Masks

Marhay70

Yes: valved

joeguevara wrote: »

I was responding to the requirement not to complete the transaction as in Legislation. Would be much more effective if in shops over a certain square metre to have security at the door. Could provide a tax break to finance this as it would reduce medical costs if infections. If, let’s say the Londis beside my office, a person enters they are automatically required to go left where there is a choppd so can order there where others are queuing, then the deli, then the coffee and finally by walking through the walkways at the till where they queue. If it’s then noticed that no mask (none of the other staff would ever have authority to do that or would they want to) if refused they would have already been in the shop ages anyway, probably a smalll point.

I do see least compliance in a small central or independent where people run in for cigarettes or a coffee. Just a thought.

You sound like you are familiar with this shop. Maybe the place to air your concerns is the shop owner/manager, it may be something they are unaware of. I would do it purely because I don't like to see morons flouting the regulations.

Seanergy

Yes: valved

Jim_Hodge wrote: »

The guidelines specifically say face coverings are not required if staff are behind screens. At least Dunnes have screens all around the cashiers while our local Tescos only have a small screen directly in front of them.

Show me the science that instructed the HSE to draw up those guidelines, it doesn't exisit.

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

But if it's effectively a sealed-off box, bar a slot at the bottom to hand you the receipt/change/whatever, surely common sense would say that's sufficient protection, even if there isn't actually a peer-reviewed study proving it?

It is nowhere near a sealed off box, common sense?

saabsaab

Yes: homemade

suicide_circus wrote: »

Out and about in Dublin city centre today and there is a noticeable decrease of mask wearing in shops.

No surprise cases in Dublin are rising so..

Marhay70

Yes: valved

Seanergy wrote: »

Show me the science that instructed the HSE to draw up those guidelines, it doesn't exisit.



It is nowhere near a sealed off box, common sense?

Are you suggesting that to avoid Covid, we all need to live in our own individual bubble because I certainly have not seen any science on that?

Seanergy

No: I don't care enough

Seanergy wrote: »

All the tills have perspex screens but show me the science behind perspex screens. There is none, just as there is no art to hanging or installing them, any old slab of plastic seems to be acceptable.

When I went to checkout, I realised the tiller infront of me had no mask on, so best thought I should use another tiller only to realise none of them had masks on.

Dunnes have been my favoured supermarket chain throughout the pandemic for 2 reasons, the had the best H&S program in place and they tend to have the larger and airier shops, making it easier to SD and offering better air quality.

It's going to have to be another email to Dunnes about PRP's, possible risk points.

From my experience very few till operators are wearing masks. SuperValue I’ve found are the only ones really that do.

Dunnes a very odd one might have a mask but most don’t (that’s across multiple different stores), Aldi I don’t think I’ve ever seen a till operator wearing a mask and I rarely go to lidl but fairly sure they don’t wear them either when behind the screens.

I agree they should be but they are keeping the guidelines by not wearing them behind screens.

joeguevara

Marhay70 wrote: »

You sound like you are familiar with this shop. Maybe the place to air your concerns is the shop owner/manager, it may be something they are unaware of. I would do it purely because I don't like to see morons flouting the regulations.

Actually the compliance there is excellent. Just using it as an example of how other shops could be effected. Was very surprised as the shop is mostly frequented by young construction workers and every single one of them would put on a mask before going in.

is_that_so

No: other

Seanergy wrote: »

Show me the science that instructed the HSE to draw up those guidelines, it doesn't exisit.

Science more definitively tells us that pollution can kill us yet many of us spend our lives living with it as an acceptable risk. It's how we process scenarios and make judgements. Our data or science on such locations does not show them to be a big risk and that the shielding is accepted as an adequate prophylactic.

joeguevara

Nickolas White Petroleum wrote: »

From my experience very few till operators are wearing masks. SuperValue I’ve found are the only ones really that do.

Dunnes a very odd one might have a mask but most don’t (that’s across multiple different stores), Aldi I don’t think I’ve ever seen a till operator wearing a mask and I rarely go to lidl but fairly sure they don’t wear them either when behind the screens.

I agree they should be but they are keeping the guidelines by not wearing them behind screens.

All Tesco employees on tills and self service and indeed in all the shop in Dun Laoghaire wear them. As a shopping centre albeit a small one is probably the best I’ve been in, with sanitising stations for baskets and trolleys and also in two locations in the shop itself. Also a lady sanitises all baskets and self service stations immediately after customer finishes.

Marhay70

Yes: valved

Nickolas White Petroleum wrote: »

From my experience very few till operators are wearing masks. SuperValue I’ve found are the only ones really that do.

Dunnes a very odd one might have a mask but most don’t (that’s across multiple different stores), Aldi I don’t think I’ve ever seen a till operator wearing a mask and I rarely go to lidl but fairly sure they don’t wear them either when behind the screens.

I agree they should be but they are keeping the guidelines by not wearing them behind screens.

The science I've heard about the transmission of the virus is that it spreads via droplet or, under pressure, by aerosol. The trajectory is forward and eventually down so I imagine if a till operator turned sideways and sneezed without covering their nose and mouth, then theoretically, if the screen is only on the front, then the germs could be expelled into the open air. I would say however, the instinctive reaction of most people is to cover their face and sneeze downwards, I would think the person in most danger is whomever succeeds them on the checkout, but then that poses a whole new dilemma.

Seanergy

Yes: valved

Marhay70 wrote: »

Are you suggesting that to avoid Covid, we all need to live in our own individual bubble because I certainly have not seen any science on that?

Nope, wasn't.

Plenty of science supporting bubble living btw, why do youy think we embraced a lockdown? It's No.1 in the WHO NPI playbook.

Marhay70

Yes: valved

joeguevara wrote: »

Actually the compliance there is excellent. Just using it as an example of how other shops could be effected. Was very surprised as the shop is mostly frequented by young construction workers and every single one of them would put on a mask before going in.

It may be excellent but obviously it's not universal, it only takes one.

Marhay70

Yes: valved

Seanergy wrote: »

Nope, wasn't.

Plenty of science supporting bubble living btw, why do youy think we embraced a lockdown? It's No.1 in the WHO NPI playbook.

The WHO were just following best practice with regard to viruses. We must remember that eight months ago we knew absolutely nothing about this virus, it has been a learning curve ever since.

joeguevara

Marhay70 wrote: »

It may be excellent but obviously it's not universal, it only takes one.

It is. Nobody goes in that is not wearing a mask. I think you misunderstood my point and is probably the way I’m expressing it. I was saying that the legislation mandates shop staff to only refuse a person to complete transaction if not wearing a mask whereas they should be restricting entry. I then used the shop I’m used to if a similar shop existed then a person could essentially go through the entire shop without a mask before any action. But I must say I’m delighted that the shop next door is at it is. I wouldn’t go to a shop if compliance wasn’t as good as it can be.

Beasty

No: I don't care enough

Threads merged

Marhay70

Yes: valved

joeguevara wrote: »

It is. Nobody goes in that is not wearing a mask. I think you misunderstood my point and is probably the way I’m expressing it. I was saying that the legislation mandates shop staff to only refuse a person to complete transaction if not wearing a mask whereas they should be restricting entry. I then used the shop I’m used to if a similar shop existed then a person could essentially go through the entire shop without a mask before any action. But I must say I’m delighted that the shop next door is at it is. I wouldn’t go to a shop if compliance wasn’t as good as it can be.

I did, I thought you were citing that shop as an example. Cheers.

BluePlanet

Yes: surgical

I came across this post on twitter.
A doctor in US making the case that masks are working.

While they are 'leaky' and don't stop all infection, they appear to stop enough of it that results in exposure to a lower viral load (a smaller amount of the virus).
While the virus will still replicate and 'get big' inside the infected party, that lower viral load at the onset may be buying our immune response a bit of time.

https://twitter.com/AliNouriPhD/status/1290361822256812032

Strumms

No: other

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/ireland-may-see-1-200-more-covid-19-deaths-by-2021-if-face-mask-use-doesn-t-improve-us-experts-1.4347042

Apologies if this has been already posted but hardly surprising by the sudden high percentage of idiots who have dispensed with mask wearing in public... it was depressing in Omni Park this week... especially the auld cûnt passing by coughing between me and a shelf full of food in Tesco...idiot bint.

Loafing Oaf

No: I don't care enough

Seanergy wrote: »

Nope, wasn't.

Plenty of science supporting bubble living btw,

Blade Runner on the money once again:P

Seanergy

Yes: valved

Marhay70 wrote: »

The WHO were just following best practice with regard to viruses. We must remember that eight months ago we knew absolutely nothing about this virus, it has been a learning curve ever since.

And we operate a delayed response inline with WHO advice. The WHO have not advised the use of perspex screens in place of face coverings.

How did the HSE learn that perspex screens at checkout's were equal to or better than clerks wearing face coverings?

Where is the science behind these HSE guidelines?

Today I witnessed not one but a whole row of Dunnes Stores cashiers operating masklessly.

robinph

No: I don't care enough

Seanergy wrote: »

Where is the science behind these HSE guidelines?

You want some scientific papers to be quoted regarding if air or droplets of water from someone's breath can pass directly through a solid sheet of perspex?

Seanergy

Yes: valved

No I didn't and my concern is not with the solidity of the sheets of perspex and i'm fully aware that scientifically a sheet will block any droplet that travels in a straight line.

odyssey06

robinph wrote: »

You want some scientific papers to be quoted regarding if air or droplets of water from someone's breath can pass directly through a solid sheet of perspex?

In a lot of the places I have seen it is solid but incomplete - gaps either at bottom or side.

BluePlanet

Yes: surgical

Seanergy wrote: »

And we operate a delayed response inline with WHO advice. The WHO have not advised the use of perspex screens in place of face coverings.

How did the HSE learn that perspex screens at checkout's were equal to or better than clerks wearing face coverings?

Where is the science behind these HSE guidelines?

Today I witnessed not one but a whole row of Dunnes Stores cashiers operating masklessly.

I doubt there is any actual science to support it.
They should all be wearing masks.

The perspex screens are probably just a cop-out, cowardly type of solution because the government are afraid of taking strong action with mandates like compulsory masks for all employees in all workplaces.

Marhay70

Yes: valved

Seanergy wrote: »

And we operate a delayed response inline with WHO advice. The WHO have not advised the use of perspex screens in place of face coverings.

How did the HSE learn that perspex screens at checkout's were equal to or better than clerks wearing face coverings?

Where is the science behind these HSE guidelines?

Today I witnessed not one but a whole row of Dunnes Stores cashiers operating masklessly.

I assume it's a matter of physics. I would say if the virus is disrupted while passing through porous material then it's going to have at least as difficult a journey through solid material. I think we have enough educated people in this country to figure that out on our own.

Diarmuid

Just posting this anecdote here. On hols in Italy at the moment. Piémonte to be precise. With regard to mask wearing,

On the street I reckon
20% wear a mask
60% wear a mask on their elbow or less frequently on their chin
20% don't wear a mask

In shops, all wear masks

Restaurants and bars are pretty much back to normal apart from the fact that the waiters wear masks all the time

This is in a location with pretty much no foreign holiday makers

patnor1011

No: I will wait for the HSE to recommend

Nickolas White Petroleum wrote: »

The country should never have come out of the lockdown when it did that was a massive error in judgement. If we kept locked down over the summer we could be in a place now with the virus almost gone from the county and we could be able to open even more than we are but much more safely (but not travel into or out of the country allowed bar absolute emergencies). This opinion is strongly supported by experts such as a professor in UCC in virology.

A harder lockdown for a little longer would be much better than a much longer half hearted lockdown we have now.

You do not get it do you? The lockdown we had still meant that half of the population if not most was exposed. Over third of workforce went to their jobs to cater for people who were "locked down". Only that they were not. Shops become new meeting points and some people went there few times a day just to meet friends and get some gossip.
People who worked during this "lockdown" were not only medical staff. Hundreds of thousands on generaly low paid jobs. It was nice to see how HSE or AnPost declared how they value their staff and gave them bonuses. People clapped for them daily. Rest of workers - deplorables were told to be happy still having jobs and had to show up daily or risk unemployment and all what stems from it down the line.
Your call for even stricter lockdown only show how detached from reality you are.
If everyone went home you will be first one to call for lifting of restrictions if you could not get to shop and there would be nothing on TV and internet.

patnor1011

No: I will wait for the HSE to recommend

jackboy wrote: »

Zero Covid may be possible quickly with masks combined with a selection of the previous restrictions. The 2k and 5k restrictions were nonsense and could be omitted.

Nonsense. Unless you plan to build a wall and plough every airport too. Armed zero covid vigilante groups combing beaches looking for intruders bringing disease on ships.

patnor1011

No: I will wait for the HSE to recommend

Seanergy wrote: »

Just back from my weekly Dunnes Stores shop and not one mask on any of the tillers, all other staff wearing visors or masks.

There was a shift change infront of me, a masked worker arrived to relieve the one working the till, they took off their mask to work the till and the one who had been working the till unmasked put on a mask to walk off through the shop for her break.

Obviously policy or advice from HSE must have changed.

Every dunnes till and cashier are pretty much covered with plexi glass. Much more protected than any other shopper walking the shop with visor on. You need to calm down a bit or if you do not like it shop somewhere else.

ednwireland

No: other

Diarmuid wrote: »

Just posting this anecdote here. On hols in Italy at the moment. Piémonte to be precise. With regard to mask wearing,

On the street I reckon
20% wear a mask
60% wear a mask on their elbow or less frequently on their chin
20% don't wear a mask

In shops, all wear masks

Restaurants and bars are pretty much back to normal apart from the fact that the waiters wear masks all the time

This is in a location with pretty much no foreign holiday makers

seems reasonable ?

patnor1011

No: I will wait for the HSE to recommend

Roger_007 wrote: »

For screens to be effective the would need to totally enclose and seal the checkout area and have a separate air supply. The ones that are in use in shops are a joke. They re nothing but a fig leaf to pretend that the staff are protected in some way. They are not protected at all.
It’s all part of the Orwellian world that we now inhabit where you can get people to believe in just about anything.

They are probably the same joke as homemade face masks or visors. Or majority of people reusing the same mask over and over just to comply with "regulations". That should show you how how unbelievable this whole masks excercise is really. Government PR stunt to show that they are doing something by forcing some ridiculous regulations like "substantial meals" for example.