How will schools be able to go back in September?

NelRom

iamwhoiam wrote: »

How many parents are at home and not working and could give that time to a child ? Or indeed to two or three children? Many parents are working full time either away from or at home . Parents have babies to mind or children with special needs to care
Education would be totally unbalanced and some having time to educate at home and many others not being able to at all

Were both working full time at home so obviously a safe return is the first hope. These suggestions are in the event it doesn't happen- I'd like my kids taught for as long as possible each day and leave something like homework and revision that I can oversee for a small part of the day.
Parents with babies - that is tough going and I don't have the answer but surely any other child being taught would help.
I have a child with SN, and would expect classes and check ins or calls for that too.
Education is already unbalanced unfortunately, that is just a sad reality of life.

Smacruairi

NelRom wrote: »

Were both working full time at home so obviously a safe return is the first hope. These suggestions are in the event it doesn't happen- I'd like my kids taught for as long as possible each day and leave something like homework and revision that I can oversee for a small part of the day.
Parents with babies - that is tough going and I don't have the answer but surely any other child being taught would help.
I have a child with SN, and would expect classes and check ins or calls for that too.
Education is already unbalanced unfortunately, that is just a sad reality of life.

Taught for as long as possible. So how long is that ideally with remote tech and methods as they are?

NelRom

Smacruairi wrote: »

Taught for as long as possible. So how long is that ideally with remote tech and methods as they are?

I've already given a suggestion a few posts back

arctictree

There is talk in my locality of some parents implementing a rota where they teach a specific class each day of the week in a rented building (GAA or local hall or something). I suppose life moves on ...

Bananaleaf

Nannies to be provided to all households
A concession of 5hrs per working week for those with kids at home
Training courses put on for parents to help them teach their kids

I know you guys are just thinking out loud and I know the nannies for all was a bit of a joke, but financially, those are all MASSIVE asks in comparison to what the teachers want. If they wont give us masks and perspex screens ye have no hope of getting any of the above

If the schools dont open in Sep, the general public will only have ourselves to blame. People need to be socially distant and responsible. A lot are, but a lot aren't.

The longer we go without hearing from the dept, the more concerned I am. It is my opinion that if there were a plan, we would know about it by now. I've a feeling they are waiting til the last minute to give us as little opportunity to negotiate/call them out on it all. I know it is the summer holidays but I'm going to email my principal on Monday, outlining my concerns and questions for the coming academic year - I'd advise others to do the same as it is quite likely that by the time we are back in for start up, all agreements will have been made by then.

I must say, whatever about school staff, (we're used to it) it is a real smack in the face to parents that the department seem to think that they must only start organising their households for back to school at the very end of the summer. The thought that parents might be waiting for them to announce something - so that they can sort uniforms, travel, their own working hours, childcare and god knows what else I've forgotten - doesn't appear to have entered their heads and that is astonishing.

wirelessdude01

arctictree wrote: »

There is talk in my locality of some parents implementing a rota where they teach a specific class each day of the week in a rented building (GAA or local hall or something). I suppose life moves on ...

That won't be allowed.

iamwhoiam

NelRom wrote: »

Were both working full time at home so obviously a safe return is the first hope. These suggestions are in the event it doesn't happen- I'd like my kids taught for as long as possible each day and leave something like homework and revision that I can oversee for a small part of the day.
Parents with babies - that is tough going and I don't have the answer but surely any other child being taught would help.
I have a child with SN, and would expect classes and check ins or calls for that too.
Education is already unbalanced unfortunately, that is just a sad reality of life.

My own daughter tried her very best , both working full time from home , one child in senior infants and a young colicky baby .
By early June I saw the stress mounting and they were both worn out
My advice at that stage was to let it go , do reading at bedtime and Maths in daily life , ( counting trees etc ) So many were under horrendous pressure trying their very best and not managing full time work and being a parent and a teacher all at once

NelRom

iamwhoiam wrote: »

My own daughter tried her very best , both working full time from home , one child in senior infants and a young colicky baby .
By early June I saw the stress mounting and they were both worn out
My advice at that stage was to let it go , do reading at bedtime and Maths in daily life , ( counting trees etc ) So many were under horrendous pressure trying their very best and not managing full time work and being a parent and a teacher all at once

Similar experience where we just about bungled by with what we could in relation to school work as we both have pressurized jobs. I need to believe the government doesn't intend on continuing to expect this of us come september and will ensure our children are taught at home if not in class.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

arctictree wrote: »

There is talk in my locality of some parents implementing a rota where they teach a specific class each day of the week in a rented building (GAA or local hall or something). I suppose life moves on ...

As much as it is trying to take the initiative that won't be allowed.

Not with child protection laws, insurance etc there are standards and procedures in place for a reason.

jrosen

Yosef Stocky Backspace wrote: »

Do you want your child taught properly when in class? If so are you happy for all their academic performance and behaviours and eccentricities to be live streamed into other people's homes, and possibly recorded? Like when the teacher asks for answers or contributions to something and your child says something odd, or tells an embarrassing story about your family that they think is relevant to the context. And it's no longer something forgotten about in a few minutes, or just heard by peers, but is now viewed by other adults and siblings and could be recorded. The only way not to expose all these vulnerable moments to all sorts is to have lessons like a lecture, which is not desirable use of precious classroom time imo.

As I said all kids stayed on mute, teamed with short sessions on line. Parents seemed of the opinion it delivered. Look its worth exploring like other suggestions because right now it they dont seem to have much else.

arctictree

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

As much as it is trying to take the initiative that won't be allowed.

Not with child protection laws, insurance etc there are standards and procedures in place for a reason.

Nothing to stop my wife taking 10 kids and teaching them for a morning.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

iamwhoiam wrote: »

How many parents are at home and not working and could give that time to a child ? Or indeed to two or three children? Many parents are working full time either away from or at home . Parents have babies to mind or children with special needs to care
Education would be totally unbalanced and some having time to educate at home and many others not being able to at all

We both working parents here and it's been really difficult.

I don't think I'd be able to continue the juggling act for much longer, feeling burnt out to be honest and I haven't been able to give any aspect of home/work/school 100% of the full attention they deserve.

I'm probably not alone in feeling guilty and overwhelmed.

jrosen

iamwhoiam wrote: »

How many parents are at home and not working and could give that time to a child ? Or indeed to two or three children? Many parents are working full time either away from or at home . Parents have babies to mind or children with special needs to care
Education would be totally unbalanced and some having time to educate at home and many others not being able to at all

We both work and I Cant work from home so there is no way my husband can do his job which is time sensitive and commit to times for home learning. If the kids dont go back it will 100% affect my ability to go to work.

Sanjuro

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

We both working parents here and it's been really difficult.

I don't think I'd be able to continue the juggling act for much longer, feeling burnt out to be honest and I haven't been able to give any aspect of home/work/school 100% of the full attention they deserve.

I'm probably not alone in feeling guilty and overwhelmed.

You're absolutely not alone. We've a 6 year old and a 4 year old, and it's been absolutely draining. Both my wife and I have full time jobs that aren't going anywhere and while the teaching of our daughter is minimal, the childcare is another full time job on top of our own ones. It's completely unsustainable and causing us untold stress.

r93kaey5p2izun

jrosen wrote: »

As I said all kids stayed on mute, teamed with short sessions on line. Parents seemed of the opinion it delivered. Look its worth exploring like other suggestions because right now it they dont seem to have much else.

All kids on mute is for teaching a group fully online. If some are in the classroom then you can't mute them if you are delivering a proper meaningful lesson to them, which is live streamed to part of the class at home.

But what you describe has been done by many teachers. It has not worked for many students. And many parents have complained about various aspects of this set up, from inadequate tech to access live lessons at a certain time, to not being happy with students watching content without interaction.

NelRom

One would wonder if we are realistically heading toward universal social income if primary schools don't go back and parents are expected to become educators past the initial basics mentioned in the constitution.
I believe secondary schools have been much better about the online teaching?

NelRom

Yosef Stocky Backspace wrote: »

All kids on mute is for teaching a group fully online. If some are in the classroom then you can't mute them if you are delivering a proper meaningful lesson to them, which is live streamed to part of the class at home.

But what you describe has been done by many teachers. It has not worked for many students. And many parents have complained about various aspects of this set up, from inadequate tech to access live lessons at a certain time, to not being happy with students watching content without interaction.

Even the challenges of this would be better than the 'set work/ correct work' setup I had.

r93kaey5p2izun

NelRom wrote: »

Even the challenges of this would be better than the 'set work/ correct work' setup I had.

Yes, it might be for you. Other parents specifically requested what you are complaining about. Opinions on what worked vary greatly.

wirelessdude01

Still waiting on the department to step up and give us some practical advice, guidance and guidelines. There should be no need for us or parents to be trying to second guess what will be happening or parents talking about taking groups of kids for lessons.

khalessi

NelRom wrote: »

One would wonder if we are realistically heading toward universal social income if primary schools don't go back and parents are expected to become educators past the initial basics mentioned in the constitution.
I believe secondary schools have been much better about the online teaching?

Depends on the schools access to internet and technology and the platforms used to deliver it.

As a parent I tore my hair out over Seesaw useless pile of excrement. I could not contact teacher, could not upload Word documents had to turn them into pdfs. It was time consuming and the exercises were pointless.

As a teacher I used Google classroom and found it very good. Children could post questions and have them asked almost immediately. I could put up videos from YouTube to explain content and also write up step by step guides for the children to follow. They could upload work and I could correct it as they watched and we could discuss it and leave private comments about the work to each other.

appledrop

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

We both working parents here and it's been really difficult.

I don't think I'd be able to continue the juggling act for much longer, feeling burnt out to be honest and I haven't been able to give any aspect of home/work/school 100% of the full attention they deserve.

I'm probably not alone in feeling guilty and overwhelmed.

My heart goes out to you. We were close to breaking point too but are very lucky that our little boy is now back + creche + difference it has made to us all is unbelievable. He is happier as now has children to play with(he is only child) we can now get our work done as normal so when he comes home can all spend time together.

The schools need to go back for everyone's sake.

What really pissed me off aswell was all z list celebrities etc waffling on about how great ots been spending quality time during lock down bla bla bla.

Yea great from them because they have no work! while rest of us meant to work full time + juggle childcare/ home schooling.

FC1

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

We both working parents here and it's been really difficult.

I don't think I'd be able to continue the juggling act for much longer, feeling burnt out to be honest and I haven't been able to give any aspect of home/work/school 100% of the full attention they deserve.

I'm probably not alone in feeling guilty and overwhelmed.

I completely agree with you. I too had a similar experience. I believe though a plan could be put in place to standardise homeschooling so that every school is the same. I think if it was kept simple with some interaction from teachers it could work. Before the summer hols my children's schools expectations of what we could achieve at home with no interaction ( just 1 email per week) was ridiculous.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Still waiting on the department to step up and give us some practical advice, guidance and guidelines. There should be no need for us or parents to be trying to second guess what will be happening or parents talking about taking groups of kids for lessons.

It's shambolic that they haven't even come up with a phased plan or several different plans based on differing criteria e.g case numbers/R0

I think its the not knowing that is unsettling to all stakeholders.

At least if we know what may be in store we can all at least prepare ourselves and kids mentally and practically.

I can't believe they are going to wing this and all signs pointing to the fact that they are indeed going to wing it.

wirelessdude01

FC1 wrote: »

I completely agree with you. I too had a similar experience. I believe though a plan could be put in place to standardise homeschooling so that every school is the same. I think if it was kept simple with some interaction from teachers it could work. Before the summer hols my children's schools expectations of what we could achieve at home with no interaction ( just 1 email per week) was ridiculous.

Still waiting on the department.

I heard of a school that gave work at 9am, midday and 3pm. Every piece was expected.to be done and uploaded to the teacher. Emails and then phone calls were received it that didn't occur. Total overload but dictated by the principal so the teachers had to comply even though they mostly didn't agree with it.

NelRom

Yosef Stocky Backspace wrote: »

Yes, it might be for you. Other parents specifically requested what you are complaining about. Opinions on what worked vary greatly.

But those parents who didn't want to engage in the taught/ streamed element could still do the set work/ correct work part- so would still get what they want. However, most parents who want actual teaching streamed etc. did not get that.

FC1

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Still waiting on the department.

I heard of a school that gave work at 9am, midday and 3pm. Every piece was expected.to be done and uploaded to the teacher. Emails and then phone calls were received it that didn't occur. Total overload but dictated by the principal so the teachers had to comply even though they mostly didn't agree with it.

That's ridiculous. I would imagine very few children were able to keep that up. I think schools are of the opinion that children can just work away by themselves. Most need help from parents though. Every home has a different set of circumstances which may prevent them from fully getting the work done. I think most households tried their best.

khalessi

If it is going to be online schooling, the curriculum will have to be pared back. Experienced homeschoolers recomment about 3 hours per day of formal instruction and the rest informal through play, baking, painting etc. Thats why I was interested in Scoondal doing a diary as it could teach a lot. I have looked into homeschooling over the years as I am interested but as a single parent its not feasible for me, though I enjoy reading about other peoples experiences. Sadly my intentions were totally misconstrued to suit someone elses agenda.

In Australia they have had bush schools for years over the cb radios so we have to be able to make it work somehow. It needs more balance, as a single parent trying to work/teach and homeschool was near impossible but at least I was at a better advantage then most as I teach and knew where to find resources when they were not supplied, though my kids had no interest in that side of me as I according to them am Mum not teacher, oh well.

I ended up concentrating on English and Maths and covered Titanic with the Titanic and A Night to Remember movies and Titanic docs. It was what it was. Now I am trying to catch up using Khan Academy for Maths, unsuccesfully I might add. I think my one hour aday approach was too ambitious lol

ziedth

Sanjuro wrote: »

You're absolutely not alone. We've a 6 year old and a 4 year old, and it's been absolutely draining. Both my wife and I have full time jobs that aren't going anywhere and while the teaching of our daughter is minimal, the childcare is another full time job on top of our own ones. It's completely unsustainable and causing us untold stress.

I would be a fairly passive and easy going guy and especially with all that is going on in the world I would like to try an do my part to help others and obviously my own kids. However, I will not be teaching my kids in September. Both Myself and my wife work full time and while i'm happy to help the kids with homework in he evening if needs be there is no way I'm coming in from a 10 hour day and then a further few hours to try and teach my 8 year old geography (or whatever).

Even if we were both out of work I can't see how that is fair? I'm not a teacher and I know for a fact I wouldn't be any good at it. Should my kids suffer because I'm not up to the task?

r93kaey5p2izun

NelRom wrote: »

But those parents who didn't want to engage in the taught/ streamed element could still do the set work/ correct work part- so would still get what they want. However, most parents who want actual teaching streamed etc. did not get that.

But they still complained. And looked for changes.

As for streaming live lessons, it's not effective in my experience and many who thought that's what they wanted realised it was actually not. I taught a small group of Leaving Certs during lockdown because they had no teacher. Their parents wanted live lessons. Then they wanted recorded content instead, or as well in some cases. Then they wanted both. Then they wanted just work set and corrected. Then they complained when I did all of that because it wasn't fair that the others were moving on with stuff in live lessons when their child hadn't had time yet to watch the recorded content. And it wasn't fair that others were moving on with recorded content when their child could only look at questions. So basically they all wanted different things and essentially private grinds. Not to mention that what their children wanted was not what they wanted. It was a full time job for 8 students. And I would definitely never agree to it again during to unreasonable expectations.

FC1

Yosef Stocky Backspace wrote: »

But they still complained. And looked for changes.

As for streaming live lessons, it's not effective in my experience and many who thought that's what they wanted realised it was actually not. I taught a small group of Leaving Certs during lockdown because they had no teacher. Their parents wanted live lessons. Then they wanted recorded content instead, or as well in some cases. Then they wanted both. Then they wanted just work set and corrected. Then they complained when I did all of that because it wasn't fair that the others were moving on with stuff in live lessons when their child hadn't had time yet to watch the recorded content. And it wasn't fair that others were moving on with recorded content when their child could only look at questions. So basically they all wanted different things and essentially private grinds. Not to mention that what their children wanted was not what they wanted. It was a full time job for 8 students. And I would definitely never agree to it again during to unreasonable expectations.

It sounds like you were dealing with very unreasonable people. It was not your fault if they did not find the time to watch the content. I get your frustration.