Immigration authorities raid places of employment

weldoninhio

mariaalice wrote: »

Yes as in not Irish, is your issue with the Brazilians and Mexicans who are working here?

I've no idea what you are talking about, so I'm out.

mariaalice

I am not for or against immigration, of course, it has to be regulated some way, however, some of the arguments here are boarding on nonsense.

Eric Cartman

Varik wrote: »

Some people act like any kind of immigration control has to be total 100% deportation of all immigrants and stopping it in full, that there can't be any nuance to it. We already have lower requirements for non-EEA immigrants in certain cases where they've needed skills or qualifications.

Thats it “we just dont want unskilled or uneducated migrants, speaking our language and sharing our customs would be lovely “ is “kick out all the foreigners” in their heads

CucaFace

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Thats it “we just dont want unskilled or uneducated migrants, speaking our language and sharing our customs would be lovely “ is “kick out all the foreigners” in their heads

That speak our language? So basically we can only bring in educated migrants from Canada, USA, UK, Australia, South Africa and New Zealand? I'm sure we will have no problem doing that....

By the way what level of education do you think the Brazilian's and Mexicans who are coming here to study have? The vast majority of them are middle class people from their countries, otherwise they would never be able to get the funds together to come here. Because unlike us, they actually come from countries where there are true issues with equality and crime just to mention a few.

Do you live in Dublin? Have you made one friend from people from these countries? Do you really think a Mexican or Brazilian isn't culturally very similar to us? Catholic people, from countries with poor colonial pasts who have had to immigrate on mass, like to drink and have the craic and who have a really good sense of humour.... please tell me how these are so different to us?

Sultan of Bling

Eric Cartman wrote:

Thats it “we just dont want unskilled or uneducated migrants, speaking our language and sharing our customs would be lovely “ is “kick out all the foreigners†in their heads

CucaFace wrote:

That speak our language? So basically we can only bring in educated migrants from Canada, USA, UK, Australia, South Africa and New Zealand? I'm sure we will have no problem doing that....

You would have to kick lots of Irish people out too as the vast majority don't speak our native language either.

weldoninhio

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

You would have to kick lots of Irish people out too as the vast majority don't speak our native language either.

The poster you quoted never mentioned "native" language.

Chinasea

CucaFace wrote: »

Very few Irish are doing these jobs, many would rather sit on their arses from the age they can get social welfare to the day they die. All the time taking from the system and looking for more and more without giving anything back to society. And strangely its from these useless wasters that the immigrants get most of their abuse from around the city...

Dublin city is totally reliant on non Irish with regards to cafe's restaurant and lower paid jobs. It would grind to halt if for example the English language sector was stopped from bringing Brazilians/Mexicans ect here to study English. Who else would live 3/4 in a bedroom for a year while working in a minimum wage job?

100% true.

Saw a lovely (not) picture of the Irish flag with a banner "House our own First" . They left out 'regardless of if they have or will ever contribute to their beloved Eireann go braith...other than of course babbies galore

4068ac1elhodqr

CucaFace wrote: »

That speak our language? So basically we can only bring in educated migrants from Canada, USA, UK, Australia, South Africa and New Zealand? I'm sure we will have no problem doing that....

Don't forget about 1bn Indians who are fairly fluent with English. As it's also the main business langauge of various states (inc Ire), there is very wide uptake of it across the EU, and the entire world really.


The uk will introduce points for en-language ability, but it will be on a scale, so just above average skills may suffice for a well-paid Phd scientist, but an entry level Nurse will need to have 'excellent' or 'fluent' ability to get enough points.

mariaalice

Kye Refined Ozone wrote: »

Don't forget about 1bn Indians who are fairly fluent with English. As it's also the main business langauge of various states (inc Ire), there is very wide uptake of it across the EU, and the entire world really.


The uk will introduce points for en-language ability, but it will be on a scale, so just above average skills may suffice for a well-paid Phd scientist, but an entry level Nurse will need to have 'excellent' or 'fluent' ability to get enough points.

That is not going to happen, the devil is in the detail as always with this things thing they have changed the yearly salary needed for a visa with a job offer jut enough so they can bring in band 5 nurse. There is already and English language test for nurses in the uk https://www.nmc.org.uk/registration/joining-the-register/english-language-requirements/

The optics and headlines are one thing and what will acutely happen is another.

Kermit.de.frog

Is there a risk we will receive more and less skilled immigrants due to the UKs tougher immigration regime?

mariaalice

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Is there a risk we will receive more and less skilled immigrants due to the UKs tougher immigration regime?

Depends, we are very self-absorbed about this we are not the only country in the world a lot of eastern European economies are booming. We are attractive for south Americans, south Africans ect because its easy to get a visa but those coming are mostly from middle-class backgrounds.


I suppose we could become a target for less well educated but not poorly educated from developing nations.

Yurt2

mariaalice wrote: »

Depends, we are very self-absorbed about this we are not the only country in the world a lot of eastern European economies are booming. We are attractive for south Americans, south Africans ect because its easy to get a visa but those coming are mostly from middle-class backgrounds.


I suppose we could become a target for less well educated but not poorly educated from developing nations.

There was a noticeable spike in Pakistani nationals claiming asylum a couple of years back after a high-profile immigration crackdown in the UK.

It's inevitable we'll see a spillover from what happens there in the next few years. This Conservative government, rightly or wrongly, has a particular eye on immigration. The days of landing in the UK on a tourist permit and disappearing into your ethnic community no questions asked are probably numbered.

I don't want to see attitudes harden against immigrants, but we're going to have to think a lot harder about what kind of immigration we want in the coming years.

Eric Cartman

CucaFace wrote: »

That speak our language? So basically we can only bring in educated migrants from Canada, USA, UK, Australia, South Africa and New Zealand? I'm sure we will have no problem doing that....

By the way what level of education do you think the Brazilian's and Mexicans who are coming here to study have? The vast majority of them are middle class people from their countries, otherwise they would never be able to get the funds together to come here. Because unlike us, they actually come from countries where there are true issues with equality and crime just to mention a few.

Do you live in Dublin? Have you made one friend from people from these countries? Do you really think a Mexican or Brazilian isn't culturally very similar to us? Catholic people, from countries with poor colonial pasts who have had to immigrate on mass, like to drink and have the craic and who have a really good sense of humour.... please tell me how these are so different to us?

And the EU countries, as per usual we are only discussing non EU migration due to our membership of the EU and the free movement it brings.

If all these brazillians are educated and so middle class why are they sharing apartments between 6,8,10 of them and out selling drugs on rickshaws at night, obviously not all of them doing this but its a commonly reoccuring theme.

Yurt2

I've met several Brazilians who were open about they were only in Ireland because the English language school route was much easier to stay here medium term, and that the UK was much more challenging to secure a visa for. A lot of them have perfectly good English in any case.

From what I can tell, a lot of them would be lower-middle class Brazilains, ones who would have been doing alright but not spectacular before the downturn in the Brazilian economy.

Eric Cartman

Yurt! wrote: »

I've met several Brazilians who were open about they were only in Ireland because the English language school route was much easier to stay here medium term, and that the UK was much more challenging to secure a visa for. A lot of them have perfectly good English in any case.

From what I can tell, a lot of them would be lower-middle class Brazilains, ones who would have been doing alright but not spectacular before the downturn in the Brazilian economy.

Therefore criminals here under false pretenses.

Yurt2

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Therefore criminals here under false pretenses.

I wouldn't call them criminals, but it's clear many aren't here for the English language tuition, and would have their eye on staying in Ireland longer.

The Brazilians I've met have been generally great craic - but if we're to be honest, the english language school industry is a convenient back door for a lot of people to come here.

The rickshaw thing was out of control for a while.

4068ac1elhodqr

mariaalice wrote: »

That is not going to happen

Can you supply the lotto numbers for tonight also, thanks.


There is many cases of Nurses in the uk with very poor English language abilities, a stricter test will certainly help reduce communication mistakes going forward.

James Brown

Millicently wrote: »

Ah play me a song on the worlds smallest violin. Jesus wept, poor you. There are bullies all over the world in every country in every industry. You claim to have been picked on because of your colour, people get picked on for being fat, thin,tall, short any number of things. But I'm really tired of people playing the race card in this country. Don't like it, explore other options for working or living, but don't tar the people of this country as racist.

So you're giving him sh*t for telling us about an incident? He should keep quiet because it's not new to you?
He never tarred the people of this country, (which includes himself by the way) but the reception he's getting on here is pretty ignorant IMO.
'Don't like it leave' is it? Sure we use to say that to the unemployed and poor. Maybe we should make things better? just a thought.

Lefty Bicek

Bowie wrote: »

So you're giving him sh*t for telling us about an incident? He should keep quiet because it's not new to you?
He never tarred the people of this country, (which includes himself by the way) but the reception he's getting on here is pretty ignorant IMO.
'Don't like it leave' is it? Sure we use to say that to the unemployed and poor. Maybe we should make things better? just a thought.

We can only go on what that poster told us.

He/she decided to conclude from the single incident related, that 'it's not down to be brown here'.

A more sensible conclusion to be drawn from the single incident - as it was told to us - is that he was dealing with an irate/irrational/stressed/unstable woman.

Specific incidences don't work if you wish to make general points.

Spook_ie

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Have you ever gone for a coffee, to a deli, shop, restaurant, cafe in Dublin? Ever stayed in a hotel? Gone for a pint/meal? Ever had food delivered?

If the answer is yes the please tell us (honestly) how many of the staff you encountered were Irish?

More to the point of the OP, how many of them do you think may or may not be here legally?

Boggles

Spook_ie wrote: »

More to the point of the OP, how many of them do you think may or may not be here legally?

About 26,000 "undocumented" people in Ireland. The vast majority who work.

report from the Justice Committee showed 89 per cent of undocumented people were working, a third of whom have held their current jobs for more than five years.

A sensible amnesty should be introduced much like the one Boris Johnson has proposed in the UK. (Yes the bould Bojo).

It would benefit not just them, but the country and the economy as a whole.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/varadkar-urged-not-to-forget-undocumented-living-in-ireland-1.3429507

Yurt2

Boggles wrote: »

About 26,000 "undocumented" people in Ireland. The vast majority who work.



A sensible amnesty should be introduced much like the one Boris Johnson has proposed in the UK. (Yes the bould Bojo).

It would benefit not just them, but the country and the economy as a whole.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/varadkar-urged-not-to-forget-undocumented-living-in-ireland-1.3429507

For the sake of the credibility of the immigration system, I would strongly disagree with such an amnesty. I also think the economic benefits of such are oversold, and I do think it would act as a pull factor.

Not opposed to immigration, but I would like to see a system that rewards honesty and not sleight of hand. It's ultimately the organs of the state who get to decide who reside here, and not up to the individual who violated laws to remain to say 'I belong here.'

4068ac1elhodqr

Boggles wrote: »

About 26,000 "undocumented" people in Ireland. The vast majority who work.

If 'undocumented', they won't be paying income tax, they'll be paying a majority of pocket cash their criminal gangmasters (who'll reinvest this for other dodgy enterprises dealings).

Often traffickers force their subjects to 'work' for many years in a form of modern slavery, to repay their original debt of trafficking. From nailbars to car washing, and other 'services'.

Dodgy businesses that choose to use them as cheap (below min wage) illegal-labour will be operating outside of regulations. Many of the undocumented will also avail of WesternUnion to move vast amounts of black-market cash outwards (often again as debt payment), and again of no benefit to the state tax abacus counters at end of fiscal year, who won't see much of it.

Eric Cartman

Boggles wrote: »

About 26,000 "undocumented" people in Ireland. The vast majority who work.



A sensible amnesty should be introduced much like the one Boris Johnson has proposed in the UK. (Yes the bould Bojo).

It would benefit not just them, but the country and the economy as a whole.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/varadkar-urged-not-to-forget-undocumented-living-in-ireland-1.3429507

proof, where is there any proof of that.

edit, read the article, but don't believe them for one second.

Timberrrrrrrr

Eric Cartman wrote: »

proof, where is there any proof of that.

edit, read the article, but don't believe them for one second.

Says the lad who posted statistics from Denmark.when asked for proof of his claim :rolleyes:

Non EU migrants are more likely to be involved in crime than native irish people

BarnardsLoop

Eric Cartman wrote: »

proof, where is there any proof of that.

edit, read the article, but don't believe them for one second.

Quelle surprise that you don't believe evidence that contradicts your worldview. :pac:

Eric Cartman

BarnardsLoop wrote: »

Quelle surprise that you don't believe evidence that contradicts your worldview. :pac:

you wouldnt believe a tobacco company saying cigarettes are good for you...


interesting how youve mapped my world view with only 8 posts on this site....

Redneck Reject71

Millicently wrote: »

Ah play me a song on the worlds smallest violin. Jesus wept, poor you. There are bullies all over the world in every country in every industry. You claim to have been picked on because of your colour, people get picked on for being fat, thin,tall, short any number of things. But I'm really tired of people playing the race card in this country. Don't like it, explore other options for working or living, but don't tar the people of this country as racist.

For one, I'm not playing the race card for spite, regardless what you may think. And second, I'm not tarring everyone with the same brush. Thats your exaggeration, not mine. For the most part I find the Irish very fun and friendly and have many as friends. But there are a few who are judgemental when it comes to others who have a different skin tone. Take it for what you will.

Boggles

Eric Cartman wrote: »

proof, where is there any proof of that.

edit, read the article, but don't believe them for one second.

So you ask for proof, then read the article and declare you don't believe it.

Have you something that refutes it apart from a little sullied personal opinion?

Boggles

Kye Refined Ozone wrote: »

If 'undocumented', they won't be paying income tax, they'll be paying a majority of pocket cash their criminal gangmasters (who'll reinvest this for other dodgy enterprises dealings).

Often traffickers force their subjects to 'work' for many years in a form of modern slavery, to repay their original debt of trafficking. From nailbars to car washing, and other 'services'.

Dodgy businesses that choose to use them as cheap (below min wage) illegal-labour will be operating outside of regulations. Many of the undocumented will also avail of WesternUnion to move vast amounts of black-market cash outwards (often again as debt payment), and again of no benefit to the state tax abacus counters at end of fiscal year, who won't see much of it.

WTF are you talking about, did you even read the article?

The majority of undocumented migrants in Ireland entered the State legally, many on study visas and decided to remain after their visas expired.

They weren't trafficked or smuggled in by criminal gangs, the vast majority of undocumented people enter the state legally.