Woman rakes up 648 convictions

Grab All Association

indo wrote:

Serial thief Jennifer Armstrong (44), who has one of the longest criminal records ever seen in this country, was arrested for shoplifting wine just two days after she was released from a 16-month prison sentence.

Among her staggering litany of past offences, described as an Irish "record", Armstrong has been convicted for assault and stealing from and harassing the public around Dublin city centre.
Judge Carol Anne Coolican spared her jail for her latest offence, giving her a one-month suspended sentence after Armstrong begged for "one last chance".

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/serial-thief-handed-one-last-chance-as-she-walks-free-after-648th-conviction-38312544.html

Clearly this person will never change and she will just continue to steal, assault and be a burden to us the taxpayers.

The only solution for people like this is a long sentence to the central mental health hospital with/or psychiatric drugs to inhibit their behaviors or a lobotomy.

eamonnq

Must have a good rake.

Tell me how

Grab All Association wrote: »

The only solution for people like this is a long sentence to the central mental health hospital with/or psychiatric drugs to inhibit their behaviors or a lobotomy.

She's not going to change, because she doesn't want to change.

Why suggest wasting the limited resources of mental health services in a B Movie film plot just because she is happy to be in and out of jail.

She'll continue to plead for leniency when caught, but doesn't care if she gets it or not.

Turner

648 convictions at anywhere between 5 snd 15 (sometimes uo to 30) adjournments per conviction, not to mention bench warrants the appeals court, high court bail, once her district court bail is refused etc etc

You are talking thousands of court adjournments and outcomes.

Shes a million euro legal aid bounty!!!

Wouldnt make financial sense to the legal profession to lock her up.

It certainly would make sense to the retail community!

Cork Trucker

You can be sure she has already offended since this court case was dealt with, to some committing crime is an occupation.

SEPT 23 1989

She must get invited to the Law Society’s Christmas party at this stage

Greyfox

Absolute piece of s**t, she should have a long sentence by now.

Don't worry some fruitcake will be on here soon saying its better to give her one more chance.

And some people think we dont have a lenient legal system

Your Face

Jaysus, she's 44?!
Looks like one of Macbeth's crones.

Sorry that was a bit rash, I meant, of course, The Scottish Play.

gifted

10 convictions should automatically warrant a 10 year jail sentence

punisher5112

She's 44 she looks in her late 60s....

Hard work that robbing.

BarryD2

Needs a bit of lateral thinking - how about a system of assisted emigration, a deal with say Putin to take in recidivists and settle them in Siberia!

dodzy

Jasus, she’s some hound.

NewbridgeIR

Another suspended sentence - she's obviously well-connected, comes from a good family, posh or upper class.

Get Real

Some of my point here is whataboutery I'll concede- but if this woman was in Texas, theresr a good chance she'd be doing a life sentence. Their three strikes law is particularly harsh and can include simple theft.

I understand those who make an argument regarding rehabilitation over punishment. But a happy medium needs to be found in this country.

Surely something warrants a ten year sentence automatically. What do people class as "fair"? 50 convictions?

The fact she's committed 648 crimes- or rather convicted of that amount and probably done many more that she wasn't caught for- is an absolute kick to the victims, the guards, the retail community.

In theory, a six month sentence per offence, would mean 320 years. She'd be locked up long ago.

She commits offences while already being out in bail for others she has before the court.

Each and every time she appears has to be taken on it's merits, and her past offending cannot be used to presume she is guilty this time around, as she still has the same presumption if innocence as anyone else.

I think at some point, if we don't have a ten years for 50 convictions, then at the very least, legislation should allow for anyone with over 50 convictions to be automatically denied bail while their current case is being dealt with. They should still have a "presumption of innocence" with regard to the case and it's technical points. But they should lose their right to bail as a consequence of 50 confirmed crimes in the past.

At what point do the rights of victims and the rights of criminals find a balanced medium? Because at the moment, in court, it's all about the offender.

notsoyoungwan

Why do you think she needs psychiatric treatment rather than prison? While she has the almost obligatory sob story background trotted out by defence solicitors, there’s nothing to suggest serious mental illness. The picture is one of recidivistic criminal behaviour with no care for the consequences.

py2006

If she was a man...

nthclare

notsoyoungwan wrote: »

Why do you think she needs psychiatric treatment rather than prison? While she has the almost obligatory sob story background trotted out by defence solicitors, there’s nothing to suggest serious mental illness. The picture is one of recidivistic criminal behaviour with no care for the consequences.

The solicitor who defended her last month could be representing the state against her next year.

Its absolutely bonkers the system lol

El_Bee

Guys, prison doesn't work, they tried prison in america and there's still crime over there. this poor woman clearly suffers from a Difficult home life, Substance abuse issues, Learning difficulties, Having a "bad time of it", she probably has a letter from a social worker saying that she swears she'll turn things around..... THIS time! so lay off the poor woman. No-one is perfect I'm sure you're all no angles, stop being busy bodies and worrying about other people stick to your own lives ok?

Gimme A Pound

py2006 wrote: »

If she was a man...

It's like a default reaction - no thinking, just shoot.

I think you'll find that there are plenty of men with a massive string of convictions behind them walking the streets, but why bother with the truth when there's a battle of the sexes to be had?!

py2006

El_Bee wrote: »

THIS time! so lay off the poor woman. No-one is perfect I'm sure you're all no angles, stop being busy bodies and worrying about other people stick to your own lives ok?

Yea, but we are right angles...

topper75

Turner wrote: »

...

Wouldnt make financial sense to the legal profession to lock her up.

It certainly would make sense to the retail community!

This country isn't run for ordinary people. It never was and never will be, whatever colour flag they fly over their big buildings. The system is broadly the same.

But of course that is just me being a populist. I should probably just know my station.

Greyfox

Greyfox wrote: »

Absolute piece of s**t, she should have a long sentence by now.

Don't worry some fruitcake will be on here soon saying its better to give her one more chance.

And some people think we dont have a lenient legal system

Nice Language..... How about checking with the people who served time behind bars for stupid stuff like non payment of fines before praising our "lenient" legal system BTW is it normal now for people to call others they don't even know "a piece of s1ht" Heaven help society......

looksee

At what point does criminality and recidivism segue into mental illness? And this is not an appeal or an excuse to 'let her off'; she is a liability to shopkeepers, the justice system, the gardai, and herself. There has to come a time when she should be removed to a controlled situation and some attempt made to figure out what is happening in her head that she continues to steal - an activity she is clearly not very good at judging by the number of times she has been caught.

Larbre34

In certain countries she wouldn't have any hands by now, in Ireland its 649 strikes and you're out.

I can't help feeling that we need a happy medium.

klaaaz

gifted wrote: »

10 convictions should automatically warrant a 10 year jail sentence

Get Real wrote: »

Some of my point here is whataboutery I'll concede- but if this woman was in Texas, theresr a good chance she'd be doing a life sentence. Their three strikes law is particularly harsh and can include simple theft.

I understand those who make an argument regarding rehabilitation over punishment. But a happy medium needs to be found in this country.

Surely something warrants a ten year sentence automatically. What do people class as "fair"? 50 convictions?

Are people in the "lock 'em up brigade" willing to pay higher direct income taxes to lock people like the offender up for life/10 years? It costs money to put people in prison and yet the lock 'em up brigade want lower taxes, you can't have both!

NewbridgeIR

klaaaz wrote: »

Are people in the "lock 'em up brigade" willing to pay higher direct income taxes to lock people like the offender up for life/10 years? It costs money to put people in prison and yet the lock 'em up brigade want lower taxes, you can't have both!

Do people who advocate for higher taxes want to see this additional revenue used for keeping criminals in prison?

patmahe

The thing is, this is the number of times she was caught and convicted, what about all the times she wasn't caught?

riffmongous

Spent 27 years in jail already according to the Herald. 88 convictions for theft and 200 for public intoxication. Alcoholic with history of substance abuse.

Wtf ?

dodzy wrote: »

Jasus, she’s some hound.

The tide would'nt take her out....:D

riffmongous

riffmongous wrote: »

Spent 27 years in jail already according to the Herald. 88 convictions for theft and 200 for public intoxication. Alcoholic with history of substance abuse.

Weird, that would mean she's been in the entire time since she was 17. Must work quick to get caught again each time.

D3V!L

Does she get a letter from Micky D when she reaches 1000 ?

punisher5112

El_Bee wrote: »

Guys, prison doesn't work, they tried prison in america and there's still crime over there. this poor woman clearly suffers from a Difficult home life, Substance abuse issues, Learning difficulties, Having a "bad time of it", she probably has a letter from a social worker saying that she swears she'll turn things around..... THIS time! so lay off the poor woman. No-one is perfect I'm sure you're all no angles, stop being busy bodies and worrying about other people stick to your own lives ok?

My heart bleeds....

No wonder they can do what they want when there are those like you ...

Gimme A Pound

Deleted User wrote: »

Nice Language..... How about checking with the people who served time behind bars for stupid stuff like non payment of fines before praising our "lenient" legal system BTW is it normal now for people to call others they don't even know "a piece of s1ht" Heaven help society......

Your focus is on three words on the internet rather than her behaviour? Yeah you know that that expression has been used for years - it's hardly something new.

And nobody said anything about people who are imprisoned for non payment of fines.

Kinda bigger concerns for society than three little words...

Former Observer

Some people want to give her a life sentence for stealing a bottle of wine? Would you get over yourselves. lol

She should be punished fairly for every crime she commits, but you'd have to be sick in the head to want to give someone ten years for stealing a bottle of wine. She is obviously disturbed and needs assistance, but probably will not accept it.

Odelay

Larbre34 wrote: »

In certain countries she wouldn't have any hands by now, in Ireland its 649 strikes and you're out.

I can't help feeling that we need a happy medium.

If she was in any of those countries all that be left of her would be two little toes they’d have so much chopped off.

Odelay

Former Observer wrote: »

Some people want to give her a life sentence for stealing a bottle of wine? Would you get over yourselves. lol

She should be punished fairly for every crime she commits, but you'd have to be sick in the head to want to give someone ten years for stealing a bottle of wine. She is obviously disturbed and needs assistance, but probably will not accept it.

Im not sure if you’re taking the piss or not. But assuming you’re serious, it’s not the one bottle of wine people have an issue with it’s the enormous amount of convictions. If she had been sentenced to six months for each the problem would have solved itself.

Get Real

klaaaz wrote: »

Are people in the "lock 'em up brigade" willing to pay higher direct income taxes to lock people like the offender up for life/10 years? It costs money to put people in prison and yet the lock 'em up brigade want lower taxes, you can't have both!

I genuinely wouldn't consider myself as part of the lock em up brigade. I said after 50 convictions. 50. Then ten years.

Some places, people get 25 years for 3 convictions. I am not a supporter of that. I think having an "allowance" of 50 convictions is quite reasonable. To think the vast majority of people go through life with none. Or maybe something minor when they were young etc. But someone with 50 and over is past help. 10 years might be the next step in providing that help.

I can't speak for everyone, but yes, I'd be happy to pay for someone with over 50 convictions to serve 10 years.

If it costs 80,000 a year to house her, as part of 2.19 million working people, I'd happily contribute 5cent a year. So you wouldn't even need to take off the pensioners and unemployed.

If I knew 50euro a year was servicing 1000 serial offenders with 50plus convictions, yes I'd have no issue.

Don't forget, I'm not saying "lock em all up".

I'm saying apply it to those who have many 100s of victims, who have already cost many thousands, possibly 100s of thousands, in legal aid, Garda time, and retail/personal loss.

Would I pay 5 cent a year to ensure this woman doesn't take my mother's phone, or steal from my local shop, or take up a cell in a Garda station while I'm queueing for a passport application? Of course I would.

It's a tiny percent of the population, generating a disproportionate amount of the crime. Again I'm not saying lock up on three, or ten or twenty. But 50 convictions. I don't think that's unreasonable?

thomasm

She will be a blight on society forever and there is nothing anyone can do to change that.



At 27 years she must be one of the longest serving prisoners in the history of the state surely !!

spurious

We have a crazy system alright but hundreds of convictions for an alcoholic for stealing bottles of wine and the like is a bit less worrying than roided up coke heads with tens of unprovoked assault convictions prowling the streets.

Graces7

looksee wrote: »

At what point does criminality and recidivism segue into mental illness? And this is not an appeal or an excuse to 'let her off'; she is a liability to shopkeepers, the justice system, the guards, and herself. There has to come a time when she should be removed to a controlled situation and some attempt made to figure out what is happening in her head that she continues to steal - an activity she is clearly not very good at judging by the number of times she has been caught.

agree wholeheartedly.

a few decades ago there were large mental institutions that catered for those unable to cope in many ways. N B I know the Uk system better than the Irish.They closed these for costs and it went to "care in the community" when the community did not care. and the only facilities were for the very seriously mentally ill. This woman is clearly unable to stop herself as she is . She would still have been locked up but some investigation .. alcohol abuse alone? No amount of prison will work

Former Observer

Former Observer wrote: »

Some people want to give her a life sentence for stealing a bottle of wine? Would you get over yourselves. lol

She should be punished fairly for every crime she commits, but you'd have to be sick in the head to want to give someone ten years for stealing a bottle of wine. She is obviously disturbed and needs assistance, but probably will not accept it.

And if she stole 648 bottles of wine from a warehouse, what would you say? Just a bottle of wine?

Greyfox

El_Bee wrote: »

Guys, prison doesn't work, they tried prison in america and there's still crime over there. this poor woman clearly suffers from a Difficult home life, Substance abuse issues, Learning difficulties, Having a "bad time of it", she probably has a letter from a social worker saying that she swears she'll turn things around..... THIS time! so lay off the poor woman. No-one is perfect I'm sure you're all no angles, stop being busy bodies and worrying about other people stick to your own lives ok?

This attitude is what's wrong with Ireland. What about the victims and also the future victims?? do you just not care about these people? Why should I just ignore the fact that the crappy legal system is telling criminals its ok to commit crime?

Deleted User wrote: »

Nice Language..... How about checking with the people who served time behind bars for stupid stuff like non payment of fines before praising our "lenient" legal system BTW is it normal now for people to call others they don't even know "a piece of s1ht" Heaven help society......

And every word of it deserved, she's a terrible person and should be locked up. Fines are different, her convictions arent for not paying her tv licence. Our lenient legal system allows criminals get away with horrible crimes, I don't think anybody should accept living in a society that cares more about criminals than it does about victims

Autecher

spurious wrote: »

We have a crazy system alright but hundreds of convictions for an alcoholic for stealing bottles of wine and the like is a bit less worrying than roided up coke heads with tens of unprovoked assault convictions prowling the streets.

I do agree with you on the coke heads but she has 88 convictions for theft, 216 convictions for public intoxication and unspecified numbers for assault and harassment. No doubt there are others but that's all I could find on her. She doesn't just steal, she is a menace and annoyance to people too.


https://www.herald.ie/news/courts/prolific-criminal-is-given-one-last-chance-after-conviction-number-648-38312572.html

Wheety

Armstrong begged for "one last chance"


She's having a laugh

Bio Mech

Say no to drugs kids.

branie2

That's a lot!

Those drugs kids are scary though

whisky_galore

dodzy wrote: »

Jasus, she’s some hound.

Jesus.
Thought it was Michael Gambon in drag.

mfceiling

Sheesh....It's only 648 previous convictions.

Of course she deserves another chance. Obviously she'll have learned her lesson now. A lot of people are very quick to judge this poor girl. We all deserve a 2nd chance or in her case a 649th one.

CageWager

klaaaz wrote: »

Are people in the "lock 'em up brigade" willing to pay higher direct income taxes to lock people like the offender up for life/10 years? It costs money to put people in prison and yet the lock 'em up brigade want lower taxes, you can't have both!

This is EXACTLY what I want my tax Euros spent on - locking up criminals to make Ireland a safer community for law-abiding citizens. We could offset the extra cost by scaling back the obscenely generous social welfare structure that supports a huge cohort who are fully capable of supporting themselves.

Odhinn

Greyfox wrote: »

Absolute piece of s**t, she should have a long sentence by now.

Don't worry some fruitcake will be on here soon saying its better to give her one more chance.

And some people think we dont have a lenient legal system

She's served a total of 27 years.