those times.

HIQA`s report is speculative more than scientific.
The clue is in the fact that it is based on the RIP.ie website



HIQA is speculating that because Covid-19 deaths are more than the total of excess deaths based on the same period on previous years, then the difference is from causes other than Covid-19.
It could as easily be speculated that the numbers from other causes were reduced due to having lockdown.


If they really wish to compare excess deaths from Covid-19 using RIP.ie to give a truer reflection, then perhaps they should have checked the figures for deaths during the height of pandemic.
For the month of April research by Maynooth University and the University of Limerick using the same source shows deaths in some counties double that of previous year, with other counties showing increases of 50% and more.


Very shoddy work from from a body whose title is the Health Information and Quality Authority imo.

Ginger n Lemon

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Didnt you say earlier that our economic damage is out our control?

Reality is, 350 euros a week, wage subsidy scheme, all of this just delays 203 euro collection for hundreds of thousands of individuals, at expense of tax payers.

Only way you can prevent this is by allowing tourism, removing restrictions that make businesses nonviable, and actually projecting some confidence as oppose to be talking up 2nd waves and "we can borrow, we have to borrow and we will borrow".

We are at 22.5% unemployment 6 weeks AFTER phase 1. 40k + construction workers sitting at home getting 350 euro a week. Lets keep subsidising? Lets keep that PUP to Xmas?

This will be a depression if with dont protect productive capacity. If we have the productive capacity in the economy, stimulus, as will will be publishing this month I believe, can be implemented without inflationary pressure. If we lose the productive capacity in the economy, stimulus drives inflation. Economics 101

Hurrache

Damiencm wrote: »

It was a news item on Actual HIQA report, not sure what you are on about

It was published in the Irish media, which the poster has oft said they don't read.

Pretty much all figures published in all media outlets are from some sort of official government organisation the world over.

Onesea

New research suggests Ireland covid 19 death toll may have been overstated. Health watchdog hiqa says the number of excess deaths is "substantially lower" than the 1700 officially recorded coronavirus deaths.

The tale that keeps on giving.

Goldengirl

charlie14 wrote: »

HIQA`s report is speculative more than scientific.
The clue is in the fact that it is based on the RIP.ie website



HIQA is speculating that because Covid-19 deaths are more than the total of excess deaths based on the same period on previous years, then the difference is from causes other than Covid-19.
It could as easily be speculated that the numbers from other causes were reduced due to having lockdown.


If they really wish to compare excess deaths from Covid-19 using RIP.ie to give a truer reflection, then perhaps they should have checked the figures for deaths during the height of pandemic.
For the month of April research by Maynooth University and the University of Limerick using the same source shows deaths in some counties double that of previous year, with other counties showing increases of 50% and more.


Very shoddy work from from a body whose title is the Health Information and Quality Authority imo.

Yes .
And could be an attempt to minimise as this is the body that the HSE is blaming for not protecting the nursing homes .

FintanMcluskey

Goldengirl wrote: »

Yes .
And could be an attempt to minimise as this is the body that the HSE is blaming for not protecting the nursing homes .

Ok, so now that one of the most scrutinising bodies in the country is beginning to ask questions at the rather speculative recording of death's, it could be a conspiracy and cover up by that same body?

Even Tony H admitted many deaths were recorded as Covid death's without Covid being the cause of death.

This inquest is beginning, and I'm looking forward to it

facehugger99

Onesea wrote: »

New research suggests Ireland covid 19 death toll may have been overstated. Health watchdog hiqa says the number of excess deaths is "substantially lower" than the 1700 officially recorded coronavirus deaths.

The tale that keeps on giving.

The true figures will really expose the nonsense of the lockdown.

Political and media driven hysteria has cost us billions.

hmmm

facehugger99 wrote: »

The true figures will really expose the nonsense of the lockdown.

The figures are only low because we had a lockdown.

titan18

It'd be common sense to assume that normal deaths would have reduced in that period. Less people out, less cars on road etc.

So you can't compare against a previous year as the behaviour isn't the same.

is_that_so

facehugger99 wrote: »

The true figures will really expose the nonsense of the lockdown.

Political and media driven hysteria has cost us billions.

From an epidemiological standpoint and a brand new disease it made sense and as has been accepted we got to it early. Some of our European neighbours are good examples of where we might have ended up with our massively weak health system overrun.
As for the deaths it also makes sense to put them in the COVID column for now, for statistical purposes. Even if they had other life-shortening illnesses, in a good many cases the actual cause of death came through COVID. Had there been no COVID it would have been their underlying conditions on the death certificate. Those conditions were still recorded anyway for a complete profile.

is_that_so

hmmm wrote: »

The figures are only low because we had a lockdown.

Oh no they're not or is BS the right answer here?

facehugger99

Untold billions to save a couple of hundred awl lads.

Never mind the tens of thousands that will needlessly now die as a result of the hole we've blown in our finances.

They don't count as much apparently.

facehugger99

facehugger99 wrote: »

Untold billions to save a couple of hundred awl lads.

Never mind the tens of thousands that will needlessly now die as a result of the hole we've blown in our finances.

They don't count as much apparently.

Hysterical ranting. Any evidence any where that anything close to the level you estimate will die. And the economy will recover far quicker than you think.

Onesea

Seriously, if anything this mess has shown how easily people are led and want to be by their government.
Look at the dam stats available in Europe.

Doctor Jimbob

facehugger99 wrote: »

Untold billions to save a couple of hundred awl lads.

Never mind the tens of thousands that will needlessly now die as a result of the hole we've blown in our finances.

They don't count as much apparently.

Tens of thousands? That's a daft statement at the best of times but after you accusing others of hysteria a few posts ago it's downright bizarre.

Will there be issues as a result of the lockdown? Yes.

Are posts like yours every bit as hysterical as the ones saying tens or hundreds of thousands would die in Ireland? Also yes.

charlie14

facehugger99 wrote: »

Untold billions to save a couple of hundred awl lads.

Never mind the tens of thousands that will needlessly now die as a result of the hole we've blown in our finances.

They don't count as much apparently.

We blew a much bigger hole in our finances during the banking crisis, but I haven`t heard of tens of thousands dying because of it.

Arghus

facehugger99 wrote: »

Untold billions to save a couple of hundred awl lads.

Never mind the tens of thousands that will needlessly now die as a result of the hole we've blown in our finances.

They don't count as much apparently.

Tens of thousands?

Who are supposed to be the Doom and Gloom merchants again?

Penfailed

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Is anyone in this thread doing a staycation? if yes - which hotel and how many nights?

Yes. I'll be off in the campervan for two weeks.

How are you going to manage wearing your face mask on a flight for a couple of hours when you could barely breathe when getting your hair cut?

fr336

facehugger99 wrote: »

Untold billions to save a couple of hundred awl lads.

Never mind the tens of thousands that will needlessly now die as a result of the hole we've blown in our finances.

They don't count as much apparently.

Calm down!

GocRh

The Irish Times headlines today looking very biased:

'Travel restrictions to stay, green list put on hold' - according to unnamed sources and not official
'It's reopening way to fast' headline just below, including interview with some professor saying we shouldn't reopen to travel for another 5 years!

The independent and the journal are not reporting any changes to the green list plan.

Damiencm

Why make a decision when we can just sit on the fence 

My mind is made up at this stage, as long as my flight remains scheduled for August I'll be on it