Do you believe in UFOs & flying saucers ?

Rhys Essien

The French government done a study on UFOs in 1978. It was a 500 page report.

They studied 11 cases in detail.

In 10 of the 11 cases, the conclusion was that the witnesses had witnessed a material phenomenon that
could not be explained as a natural phenomenon or a human device.

One of the conclusions of the total report is that behind the overall phenomenon there is a "flying machine. . . whose modes of sustenance and propulsion are beyond our knowledge."

Report here.

https://www.nsa.gov/Portals/70/documents/news-features/declassified-documents/ufo/french_gov_ufo_study.pdf

PokeHerKing

JackTC wrote: »

The first video is a bird or possibly a balloon. The apparent speed is due to parallax.

The second triangular one is a camera effect called Bokeh.

The rest I don't know.

You think the two pilots yeehaawing in that first clip are tracking a bird/balloon and dont realise it? Wouldnt want them as your air support so.

PokeHerKing

yourdeadwright wrote: »

If the governments & military have blatantly lied about these for years by saying they where not real why would you believe them now?

What has changed that all of a sudden they would tell the truth without even one decent picture or video?

If these things are military & they have mastered a new technology then they would be flying them more often than before and more chance of them being seen and pictured, so bwst way to kept it hidden is to also pretend thet have no idea what they are

Males no sense for them to suddenly tell everyone one the exists for no reason after years of lying,

Again surely thet would have something in place to get a better picture with todays technology

So you think its a reverse cover up?

emo72

Maybe some of those objects might not be metal based or any material we know of. Or possibly coated in a field or force that doesn't allow us to photograph it easily.

Maybe they don't want us to photograph it easily. Hence no concise clear photo

That's worth considering.

Pintman Paddy Losty

I remember these UFO documentaries used to be on the discovery channel when I was younger. Always the same. Grainy footage of a bright dot moving suspiciously like dust catching light or straight lines like a weather balloon. Then you'd have talking head commentators claiming it was aliens. They always looked like total fruitcakes. Then the lads who claim they were beamed up and probed. All very odd.

Very little has changed. If there were these things flying around more of us would see them. Not a credulous as some folk round here.

nocoverart

Pre New York Times article back in 2017, I would of thought people claiming UFO as real phenomenon were nothing short of fruitcakes. The paradigm has definitely shifted for me as far as keeping an open mind goes. Anyways, I’ll always root for the dreamers now... skepticism is boring and the Universe is big.

Hamsterchops

Pintman Paddy Losty wrote: »

I remember these UFO documentaries used to be on the discovery channel when I was younger. Always the same. Grainy footage of a bright dot moving suspiciously like dust catching light or straight lines like a weather balloon. Then you'd have talking head commentators claiming it was aliens. They always looked like total fruitcakes. Then the lads who claim they were beamed up and probed. All very odd.

Very little has changed. If there were these things flying around more of us would see them. Not a credulous as some folk round here.

Everything has changed since 2017, and the revelations that finally hit home that there really are things in the sky that we know nothing about.

Objects that are impossible to explain, that move in ways that defy our understanding of the laws of physics < all this is now being taken seriously by the authorities.

For far to long the image of the Twilight Zone, Mars Attacks & independence day were used as a light-hearted way of fobbing off real sightings, but now within just the last few years, finally the real 5 or 10% of Unexplained sightings are getting their moment in the spotlight, to find out what they are.

Did you listen to Obama?
Did you watch Alex Dietrich talking about the 2004 Nimitz encounters?

For the purpose of this discussion forget the world if Sci-fi, and consider the fact that there is something in our skies that is unexplained.

yourdeadwright

PokeHerKing wrote: »

So you think its a reverse cover up?

Yes I do ,
Its got harder for them to ignore it so its easier to say, " god ye we see that thing to & like you we have no idea what it is "

flanna01

What if.....

The Military needed a big money injection? What better propaganda than an alien invasion...??

Wait, Hear me out...

You think its beyond Homeland Security and the CIA?? Seriously??

Money talks in this world, and there are plenty of suckers with money and weak minds...

Rock up to the Oval Office in full Millatary clobber, all the whistles and bells, sword hanging off the hip, tell the sitting Prez that you have some ultra secret information to share with him... Looks like we are being swarmed by these super advanced gizzmo's... We need funding to study them and protect the world......

The Prez promises an open cheque book to the Naval Fleet Commander - No questions asked.

Sometimes it pays to think outside of the box.

steddyeddy

flanna01 wrote: »

What if.....

The Military needed a big money injection? What better propaganda than an alien invasion...??

Wait, Hear me out...

You think its beyond Homeland Security and the CIA?? Seriously??

Money talks in this world, and there are plenty of suckers with money and weak minds...

Rock up to the Oval Office in full Millatary clobber, all the whistles and bells, sword hanging off the hip, tell the sitting Prez that you have some ultra secret information to share with him... Looks like we are being swarmed by these super advanced gizzmo's... We need funding to study them and protect the world......

The Prez promises an open cheque book to the Naval Fleet Commander - No questions asked.

Sometimes it pays to think outside of the box.

Well it's interesting but the US military don't need the money really.

flanna01

flanna01 wrote: »

What if.....

...the U.S. Military is faking the whole thing so that its enemies waste time and resources on a Giant Red Herring?

nocoverart

flanna01 wrote: »

What if.....

The Military needed a big money injection? What better propaganda than an alien invasion...??

Wait, Hear me out...

You think its beyond Homeland Security and the CIA?? Seriously??

Money talks in this world, and there are plenty of suckers with money and weak minds...

Rock up to the Oval Office in full Millatary clobber, all the whistles and bells, sword hanging off the hip, tell the sitting Prez that you have some ultra secret information to share with him... Looks like we are being swarmed by these super advanced gizzmo's... We need funding to study them and protect the world......

The Prez promises an open cheque book to the Naval Fleet Commander - No questions asked.

Sometimes it pays to think outside of the box.

Probably the least likely explanation IMO, even less likely than Aliens ha. Don’t think the Military have to go the Alien route for some more Dollah Dollah.

This website with a rather anticlimactic answer to what they think is going on with most of the footage seen.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/40054/adversary-drones-are-spying-on-the-u-s-and-the-pentagon-acts-like-theyre-ufos

Not convinced by the article or the sheer arrogance that they have it all sewn up.

BorneTobyWilde

How can a balloon speed off at speeds not of this world.

JackTC

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

How can a balloon speed off at speeds not of this world.

It isn't . The apparent speed is due to parallax. The balloon is travelling at a normal speed.

Hamsterchops

JackTC wrote: »

It isn't . The apparent speed is due to parallax. The balloon is travelling at a normal speed.

Balloon.

Did I miss something ?

steddyeddy

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Balloon.

Did I miss something ?

It's something some of the sceptics have put forward as theory as to what's in the videos. Mick West, professional sceptic was the patron of the balloon theory. It came about at a time when Mick, professional sceptic told the 6 fighter pilots in the Nimitz incident that they didn't understand their controls and were confusing them with those of a helicopter.

Interestingly the parallax theory was also floated by Mick. It's simply an optical illusion whereby the observed position of an object is influenced by the observer's line of sight. It has previously been used erroneously by sceptics as an explanation for observed speed by forward looking infra red imaging and radar contacts.

This is a good example of dogma in scepticism. I am saying I don't believe these objects are balloons, planes ect and explaining my reasons based on peer reviewed articles and they are starting with a central thesis "it is a balloon" and changing the facts to suit.

The pilot who took the video that some of the balloon sceptics are referring to has referred to this theory in an interview.

I want to ask you some questions based on theories that America’s armchair skeptics have put forward — like whether it was birds, or whether it was some sort of thermal weather event. I mean, I’m sure you have had enough flight time that you’ve seen birds.

Yup. Birds normally fly close to the surface of the ground. So, for example, you’re not going to see birds flying at 5,000 feet. You’re going to see them more down at like 2,000 feet and below, like down to the surface. That’s just kind of how birds normally operate. And they’re typically not alone. So you can you can physically see them, in a flock or whatever. You don’t see birds at 5,000 or 10,000 or 20,000 feet. That’s just not how birds operate. So birds are out of the question.

And just so that I anticipate your next question: There are weather balloons that people launch, but this was not a weather balloon — because a balloon, it just ascends and floats from low to high altitude; it doesn’t behave erratically. I mean, it’s just a damn balloon. So that was out of the question.

It wasn’t — to the best of my knowledge — a cruise missile or any other kind of test aircraft that we possibly may have not known about, just because of the way it was behaving. Like I said, it was just very erratic. It would go from like 50 feet off the ground, which when you’re out in the open ocean, you know, off the coast of San Diego, it looked like it was just hovering over the water. But there was no method of propulsion that was keeping it airborne: no wings, no heat, keeping it airborne or aloft.

steddyeddy

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

How can a balloon speed off at speeds not of this world.

It's worth listening to the pilots account and not entertaining ideas like this.

The thing that stood out to me the most was how erratic it was behaving. And what I mean by “erratic” is that its changes in altitude, air speed, and aspect were just unlike things that I’ve ever encountered before flying against other air targets. It was just behaving in ways that aren’t physically normal. That’s what caught my eye. Because, aircraft, whether they’re manned or unmanned, still have to obey the laws of physics. They have to have some source of lift, some source of propulsion. The object was not doing that. It was going from like 50,000 feet to, you know, a hundred feet in like seconds, which is not possible.

MadYaker

JackTC wrote: »

It isn't . The apparent speed is due to parallax. The balloon is travelling at a normal speed.

You honestly think professional pilots and all the other people who've analysed this footage wouldn't have noticed that as well? The footage is 15 years old, if what the americans are saying is true.

PokeHerKing

JackTC wrote: »

It isn't . The apparent speed is due to parallax. The balloon is travelling at a normal speed.

Its Parallax dude, parrralllaax!!

Capt'n Midnight

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

How can a balloon speed off at speeds not of this world.

Chevaline was the name for the re-entry speed decoy balloons used in the UK's nuclear missiles.

Hamsterchops

There'll be a lot of shock and bewilderment all round if in ten days time the official report points to balloons and the parallax effect . . .

Seventy years of eyewitnesses, pilots and radar systems confusing balloons and the parallax effect for unexplained aerial phenomon!

I'm no expert, but when you throw the likes of ex US President Obama into the mix, then surely there's something unexplained in our skies.

No/Yes?

Beechwoodspark

I won’t be getting my hopes up about the big “reveal”

They’ll tell the public exactly what they want and nothing further

Hamsterchops

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

I won’t be getting my hopes up about the big “reveal”

They’ll tell the public exactly what they want and nothing further

I agree, it will be a bit wishy washy, well there is 5 - 10% of sightings that we still can't identify.

..... although we can say that there is something unexplained in our skies, something that exhibits an unknown propulsion, and that is capable of speed well beyond our technology ..... or words to that effect.

Nothing concrete, although it will create a paradigm shift in the way we think about such sightings. No longer will it be a bit 'jokey' to talk about the subject, from then on it will be a source for fascination and wonderment as to what they are & where they come from!

Fuzzyduzzy

Biden was finally asked about his views. This was a big moment after his own government and many previous officials have made serious statements. What do you have to say Joe?

https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1395872243931140096?s=20

JackTC

steddyeddy wrote: »

It's worth listening to the pilots account and not entertaining ideas like this.

Have a look at the below video (start at 5:35) and watch until the end.

Tell me why you think this sceptic is wrong

RobertKK

Given the age of our solar system compared to the age of the universe, it is entirely possible given the number of galaxies and the number of stars each galaxy has and how these stars also have planets, that maybe intelligent life could have happened elsewhere in the universe, many millions or billions of years earlier than on Earth.

Dr. Bre

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

I won’t be getting my hopes up about the big “reveal”

They’ll tell the public exactly what they want and nothing further

Exactly . It won’t be a day that shook the world moment .

Hamsterchops

JackTC wrote: »

Have a look at the below video (start at 5:35) and watch until the end.

Tell me why you think this sceptic is wrong.

These debunkers can be great fun, and from time to time I really am taken in by Mick West (in particular) who can debunk each and every sighting, since the 'Foo Fighters' were in short pants!

... but then you watch Dave Fravor or Alex Dietrich being interviewed on CNN and it's like "Well, how can they mistake a duck for an unknown craft of some kind?" How can the Captain of the Nimitz be so thick as to be confused by a duck or a balloon?

How can Obama be hoodwinked by a radar glitch?

Personally, I think there is something unexplained, I mean there has to be something other than a duck, a parallax or a balloon!

Or is everything a joke and a fake?

JackTC

Hamsterchops wrote: »

These debunkers can be great fun, and from time to time I really am taken in by Mick West (in particular) who can debunk each and every sighting, since the 'Foo Fighters' were in short pants!

... but then you watch Dave Fravor or Alex Dietrich being interviewed on CNN and it's like "Well, how can they mistake a duck for an unknown craft of some kind?" How can the Captain of the Nimitz be so thick as to be confused by a duck or a balloon?

How can Obama be hoodwinked by a radar glitch?

Personally, I think there is something unexplained, I mean there has to be something other than a duck, a parallax or a balloon!

Or is everything a joke and a fake?

Right but you didn't explain how the person in the video I posted is wrong.

Fiery mutant

Actually Jack, you are saying all the professionals who have spent their careers in high powered, high pressure roles, performing at a level most of us could only dream about, cannot tell the difference between a high powered unknown craft, and a ballon.

Some of these pilots fly the most powerful machines on the planet, performing mock dogfights at massive speeds against other high powered machines, and are getting hoodwinked by a balloon???