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Woman rakes up 648 convictions

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    #302
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    apache wrote: »
    She's only out of prison a while before she gets lifted again. When she leaves prison she is given shelter but ends up robbing wine. She then gets mouldy drunk and causes arguments and gets battered.
    I saw her begging on Wednesday and she was back in prison by Thursday.




    Sad and pathetic, at the end of the day.


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    #303
    mikeym
    Registered Users Posts: 3,985 ✭✭✭mikeym


    She will probably change her life around and make a fortune from writing a book:D


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    #304
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    No in general I don't dismiss it if the person is willing to step up and turn their life around.

    But as I said to another poster maybe help was offered in this case and she refused to take it.

    It wouldn't surprise me in this case.

    Sure. But if course Ireland has some token rehabilitation efforts but it's not the norm. So not likely it was available. But since you're making up facts, you're free to make up any back story you want


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    #305
    Hal3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 818 ✭✭✭Hal3000


    Odhinn wrote: »
    You realise that with a bit of bad luck you could have ended up the exact same?

    You're just trolling now.


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    #306
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Hal3000 wrote: »
    You're just trolling now.

    Factors that predict criminal behaviour are probably a lot more diverse than you'd think and lots of them are learned traits. There's no point explaining them to you because you wouldn't believe me. I know someone who works in forensic psychology and the tests they cary out to predict likelihood of recidivism really surprised me. They work in a forensic hospital and they only deal with the toughest cases. Sexual offenders, violent criminals. Unfortunately the service isn't available for people early in their criminal career

    The amount of it that's built in from childhood experience is huge.


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    #307
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,943 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    El_Duderino 09 wrote:
    The amount of it that's built in from childhood experience is huge.


    Its also well known that disorders such as learning disabilities, developmental disorders etc are common amongst criminal populations as well


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    #308
    whomitconcerns
    Registered Users Posts: 4,323 ✭✭✭whomitconcerns


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    Its also well known that disorders such as learning disabilities, developmental disorders etc are common amongst criminal populations as well
    They are common in the non criminal population also... It's not an excuse


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    #309
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,943 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    whomitconcerns wrote:
    They are common in the non criminal population also... It's not an excuse


    This is true, disorders are never an excuse for bad behaviour, but are a critical part of understanding why such behaviour occurs, many of these issues/disorders are detectable at a young age, early intervention is critical, but in many cases this does not occur at all, allowing more complex behaviour to occur later in life, such as criminality


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    #310
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    Its also well known that disorders such as learning disabilities, developmental disorders etc are common amongst criminal populations as well

    Huge. The person I know got th job in forensics because of their previous experience of working with adults with learning disabilities. Criminals use that to their advantage. They can be easier to persuade/coerce and having LD makes it more difficult to make anything more than part time minimum wage in any other career.

    I feel I need to say in every single post that learning difficulty or growing up in a high crime area,, like all the other factors, increase/decrease likelihood of criminal behaviour.


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    #311
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    whomitconcerns wrote: »
    They are common in the non criminal population also... It's not an excuse

    I don't see it as an excuse either. But it's something we can use to our advantage to influence criminal behaviour and promote normal behaviours as both preventative and remedial Interventions.


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    #312
    Hal3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 818 ✭✭✭Hal3000


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    I don't see it as an excuse either. But it's something we can use to our advantage to influence criminal behaviour and promote normal behaviours as both preventative and remedial Interventions.

    Who is we? All good plans but not happening or likely to happen here in the future. Until we have a system that can deliver these programs it's not crazy to say that repeat offenders should be locked up.


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    #313
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Hal3000 wrote: »
    Who is we? All good plans but not happening or likely to happen here in the future. Until we have a system that can deliver these programs it's not crazy to say that repeat offenders should be locked up.

    "We" is any society with the ambition to do it. If you're fixated on punishment it's understandable that you'd have no interest in the society.


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    #314
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,369 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    Sure. But if course Ireland has some token rehabilitation efforts but it's not the norm. So not likely it was available. But since you're making up facts, you're free to make up any back story you want

    I didn't make anything up so maybe back up that last sentence with proof or retract it.


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    #315
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    I didn't make anything up so maybe back up that last sentence with proof or retract it.

    You invented a scenario where she was offered rehabilitation and didn't take it. Baseed on a sum total of zero evidence of what she was or wasn't offered. Or was it based on some evidence you're withholding and are yet to reveal? You tell me.


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    #316
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,369 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    You invented a scenario where she was offered rehabilitation and didn't take it. Baseed on a sum total of zero evidence of what she was or wasn't offered. Or was it based on some evidence you're withholding and are yet to reveal? You tell me.

    No I said she may have been offered help and may not have taken it.

    We don't know that it didn't happen and I never suggested it was factual which is when you jumped in being a bit of a smartarse suggesting I was making things up.


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    #317
    SeanW
    Registered Users Posts: 8,781 ✭✭✭SeanW


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    "We" is any society with the ambition to do it. If you're fixated on punishment it's understandable that you'd have no interest in the society.
    It's not about punishment. It's about protection - if someone is going to rob a shop or assault someone the second they get out of jail, then "society" has a right to protect itself from such a person. "We" need to stop making excuses for scumbags. "We" need to stop blaming "society" for individuals bad actions.

    Because "society" includes the shopkeepers who have their stuff taken. Society includes the people that get assaulted, or have their property damaged. They are the actual victims, and in a civilised society, they are entitled to protection from scumbags.


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    #318
    Hal3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 818 ✭✭✭Hal3000


    SeanW wrote: »
    It's not about punishment. It's about protection - if someone is going to rob a shop or assault someone the second they get out of jail, then "society" has a right to protect itself from such a person. "We" need to stop making excuses for scumbags. "We" need to stop blaming "society" for individuals bad actions.

    Because "society" includes the shopkeepers who have their stuff taken. Society includes the people that get assaulted, or have their property damaged. They are the actual victims, and in a civilised society, they are entitled to protection from scumbags.

    Yes, I've been saying this all along. The point these guys are trying to get across is that early intervention will stop future victims. If that's the case then why so many repeat offenders and victims in Ireland? Oh wait, because we don't have any systems or agencies that can deliver these rehabilition programs. It's total hypothetical pie in the sky garbage repeated on loads of other threads here backed up by zero proven results in Ireland. Until we have all these rehab programs then repeat offenders must be appropriately punished... My point over and over and over again.


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    #319
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    No I said she may have been offered help and may not have taken it.

    We don't know that it didn't happen and I never suggested it was factual which is when you jumped in being a bit of a smartarse suggesting I was making things up.

    You invented the scenario based on nothing but your bias. You can expect other posters to reinforce your imaginings, but I called it what it us -your imagination.


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    #320
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    SeanW wrote: »
    It's not about punishment. It's about protection - if someone is going to rob a shop or assault someone the second they get out of jail, then "society" has a right to protect itself from such a person. "We" need to stop making excuses for scumbags. "We" need to stop blaming "society" for individuals bad actions.

    Because "society" includes the shopkeepers who have their stuff taken. Society includes the people that get assaulted, or have their property damaged. They are the actual victims, and in a civilised society, they are entitled to protection from scumbags.

    Just as a matter if Interest, do you consider anyone in this thread has excused her behaviour?


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    #321
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Hal3000 wrote: »
    Yes, I've been saying this all along. The point these guys are trying to get across is that early intervention will stop future victims. If that's the case then why so many repeat offenders and victims in Ireland? Oh wait, because we don't have any systems or agencies that can deliver these rehabilition programs. It's total hypothetical pie in the sky garbage repeated on loads of other threads here backed up by zero proven results in Ireland. Until we have all these rehab programs then repeat offenders must be approiatley punished... My point over and over and over again.

    We don't do it in Ireland, and you consider that to be proof that it can't work? What a strange way to figure out what works. Is it a lack of ambition that gives you that outlook?

    Just to be clear, i support establishing the services to rehabilitate people. I'm not afraid of doing things differently from how they've been done in the past. I believe Irish people are capable of improving their society by improving how we do things. The fact that we don't currently have the services just means we need to establish the services.


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    #322
    Hal3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 818 ✭✭✭Hal3000


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    We don't do it in Ireland, and you consider that to be proof that it can't work? What a strange way to figure out what works. Is it a lack of ambition that gives you that outlook?

    Just to be clear, i support establishing the services to rehabilitate people. I'm not afraid of doing things differently from how they've been done in the past. I believe Irish people are capable of improving their society by improving how we do things. The fact that we don't currently have the services just means we need to establish the services.

    Never once said it can't work in any of my posts. I said we don't have it here so until we do repeat offenders must be appropriately punished. You're on some sort of social experiment crusade here. This is Ireland we can't even run our mental health services correctly.These programs you talk about are decades away from being in Irish society, and until that time comes I would prefer if repeat offenders weren't roaming around freely in society. If that makes me a bad person then perhaps it's true, society really is *****d..


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    #323
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    "We" is any society with the ambition to do it. If you're fixated on punishment it's understandable that you'd have no interest in the society.

    Personally I couldn't give a f*ck about punishment, my desire to see career criminals locked up is to make sure that they can't amass more innocent victims. If this woman had been jailed on her 647th conviction, then whoever the victim of her 648th crime was would never have been a victim of it in the first place.


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    #324
    Greyfox
    Registered Users Posts: 3,735 ✭✭✭Greyfox


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    Just as a matter if Interest, do you consider anyone in this thread has excused her behaviour?

    They don't need to, anger towards scumbags is understandable due to how lenient our legal system is
    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »
    The fact that we don't currently have the services just means we need to establish the services.

    Nonsense, it makes far more sense to invest money in preventing criminal behaviour before it occurs then in rehabilitation, criminals should have to show a real desire to be rehabilitated before we invest in them. We have bigger problems in Ireland including a rental crisis and riddiculous waiting times for A&E and mental health issues.


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    #325
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,282 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    Personally I couldn't give a f*ck about punishment, my desire to see career criminals locked up is to make sure that they can't amass more innocent victims. If this woman had been jailed on her 647th conviction, then whoever the victim of her 648th crime was would never have been a victim of it in the first place.

    There was a chance to fix this problem for life 637 crimes ago but ofcourse our legal system has no balls.


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    #326
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,028 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Greyfox wrote: »

    Nonsense, it makes far more sense to invest money in preventing criminal behaviour before it occurs then in rehabilitation, criminals should have to show a real desire to be rehabilitated before we invest in them. We have bigger problems in Ireland including a rental crisis and riddiculous waiting times for A&E and mental health issues.

    LOL. Rehabilitation is a way to prevent crime.


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    #327
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    Greyfox wrote: »
    They don't need to, anger towards scumbags is understandable due to how lenient our legal system is


    She's spent 27 years behind bars. I'm not seeing that as "lenient" meself.


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    #328
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    Odhinn wrote: »
    She's spent 27 years behind bars. I'm not seeing that as "lenient" meself.

    Resulting from 600+ convictions.. are you joking?! :eek:


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    #329
    CrankyHaus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,281 ✭✭✭CrankyHaus


    Odhinn wrote: »
    She's spent 27 years behind bars. I'm not seeing that as "lenient" meself.


    Wasn't that merely stated by her defence counsel in applying for leniency and in any case is certainly not true.


    She's 44. If she spent 27 years in prison then the last time she was free was when she was 17, which cannot be the case if she amassed 648 convictions since her 18th birthday.


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    #330
    Cork Trucker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,553 ✭✭✭Cork Trucker


    A guy from Kerry today racked up his 400th conviction in Cork. 255 for the same offence

    https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Man-clocks-up-his-400th-conviction-at-Cork-District-Court-928b62d7-4915-4414-976b-8619b4aafad1-ds?fbclid=IwAR1TWf24Quuwjo0yPCt_eypKLxBTfplfK47YIrIcrJYY6xecmeHGYbsaWc4


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    #331
    Cork Trucker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,553 ✭✭✭Cork Trucker


    CrankyHaus wrote: »
    Wasn't that merely stated by her defence counsel in applying for leniency and in any case is certainly not true.


    She's 44. If she spent 27 years in prison then the last time she was free was when she was 17, which cannot be the case if she amassed 648 convictions since her 18th birthday.

    She may have been in custody in a juvenile detention centre pre 18 such as Oberstown or Gleann Alainn


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