The Dominance of Dublin GAA *Mod warning post#1*

Jaden

The intercounty setup is no longer a viable proposition in the long term - if the measure of viability is an even chance for all participants to attain honours. It could be argued very strongly that it was never fair. I don't think anyone is claiming otherwise. The imbalance is inherent in the county division system.

Realistically, a move away from this setup to a more even distribution of resource (Funding, Population) is the only way to ensure inherent fairness. I'm just not sure the appetite to embrace this brave new world exists yet. Alot of the ethos of the GAA is mired in tradition, and building up enough forward momentum to overcome this inertia is no small task.

Rosita

Enquiring wrote: »

But as it is, I've already noted that the 4 new counties have the population and resources to thrive. They will be better positioned to promote hurling and football in our capital. I don't see how you think having 4 new competitive teams in hurling and football is counter productive?

Having four new competitive teams in the Dublin area is counter-productive if the plan is to re-energise the competitions from the point of view of other counties. In the long run it'd make Dublin stronger and potentially reconfigure the whole football competition into a Dublin-centric competition. You'd end up with a few counties dotted around the country in isolation like Antrim's hurlers.
If you're happy with that of course then it's not counter-productive. But when I used the phrase I assumed the object of your argument was to declaw Dublin.

tritium

Jaden wrote: »

The intercounty setup is no longer a viable proposition in the long term - if the measure of viability is an even chance for all participants to attain honours. It could be argued very strongly that it was never fair. I don't think anyone is claiming otherwise. The imbalance is inherent in the county division system.

Realistically, a move away from this setup to a more even distribution of resource (Funding, Population) is the only way to ensure inherent fairness. I'm just not sure the appetite to embrace this brave new world exists yet. Alot of the ethos of the GAA is mired in tradition, and building up enough forward momentum to overcome this inertia is no small task.

It’s a big one alright. If you were building it from the ground up tomorrow you’d probably say most of the top counties could support at least two teams and several small counties weren’t by themselves large enough to support a team. It would create enormous logistical issues to change things as well, some sponsors for example may be locked in for years. That said once the talk of splits gets going it’s inevitable that the inherent historical inequality of the GAA is on the table and all of these discussions are fair game. Could west Mayo vs east Mayo be a viable local derby? In soccer we see it often between city teams but the history and ethos is quite different.- who knows?

superbluedub

the kelt wrote: »

I think there will be.

And its unfortunate because its not Dublins fault, they only made the best use of every advantage that was handed to them but its gone too far unfortunately.

The GAA have a lot to answer for

And your entitled to your opinion , sure its all only opinions afterall

Enquiring

It's clear the argument defending the funding disparity has been lost and lost badly. Dublin supporters are just close of saying they're taking their ball and going home.

This is what we can expect when this gets even more publicity and momentum in the media etc. The empty threats will be thrown about along with the abuse and deflection. It's important everyone in favour of change stand up to this and let the facts and evidence do the talking. That's what those who want fair competitions have in our favour. The numbers and data speaks for itself.

Enquiring

Rosita wrote: »

Having four new competitive teams in the Dublin area is counter-productive if the plan is to re-energise the competitions from the point of view of other counties. In the long run it'd make Dublin stronger and potentially reconfigure the whole football competition into a Dublin-centric competition. You'd end up with a few counties dotted around the country in isolation like Antrim's hurlers.
If you're happy with that of course then it's not counter-productive. But when I used the phrase I assumed the object of your argument was to declaw Dublin.

Basically you're picking something out of thin air with nothing at all to back it up. A sure sign of a weak defense.

ShyMets

Enquiring wrote: »

It's clear the argument defending the funding disparity has been lost and lost badly. Dublin supporters are just close of saying they're taking their ball and going home.

This is what we can expect when this gets even more publicity and momentum in the media etc. The empty threats will be thrown about along with the abuse and deflection. It's important everyone in favour of change stand up to this and let the facts and evidence do the talking. That's what those who want fair competitions have in our favour. The numbers and data speaks for itself.

In your opinion

TCP/IP

ShyMets wrote: »

In your opinion

Your better off not engaging with the OP as he has a very clear agenda and best not fall to his level.

ShyMets

TCP/IP wrote: »

Your better off not engaging with the OP as he has a very clear agenda and best not fall to his level.

Their agenda is very clear. The OP also has talent for avoiding answering certain questions or just plain ignoring them
.
But I enjoy indulging them from time to time. It's a guilty pleasure

Enquiring

ShyMets wrote: »

In your opinion

You're free to outline why Dublin should be allowed to continue as is with 2 decades of over funding and the resulting annual income of 5 and 6 million more than most other counties.

Try to give an answer without whataboutery. No one has even attempted to justify it up to now.

Rosita

Jaden wrote: »

The intercounty setup is no longer a viable proposition in the long term - if the measure of viability is an even chance for all participants to attain honours. It could be argued very strongly that it was never fair. I don't think anyone is claiming otherwise. The imbalance is inherent in the county division system.

/QUOTE]

Only problem with this is that sport never sets out to give all participants an even chance. That's an unrealistic premise for starters.

ShyMets

Enquiring wrote: »

You're free to outline why Dublin should be allowed to continue as is with 2 decades of over funding and the resulting annual income of 5 and 6 million more than most other counties.

Try to give an answer without whataboutery. No one has even attempted to justify it up to now.

You're also free to outline the answer to the question I asked you a couple of days back about what you where doing to effect change beyond posting on Boards ie.

Enquiring

ShyMets wrote: »

You're also free to outline the answer to the question I asked you a couple of days back about what you where doing to effect change beyond posting on Boards ie.

That's already been outlined. Watch out for congress 2022. You have any defence of the funding?

ShyMets

Enquiring wrote: »

That's already been outlined. Watch out for congress 2022. You have any defence of the funding?

No it has not. Beyond posting on Boards you have never specifically outlined what you are doing to effect change.

superbluedub

Enquiring wrote: »

That's already been outlined. Watch out for congress 2022. You have any defence of the funding?

Yea looking forward to congress 2022 , the splitting Dublin in 4 followers
will be drying there eyes .

Enquiring

superbluedub wrote: »

Yea looking forward to congress 2022 , the splitting Dublin in 4 followers
will be drying there eyes .

Let's see. Change is definitely coming, we'll just have to wait to find out what that is. One things for sure, not many in the GAA world will be left unaware of the level of funding disparity in Dublin's favour for the past 2 decades and the resources they now possess. The near 100 titles Dublin GAA have won since 2002 will forever be associated with the funding disparity.

superbluedub

Enquiring wrote: »

Let's see. Change is definitely coming, we'll just have to wait to find out what that is. One things for sure, not many in the GAA world will be left unaware of the level of funding disparity in Dublin's favour for the past 2 decades and the resources they now possess. The near 100 titles Dublin GAA have won since 2002 will forever be associated with the funding disparity.

Yes absolutely lets wait and see , nothing will change due to the opinions of the split Dublin in 4 followers on boards.ie thats for sure , cant wait for it actually .

Rosita

Enquiring wrote: »

Basically you're picking something out of thin air with nothing at all to back it up. A sure sign of a weak defense.

It's an opinion as to what might happen. That's all. It hard to back up a supposition about the future with hard facts. You are entitled to explain why you think it wouldn't happen.

ArielAtom

ShyMets wrote: »

No it has not. Beyond posting on Boards you have never specifically outlined what you are doing to effect change.

It's the ultimate in whataboutery!!!!! Never answers a question. Rinse n repeat. All their arguments have been busted, a bit like Connellan and his ill prepared debate that he was unable to get to congress this year because of poor planning. But it is amusing to watch the ramblings of a few people on a chat forum who honestly think that posting here is going to affect a decision made at congress. Being a member of the GAA is a start. Some are even to ashamed of their own county to admit where they are from.

Enquiring

Rosita wrote: »

It's an opinion as to what might happen. That's all. It hard to back up a supposition about the future with hard facts. You are entitled to explain why you think it wouldn't happen.

Your opinion is that Dublin will cease to dominate the football championship as one county despite ever increasing resources yet you think the 4 counties after the split will dominate. I don't think much explanation is needed to dispute that in fairness.

Enquiring

ArielAtom wrote: »

It's the ultimate in whataboutery!!!!! Never answers a question. Rinse n repeat. All their arguments have been busted, a bit like Connellan and his ill prepared debate that he was unable to get to congress this year because of poor planning. But it is amusing to watch the ramblings of a few people on a chat forum who honestly think that posting here is going to affect a decision made at congress. Being a member of the GAA is a start. Some are even to ashamed of their own county to admit where they are from.

You're the poster who claimed the funding was just for primary school children and was only in operation from 2007-2017. And you're talking about ill prepared and busted? Priceless.

ShyMets

Enquiring wrote: »

You're the poster who claimed the funding was just for primary school children and was only in operation from 2007-2017. And you're talking about ill prepared and busted? Priceless.

And yet you are the poster who refuses to answer some of the simple questions which have been put to you

Enquiring

It's obvious that the funding talk really stings some Dublin supporters. If it didn't, why would they abuse people and throw their toys out of the pram when this gets raised by anyone in the media? What needs to be pointed out is that this is not an attack on Dublin, splitting Dublin is necessary for the health of our games and it has huge benefits for Gaelic games in our capital as well.

Obviously with the true extent of the funding disparity revealed, some will put an asterisk beside titles won by teams under the Dublin GAA banner. It definitely takes away from any titles won, that's for sure but it's no excuse to abuse these people. They didn't force Dublin to take the money and had no role in awarding it. The anger should be directed at those behind the decision.

ShyMets

Enquiring wrote: »

It's obvious that the funding talk really stings some Dublin supporters. If it didn't, why would they abuse people and throw their toys out of the pram when this gets raised by anyone in the media? What needs to be pointed out is that this is not an attack on Dublin, splitting Dublin is necessary for the health of our games and it has huge benefits for Gaelic games in our capital as well.

Obviously with the true extent of the funding disparity revealed, some will put an asterisk beside titles won by teams under the Dublin GAA banner. It definitely takes away from any titles won, that's for sure but it's no excuse to abuse these people. They didn't force Dublin to take the money and had no role in awarding it. The anger should be directed at those behind the decision.

Personally I'm not stung or throwing toys out of a pram. As I've stated before I can see Dublin being spilt and amalgamations happening.

I can also see the GAA becoming semi pro.

Rosita

Enquiring wrote: »

Your opinion is that Dublin will cease to dominate the football championship as one county despite ever increasing resources yet you think the 4 counties after the split will dominate. I don't think much explanation is needed to dispute that in fairness.

I never suggested that Dublin will cease to dominate. I just think that Dublin might lose occasionally in the future and another team outside of Dublin could win the championship. I think if you have four teams in Dublin it's very hard to imagine, given how poor most county teams are, that this possibility isn't reduced. To make it less abstract, you would probably move Galway from maybe seventh best team in the country to eleventh best at the stroke of a pen by creating four teams in Dublin. By all means support the creation of four teams in Dublin, but don't delude yourself about the consequences in competition terms.

Enquiring

ShyMets wrote: »

Personally I'm not stung or throwing toys out of a pram. As I've stated before I can see Dublin being spilt and amalgamations happening.

I can also see the GAA becoming semi pro.

I'm not saying every Dublin supporter starts abusing people but it's a significant number. If an argument can't be formed without resorting to abuse then it really is not much of an argument.

Enquiring

Rosita wrote: »

I never suggested that Dublin will cease to dominate. I just think that Dublin might lose occasionally in the future and another team outside of Dublin could win the championship. I think if you have four teams in Dublin it's very hard to imagine, given how poor most county teams are, that this possibility isn't reduced. To make it less abstract, you would probably move Galway from maybe seventh best team in the country to eleventh best at the stroke of a pen by creating four teams in Dublin. By all means support the creation of four teams in Dublin, but don't delude yourself about the consequences in competition terms.

You missed the part where every county will be given appropriate funding? We have seen the difference it makes to the standards of counties that would be considered minnows. Dublin hurlers would be considered so prior to the funding. Only one title across the board in the 20 years prior to funding, they won 14 titles at club and inter county level post funding. That would have been unthinkable pre cash injection. The same will happen if teams are given resources. And that's just for minnows, the middle ranked teams will also rise.

superbluedub

Enquiring wrote: »

It's obvious that the funding talk really stings some Dublin supporters. If it didn't, why would they abuse people and throw their toys out of the pram when this gets raised by anyone in the media? What needs to be pointed out is that this is not an attack on Dublin, splitting Dublin is necessary for the health of our games and it has huge benefits for Gaelic games in our capital as well.

Obviously with the true extent of the funding disparity revealed, some will put an asterisk beside titles won by teams under the Dublin GAA banner. It definitely takes away from any titles won, that's for sure but it's no excuse to abuse these people. They didn't force Dublin to take the money and had no role in awarding it. The anger should be directed at those behind the decision.

Its also obvious the the split Dublin in 4 followers , dont like hearing the so called split will not happen for a very long time if ever and get very sulky when they hear how good this Dublin team is. .

tritium

Enquiring wrote: »

It's obvious that the funding talk really stings some Dublin supporters. If it didn't, why would they abuse people and throw their toys out of the pram when this gets raised by anyone in the media? What needs to be pointed out is that this is not an attack on Dublin, splitting Dublin is necessary for the health of our games and it has huge benefits for Gaelic games in our capital as well.

Obviously with the true extent of the funding disparity revealed, some will put an asterisk beside titles won by teams under the Dublin GAA banner. It definitely takes away from any titles won, that's for sure but it's no excuse to abuse these people. They didn't force Dublin to take the money and had no role in awarding it. The anger should be directed at those behind the decision.

On twenty years time the record books will list this dublin team as the greatest Gaelic football team of all time

No asterix, No footnotes

Simply the best, a team that none of their peers could match and one that changed the way the game is played for the better. A mix of incredible skill and resilience that made their own success story on the field of play

Rosita

Enquiring wrote: »

You missed the part where every county will be given appropriate funding? We have seen the difference it makes to the standards of counties that would be considered minnows.

.

Counties? Which counties?