Cyclists

Potential-Monke

Chorcai wrote: »

There's a fúck wad here in Drogheda on one of these yokes and he treats the footpaths as bmx course, on his "cycle" to the train station each morning, these can do 50 mp/h serious damage done when and I mean when he hits someone.
https://www.eta.co.uk/2013/01/30/50mph-electric-bicycle-for-commuting/

Genuinely report him to the Gardai. That bike can go by itself, so under Irish legislation it's classed as an MPV - Mechanically Propelled Vehicle, and as such requires a driving licence.

micar

Thargor wrote: »

Where are all these footpath cyclists? .

The only time i use the footpath is to cycle up Mobhi Road in Glasnevin.

The road is simply wide enough to cater for a bike and car side by side. The road surface on the left hand side against the curb is quite dangerous is parts.

After a few incidents cycling on the road, I moved onto the footpath. The vast majority of cyclists use the footpath which is quite wide anyway.

There are 2 house being renovated and there constantly vans parked on the footpath. I suppose people will have an issue with the 90 seconds I use the footpath compared to the 8/9 hours the vans are parked there

In general, the majority of cyclists I see on footpaths are kids.

AndrewJRenko

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Andrew, you obviously have a serious issue with motorists, I'd imagine from being a cyclist/pedestrian? You're blaming every single motorist for your woes, and throwing out facts about deaths involving cars. Not every driver is the same, just like not every cyclist is the same. You expect people to take your point of view on board, but at the same time blame every motorist, so how can they take your point if you're blaming them?

I don't blame every motorist, but I don't buy into the 'just a few bad apples' thing, given the clear evidence that four out of five motorists break speed limits and the majority of motorists use their phones at the wheel.

Spook_ie wrote: »

Didn't you, looks to me that is what you said. Many times drivers are charged with careless or dangerous driving just because on conviction they don't have capital punishment doesn't mean they aren't convicted.

Nope, I didn't say 'drivers never get convicted'. I did indicate that it's probably the only way to kill someone and walk away without any jail time.


It must be a great feeling to get the oul taxi licence and know that you can take up whatever space you like - path, bike lane, double-park (even when there is nice big empty driveways or other vacant spaces nearby) and to hell with the consequences for everyone else?


https://streamable.com/7c3jb


The first clip isn't the clearest, but the taxi pulled out of the clinic driveway into the path of the cyclist in front of me, who had to take evasive action.

Potential-Monke

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I don't blame every motorist, but I don't buy into the 'just a few bad apples' thing, given the clear evidence that four out of five motorists break speed limits and the majority of motorists use their phones at the wheel.

You don't have to accept it, but the facts prove otherwise. A quick Google has shown me that there are over 2.1 million cars in Ireland, and according to this Journal artice (the first I found) there were 14,000 drivers convicted of driving while using a phone in 2017. That's 0.67% of motorists convicted. Now, I understand that not everyone gets caught, but if 'the majority' of motorists use their phones at the wheel, that figure would be much higher.

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but it doesn't happen to the extent you claim.

Chorcai

micar wrote: »

Considering my home house is beside the train station, please report him to the Guards.

Give them the time he usually goes to the station.

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Genuinely report him to the Gardai. That bike can go by itself, so under Irish legislation it's classed as an MPV - Mechanically Propelled Vehicle, and as such requires a driving licence.

Will do!

Spook_ie

beauf wrote: »

It didn't mention cars... or pedestrians. His observations were about cars AND cyclists...and pedestrians. And peak time also.

Keep digging though...

Not digging, just pointing out your factual discrepancies when dissing a poster.

Spook_ie

beauf wrote: »

So when you feel like it you don't basically.

But I'm impressed so many dogs have learnt to cycle.

What dogs cycling? Maybe you're in some alternative universe.

Spook_ie

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

It's not hard really.

I'd say there's a maximum of 12 bicycles in a standard parking space even when double stacked, not 21.

AndrewJRenko

Potential-Monke wrote: »

You don't have to accept it, but the facts prove otherwise. A quick Google has shown me that there are over 2.1 million cars in Ireland, and according to this Journal artice (the first I found) there were 14,000 drivers convicted of driving while using a phone in 2017. That's 0.67% of motorists convicted. Now, I understand that not everyone gets caught, but if 'the majority' of motorists use their phones at the wheel, that figure would be much higher.

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but it doesn't happen to the extent you claim.

Try cycling along a line of cars stopped at any traffic light in Dublin. More than half of the drivers will have a phone in their hand. I see it every day, as does any cyclist keeping an eye out from their elevated position.

The recent Liberty survey confirmed this. The Aviva survey from a year or two back had Ireland 2nd worst on the European league table for checking social media while driving.

It is absolutely endemic.

Potential-Monke

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Try cycling along a line of cars stopped at any traffic light in Dublin. More than half of the drivers will have a phone in their hand. I see it every day, as does any cyclist keeping an eye out from their elevated position.

The recent Liberty survey confirmed this. The Aviva survey from a year or two back had Ireland 2nd worst on the European league table for checking social media while driving.

It is absolutely endemic.

And anyone that does it should be shot with pellets of their own sh!te. But it's not everyone, and certainly not as common as you let on, especially outside the Pale. And checking the phone at the lights, while still wrong, is very different to driving while using the phone. You made it sound like they're all driving around the place while on the phone the whole time.

Anyway, I hate Dublin so I won't be cycling there (or anywhere) to experience this. And I have seen other motorists use their phones while driving and stationary, but again nowhere near the level you are letting on. Not saying it doesn't happen, but it's not everywhere and all the time. And I still have a 'second sight' for this, as when I was a Garda it was a pet peeve of mine, so i'd like to think i'm more aware of this than your regular motorist. Unsurprisingly, you see it a lot more when not driving the patrol car.

beauf

Chorcai wrote: »

There's a fúck wad here in Drogheda on one of these yokes and he treats the footpaths as bmx course, on his "cycle" to the train station each morning, these can do 50 mp/h serious damage done when and I mean when he hits someone.
https://www.eta.co.uk/2013/01/30/50mph-electric-bicycle-for-commuting/

That's not a bicycle under our laws.
He can only use it on a private land.

Effectively hes a motorcyclist without insurance or tax.

beauf

Potential-Monke wrote: »

A....And checking the phone at the lights, while still wrong, is very different to driving while using the phone. ...

No difference in law.

Since this thread wants laws blindly obeyed without question.

beauf

Spook_ie wrote: »

Not digging, just pointing out your factual discrepancies when dissing a poster.

A fact isn't something you make up, then invent an imaginary argument against it, while misquoting.

an intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent's real argument.

beauf

Chorcai wrote: »

Outside of the cities, these don't exist

I've seen them in the middle of nowhere and wondered why they aren't in cities.

Ironic isn't it.

beauf

Potential-Monke wrote: »

..... I have seen other motorists use their phones while driving and stationary, but again nowhere near the level you are letting on. ....

How do you judge how many are doing it. Usually when driving if the car in front is wandering they are usually on the phone. Same with trucks not paying attention. Common enough I'd guesstimate.

Potential-Monke

beauf wrote: »

No difference in law.

Since this thread wants laws blindly obeyed without question.

That's why I said it was still wrong, but driving while using a phone and stationary while using a phone is something that should be clarified, one is wrong, the other is dangerous.

beauf wrote: »

How do you judge how many are doing it. Usually when driving if the car in front is wandering they are usually on the phone. Same with trucks not paying attention. Common enough I'd guesstimate.

I judge by seeing. And no, a swerving car is not usually caused by using a phone. it can be one reason, but there are many. I'd wager using the car stereo is a more likely factor, in my guesstimate, but that's the joys of guesstimating, it's a guess.

beauf

Potential-Monke wrote: »

That's why I said it was still wrong, but driving while using a phone and stationary while using a phone is something that should be clarified, one is wrong, the other is dangerous.

I judge by seeing. And no, a swerving car is not usually caused by using a phone. it can be one reason, but there are many. I'd wager using the car stereo is a more likely factor, in my guesstimate, but that's the joys of guesstimating, it's a guess.

They did clarify it.

The law was introduced in 2014 by then transport minister Leo Varadkar to close a loophole which meant drivers could escape fines and penalties if they were texting or browsing on a phone which was resting in a cradle on their dashboard, rather than holding it directly in their hands.

https://extra.ie/2019/01/02/news/irish-news/just-three-drivers-have-been-convicted-for-using-mobile-phone-behind-the-wheel

https://extra.ie/2018/11/15/news/irish-news/motorists-caught-using-mobile-phones

But then you'd know all this based on your experience. Since its only an offence if you see it. Probably explains why it doesn't count if anyone else sees it.

The stats for cycling fines are equally abysmal. Something like a 2 per day for the whole country. Assuming you can just the crimes stats.

beauf

Potential-Monke wrote: »

T....And no, a swerving car is not usually caused by using a phone. it can be one reason,...

It is in my experience. I must have imagined it.

Potential-Monke

beauf wrote: »

They did clarify it.

https://extra.ie/2019/01/02/news/irish-news/just-three-drivers-have-been-convicted-for-using-mobile-phone-behind-the-wheel

https://extra.ie/2018/11/15/news/irish-news/motorists-caught-using-mobile-phones

But then you'd know all this based on your experience. Since its only an offence if you see it. Probably explains why it doesn't count if anyone else sees it.

The stats for cycling fines are equally abysmal. Something like a 2 per day for the whole country. Assuming you can just the crimes stats.

That law was specifically for checking texts or emails, or 'accessing information'. Still doesn't cover someone using Spotify on their phone while in a cradle and hooked up to their car. Plus, it's next to impossible to prove, unless the Garda sees the person sending a text or email, which is too hard to prove in general, what will all the different Apps out there, could have been anything.

But the original law is specifically for holding a phone, and that is being enforced.

beauf wrote: »

It is in my experience. I must have imagined it.

You didn't, but it's unfair to say it's caused usually by a phone.

YFlyer

Potential-Monke wrote: »

You don't have to accept it, but the facts prove otherwise. A quick Google has shown me that there are over 2.1 million cars in Ireland, and according to this Journal artice (the first I found) there were 14,000 drivers convicted of driving while using a phone in 2017. That's 0.67% of motorists convicted. Now, I understand that not everyone gets caught, but if 'the majority' of motorists use their phones at the wheel, that figure would be much higher.

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but it doesn't happen to the extent you claim.

Lol

AllForIt

One never feels so stupid than when it's pissing down with rain and your stopped at lights on your bike and not another car to be seen anywhere in sight.

Potential-Monke

Potential-Monke wrote: »

That's why I said it was still wrong, but driving while using a phone and stationary while using a phone is something that should be clarified, one is wrong, the other is dangerous.



I judge by seeing. And no, a swerving car is not usually caused by using a phone. it can be one reason, but there are many. I'd wager using the car stereo is a more likely factor, in my guesstimate, but that's the joys of guesstimating, it's a guess.

You'd be surprised. As a motorcyclist, I have the benefit of being able to pull up alongside erratic drivers. Virtually every time they are on their phone, although I have had occasions where they are reading a document or looking at an old paper map.

The look on their face when they think it's a Garda bike beside them is priceless. I doubt it does anything to change their habits, though.

2011

Potential-Monke wrote: »

A quick Google has shown me that there are over 2.1 million cars in Ireland, and according to this Journal artice (the first I found) there were 14,000 drivers convicted of driving while using a phone in 2017. That's 0.67% of motorists convicted. Now, I understand that not everyone gets caught, but if 'the majority' of motorists use their phones at the wheel, that figure would be much higher.

I highlighted the only sensible part of your post in bold. Suggesting that few are doing this because so few get caught does not hold any water. Drivers on mobile phones is a huge issue.

Drive on the M50 you will see most cars speeding with impunity, yet how many get caught? Sweet FA.


On another point, I like this:

Potential-Monke

2011 wrote: »

I highlighted the only sensible part of your post in bold. Suggesting that few are doing this because so few get caught does not hold any water. Drivers on mobile phones is a huge issue.

Drive on the M50 you will see most cars speeding with impunity, yet how many get caught? Sweet FA.

Similarly, in the same vein, saying that everyone does it also doesn't hold any water, so it's all down to personal experience then?

But I'm sticking to my guns, if everyone was at it, the detection figures would be higher. I can speak from experience, you could go an entire day in a marked Garda car and not notice a single driver on the phone, but understandable as only the truly thick stay on the phone with a very visible Garda car around.

Change over to the unmarked, you will get more, but if everyone was doing it, the figure would be much higher. Neither of us can prove it. And yes, drivers on phones is a huge issue, and if they only use it to make/take calls, they're complete idiots as Bluetooth solves that. If they're texting/emailing/using social media they should be removed from the roads. But that's very hard to prove due to a lack of proper legislation giving Gardai the power to prove it.

AndrewJRenko

Potential-Monke wrote: »

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Try cycling along a line of cars stopped at any traffic light in Dublin. More than half of the drivers will have a phone in their hand. I see it every day, as does any cyclist keeping an eye out from their elevated position.

The recent Liberty survey confirmed this. The Aviva survey from a year or two back had Ireland 2nd worst on the European league table for checking social media while driving.

It is absolutely endemic.

And anyone that does it should be shot with pellets of their own sh!te. But it's not everyone, and certainly not as common as you let on, especially outside the Pale. And checking the phone at the lights, while still wrong, is very different to driving while using the phone. You made it sound like they're all driving around the place while on the phone the whole time.

Anyway, I hate Dublin so I won't be cycling there (or anywhere) to experience this. And I have seen other motorists use their phones while driving and stationary, but again nowhere near the level you are letting on. Not saying it doesn't happen, but it's not everywhere and all the time. And I still have a 'second sight' for this, as when I was a Garda it was a pet peeve of mine, so i'd like to think i'm more aware of this than your regular motorist. Unsurprisingly, you see it a lot more when not driving the patrol car.

Get on a bike and you get a third sight for it from your elevated viewpoint. You don't see a tenth of what's happening from another car. That's why more enlightened police forces send out officers on bikes specifically to address this dangerous, selfish offence.

Potential-Monke

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Get on a bike and you get a third sight for it from your elevated viewpoint. You don't see a tenth of what's happening from another car. That's why more enlightened police forces send out officers on bikes specifically to address this dangerous, selfish offence.

And now you're having a go at the guards. I'm out.

2011

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Similarly, in the same vein, saying that everyone does it also doesn't hold any water

Agreed, I never suggested that every driver behaves in this manner or even that a majority do. My point is that far more drivers do this than are caught, to suggest otherwise is daft.

beauf

Potential-Monke wrote: »

And now you're having a go at the guards. I'm out.

What's have security guards got to do with it...

Feisar

micar wrote: »

The only time i use the footpath is to cycle up Mobhi Road in Glasnevin.

The road is simply wide enough to cater for a bike and car side by side. The road surface on the left hand side against the curb is quite dangerous is parts.

After a few incidents cycling on the road, I moved onto the footpath. The vast majority of cyclists use the footpath which is quite wide anyway.

There are 2 house being renovated and there constantly vans parked on the footpath. I suppose people will have an issue with the 90 seconds I use the footpath compared to the 8/9 hours the vans are parked there

In general, the majority of cyclists I see on footpaths are kids.

Similar to yourself I only follow the rules when it suits. 120KMPH is far to slow on a motorway.

beauf

...and we are back...

beauf wrote: »

....
Since this thread wants laws blindly obeyed without question.

Feisar wrote: »

Similar to yourself I only follow the rules when it suits. 120KMPH is far to slow on a motorway.

...Not all countries have the same speed limits on motorways...

Also motorways are the fastest roads yet also the safest.